Chronicle Volume III Amazon Preview

[Nefarious Tea]

Does that prove he's retconned?

Or does that prove he's still canon?

Discuss.

I mean... you do know what a 404 error is, right?

[Minikin]

It would have to be - the book doesn't go up to 400 pages, after all. I think the indexes of all of the "Chronicle" books have little jokes in them, like "dreadlord, see Jaina Proudmoore" in Vol. 2.

lol thats cool.

ALSO ALSO ALSO Few things
1. I wonder if Med'dan is gone, does that mean the whole C'thun rez part done by Cho'gall is also gone?
2. The lich king detail is really interesting. Arthas wanted to defend azeroth. I wonder if Bolvar is moving in the same direction and will ultimately decide that with all the lousy sqaubbling of the horde and alliance, its better to just make deathknights of them all.

[Kallisto]

Its kinda stupid statement considering Sylvanas and Forsaken were first who killed Alliance members.

The only alliance member they killed was a dick who was going to betray them anyway since that is Garithos in a nutshell. If you're not human then you're worse than scum and should die. He was so bad as a person the Alliance actually hates him because he basically in their mind forced the Blood Elves away from the alliance.

As for proof that Alliance killed Forsaken emissaries. Well if they reached the horde ok and came back with Tauren druids then they would have surely made it to Stormwind just fine too.

[Deleted]

The only alliance member they killed was a dick who was going to betray them anyway since that is Garithos in a nutshell. If you're not human then you're worse than scum and should die. He was so bad as a person the Alliance actually hates him because he basically in their mind forced the Blood Elves away from the alliance.

As for proof that Alliance killed Forsaken emissaries. Well if they reached the horde ok and came back with Tauren druids then they would have surely made it to Stormwind just fine too.

There could have been rogue scourge agents, furious dreadlords and whatnot that didn't want her to come to terms with the Alliance. Azeroth wasn't exactly a peaceful place at the time, they could have been murdered by about everyone.

Not... that I would put it past the Alliance members to actually kill them. I mean, after the second war they exiled Tirion and stripped him of his Paladin powers because he didn't kill Eitrigg, so..
Plus they might not even have waited to let them explain themselves as ambassadors, they were undead, who would have believed them after the war against the Scourge? Kind of a 'better safe than sorry' approach. Not very wise, but maybe understandable, depending on whom they met first.

[Vladier]

I'm pretty sure it's been mentioned somewhere that it was the Scarlet Crusade that killed the emissaries to the Alliance, under the orders of Balnazzar. It makes sense that he would do it, considering that Varimathras wasn't loyal to Sylvanas in the slightest, and would know about the emissaries. With the Horde being a long-lasting enemy of the Alliance, them allying with the undead in the Eastern Kingdoms who from Stormwind's point of view didn't make any attempt to establish diplomatic communications, would make for a perfect opportunity to sow strife on the continent.

[Qualia]

ALSO ALSO ALSO Few things
1. I wonder if Med'dan is gone, does that mean the whole C'thun rez part done by Cho'gall is also gone?

He isn't, though, just not mentioned in Chronicle. Basically, anything not mentioned in Chronicle, but mentioned in other canonical sources and doesn't contradict with what was said in the book, would still retain their canon status.

Seeing that Blizzard still remember about him to put a joke in, he's still in their mind. I wouldn't raise my hope too high about him being gone and just hope he won't be appearing in the story again anytime soon instead

[ello]

There could have been rogue scourge agents, furious dreadlords and whatnot that didn't want her to come to terms with the Alliance. Azeroth wasn't exactly a peaceful place at the time, they could have been murdered by about everyone.

Not... that I would put it past the Alliance members to actually kill them. I mean, after the second war they exiled Tirion and stripped him of his Paladin powers because he didn't kill Eitrigg, so..
Plus they might not even have waited to let them explain themselves as ambassadors, they were undead, who would have believed them after the war against the Scourge? Kind of a 'better safe than sorry' approach. Not very wise, but maybe understandable, depending on whom they met first.

Well, it's a dangerous world and I imagine they wrote it as a "she suspects" to keep it somewhat ambiguous. But given that the Horde ambassadors were perfectly fine(and they have a much tougher journey to trek, given they have to cross an ocean) and we have no evidence of some third party intervening, the simplest answer is that they made it into Human territory and were killed because they were Undead.

Which is understandable, because as you said, this was right after the Zombie Apocalypse happened. Still, it established Stormwind as a hostile nation with no possibility of diplomacy.

[Deleted]

Well, it's a dangerous world and I imagine they wrote it as a "she suspects" to keep it somewhat ambiguous. But given that the Horde ambassadors were perfectly fine(and they have a much tougher journey to trek, given they have to cross an ocean) and we have no evidence of some third party intervening, the simplest answer is that they made it into Human territory and were killed because they were Undead.

Which is understandable, because as you said, this was right after the Zombie Apocalypse happened. Still, it established Stormwind as a hostile nation with no possibility of diplomacy.

