Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Varx]

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See this is the part where I kinda have to facepalm a bit.

Because you just literally read I am against artificial segregation of the races, that I would hope the game would be more reflective of the nuances of ideology, and STILL you ask "well, would you have been fine with that unecessary dichotomy if it had been slightly closer to what you wanted mmm?"

It's a moot question because it doesn't address the core of my issue with the restrictive race choice. It's a moot question because the issue is WHY there has to be an artificial dichotomy between factions, when the lore already has groups of the same race, in different factions.

(And even yet, YEAH, Void Elves would have been much better if made of High Elves, because it would have both respected the ideas of faction ideology and served as a continuation of the HE story)



Yes, it not necessary to make "regular shaped" kul tirans when you have the human model. It's close enough you can fulfill that fantasy with the assets you have.

Much like you can (almost) fulfill a High Elf fantasy with the VE model, thus making High Elves their own AR isn't needed.

So yeah, let's just add some kul tiran jewelry on humans and normal hair colors on Void Elves and we are kinda set.



Literally not the point; I'm not arguing against the faction divide's necessity -I LIKE THE FACTION DIVIDE- My point is that the faction divide should be more meaningful than being forced to chose races based on a gameplay segregation that isn't reflecting of the lore. That's a handicap of the potential.

Or you really think the faction divide rests solely on the segregation of races and models... when Pandaren literally go against that already?

Not every race fits into that mold man. U can't expect orcs to run around sw like any other Tuesday and think it's okay for the entirety of warcraft.

It's okay for pandas since that's their gimmick and their inclusion revolves around it. That gimmick doesn't revolve around velves or helves or any other race despite what the lore shows. Pure high elves have been solidified as a playable horde race just like orcs and tauren despite what current or future npc groups form. It's painfully obviously and something players like you refuse to accept.

Just because something exists in lore doesn't mean it should be available for players.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

Not every race fits into that mold man. U can't expect orcs to run around sw like any other Tuesday and think it's okay for the entirety of warcraft.

It's okay for pandas since that's their gimmick and their inclusion revolves around it. That gimmick doesn't revolve around velves or helves or any other race despite what the lore shows. Pure high elves have been solidified as a playable horde race just like orcs and tauren despite what current or future npc groups form. It's painfully obviously and something players like you refuse to accept.

*Sigh* and why would EVERY race need to fit that mold? You are making so many assumptions about what other people think or believe.

Only some races have significant groups on both factions, the largest ones being High Elves and Kul Tirans -yet there are more viable ones- all there is needed is a certain balance of what gets exchanged, and the limitations of it, which can be done through unlocking of AR, or customization options.

Just because something exists in lore doesn't mean it should be available for players.

Sure, but there has to be a reason for things to be a certain way; and my whole point is that the hard dichotomy of race/faction combos doesn't have a good reason. Because the racial segregation of factions at this point is just a hindrance to the actual lore of the game, an artificial barrier. Addressing the artificiality of that barrier doesn't meant that "every race can be of both factions", but should allow for more player agency based on the nuances of the setting itself.

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Well for me personally, I want black hair, specifically because my character concept always called for it, but also because it never made sense to me that void elves didn't have black as a hair color option (and white too for that matter).

For other people, particularly those that have been campaigning for playable alliance high elves, void elves were a perversion of that request. Basically a corrupt-a-wish. No one ever asked for void elves to be a playable option because void elves didn't exist prior to allied races being added to the game (and more specifically don't exist until their unlock scenario), whereas the highmountain, nightborne, and lightforged did, and had foundational elements laid prior to allied races ever being a thing.

Since Blizzard added the blue eyes and broad range of skin options to void elves, and billed these as "high elf customization", the only thing left to finish the high elf aesthetic is a few natural hair color options. This is asked for by those seeking playable alliance high elves and also by those who just want a bigger range of colors for their their hair. The current hair palette is very "one-note" and more variety is desirable by many. Since alliance high elves as their own race is unlikely to ever happen since void elves exist and have high elf customization options, those seeking alliance high elves are simply trying to finish that aesthetic. And other players, such as myself, simply want more variety (and specifically black in my case).

Like it or not, Blizz basically set a precedent that high elf customization options are part of the void elf package when they added "high elf customization" to void elves, and asking for the last bit to finish the aesthetic is well within reason (and I agree with this). Blizzard also doesn't have to copy and paste all the blood elf hairstyles and colors to fulfill that request either. If Blizzard wants to add more hairstyles, they can make new ones or simply port styles from other alliance races. If Blizzard wants to make certain the void aesthetic is always an option they can turn the hair tentacles into a toggle like the night elf hair vines so that all void elf hairstyles can have tentacles if the player wants them to. And as for hair colors Blizzard could add a few token colors in the human range to basically fulfill the request.

