I don't really get all the hate for SV hunters

[Khallid]

I mean I get it if you just miss the old sv hunter spec and wish it would be reverted but I don't really get the hate for them as a melee class. Fantasy wise I think its a cool spec. I like fighting side by side with my pet. Could its rotation use a little refinement? Yes but at the same time as someone who plays most of the melee classes in the game I think its one of the better and funner specs to play. Damage wise I also think its gets overhated. I currently do as much or more damage on my hunter as I do on my arms warrior and close to what my sub rogue does despite having a lower ilvl than those toons have by a decent margin. So while I get that it just might not be everyone's cup of tea I think its overhated to some degree by the loud minority. Its currently my fave spec to play alongside my sub rogue for dps purposes. I really hope Bliz doesn't do anything drastic with the spec and just adds a little refinement to its skillset. Long live the new SV hunter!

I think most of the hate comes from people who played the Survival spec in previous expansion (I hear it was great in MoP but I wasn't playing back then) and basically lost the spec. If you weren't attached to the old survival then it's just another spec and there's nothing outrageous with having one melee spec.

But overall I think the implementation of survival in Legion is quite bad. I tried it out a bit and did the Mage Tower for it but I find it very clunky. It has way too many skills that are just weak fillers with nothing interesting to them. Spamming the Mongoose Bite and Flanking Strike to get more Mongoose Bites is not paricularly fun for me because of how the timed buff works, and I hate when I tried to hit one more Mongoose but missed it for a fraction of a second and then it restarts the buff, but the next buff is obviously fucked because I'm out of charges to build up again so soon. The Fury of the Eagle is also crappy because it's a channel. I literally couldn't believe that a melee spec with all instant casts has to stand still channeling. And because of how it extends the Mongoose buff it also feels kind of shitty if you get a good series rolling and Fury of the Eagle is still on cooldown. Based on the way it works, and how it doesn't do any damage without the Mongoose stacks, it doesn't even make sense to have more than 5 seconds cooldown. It's not like you can spam an ability that requires you to buiuld stacks from another ability. It should be on use for every single stack window. Traps weren't implemented in a way that they feel like a natural part of the rotation either.

I never mained survival so maybe I'm missing some of the know-how and nuance to do the rotation properly, but my impression from practicing a little bit was that I didn't like it at all.

[RaZz0r]

in short "Waaaaaaaah I don't like melee"

Ofc i don't like melee if i liked melee i would have picked a fucking melee class to begin with forcing a melee spec on a class that has always been ranged is fucking retarded when there are plenty of other classes to fill that role.

If you want to play a melee spec roll a fucking melee dps and not a ranged dps.

[Deleted]

Ofc i don't like melee if i liked melee i would have picked a fucking melee class to begin with forcing a melee spec on a class that has always been ranged is fucking retarded when there are plenty of other classes to fill that role.

If you want to play a melee spec roll a fucking melee dps and not a ranged dps.

Alright.

Which class fills being a medium armored Tracker using a spear with a Hunting Companion?

[Asiel]

Alright.

Which class fills being a medium armored Tracker using a spear with a Hunting Companion?

BM /10chars

[Deleted]

BM /10chars

So where does the Spear part fall into that?

[Asiel]

So where does the Spear part fall into that?

You need me to spell out what I already said earlier in the thread? You called my whole post “stupid as fuck” because you either didn’t like the fact that SV already had a niche or didn’t read it and were too lazy to actually refute a point.

[Sylar Hao]

I still think that BM should go melee and SV go back to ranged.

I mean, BM is the master of beast, they have such a deep connection with beasts and his pet(s) that they feel the beast they have within. So it makes much more sense that they go wild and savage, toe to toe alongside his animal best friend, butchering their foes with axes, or swords or polearms.

On the other hand, I view SV as a sneaky hard to catch master trapper and kiter... I mean, the spec is named Survival, a character that tries to survive... if you want to survive you don't go melee, you try to avoid melee range as much as possible.

[Deleted]

You need me to spell out what I already said earlier in the thread? You called my whole post “stupid as fuck” because you either didn’t like the fact that SV already had a niche or didn’t read it and were too lazy to actually refute a point.

It's niche was the flavor of shots it fired. Thematically, it was exactly the same as MM.

Every single "Old school" Survival spell could basically be a MM talent.

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I still think that BM should go melee and SV go back to ranged.

I mean, BM is the master of beast, they have such a deep connection with beasts and his pet(s) that they feel the beast they have within. So it makes much more sense that they go wild and savage, toe to toe alongside his animal best friend, butchering their foes with axes, or swords or polearms.

On the other hand, I view SV as a sneaky hard to catch master trapper and kiter... I mean, the spec is named Survival, a character that tries to survive... if you want to survive you don't go melee, you try to avoid melee range as much as possible.

Honestly I agree with this. I want a Melee Hunter spec, Survival or BM doesn't matter.

[Kithelle]

I have absolutely nothing wrong with the people that play Survival, my problem is with the spec itself and the backwards reasoning behind making IT the “melee spec” over BM. They had to come up with an entirely new spec and playstyle for SV which had a niche in the “magic damage hunter spec” instead of changing Cobra Shot to Cobra Strike, giving it a melee maximum range and changing absolutely nothing else about BM’s rotation to fit the Rexxar fantasy they wanted. Instead they ruined one of my favorite specs in the game to give birth to what I consider to be the most unplayable piece of absolute trash that is the current Survival rotation that doesn’t even seem to work WITH ITSELF.

While I don't hate the current Survival, I probably would have preferred this a little more.

