Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[FlubberPuddy]

there is also my fight against the undeads !!! for quelthalas! :P

I just love more that the thread now has moved past the juvenile back and forths of 'no you can't have it because i say so!' and it's much more focused on what the future may bring in terms of additional customizations/lore/stories for these groups of various high elves.

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Shadow Mend is a thing, so doesn't that confirm that healing with shadow magic is possible? What exactly is the difference (canonically) between Void and Shadow? Is there any?

I totally forgot about that, it's a great example. And sure it has the 'dmg self component' but unfortunately priests just spam which nullifies that component anyway! So might as well allow Shadow/Void healing!!

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

Shadow Mend is a thing, so doesn't that confirm that healing with shadow magic is possible? What exactly is the difference (canonically) between Void and Shadow? Is there any?

I mean you can heal woulds with several magics; Light, Life, Fel, and Void as far as I know, with Fel and Void having drawbacks (Fel siphons the life of one creature to the other, and Void... I don't exactly know hoe that works, but Shadow Mend itself has that penalty of suffering damage if in combar, so how does that reflect from a lore perspective?

As far as a difference between Void and Shadow, I don't think there's any, save for Shadow perhaps being less of a deep dive if that makes sense.

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Agreed. WoW has always loved to flip the script on expectations, Void Elves being "good guy" void users that are basically vaccinated to void influence fits right in with that. It just reminds me of Demon Hunters, how they are using the power of their enemy to fight them. Void Elves will be crucial in the battle against the void lords.

Indeed. It just has a lot of narrative potential, I'm kinda glad that WoW has decided to move any of the cosmic forces from being outright evil -even if there's still some sort of positive/negative leaning on them-

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Shadow Mend is a thing, so doesn't that confirm that healing with shadow magic is possible?

Actually giving it some thought, I think I have a theory, Shadow Mending is reality warping.

One of the most noticeable aspect of Void magic is its ability to warp reality, by inducing visions, creating alternative realities, tearing through time and space, and mind control among others. A lot of its effects are based around the possibility of distort reality itself, so what if "Shadow Mend" is a reality warp to an un-injured state? -Similar to what a chronomancer could do, but with Space rather than Time- With the penalty of incurring damage until leaving combat being related to the difficulty of warping reality on something that is not on an idle state.

[Lahis]

Shadow Mend itself has that penalty of suffering damage if in combar, so how does that reflect from a lore perspective?

Heals physical wounds with the cost of mental damage?

Most of Shadow priest kit attacks the mind instead of the body.

[Kyriani]

One of the most noticeable aspect of Void magic is its ability to warp reality, by inducing visions, creating alternative realities, tearing through time and space, and mind control among others. A lot of its effects are based around the possibility of distort reality itself, so what if "Shadow Mend" is a reality warp to an un-injured state? -Similar to what a chronomancer could do, but with Space rather than Time- With the penalty of incurring damage until leaving combat being related to the difficulty of warping reality on something that is not on an idle state.

I really love this take on it! I've always wanted a healing spec for mages that revolved around using Chronomancy to "undo" injuries. That same concept applied to Void healing in general is most appealing to me.

[Tinniel]

I really love this take on it! I've always wanted a healing spec for mages that revolved around using Chronomancy to "undo" injuries. That same concept applied to Void healing in general is most appealing to me.

Ough, yes-yes, let's make VE-paladins with a special void ability. It's like Light, but Void. There aren't any differences between those opposites power energies. And it's just a little logic breaking just for "high elves" for which you now debate and get this avatar. And then you will wonder why, thanks to you, the lore is already slipping to the bottom. No compromises and no "custom".

[Alanar]

With all the fuzz going on and everyone getting blue eyes, there is one thing that is pretty clear.

Blood elves look and feel like true high elves.. the irony.

/hairflip.

[elbleuet]

With all the fuzz going on and everyone getting blue eyes, there is one thing that is pretty clear.

