Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Arbs]

This is the easiest way for Blizzard to fix this, Kill Veressa & than all the High Elves run back to the Blood Elves or join Alleria & become Void Elves.

[Alarium]

Can this thread be closed already? It's settled.

Sure, we'll close it just for you, princess.

[Enkrypt]

This is the easiest way for Blizzard to fix this, Kill Veressa & than all the High Elves run back to the Blood Elves or join Alleria & become Void Elves.

I wish we'd get that kind of closure on this matter. I'm so tired of reading, "But the Silver Covenant!" and "But there's like twelve of them in this picture!!"

The far-reaching antics of the delusional are becoming unoriginal and tiresome. I hoped they'd run out of gas pretty soon, especially after the Q&A. But apparently they want Johnny Depp to speak to Ion directly about this issue. An extreme testament to how ridiculous these people can be, at times.

[DeicideUH]

I never described a rule. I described a logic A to B. Good reasoning for those races to become adventurers.

High Elves don't have this.
Which is irrelevant to the issue here. Blizzard can easily make a storyline about reforming the High Elves, sure, but it won't make sense for them to suddenly go "wow I want to be an adventurer again. I want to leave the home I just helped recreate."

You are trying to make rules where there's none. Each race has its own story.
And about reasons to be adventurers: high elves rely on the Alliance. The Alliance supports their endeavor, they help the Alliance in return. It's simple as that.

[Wolfman31]

If you consider this topic finished, you are free to abandon the thread.
Why do you want to close a thread if people still want to participate in it?

The Game Director just finished it for us. If you want to participate in a futile conversation because you have nothing better to do, go right ahead. Personally, I'd rather use the internet for what it was intended: free porn and cat memes.

Sure, we'll close it just for you, princess.

Awwww! Thanks, cupcake!

[RangerDaz]

They'll never want to do it. Creating two very similar races on both sides with the same race that saved the Horde in 2007 is something Blizzard (or even Activision) doesn't want to touch. They're in it for the health of the game first. Regardless of how much money this would make, it would pale in comparison to the amount they'd lose if the game starts to fall apart because the factions go out of wack once more.

You can disagree with this outcome, but Blizzard clearly believes this is a possibility, which is why the faction integrity matters to them. High Elves will never come, and it's why Void Elves look so different from Blood Elves.

Well, that is a possibility, yes. As i previously said many times, it is their game afterall.
There are always two sides on each coin. My conviction is that the pros for adding High Elves to the Alliance are bigger than the cons.

- - - Updated - - -

The Game Director just finished it for us. If you want to participate in a futile conversation because you have nothing better to do, go right ahead. Personally, I'd rather use the internet for what it was intended: free porn and cat memes.

Awwww! Thanks, cupcake!

Cool. Then feel free to go and watch your other hobbies.
By the way, I also like dog memes.

[Goldielocks]

You are trying to make rules where there's none. Each race has its own story.

Are you not reading what I'm saying? What I'm saying is that your concept doesn't make sense.

What, now things don't have to make sense? Logical bridges are "rules" now?

And about reasons to be adventurers: high elves rely on the Alliance. The Alliance supports their endeavor, they help the Alliance in return. It's simple as that.

Again, doesn't make sense. A High Elf serving the Alliance wouldn't create a home and then leave it again. That's a massive waste of time. They'd just keep serving the Alliance like they had always been.

[Traycor]

Uniting a divided people and settling somewhere to begin anew is a pretty compelling theme.

That would make for a great introductory story line. Especially if we see the dissemination of the race's new theme.

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

And if he had acknowledged all that hard work before delivering his emphatic no, would you really have felt better?

Yes. Because to be truthful, that was the most I was expecting.

'We've seen the posts on the forums, the concept art, the designs, the videos, we see there is a real passion out there, but I'm sorry guys it's not going to happen because as I said seven months ago Blood Elves are High Elves'.

He still would have been saying it meant nothing, except more directly. There was no way to let the pro High Elf community down gently on this one, particularly as they worked themselves into a frenzy of truly believing they were on the cusp of achieving their aim when there was literally no evidence to support that view.

And they would still be as angry and hurt this morning.