Exactly.
I think there was more behind it, especially because this comes now after the omnious 'the Loa said so' to make her warchief (this would ofc be a new plot, but made to fit with older lore by, for example, the new information we get from chronicle). My guess is, some force wanted her to be with the Horde and had plans for her there. My clues for that: Magatha telling Thrall to take her in, ambassadors to Alliance getting killed and therefore no chance to join the Alliance and probably also a deep mistrust and maybe even more hatred for the Alliance in Sylvanas and some spirits whispering to Vol'jin about her becoming warchief. Maybe even still Varimathras planting false ideas into everyones' minds at Antorus (because if it was indeed a 'plot' against Sylvanas, he can't be right in that it is her own game).
I'm only unsure of this theory, because I can't see where it is supposed to go, at least not yet. It might also be a game several higher powers are playing against each other with Sylvanas as their pawn.
If this is the case I could even see a sure way for Sylvanas to not get the Garrosh treatment, because if she ever finds out about this, she is going to crush this plan and go for the one trying to manipulate her. I don't think she likes getting manipulated like that.

[ello]

Exactly.
I think there was more behind it, especially because this comes now after the omnious 'the Loa said so' to make her warchief (this would ofc be a new plot, but made to fit with older lore by, for example, the new information we get from chronicle). My guess is, some force wanted her to be with the Horde and had plans for her there. My clues for that: Magatha telling Thrall to take her in, ambassadors to Alliance getting killed and therefore no chance to join the Alliance and probably also a deep mistrust and maybe even more hatred for the Alliance in Sylvanas and some spirits whispering to Vol'jin about her becoming warchief. Maybe even still Varimathras planting false ideas into everyones' minds at Antorus (because if it was indeed a 'plot' against Sylvanas, he can't be right in that it is her own game).
I'm only unsure of this theory, because I can't see where it is supposed to go, at least not yet. It might also be a game several higher powers are playing against each other with Sylvanas as their pawn.
If this is the case I could even see a sure way for Sylvanas to not get the Garrosh treatment, because if she ever finds out about this, she is going to crush this plan and go for the one trying to manipulate her. I don't think she likes getting manipulated like that.

I think you've come up with a pretty wild fan theory to avoid the obvious answer, i.e. stormwind killed them.

[un_known]

YES!

They're splitting kills up! Good. I would have disliked the whole "combined forces of Alliance/Horde". Some people will be salty about that though. I, for one, am all for this.




Lol nice catch.

Looks like they’re going the way of “which faction killed which boss” when it was the world first race as horde got world first on magtheridon while alliance got legitimate world first on vasjh

[Deleted]

I think you've come up with a pretty wild fan theory to avoid the obvious answer, i.e. stormwind killed them.

Oh no, if Stormwind killed them or not is not important in this theory. They were killed. If Stormwind didn't, someone else did. The important thing about my theory is that the ones sent to Stormwind were, indeed, killed and the ones sent to the Horde were not. And that someone made sure this would be the case. If that had to be by 'protecting' the ones sent to the Horde, by way of Magatha speaking up for them for example, or to kill the ones sent to the Alliance doesn't matter.
As I said, it is even quite probable that the Alliance killed them, what is more interesting is, why the Horde did not. They had just as much reason to not trust undead and if those ambassadors had encountered some grunts that had previously fought the Scourge they'd have been just as dead. Necromancy was forbidden. Thrall even said himself in Vanilla that he himself would have declined the offer of the Forsaken, were it not for Magatha.
But, as it were, all turned out "well" and Sylvanas and the Forsaken got their place in the Horde and one more reason to hate the Alliance (not that they would have needed much more).
But you're right ofc, it's only a wild fan theory. Although I don't want to turn blame away from the Alliance, because ...well. They have on several occasions been serious morons against everything they thought strange and have been very set in their ways about what is acceptable in the past and very slow to change. My only clue as to why it may not have been the Alliance and someone made sure the ambassadors died before they even got there, was that the chronicle actually leaves it open. I have no doubt that if the ambassadors really got there, they were killed by the Alliance.

[ello]

As I said, it is even quite probable that the Alliance killed them, what is more interesting is, why the Horde did not. They had just as much reason to not trust undead and if those ambassadors had encountered some grunts that had previously fought the Scourge they'd have been just as dead.

Well, the Horde actually fought alongside controlled Undead in the second war, so even though they were suspicious it probably wasn't' a case of KILL ON SIGHT like it would be for the Alliance.

Also, Stormwind had just lost their sister nation to the zombie apocalypse, so it makes sense that they would be more scared than the Horde living on the opposite continent.

All will be clear in a couple weeks. Assuming Chronicles elaborates further, that is :P

Necromancy was forbidden

I don't recall this honestly.