Blood elves look and feel like true high elves.. the irony.

/hairflip.

Except true High elves would never side with orcs and trolls but with humans and dwarves instead.

So High elves are still an Alliance thing

[Vaedan]

Ough, yes-yes, let's make VE-paladins with a special void ability. It's like Light, but Void. There aren't any differences between those opposites power energies. And it's just a little logic breaking just for "high elves" for which you now debate and get this avatar. And then you will wonder why, thanks to you, the lore is already slipping to the bottom. No compromises and no "custom".

There is no contradiction to the lore. There are healing spells based on shadow/void - Shadow Mend. Shadow Covenant. It sets precedent for any other future implementation of healing techniques used on the Void. What we've been discussing here was Void Knight as a possible "class skin" for paladins. That means it is separate class in the lore which uses the paladin class mechanics, so once again, it is not actually paladin (as a lore class) using a Void (lorewise). It's all around a paladin class (gameplay wise) being closest representation of Void Knight (a lore class), if that ever comes to be.

With all the fuzz going on and everyone getting blue eyes, there is one thing that is pretty clear.

Blood elves look and feel like true high elves.. the irony.

/hairflip.

I guess it's pretty subjective. As for me, when I'm on the Horde, I don't want to be a high elf, I want to be blood elf and all what it brings, including be over all the "high elf" history, since as a nation, we had to overcome it in order to survive.

When I want to be a proper high elf, I don't want to be meddling with the Horde. I'm also sure more will come during SL on that matter and the Alliance high elves will get more options.

[Tinniel]

Except true High elves would never side with orcs and trolls but with humans and dwarves instead.

So High elves are still an Alliance thing

Yes, High Elves only Alliance supporters, but not the void and void lovers as ren'dorei

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There is no contradiction to the lore. There are healing spells based on shadow/void - Shadow Mend. Shadow Covenant. It sets precedent for any other future implementation of healing techniques used on the Void. What we've been discussing here was Void Knight as a possible "class skin" for paladins. That means it is separate class in the lore which uses the paladin class mechanics, so once again, it is not actually paladin (as a lore class) using a Void (lorewise). It's all around a paladin class (gameplay wise) being closest representation of Void Knight (a lore class), if that ever comes to be.



I guess it's pretty subjective. As for me, when I'm on the Horde, I don't want to be a high elf, I want to be blood elf and all what it brings, including be over all the "high elf" history, since as a nation, we had to overcome it in order to survive.

When I want to be a proper high elf, I don't want to be meddling with the Horde. I'm also sure more will come during SL on that matter and the Alliance high elves will get more options.

Only as separate race or allied race should be High Elves for Alliance. And this this clown-show with skins and eyes that made Actiblizz right now. This is not what people asked them and this is not what people waiting entire 15 years. And for the Horde Actiblizz can easily get another troll-version race, San'Lane and other "wild barbarian" race.

[Kyriani]

Ough, yes-yes, let's make VE-paladins with a special void ability. It's like Light, but Void. There aren't any differences between those opposites power energies. And it's just a little logic breaking just for "high elves" for which you now debate and get this avatar. And then you will wonder why, thanks to you, the lore is already slipping to the bottom. No compromises and no "custom".

I wasn't saying we should make Void Elf Paladins. Without Blizzard bending over backwards to twist the lore for it to work, Void Elf Paladins just don't make sense. I do think the concept is cool though.

As to the rest of your rambling, I'll just leave you with this little bit of wisdom:

“The green reed which bends in the wind is stronger than the mighty oak which breaks in a storm.”

― Confucius

[Rhlor]

Except true High elves would never side with orcs and trolls but with humans and dwarves instead.

So High elves are still an Alliance thing

My racial leader fought in the second war against the orcs and on the side of the humans, but a human leader condemned us to death and then the night elves invaded quelthalas. A true patriot defends his nation from all enemies even if they were allies in the past! and yes! some of my alts are going to be high elves!