You might not believe it Obelisk, but there's a world of difference between acknowledgement and complete dismissal. I'm not speaking for any group here and giving my personal opinion, and even as such, it's rather tasteless to say "there was no way" to be respectful about it based on your own perception of "the high elf community" for whatever throwing a bunch of people on the same sack is worth.

If I can say something only speaking for myself, so can you.

[delus]

They really need make quest where all high elves join the Horde.

Blizzard will never told you truth why they don't want create high elves as playable race.

If high elves will really be playable...60% of blood elves change faction to Alliance.

Now try some math. How many people from horde actually main blood elf? And what it means for Horde?

It's clear that more than 40% of Horde playerbase join alliance. And that is what Blizzard really can't handle.

Forget about it.... High elves never happen.

If the blood elf players left, at least the faction would get its identity back.

[Sigxy]

There's no rule that all allied races need to be like that.

Uniting a divided people and settling somewhere to begin anew is a pretty compelling theme.

I mean, I heard that the Ruins of Silvermoon could need to be rebuilt - just have the high elves come back home, join the Blood Elves, and they can be in charge of rebuilding it?

[DeicideUH]

Again, doesn't make sense. A High Elf serving the Alliance wouldn't create a home and then leave it again.

You are just spewing random restrictions.
We are talking about the formation of a new, small nation. That nation would be commited to the Alliance. The civilians would be living safely there, under Alliance protection. The adventurers would keep adventuring.

If the worgen ever settle up again, will they ceize being playable. Would the gnomes?

This is high elf discussion in a nutshell: someone poses a restriction, we agree with that restriction and say how to bypass it, thus abiding to their rules. Someone opposes the solution with a "no, you can't do that, just because".

I mean, I heard that the Ruins of Silvermoon could need to be rebuilt - just have the high elves come back home, join the Blood Elves, and they can be in charge of rebuilding it?

That ship has sinked a long time ago.

[Garfurion]

Are you not reading what I'm saying? What I'm saying is that your concept doesn't make sense.

What, now things don't have to make sense? Logical bridges are "rules" now?
Again, doesn't make sense. A High Elf serving the Alliance wouldn't create a home and then leave it again. That's a massive waste of time. They'd just keep serving the Alliance like they had always been.

I forgot Gnomes and Darkspear all waited from vanilla to cataclysm to retake their city/island without venturing into the world and then stay home afterwards. I must have also been mistaken seeing Draenei out in the world instead of repairing their ship, Orcs who left Oggrimar after it had just been founded etc...

Players are special individuals (e.g Bilbo Baggins), not the typical member of their faction (hobbits).

[Kithelle]

I agree the second part was pointless. However he said something else too that you're conveniently not focusing on.

He said the same old shit they've been saying for years, copy and paste...something that just isn't valid anymore with the Void Elves being a crack team.

[Goldielocks]

I forgot Gnomes and Darkspear all waited from vanilla to cataclysm to retake their city/island without venturing into the world and then stay home afterwards. I must have also been mistaken seeing Draenei out in the world instead of repairing their ship, Orcs who left Oggrimar after it had just been founded etc...

Players are special individuals (e.g Bilbo Baggins), not the typical member of their faction (hobbits).

That's not the same thing. The Darkspear always started out in Durotar, as did the Gnomes in Dun Morough. They were already playable. Those characters didn't take part in the changing of their home bases.

[united]

sadistics, post the pics




ROFL



Im laughing but also sad

but im laughing way more

here you go mate. https://i.imgur.com/bUmERRx.jpg

I really wish i was lying. I wish that these people could take no for an answer and move on like adults. Lmao

[MyWholeLifeIsThunder]

I see this "he was disrespectful" line too often. He was not. What we have here is a simple case of "I didn't like his answer" & "My feelings are hurt" under false pretenses of "unprofessionalism". Not matter what he'd say, some would not find it reasonable regardless because they didn't get what they wanted.

I'm not talking about some on here, I'm particularly talking about myself, so it's truly not needed to whatever everyone else is saying into my personal opinion. Which was rather succinctly about the lack of acknowledgment of any of the sides on the pro camp.

But it was there all along. He gave the same answer of 7 months ago because people refused to accept it in the first instance, their philosophy didn't change as there is something higher to preserve: The elves that you want are already tied to a faction and a conflict is created - like we've been saying all along - by giving the same one to the opposite faction. Faction identity is important, it's something to keep. Things like "Ion doesn't know his lore" are equally unproductive, because this is not a lore problematic, but a gameplay one. It has always been.

