Is Survival being streamlined/simplified in BfA?

[Byucknah The Red]

So, I ask this as someone who really wants to play a Melee hunter. When it was announced that in Legion that Survival would be a Melee spec with a pet I was SUPER excited. Then when it actually came out... well, I will say I was overwhelmed in, personally, a bad way. The current Survival hunter makes little to no sense to me, it feels like a jumbled mess of throwing everything, maybe even the kitchen sink, into its skill set without much rhyme or reason. It honestly felt like I had so many tools that did nearly the same thing or where so niche in terms of when I needed to use it. Looking at survival guides, using things such as Weak Auras, TMW, Ovale, ect it always just felt like chaos and randomness with little to no actual "rotation".

Compared to other melee classes like Retribution Paladin, Fury Warrior, Frost DK, Enhancement Shaman, ect that have solid "rotations" that feel like "I know when I need to press x" and flow really well I found myself looking at survival and being 100% unsure on what to use and when to use it along with juggling different buffs.

Now, I know (because there are several posts on it) that apparently people like this play style and are angry with what was data mined so far but I wanted to ask.

Currently, from what little information we do have, does it look like Survival is getting a more streamlined/simplified/understandable rotation akin to the other Melee DPS specs or does it look like its just going to stay in a state of utter chaos and micromanagement? Id really love to play a melee hunter but Survival in its current iteration just feels overbearing at this moment.

EDIT: And with that said, this is from my view point. I know there are players far better than I out there who probably don't see it as chaos or randomness but to me its very overbearing :S

[andreasels]

From what we see from datamining, while it seems like the old playstyle can more or less be replicated through talents (except Mok'nathal and a few filler spells), the base version seems to be a simple builder/spender type of spec with a DoT to keep up.
We will have to see what future builds bring, but atm you are able to customize your playstyle quite a bit through talents by adding more focus on either melee or ranged playstyle aswell as harder or simpler to use abilities.

[Byucknah The Red]

From what we see from datamining, while it seems like the old playstyle can more or less be replicated through talents (except Mok'nathal and a few filler spells), the base version seems to be a simple builder/spender type of spec with a DoT to keep up.
We will have to see what future builds bring, but atm you are able to customize your playstyle quite a bit through talents by adding more focus on either melee or ranged playstyle aswell as harder or simpler to use abilities.

Yay! Alright, awesome, thank you so much for the response. This has me excited, I would really like to play a Survival so this has my hopes up for BfA Thank you for the response.

[infinitemeridian]

It's basically turning into enhancement shaman, although slightly different. KC = SS, that new trap = Fire buff, etc.

[Byucknah The Red]

It's basically turning into enhancement shaman, although slightly different. KC = SS, that new trap = Fire buff, etc.

That has me excited then! Thank you guys for the replies, I am genuinely excited now!

[Khallid]

Now, I know (because there are several posts on it) that apparently people like this play style and are angry with what was data mined so far but I wanted to ask

Survival is the least played spc in Legion, and overall people complain about it nonstop, so of course it was going to get changes. If anyone complains that it's getting changed then they clearly live in a bubble. But I haven't seen anyone saying they want to keep the spec as it is, so I think you're misinterpreting the feedback.

From what I've seen, most people are angry that Survival is still a melee spec. Most Hunters like being ranged and changing some abilities while remaining melee is not a "fix" in their eyes. There's a whole lot of "bring MoP Survival spec back" going on alongside that, and a lot of dumb arguments on how another ranged spec would be or wouldn't be the same as Marksmanship.

Some other people are angry that Survival is getting BM abilities, which makes it seem like Blizzard has no imagination whatsoever. I kind of agree with that.

Some people are angry that the changes look bland because when you're making something new your expectations rise. Everyone wants something flashy and great, but it doesn't seem like we're getting that.

[Yhcti]

It's looking much better.. so far... I hated the Mongoose Bite style Survival currently has and to see it now as an "option" only and not mandatory, is extremely pleasing. I also like how wildfire bomb (dragonsfire grenade) is baseline with the option of having 2 charges, serpent sting being a ranged skill etc... it looks like itll be a fun spec for sure.

Only downside is the "cooldown" is a 10% increased crit buff, hardly a battle cry or soul harvest cooldown.

[Shelly]

Regarding just playing survival right now my advice is, spec butchery and ignore lacerate and raptor strike (unless you have the 4 piece T21 in which case you'll want to use raptor strike.)

It smooths out the rotation a lot, and if you can get the soul of the huntmaster you'll be sitting quite pretty.

I'm not really sure yet how much things can change with the T21 bonus, but in general for a nice smooth gameplay loop having a relatively high mastery and ignoring lacerate and raptor strike will give you relatively high dps in both single and AoE as well as make the gameplay loop easier to deal with. It becomes a bit more like a divine purpose ret paladin.

[Barnabas]

who knows at this point? anybody streaming alpha plays classes other than hunter.

[Kurve1776]

After having played with survival a bit in the Alpha, it is definitely much simpler and more streamlined.