[Ardenaso]

Except true High elves would never side with orcs and trolls but with humans and dwarves instead.

So High elves are still an Alliance thing

(repeating my previous post with a few edits and corrections)

Although we all know that Kael'thas and the Blood Elves dumped the name "High Elves" (and I still agree that any self-proclaimed High Elf prancing around Silvermoon deserved to be mugged for not taking the name that honors the fallen High Elves), they still tend to the Quel'thalas traditions, heritage, and its culture. They own Quel'thalas, Silvermoon, and the Sunwell and they are willing to defend them - as well as the appointed leaders' ideals, they are the true heirs to the title of High Elves and they are closer to the High Elves than the ones in the Alliance. To be a High Elf is to wield magic efficiently, as seen in Blood Knights who command the Light - compared to... High Elf Paladins who need faith to wield Light scratch that it's now forbidden anyway

The (Alliance) High Elves on the other hand, have abandoned their own kin in their time of need and chose to side with their enemy. They no longer indulge in Blood Elf stuff and they chose now to live in Human, Dwarf, and Night Elf lands, they basically set aside the nobility and the elevated status that defined them. They are now more like Wildhammer Elves or "Commoner Elves" than actual High Elves.

Now, why did they chose to fight for the Alliance? They were exiled? Lor'themar made amends for them to come back and they still refused. They didn't want to kill Alliance nor be on a genocidal/omnicidal faction? They could have been simply become neutral like the Kirin Tor or Argent Dawn/Crusade mediators who would settle at least to try and prevent civilian casualties, even Vereesa's husband and the people closest to Garithos' New Alliance Remnants themselves are neutral and are vouching for the Horde. They couldn't stand the Horde? They could have simply stayed in Quel'thalas or made themselves cleanse Ghostlands to be at least useful. But nah, to the enemy they went, while the Blood Elves were suffering in Quel'thalas for 5 years they were enjoying their selfish lives in Dalaran and human lands, doing yoga instead of helping the Blood Elves cope up with their addiction.

And then they further sealed off their legitimacy for Quel'thalas the moment they committed the Purge of Dalaran - they were pretty much eager to kill Blood Elves and they made themselves the enemies of the state (but then again it happened for gameplay reasons because you can't just put the Blood Elves on the Alliance anyway)

Quel'dorei? You are peasants playing at nobility, all too willing to mingle with lesser races that dilute your bloodline. You are unworthy of the name high elves.

Blood Elves are the real High Elves, and the High Elves today are posers

(and this is coming from someone who was an Alliance-biased pro-helfer)

(but although I would really love a unification of Vereesa, Umbric, and Mordent's Highborne in Eldre'thalas and make it their new stronghold with Alleria as their leader; Tyrande should really allow them at this point to bask in their Well of Eternity as well)

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My racial leader fought in the second war against the orcs and on the side of the humans, but a human leader condemned us to death and then the night elves invaded quelthalas. A true patriot defends his nation from all enemies even if they were allies in the past! and yes! some of my alts are going to be high elves!

to be fair it's not Garithos why the Blood Elves are on the Horde, but because the Alliance refused aid for years until TBC and the only thing that came for them was the Night Elven saboteurs; I wouldn't count Jorad Mace - he was most likely acting on his own

the only ones nowadays who were really affected by Garithos are Rommath and a few Magisters, the Illidari, the Scryers, (and the San'layn if they ever would rejoin their kin)

[Tinniel]

"Blood Elves are the real High Elves, and the High Elves today are posers

(and this is coming from someone who was an Alliance-biased pro-helfer)

(but although I would really love a unification of Vereesa, Umbric, and Mordent's Highborne in Eldre'thalas and make it their new stronghold with Alleria as their leader; Tyrande should really allow them at this point to bask in their Well of Eternity as well)"