Which again, is not something I take issue with. My problem is the really easy to understand as I brought it up; the lack of acknowledgement of any points brought by the pro side.

I'm not disagreeing with his answer, but the callousness of his response.

There's also something amusing about claiming that there's lack of acknowledgment of all the community work and ideas when that was all voluntary and was not asked. You've tried to change their minds on something that perhaps wasn't in the table for discussion to begin with since the reasoning had been granted before. It didn't work. Nevertheless, they allowed you to voice your opinion, they followed your feedback and endless threads and passed it regardless. There's a strong hypocrisy in, throughout these weeks stating that CMs had your back by consolidating discussions, extending threads and join Discord or whatever - essentially garnering their support to your cause -, to then suddenly claim you were not acknowledged because you didn't like the answer.

Feedback for Allied Races was asked. You yourself say we were allowed to voice our opinion and our feedback was followed, but how is any of that worth it if none of the points raised are addressed on an official response?

Again, the issue is not the negative answer, but the lack of acknowledgement of any of the points raised. I certainly cannot see how any of this is "hypocritical" if it is directed at me, and yet neither if it is directed to "The High Elf Community."

I also see that ridiculous argumentation of Horde bias, when in fact you focused on nothing but this High Elves debacle. Instead some to shut down whatever side discussion was happening to give the impression you were gaining massive numbers and support on this request. And alliance feedback about what really should have been important - alliance races improvement and more customization options - was bare to none. I hope you at least now turn your efforts to other things highly requested and feasible, such as fixing Worgen female.

And yet these are things that have nothing to do with the, again, simple point I'm making. Did I call Horde Bias? How is it relevant to what I am saying? Please, if you are going to respond to me, do so, but do not treat me like a proxy of your grievances with "The High Elf community."

All in all, people need to move on. Without wanting to sound cruel, if you've been waiting for 14 years for this to happen and now suddenly you're crushed and this changes your perspective on how satisfactory the game feels to you... You should change your priorities, because they don't seem healthy. There's more in the game you can obtain enjoyment, there are other interesting races, various stories that you can enjoy. You never had them, this shouldn't be a gamebreaking point now. Perhaps there was something negative in feeding all this hope, but it affects mostly the unreasonable and immature that demand to be heard no matter what.

To end I'll say this: this discussion was exhausting, full of obsessive persistence, spamming, silencing other concerns, immature behavior and unreasoning. You were even able to drain people that didn't have any take in this discussion but just got fed up and now there's backlash coming from those as well. From what I'm starting to see, there is no need for Ion to intervene any further - the community will take their own hands on this matter.

And this feels more like pontificating to the High Elf masses than a response to me. Should I leave you alone to it then?

You were always very civil in these discussions, but the fact that you took this personal appreciation and turned into an opportunity to give your discharges aimed at the "High Elf Community" is very disappointing.

I truly hope you are able to pass by this and enjoy your game. There are still reasons to enjoy it.

I know, my enjoyment of the game Hordeside is literally unaffected by this. And considering that's where my main and guild are, I'll be fine.

[Kithelle]

Except the part that Void Elves are a form of magic corrupt elf. And magic corrupt elves can be made. I highly doubt Blizzard made the Void Elves with a one off ritual/process that can't be replicated. More will likely be made.

If Void Elves have enough population being a crack team, then High Elves have a large enough population to be their own *team*.

[Obelisk Kai]

But also there isn't a clear example of who or what High Elves are as a larger group that still remains in Azeroth. There's a couple, we just met Alleria again for the first time, but they're not out there in the same way.

So, to address some of the things Ion said yesterday. This statement here is very telling regarding what it would take to create a High Elf Allied Race. They need something distinct, and we need to see clear examples of it out in the game world. Currently it's very hard to describe the differences between Blood Elves and High Elves. Even though Void Elves and Blood Elves are almost exactly the same in ideology and theme (and clash hard with High Elves, hence their rejection by High Elf fans) it still remains that it is simple to describe the differences between Void Elves and Blood Elves. "Void". It's that easy. One word describes the clear difference and it's even in their name.

