Battle for Lordaeron Lore [spoilers]

[Annedrooo]

Yeah and that's why Europeans conquered the Americas. Not because they had the right to but because they could. Ability and obligation seem to what people are hung up on here.

[Dagoth Ur]

Notice how all the Horde/ Sylvannas fan boys continue to dodge this. Fact is, the Horde burned down Teldrassil - how many innocent civilians and children would have died from that? Plus you have a Warchief who is only interested in her own self-preservation, all she did in Legion was look for a way to enslave a peaceful entity and seize immortality. I liked the Horde, but with the Forsaken at the fore-front, using the plague, destroying the land - you can no longer equate the Alliance and Horde, one of them is flat out villainous. (Protip : their flag is red)

How do you even invade Teldrasiil? I mean was Horde supposed to climb that tree so they could conquer it honorably? That would probably result in instant loss for the Horde.

Also we still don't know what exactly happens in that whole Teldrassil scenario, so this is probably discussion best left for later.

[Annedrooo]

I would say it's probably open for the taking. Feral worgen are obviously beasts and sentient one's are dubious at best.

[Melsiren]

That seems awful hard to prove. So if aliens take all our major cities tomorrow them they'll be the rightful owner of the earth?

Yes, and if they choose with their power to turn us into human cattle and use us for food. If we do not have the might to not make that happen we no longer have rights.

[Friendlyimmolation]

I dont think that diminishes their human status, they are still alive. They aren't corpses.

A beast in a hat is still a beast.

[Annedrooo]

So just anyone who wins has the right? Seems pretty fishy to me. It would be impossible to infringe upon someone's rights in that case. European settlers didn't have the right to remove native Americans from the continent, but they did.

[Annedrooo]

Your confusing ability to own things with right to own things again. Worgen, forsaken and naaru don't have the right to own anything but that doesn't stop them from doing so.

[Friendlyimmolation]

The dead should be dead. Think about it for a second, would you be comfortable living among corpses? They have to right to interfere in the world of the living, it's selfish. I'm more curious how you're able to equate the two.

Wanting others dead because you don't like them and they are the selfish ones?

[Annedrooo]

Tirion can come visit, but no way in hell is he getting his sword back.

[Benomatic]

But undercity is the already given name to the catacombs under the capital. Sylvanas really can't plague again that which she already infected/plagued! Nonsense.

[Maxilian]

The gilneans when they assume human form.

Can the forsaken do that?
pic pic pic

The Forsaken looks at the Worgen, and stop breathing and with the little air they have left they are like "Can you do this?"

And that's how the next war between the Worgen and the Forsaken unfold, just both sides showing weird things that the other cannot do.

[Maxilian]

Just for the fun of it lets bring our boy Magni in the mix. The king of Ironforge is now a walking talking piece of crystal. Guess he has as much value and rights as kitchen table according to Annedroo. And i bet i could tons of more important characters that dont fit the description of people worthy of owning something you guys have painted here.

Could we agree that having certain level of intelligence, culture and free will would give you a right to claim something as your own. This whole conversation has been giant flipflopping contest by biased people with a hard on for their faction.

I really dont give a god damn about any of this.

Well... he did said that the Naaru and Worgen also do not have rights to anything, so i guess his stand is made.

If you don't look human, you have no rights.

Note: Well... if you don't ALWAYS look human, you have no rights (in case of Worgen)

Note2: talking about Annedroo not the Anduin avatar guy

[Jastall]

Yes, and how could they assemble a full force without already holding the land to cover themselves? They'd just take Lordaeron and be vulnerable to attack from both the north and south? The Alliance will control all of EK, the Horde control all of Kalimdor, it's pretty much the only reason Blizz chose to kill Darnassus

Blizzard literally said that the Horde still controls Silverpine and Hillsbrad as well as Quel'thalas, with the Warfront in Arathi being a defensive effort on the Alliance's part to stop the Blood Elves from retaking the Undercity. It's been linked a few times.

So yes, the Alliance IS vulnerable to counter-attacks. That's what actually happens.