No, buddy, you're wrong. Blood ELves didn't identified themselves as high elves. Quel'dorei is just a past time, history period for them and they speak about themselves as a separate nation.
High Elves today still High Elves today. Who real posers? Void Elves. They aren't just a nation and a bunch of people - just a little etnos and a tribe of voidlovers. And don't take on the role of a judge and an expert like Ponasenkov - cause I can easily said that you're a casual and lover of any kind of poop from Blizzard, if we are Alliance-bias here. Ideally, there shouldn't be a ren'dorei and there won't be. The topic of the high elves as a separate race will be relevant, and Blizzard's handouts and such "experts" like you will not be a hindrance.

[Vaedan]

The (Alliance) High Elves on the other hand, have abandoned their own kin in their time of need and chose to side with their enemy. They no longer indulge in Blood Elf stuff and they chose now to live in Human, Dwarf, and Night Elf lands, they basically set aside the nobility and the elevated status that defined them. They are now more like Wildhammer Elves or "Commoner Elves" than actual High Elves.

That is actually incorrect. The exile was not self imposted by high elves, it was Lor'themar who decided to exile them for the little reason of not agreeing on new methods of mana tapping and using unstable and dangerous sources of magic (like Fel) to sate their addiction. They were given no choice, they were kicked out. Blood elves did not give them any other opportunity. Lor'themar later regreted doing so, basically proving their point.

Don't forget that at the time of their exile, blood elves were not part of the Alliance anymore, but they were not part of the Horde yet (they become part of Horde during questing experience in Eversong/Ghostlands, which is AFTER exile of high elves). At that time, exiled elves who sided with the Alliance did not really sided with the enemy of their people, since Alliance was not the enemy of sin'dorei yet.

Now, why did they chose to fight for the Alliance? They were exiled? Lor'themar made amends for them to come back and they still refused. They didn't want to kill Alliance nor be on a genocidal/omnicidal faction? They could have been simply become neutral like the Kirin Tor or Argent Dawn/Crusade mediators who would settle at least to try and prevent civilian casualties, even Vereesa's husband and the people closest to Garithos' New Alliance Remnants themselves are neutral and are vouching for the Horde.

They sided with the Alliance since they possibly had friends and connections there, so it is logical they went for help in that direction. They were not really numerous and had many enemies on their territories. Many high elves indeed joined factions later considered neutral, such as Kirin Tor, so your complaint is not really on the place.

They couldn't stand the Horde? They could have simply stayed in Quel'thalas or made themselves cleanse Ghostlands to be at least useful. But nah, to the enemy they went, while the Blood Elves were suffering in Quel'thalas for 5 years they were enjoying their selfish lives in Dalaran and human lands, doing yoga instead of helping the Blood Elves cope up with their addiction.

You know that they were pretty much exiled for wanting overcome addiction, not just fed it with mana? Why they did not went to Ghostlands? Well, they were kicked out, it was blood elves who did not want them there. As seen in cata, as soon as Lor'themar invited them to Ghostlands during Amani crisis, Vereesa and her rangers went to help to defend their nation, so if blood elves actually showed a good will and were willing to give high elves purpose, they would not went away.

Also don't forget that following Third War, Dalaran was completely destroyed by Archimonde. High elves who went to Dalaran pretty much did not have luxurious and comfy life. They most likely had to contribute to Dalaran's rebuilding, which took until WotLK, so actually longer then Silvermoon's restoration. After Dalaran was rebuilded, sure they were allowed to use it's comforts, but I guess they earned them, since they were there to rebuild it alongside Kirin Tor. From their point of view, it's not hard to imagine their disgust when blood elves, who kicked them from their country, went to Dalaran and wanted to share it them.