For High Elves to be added, they need something clear and simple that sets them apart. Something the average player (who doesn't care about lore and can't tell a gnoll from a worgen) can instantly see and recognize. This is why Highmountain made the cut. "Moose" vs "Bull" is very easy to describe and identify. Lightforged are a little trickier (I still can't always tell them apart). But they are easy to describe. "Angel" vs "Alien".

Right now, we don't have that for High Elves. Clearly, if added, Blizzard would want High Elves to have a simple and effective theme of this kind and implement it out in the world for the player to see. The Silver Covenant (as an example) would need to adopt this theme and be easy to tell apart from Blood Elves. Currently, only banner/colors set them apart, which is a poor theme.

Here is the big win from Ion's interview:

If you want to be a fair-skinned, light blonde-haired, tall, majestic elf; that is a Blood Elf. And giving that race directly to the Alliance, I think would have blurred a lot of the lines between the two factions.

We now know what Blizzard sees the Blood Elf design philosophy to be. Blood Elves are the tall, fair, majestic elf. And this can be summed up in one word: "Majestic". Their theme at creation was vampire/fel/slightly goth. This contrasted with High Elves because they were the majestic elf. But that's now changed. Blood Elves are the "Majestic" elves.

So, the design for High Elves needs to clearly, easily, and simply describe a difference for High Elves that contrasts to "Majestic" elves. Most designs for High Elves try to retain the "Majestic" design philosophy because it was theirs when the Blood Elves were the "Fel" elves. Now that it's shifted, High Elves will never be implemented as long as we try to design them as the "also Majestic" elves. There has to be a simple, clear contrast.

Anything is possible in the future, but no plans in the near term to add High Elves as an allied race.

Most likely, they would implement such a difference over time, like how we were slowly introduced to most of the current Allied Races.

- - - Updated - - -

I'll use two examples from design ideas in this thread.

1. Swashbuckling Vagabonds: These High Elves live on ships as part of a wandering floatilla. They have no home, and most of their ships are broken down/repaired from the Second War. Their heritage armor would be worn down. Their hair styles would not be the "super model" designs the Blood Elves have. War paint and scars would further emphasize this look. Other races might mockingly call them "Low Elves" instead of High Elves, which would highlight how far they have fallen.

2. Allies of the Blue Dragonflight: The Blue Dragonflight has fallen and is in desperate need of allies. The High Elves are in much the same situation, and could desperately use the magic of the dragonflight. They make an alliance of convenience.
These High Elves start wearing blue scale armor with dragon motif and themes. They might wear "Dragoon" helmets (think Final Fantasy old school Dragoon). They could take up fighting with fist weapons that resemble dragon claws and have monks as their primary guard/troop that represents the race. Blue war paint would be an added extra. The proximity to the dragonflight might give them a variety of blue and white hairstyles.
If you really wanted to push it (this might be too far), one of the skins could allow for a slight accent of blue scales maybe under the jawline or in other subtle areas.

Either one of these ideas clearly separates the High Elves from the "Majestic" theme of the Blood Elves. And they would still be High Elves.

You are focusing far too much on the word majestic. This is not the revelation you needed to craft the perfect theme, this is false hope. Traycor they don't want to do this and if you haven't convinced them it's possible by now then you are never going to.

They don't want the Alliance to have High Elves. And they're being as blunt as they can with that truth.

You need to let this go with dignity and not scrabble around the forums grasping at a single word and thinking that's the key.

[Obelisk Kai]

To me, with the awesome designers Blizzard has at hand, it's a matter of them putting a good story first then asking their designers to work visual ideas on it.

Void elves are a failure not because of how they look, but because their lore is terrible. Void elves feel like an afterthought, Blizzard didn't try to get what people expected of high elves and instead of building something over that they made its complete opposite. And they were not seeded at all, only forced upon us. If people had gotten time to know and like them beforehand, maybe the whole issue wouldn't exist. Heck, there was so little attention given to them that they barely appear in BfA so far. Their big presence in Siege of Lordaeron is Alleria opening a portal and a few bow-wielding generic rangers coming throught. And then the gnome machines that are also brought by her steal the spotlight.

Right now, if you don't like the blue color, you have no reason to like void elves, because their "uniqueness" is essentially that.

Void Elves are around for the duration, and you need to get used to it. If you want to play a High Elf, you can come to the Horde as Blizzard has suggested.