[Qualia]

Looks like they’re going the way of “which faction killed which boss” when it was the world first race as horde got world first on magtheridon while alliance got legitimate world first on vasjh

Not really. For example, Chronicle also stated that the Alliance was the one who defeated C'Thun, while it was Nihillum who got world first as Horde back then. Onyxia World First was Horde, but it was Alliance (well, Varian) who killed her in Chronicle. It's just a coincidence that Mag & Vashjr's kills fall into the same factions as the world first race (there is a ~33% chance of it being right anyway)

[Kwento]

Not really. For example, Chronicle also stated that the Alliance was the one who defeated C'Thun, while it was Nihillum who got world first as Horde back then. Onyxia World First was Horde, but it was Alliance (well, Varian) who killed her in Chronicle. It's just a coincidence that Mag & Vashjr's kills fall into the same factions as the world first race (there is a ~33% chance of it being right anyway)

Wait... They actually kept that horrific plotline with Varian “singlehandely” killing Onyxia..? God damn...

[Qualia]

All will be clear in a couple weeks. Assuming Chronicles elaborates further, that is :P

It didn't really elaborate further upon this, and I don't think that was such an important plot point either. The Forsaken emissaries to the Horde met Hamuul - who by then haven't clashed with the Undeads that much - and the Tauren archdruid was able to look past their "monstrous exterior" and believed that they could be redeemed. He then brought them to Cairne, who in turn, introduced them to Thrall. Thrall sympathized with them as they are similar to the Orcs in the sense that they were both corrupted and it was hard to overcome that past, plus the fact that they live in the ruins of Lordaeron - which would become a valuable foothold for the Horde if the Alliance provoke war again, so in the end he took them in.

For all we know, there might not have been any sort of conspiracy, just a matter of chances. It could simply be that Sylvanas' emissaries to the Horde lucked out, met the right person (well, tauren) with an open mind and little grudge against the Undead and got their chance to ask for help, while the ones to the Alliance didn't.

Wait... They actually kept that horrific plotline with Varian “singlehandely” killing Onyxia..? God damn...

Yeah, I don't quite remember the exact details of the comic, but Chronicle version seems to be the generally same with two Varians merged and killed Onyxia.

[Kwento]

.


Yeah, I don't quite remember the exact details of the comic, but Chronicle version seems to be the generally same with two Varians merged and killed Onyxia.

And here I hoped they would fix this like they fixed Med’an...

[ello]

snip

I've only seen the screenshot that says she sent emissaries everywhere and the ones sent to the Alliance got killed. I don't think the whole chapter is out so there might be some context we're missing.

But yeah, the most likely answer is probably similar to what you outlined.

[Highwhale]

The only alliance member they killed was a dick who was going to betray them anyway since that is Garithos in a nutshell. If you're not human then you're worse than scum and should die. He was so bad as a person the Alliance actually hates him because he basically in their mind forced the Blood Elves away from the alliance.

As for proof that Alliance killed Forsaken emissaries. Well if they reached the horde ok and came back with Tauren druids then they would have surely made it to Stormwind just fine too.

They made a deal - Forsaken were supposed to leave Lordaeron. Sylvanas and Forsaken broke the deal and killed Garithos and his army. Was Garithos dick or wasn't its irrelevant.

And yes its really stupid - Sylvanas betrays Alliance members and then ask for joining the to them.

[un_known]

Wait... They actually kept that horrific plotline with Varian “singlehandely” killing Onyxia..? God damn...

Yep, especially since his backstory was documented with him being split into two and both halves joining due to onyxia

- - - Updated - - -

Not really. For example, Chronicle also stated that the Alliance was the one who defeated C'Thun, while it was Nihillum who got world first as Horde back then. Onyxia World First was Horde, but it was Alliance (well, Varian) who killed her in Chronicle. It's just a coincidence that Mag & Vashjr's kills fall into the same factions as the world first race (there is a ~33% chance of it being right anyway)

Ah shit, had forgotten about that, but it was nice to see that they were somewhat looking at continuity even if it were “blind luck” that they chose which faction killed what

[Aeula]

I hope when they get around to deciding who canonically defeated Garrosh in SoO they choose the Horde.

The Alliance having an elite force break in, take down all the True Horde leaders and then Varian just turning around and leaving rather than continuing the fight and conquering the rest of the Horde would make that entire ending even more stupidly awkward.

If the Alliance is outnumbered in the room by an elite Horde squad and leaders then the situation would have clearly resulted in significant Alliance losses and potential harm to his son. In that case, leaving in peace makes perfect sense.

And I don’t think Alliance players like the idea of going through that entire siege, doing practically everything while the Horde sits back at the entrance only to give the city back to them when the job is done. The Alliance should have been support at best, the main force should have been Horde.

SoO’s ending was stupid anyway. But the Horde ending is significantly less stupid overall since it makes both the Alliance and the Horde look at least semi-competent.
Rather than putting us in a situation where the Horde did absolutely nothing, letting the Alliance be the main force of an invasion to retake their city and then having it handed it back to them because reasons.