And then they further sealed off their legitimacy for Quel'thalas the moment they committed the Purge of Dalaran - they were pretty much eager to kill Blood Elves and they made themselves the enemies of the state (but then again it happened for gameplay reasons because you can't just put the Blood Elves on the Alliance anyway)

Yes, the animosity of High Elves went beyond the edge with the Purge. I guess some high elves still hold grudges towards blood elves for exiling them. In their point of view, it was quel'dorei who stayed true to thalassian way of life, while sin'dorei were all willing to meddle with dark magics and sucking mana out of living creatures. I guess these high elves, who had to endure the hardships of their exile and remained true to the name "high elves" feel insulted when blood elves, after draenei helped reignite Sunwell, now all of sudden looks like they never tortured a naaru, they never sucked mana and they were keeper of thalassian traditions all along. They were not. They come to them once their problems were fixed, but they really did not stay true their principles in the darkest hour. I don't want to say that blood elves were wrong, I'm just pointing out why some high elves may feel towards blood elves.

Blood Elves are the real High Elves, and the High Elves today are posers

I believe both groups have their own arguments for being labeled real high elf and they dismiss the claim the other group has on this matter. Blood elves are in great advantage by ruling their ancestral homeland.

but although I would really love a unification of Vereesa, Umbric, and Mordent's Highborne in Eldre'thalas and make it their new stronghold with Alleria as their leader; Tyrande should really allow them at this point to bask in their Well of Eternity as well

I'd love that too.

[Varodoc]

"Blood Elves are the real High Elves, and the High Elves today are posers

(and this is coming from someone who was an Alliance-biased pro-helfer)

(but although I would really love a unification of Vereesa, Umbric, and Mordent's Highborne in Eldre'thalas and make it their new stronghold with Alleria as their leader; Tyrande should really allow them at this point to bask in their Well of Eternity as well)"

No, buddy, you're wrong. Blood ELves didn't identified themselves as high elves. Quel'dorei is just a past time, history period for them and they speak about themselves as a separate nation.
High Elves today still High Elves today. Who real posers? Void Elves. They aren't just a nation and a bunch of people - just a little etnos and a tribe of voidlovers. And don't take on the role of a judge and an expert like Ponasenkov - cause I can easily said that you're a casual and lover of any kind of poop from Blizzard, if we are Alliance-bias here. Ideally, there shouldn't be a ren'dorei and there won't be. The topic of the high elves as a separate race will be relevant, and Blizzard's handouts and such "experts" like you will not be a hindrance.

Ren'dorei aren't posers at all. They are their own unique race evolved from Blood elves after being mutated by the Void.

They don't even have such a small population, since their forces participated in several major battles of the Fourth War, including the suicide mission at Nazmir.

[Alanar]

There is no contradiction to the lore. There are healing spells based on shadow/void - Shadow Mend. Shadow Covenant. It sets precedent for any other future implementation of healing techniques used on the Void. What we've been discussing here was Void Knight as a possible "class skin" for paladins. That means it is separate class in the lore which uses the paladin class mechanics, so once again, it is not actually paladin (as a lore class) using a Void (lorewise). It's all around a paladin class (gameplay wise) being closest representation of Void Knight (a lore class), if that ever comes to be.



I guess it's pretty subjective. As for me, when I'm on the Horde, I don't want to be a high elf, I want to be blood elf and all what it brings, including be over all the "high elf" history, since as a nation, we had to overcome it in order to survive.

When I want to be a proper high elf, I don't want to be meddling with the Horde. I'm also sure more will come during SL on that matter and the Alliance high elves will get more options.

I guess yea sure, the thing is.. blood elves are high elves.. and adding blue eyes just make them look like true high elves.. void elves feels like second best.

But purely based on what a high elf is...Blood elves are able to look and feel like the real deal which is a fact realy. The only thing that is missing is the High elf tag. Hopefully we never get that tho.

Void elves are still void elves.. with or without blue eyes, still dont make them feel like high elves.

[Vaedan]

I guess yea sure, the thing is.. blood elves are high elves.. and adding blue eyes just make them look like true high elves.. void elves feels like second best.