[Magnagarde]

Yes, they do have a claim. Why? Because they own it, it's how claims work at the end of the day.

And that is apparently how the Forsaken are losing claim of Lordaeron and how the Alliance is taking claim of the area.

- - - Updated - - -

Blizzard literally said that the Horde still controls Silverpine and Hillsbrad as well as Quel'thalas, with the Warfront in Arathi being a defensive effort on the Alliance's part to stop the Blood Elves from retaking the Undercity. It's been linked a few times.

So yes, the Alliance IS vulnerable to counter-attacks. That's what actually happens.

I hope the Alliance takes all said territories, so we can finally play Horde for the Horde, instead of running errands for the undead high elf for two expansions straight.

[Traveler Voltin]

https://i.imgur.com/DpgRGJB.jpg

ugly map

[Kithelle]

Yeah. You can tell the difference between the Horde and Alliance through their tactics alone.

The Alliance moves to capture a city while the Horde decides to burn Darnasus to the ground. You get Horde players complaining about all the innocents killed in Camp Taurajo but then support burning an entire capital city to the ground with no concern for the civilians.

Sylvanas is becoming a saturday morning cartoon villain.

Don't you know? It's okay for Horde leaders to literally destroy entire cities...it's okay for them to slaughter masses of people...murder the innocents...yet they're still portrayed as innocents...especially by someone in this thread who has the biggest hard on for Sylvanas I've ever seen.

But you know...the Alliance enslaves some Orcs who attacked with no justification and they're evil...one camp is destroyed and it's evil...but it's okay to nuke Theramore...it's okay to burn down Teldrassil.

[Zyky]

who cares? Ally land = ally reclaim

It was never Alliance land though, Lordaeron never joined what is the current Alliance. The land always belonged to the people of Lordaeron, who are now mostly Forsaken, which make it Forsaken/Horde Land.

[Annedrooo]

I'll agree it gives you the ability to claim things as your own. And of course magni, earthen and iron dwarves aren't people. Magni might as well be an undead dwarf.

[Dartz1979]

the alliance needs to leave my waifu alone...

[Marrilaife]

Don't you know? It's okay for Horde leaders to literally destroy entire cities...it's okay for them to slaughter masses of people...murder the innocents...yet they're still portrayed as innocents...especially by someone in this thread who has the biggest hard on for Sylvanas I've ever seen.

But you know...the Alliance enslaves some Orcs who attacked with no justification and they're evil...one camp is destroyed and it's evil...but it's okay to nuke Theramore...it's okay to burn down Teldrassil.

I'm yet to see Blizzard let Alliance get any territorial gain that wouldn't be a plagued wasteland, some blasted to smithereens crater, well basically anything of value. Horde can of course get Azshara, Hillsbrad and half of Ashenvale, because why not. I bet by the end of BFA Undercity will be reclaimed and repopulated by the Forsaken who of course can endure any conditions that would kill mortals (since they're already dead), but Teldrassil will stay burnt because well sorry can't unburn that now. Exactly how Theramore is a crater now, Southshore is a pile of toxic slugde, Silverwind Refuge had all its inhabitants murdered including civilians, but Orgrimmar is unscathed despite so called "siege". Alliance doesn't get to bomb or plague Stonard, Kargath or any other big horde settlement. Doesn't get a previously neutral zone exclusively as their own, let's say Searing Gorge. All they got allowed to destroy was Camp Taurajo and even that wasn't painted in the colours "let's kill some beefcakes for a change" but rather "that was a mistake and a war crime". Even the soldier / grunt gossip in Ashran is like: Ally - "why aren't they respecting the treaty?", Horde - "I'm itching to bash some ally skulls in". The narrative for the Alliance is to be less aggressive and due to it always end on the losing side. Every time they want to sign a peace treaty, they have to give up something for it. And since the game demands to be oriented around 2 factions going forward, it's always gonna end in some treaty / ceasefire / truce. For an expansion or 2 after which Blizz undigs "faction conflict" as a fresh and exciting idea definitely not creatively bankrupt yet.