This picture is one I like to reference. It adds options, both for the void aesthetic, and options that can also fulfill the high elf aesthetic, all without copying stuff from blood elves:

Another big thing is that new possible Void Elf hair colors and styles could follow an alliance aesthetic, rather than a Blood Elf one -overall shared hair styles notwithstanding- it's an opportunity to explore the cultural differentiation of a same people in different cultural context, the choices that create difference within the universe -this could even serve to give Pandaren, let's say, faction locked options like hair or jewelry-

In the case of Void Elves, to expand and define their cultural aesthetic not only as blood elven exiles of 2 years -which is already limited- but also to fuse it with an alliance high elf one that has existed separate from the blood elf horde mainstream for over a decade in universe -and even beyond in certain cities-

Alleria herself is a prime example of the possibilities, as she is a representation of an earlier iteration of thalassian culture currently not presented on the Horde. Her literal nature as a High Elf turned Void Elf, alliance through and through, could serve to generate an elven identity that exists on an alliance context.

-and that's not even denying BE's of their own farstrider aesthetic, they could get their version of it to, but that's the point, the alliance ranger aesthetic could overall with that one, but have its own unique flouriushes such as void colors and designs, even if, let's say, both races get braids and feathers

[Varx]

*Sigh* and why would EVERY race need to fit that mold? You are making so many assumptions about what other people think or believe.

Only some races have significant groups on both factions, the largest ones being High Elves and Kul Tirans -yet there are more viable ones- all there is needed is a certain balance of what gets exchanged, and the limitations of it, which can be done through unlocking of AR, or customization options.



Sure, but there has to be a reason for things to be a certain way; and my whole point is that the hard dichotomy of race/faction combos doesn't have a good reason. Because the racial segregation of factions at this point is just a hindrance to the actual lore of the game, an artificial barrier. Addressing the artificiality of that barrier doesn't meant that "every race can be of both factions", but should allow for more player agency based on the nuances of the setting itself.

So what, turn a race neutral everytime an appropriate npc faction forms? F that.

Why limit it, then might as well make all races neutral if it's so inevitable. Then the faction divide is pointless if it doesn't have any real tangible distinction other than blue/red bad.

[Mungho]

Only some races have significant groups on both factions, the largest ones being High Elves and Kul Tirans -yet there are more viable ones- all there is needed is a certain balance of what gets exchanged, and the limitations of it, which can be done through unlocking of AR, or customization options

What? Kul Tirans are on the Horde?

[Rhlor]

What? Kul Tirans are on the Horde?

https://wow.gamepedia.com/Plunder_Harbor

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without a doubt i can see turalyon letting in orcs lightbound to stormwind

[Vaedan]

https://wow.gamepedia.com/Plunder_Harbor

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without a doubt i can see turalyon letting in orcs lightbound to stormwind

Except almost nobody wants orcs to join the Alliance?

I'm also not sure if Turalyon would be so content in teaming up with orcs. He dedicated his life on Azeroth on defeating them and in next 5 minutes he returned back home, he become commander in a fight against orcs in Arathi. Them being lightbound does not mean he have to be friendly towards them. He was pretty hostile to Lady Liadrin in Arathi as well and she is paladin as well.

There is lot of possibilities with Lightbound, but the chances are they will serve as antagonist for both factions in some of next expansions.

[BaumanKing]

Except almost nobody wants orcs to join the Alliance?

I'm also not sure if Turalyon would be so content in teaming up with orcs. He dedicated his life on Azeroth on defeating them and in next 5 minutes he returned back home, he become commander in a fight against orcs in Arathi. Them being lightbound does not mean he have to be friendly towards them. He was pretty hostile to Lady Liadrin in Arathi as well and she is paladin as well.

There is lot of possibilities with Lightbound, but the chances are they will serve as antagonist for both factions in some of next expansions.

It's apples and oranges. In Arathi Turalyon was defending his friend's homeland from the Horde invasion. He has no special hatred for his enemies and it actually pained him to see those he was fond of so revenge-ridden during the Invasion of Draenor. Alleria on the other hand still hates orcs. And since Turalyon is her lapdog now he'll do whatever she says.

[Alanar]

Just makes me wish that we got Void Krokul and Lightforged Elves instead.

The krokul were a way better option then void elf or lightforged combined imo. Idk about the appeal, but they were quite unique.