But purely based on what a high elf is...Blood elves are able to look and feel like true high elves.. just a fact realy.

Void elves are tentacle elves with blue eyes imo. D

Well, it seems that Blizzard went to the road that "high elf" is mutual term for all thalassians. Blood elves are high elves, void elves are high elves...

Blood elves indeed look like proper high elf, no doubt. I believe we will have more options for that on void elves too once allied races will get their time with more customizations.

Also, even now, not all void elf hairstyles have tentacles

[Alanar]

Well, it seems that Blizzard went to the road that "high elf" is mutual term for all thalassians. Blood elves are high elves, void elves are high elves...

Blood elves indeed look like proper high elf, no doubt. I believe we will have more options for that on void elves too once allied races will get their time with more customizations.

Also, even now, not all void elf hairstyles have tentacles

Yea I guess true high elf fans might feel sad because even afther the eye winn, they still dont look like high elves. Reason why I called it the irony.

Yea it seems so.. but..

Blood elves are high elves, but not all high elves are blood elves.

For the void elves its abit differnt.

Void elves are high and blood elves. There is no way to know, only rp can make that differences. Which I believe was the whole deal with the eye color. Pople can rp as one, but not actually be one. Blizz intended.

[Frenchvince]

Now the void elves and the blood elves both have blue hair colors.
I can no longer see anything that could stop Blizzard from adding natural hair colors to Void Elves and other bluish colors to Blood Elves.
Natural or bluish colored hair is part of the high elf customization.

Let the ship sail quietly in the right direction.

[Ardenaso]

That is actually incorrect. The exile was not self imposted by high elves, it was Lor'themar who decided to exile them for the little reason of not agreeing on new methods of mana tapping and using unstable and dangerous sources of magic (like Fel) to sate their addiction. They were given no choice, they were kicked out.

Many high elves indeed joined factions later considered neutral, such as Kirin Tor, so your complaint is not really on the place.

In their point of view, it was quel'dorei who stayed true to thalassian way of life, while sin'dorei were all willing to meddle with dark magics and sucking mana out of living creatures. I guess these high elves, who had to endure the hardships of their exile and remained true to the name "high elves" feel insulted when blood elves, after draenei helped reignite Sunwell, now all of sudden looks like they never tortured a naaru, they never sucked mana and they were keeper of thalassian traditions all along. They were not. They come to them once their problems were fixed, but they really did not stay true their principles in the darkest hour. I don't want to say that blood elves were wrong, I'm just pointing out why some high elves may feel towards blood elves.

I meant before Rommath returned to Silvermoon, surely at that time the High Elves would be enjoying some mana crystals in Stormwind Mage Quarter, Theramore, and possibly in wherever Rhonin and his gang were taking refuge (Ambermill?) but you are right on the part where the Alliance wasn't the enemy of the state yet and that's my mistake on my part. Now if you don't mind me moving the goalpost a bit: now that the Sunwell is restored, why didn't they at least approach Lor'themar themselves and seek for amends I got the impression that surely Aethas or some Sunreaver or probably Landalock (I got the impression he's one of Kael's Outland forces who chose to go back to the Alliance) would send word in Dalaran that Lor'themar is also making amends for the exield High Elves? They still chose the traitors' path in the end; I also got the impression that they didn't join the Alliance in cleansing the Sunwell in hopes that enough Blood Elves would get killed in the encounter against the Sunfury for them to easier reclaim Silvermoon for themselves (just like Tyrande made the Nightborne arm themselves so they get killed and not the Sentinels)

well yeah some neutral High Elves in the Argent Crusade and the Kirin Tor is nice, but I meant the Silver Covenant in the Alliance

Fair enough here, you are actually right on how they really felt on the Blood Elves. I guess they won't be content until Rommath is removed from power given that Vereesa tried to murder him (and here is where I'm siding with Alleria and the Void Elves on their part)