Kill Command is a focus generator that has a 30% chance to reset itself (20 focus regen)
the flanking strike talent makes you hit the target as well if you're in melee range, so if you take that talen kc = current flanking strike except it is based on your pet's position instead of yours (downgrade imo)

Raptor strike is the filler still, with the option to replace it with mongoose bite, which functions similarly to now, however instead of charge-based use it consumes 30 focus, and stacks 5 times instead of 6 (same buff window mechanic)

The bola talent is weak damage-wise but it'll be a nice ranged slow for pvp without giving up any traps or wing clip.

The chakram talent is basically glaive toss from before.

There's a serious lack of aoe capability compared to before, since there's no explosive trap at all, and carve is gone.
However, with talents you can add a little bit via butchery / 3-target serpent sting / double charge grenade

Currently there are a total of 4-5 buttons to press, with options to add more through talents.

I'm not at home atm so I can't get on and go into detail until later.

I may decide to stream a bit if I am able to tonight, but I am by no means a serious streamer so content is literally me just doing whatever catches my interest

[Yhcti]

After having played with survival a bit in the Alpha, it is definitely much simpler and more streamlined.

Kill Command is a focus generator that has a 30% chance to reset itself (20 focus regen)
the flanking strike talent makes you hit the target as well if you're in melee range, so if you take that talen kc = current flanking strike except it is based on your pet's position instead of yours (downgrade imo)

Raptor strike is the filler still, with the option to replace it with mongoose bite, which functions similarly to now, however instead of charge-based use it consumes 30 focus, and stacks 5 times instead of 6 (same buff window mechanic)

The bola talent is weak damage-wise but it'll be a nice ranged slow for pvp without giving up any traps or wing clip.

The chakram talent is basically glaive toss from before.

There's a serious lack of aoe capability compared to before, since there's no explosive trap at all, and carve is gone.
However, with talents you can add a little bit via butchery / 3-target serpent sting / double charge grenade

Currently there are a total of 4-5 buttons to press, with options to add more through talents.

I'm not at home atm so I can't get on and go into detail until later.

I may decide to stream a bit if I am able to tonight, but I am by no means a serious streamer so content is literally me just doing whatever catches my interest

What's your twitch? I will watch! doesn't need to be at a pro level dude, just whatever shows the new stuff is perfect! there aren't many noticeable SV hunters about so I doubt any will be streaming atm! I'm excited about the changes!

[Sastank]

It's a BM Hunter + Outlaw Rogue + Legion SV hunter.

[Deleted]

Survival Hunter Main here since warlords of draenor pre patch. I love the spec the way it is in legion. I have tremendous amounts of fun with it. More than with any other melee spec currently in the game.

The fact that they plan on making survival almost exclusively ranged with most of it's abilities having a 40 yd range upsets me greatly and if they plan on going through with this, my desire to play BfA will drastically decrease.

[Makabreska]

Survival Hunter Main here since warlords of draenor pre patch. I love the spec the way it is in legion. I have tremendous amounts of fun with it. More than with any other melee spec currently in the game.

The fact that they plan on making survival almost exclusively ranged with most of it's abilities having a 40 yd range upsets me greatly and if they plan on going through with this, my desire to play BfA will drastically decrease.

It won't be ranged spec, they just add some ranged abilities so it can feel more like a hunter. You still have to be melee range to perform your rotation.

[Kurve1776]

What's your twitch? I will watch! doesn't need to be at a pro level dude, just whatever shows the new stuff is perfect! there aren't many noticeable SV hunters about so I doubt any will be streaming atm! I'm excited about the changes!

it's in my signature. it's pretty fun so far for sure, but not everyone who likes it now will like the changes I'd imagine.

Only actual melee ability is raptor strike (and auto attack) which, with aspect of the eagle popped it too becomes a ranged ability (you swing your weapon and it throws a ban'thalos at the enemy) and there's a talent that makes raptor striking your pet's target increase eagle by 1 sec so if you need to do a decent amount of ranged damage for a while you totally can

[Accendor]

Only downside is the "cooldown" is a 10% increased crit buff, hardly a battle cry or soul harvest cooldown.

Which at least I find more enjoyable. I do not like this "Press Cooldown, do alle Damage in the next 6-10 seconds and then wait for big cooldown again"

[Venziir]

There was a surv hunter stream earlier today, and it had a few ranged abilities, where the character would draw a tiny crossbow and use that, just like how Outlaw rogues use their pistol.

[Yhcti]

it's in my signature. it's pretty fun so far for sure, but not everyone who likes it now will like the changes I'd imagine.

Only actual melee ability is raptor strike (and auto attack) which, with aspect of the eagle popped it too becomes a ranged ability (you swing your weapon and it throws a ban'thalos at the enemy) and there's a talent that makes raptor striking your pet's target increase eagle by 1 sec so if you need to do a decent amount of ranged damage for a while you totally can

I for one will love the changes. I like being able to range and melee, its enjoyable to me. Im all for this haha

[shade3891]

Expected something like that, i hope they make it a cool animation. Maybe a hidden wrist crossbow?

[Venziir]

Expected something like that, i hope they make it a cool animation. Maybe a hidden wrist crossbow?

Currently it looks like you just yank a hand crossbow out of your pocket.