[Ardenaso]

Helfers just don't wanna play horde side because of mudhuts and green people. I know because I used to feel the exact same way when I played a belf in TBC and I discovered helves were a thing.

what's wrong with mudhuts? I think Alterac Humans who are allies with orcs, trolls, goblins, and ogres are good for an Allied Race to fulfill the Second War fantasy

[Varx]

what's wrong with mudhuts? I think Alterac Humans who are allies with orcs, trolls, goblins, and ogres are good for an Allied Race to fulfill the Second War fantasy

Nothing of cours, I'm way past that. Just pointing it out that a majority of helfers feel that way and claim it's not about the model.

And are as happy as can be now because velves have pale options.

[Alanar]

Nothing of cours, I'm way past that. Just pointing it out that a majority of helfers feel that way and claim it's not about the model.

And are as happy as can be now because velves have pale options.

That claim sounds like bs to me, it has always been about the model and it shows when pale options were needed appearently. Lets be honest here..

[Varx]

That claim sounds like bs to me, it has always been about the model and it shows when pale options were needed appearently. Lets be honest here..

Exactly, that's my argument. So many people in this thread rabble about how it's about ideology of helves that have been alliance since wc2 to the point that if a group of belves defected to the alliance they still wouldn't be happy.

But now that there are pale velves everything is magically okay. Really shows the BS.

Yet no matter how they spin it they'll be playing void elves while pure uncorrupted elves remain on horde.

[Rhlor]

Except almost nobody wants orcs to join the Alliance?

I'm also not sure if Turalyon would be so content in teaming up with orcs. He dedicated his life on Azeroth on defeating them and in next 5 minutes he returned back home, he become commander in a fight against orcs in Arathi. Them being lightbound does not mean he have to be friendly towards them. He was pretty hostile to Lady Liadrin in Arathi as well and she is paladin as well.

There is lot of possibilities with Lightbound, but the chances are they will serve as antagonist for both factions in some of next expansions.

There are many people who want humans in the horde and since the faction identity has already been destroyed so giving lightbound orcs to the alliance and humans to the horde would be logical.

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It's apples and oranges. In Arathi Turalyon was defending his friend's homeland from the Horde invasion. He has no special hatred for his enemies and it actually pained him to see those he was fond of so revenge-ridden during the Invasion of Draenor. Alleria on the other hand still hates orcs. And since Turalyon is her lapdog now he'll do whatever she says.

mistake turalyon is loyal to the light. if xera together yrell and exarch garrosh arrive in azeroth he still loyal to xera. remember that turalyon agreed with xera imprisoning alleria.

[shoc]

Lightbound Orcs should be added as customization options to enable Mag'har Orc Paladins. Just add a short quest about how the Orcs strong will allowed them to break free from Yrel's mind control and they are back in the fold, but still with the Light.

[Ardenaso]

There are many people who want humans in the horde and since the faction identity has already been destroyed so giving lightbound orcs to the alliance and humans to the horde would be logical.

I'm no longer agreeing with Lightbound Orc for Alliance since the Alliance already got the Horde's most popular race

[Rhlor]

Lightbound Orcs should be added as customization options to enable Mag'har Orc Paladins. Just add a short quest about how the Orcs strong will allowed them to break free from Yrel's mind control and they are back in the fold, but still with the Light.

most of the lightbound orc accepted of their own free will

I think the identity of the factions is dead! give orcs to the alliance and humans to the horde

[shoc]

most of the lightbound orc accepted of their own free will

I think the identity of the factions is dead! give orcs to the alliance and humans to the horde

I mean just because Blizzard fucked up and gave High Elves to the Alliance doesn't mean faction identity is dead. Silhouettes are still very important part of what makes the WoW experience.

[Rhlor]

I mean just because Blizzard fucked up and gave High Elves to the Alliance doesn't mean faction identity is dead. Silhouettes are still very important part of what makes the WoW experience.

a lot of people want to dissolve factions to be able to make end game content

[Alanar]

Exactly, that's my argument. So many people in this thread rabble about how it's about ideology of helves that have been alliance since wc2.

Yea I agree.
The part were it became even more clear is that the fans still weren't happy even when the blue eyes were added.
Even tho it was a complete fanservice thing, realisticly the race was already playable for 14+ years and I still believe that and it will always feel likea wasted slot on the character list (void elves) when Vrykul, Krokul or hell even Taunka excists.

But, with that said: inb4, Yes Highmountain, lf drenaei and Mag'har orc also have that problem of just being options for orcs, drenaei and tauren. The ony exception are the Nightborne, because they realy wanted to fill in the gap and show us the arcane era highborne elves. Sadly they failed at making the playable model unique enough.

[Mungho]

Lightbound Orcs should be added as customization options to enable Mag'har Orc Paladins. Just add a short quest about how the Orcs strong will allowed them to break free from Yrel's mind control and they are back in the fold, but still with the Light.

This is straying off topic, but I would love to play one of those.