[Firebyrd]

Oh, so now that you've been called on your crap about the specs being identical before (because they weren't), you're now changing your argument to they were identical "thematically." What does that even mean? Of course they were the same thematically, it's a freaking class, they should be, otherwise what makes them class specializations rather than three separate classes? (Note that this has been a huge problem with specs in Legion, they acted like there were 36 classes instead of 12 and screwed up so many of them.) If any of the specs suffered from a lack of a "theme" prior to Legion, it was Marks. SV was very clearly the magical dot spec. BM was the partnering with a pet spec. Marks was a hard hitting...something or other. Could have been physical, but Arcane and Chimera kept that from being a thing. Sometimes Aimed was cast, sometimes not. Sometimes it could be used on the move, sometimes not. Meanwhile, SV and BM both had kept the same thematic feel for many years.

You like melee SV, cool, whatever. But if you ask a question, don't shit on the people giving you an answer because you don't like it. I think a fourth melee spec would have been fine, it was just destroying any of the specs that were ranged for almost twelve years was a huge problem. I mean, I've seen rogues whining about having even the mid-ranged pistol abilities as Outlaw. Imagine if they'd completely remade one of the specs to be ranged. There would have been a lot of upset and complaints about it. Funny how people don't like it when the reason they pick a class or spec gets taken away from that class/spec...

[Okacz]

You opened the thread with the very answer to your dilemma.

Yes, that's why we hate SV.

Blizz changed SV because it was, in its core, similar to MM. I'd say the change was good, but it's on Blizzards part to make sure some sort of SV rotation (ranged spec with lots of mobility, a pet that does nothing and Explosive Shot-ish spam) was retained, at least in MM with talents.

Yeah, I loved WoD SV, especially with Focusing Shot, but at the same time a melee hunter with a spear, fighting alongside his pet and using various poisons/traps isn't a bad idea. Hope those two things can live together somehow.

[Deleted]

Blizz changed SV because it was, in its core, similar to MM. I'd say the change was good, but it's on Blizzards part to make sure some sort of SV rotation (ranged spec with lots of mobility, a pet that does nothing and Explosive Shot-ish spam) was retained, at least in MM with talents.

Yeah, I loved WoD SV, especially with Focusing Shot, but at the same time a melee hunter with a spear, fighting alongside his pet and using various poisons/traps isn't a bad idea. Hope those two things can live together somehow.

Exactly my point.

They could have added Explosive Shot and Serpent sting/Black Arrow to MM and it wouldn't have made a difference.

Hell, Explosive shot replacing Aimed Shot as a talent. Bam. SV Hunter.

[Varvara Spiros Gelashvili]

Guns which are weaker than fireballs. Which is my entirely point. You don't need anything when mages make the realism angle redundant.

Mages wear cloth and fire ball has a charge time there are guns in wow that don't. If I land a clean shot between your eyes that fire ball doesn't matter.

[Deleted]

Mages wear cloth and fire ball has a charge time there are guns in wow that don't. If I land a clean shot between your eyes that fire ball doesn't matter.

You make it sound like Mage Armor and the like doesn't make Mages tougher than Mail users.

[Asiel]

It's niche was the flavor of shots it fired. Thematically, it was exactly the same as MM.

Every single "Old school" Survival spell could basically be a MM talent.

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Honestly I agree with this. I want a Melee Hunter spec, Survival or BM doesn't matter.

Thanks for ignoring the entirety of the rest of my post about BM being the melee spec only to quote someone that posted the same idea after me and agree with it. What are you even in this thread for if you aren’t reading things?

[Donkeywing]

Blizz changed SV because it was, in its core, similar to MM.

That isn't a good argument because wod sv is nothing like legion mm, meaning if they hadnt changed SV at all (and obviously replaced the legion mm talents stolen from old sv), then SV and MM would have enough ''identity'' on their own. You only have to change/rework 2 out of 3 specs if you believe all 3 specs are similar.

but at the same time a melee hunter with a spear, fighting alongside his pet and using various poisons/traps isn't a bad idea

It's a bad idea for several reasons, one being that you'll piss off a big majority of the hunter population for very obvious and predictable reasons. That's never a good idea.

[Deleted]

It's a bad idea for several reasons, one being that you'll piss off a big majority of the hunter population for very obvious and predictable reasons. That's never a good idea.

The Majority population of Hunters are fucking retarded then and deserve a Shotgun Enema.

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Thanks for ignoring the entirety of the rest of my post about BM being the melee spec only to quote someone that posted the same idea after me and agree with it. What are you even in this thread for if you aren’t reading things?

I generally disregard stupid people. You contribute nothing but whining.

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That isn't a good argument because wod sv is nothing like legion mm, meaning if they hadnt changed SV at all (and obviously replaced the legion mm talents stolen from old sv), then SV and MM would have enough ''identity'' on their own. You only have to change/rework 2 out of 3 specs if you believe all 3 specs are similar.

Ah you mean "Fires Arrows/bullets while disregarding the pet to an auto attack bot, but this time I can move and the damage is X type instead"

Yeah, Stupid.

[Donkeywing]

The Majority population of Hunters are fucking retarded then and deserve a Shotgun Enema.

You could argue you're part of that majority, since divisiveness has been established in the hunter community, and both sides seem to be pissed at each other. That divisiveness was also predicted.

[Darkeon]

Pick any class, now pick any of it's specializations.
Now replace it with a vastly different play-style than the people that enjoyed that specialization were used to.

That's how you get hate for, in this particular case, SV hunters.

[Varvara Spiros Gelashvili]

You make it sound like Mage Armor and the like doesn't make Mages tougher than Mail users.

In game it doesn't... Let's not forget that magic resistance exist as well.