Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Traycor]

Would you felt okay with them hands off and Nightborne side with the Alliance simply due to Night Elf bloodline among them?

I feel (and always felt) that Night Elves fit the culture and motivations of the horde much better than the Alliance. So Nightborne going Horde makes sense to me. However, we seem to be drifting off topic from Silver Covenant character designs. Don't want to derail the thread.

[Paraka]

Holy hell now i see, why did i even bother responding to you?

Jumping the gun early for a knee-jerk, aren't we?

Someone even said one the reasons I'd know this would be a thing.

We have better options and more possibilities open to us as Horde.

If there is one ace Alliance loves more of, it's Elves.

[RangerDaz]

Sounds like a fun trade off! Unfortunately, those undead males have nothing distinct about them. Their design is based almost entirely around the face mask. I'm sure Blizz could come up with something, but as is they would be insufficient. Maybe if they blended their design with the Wretched?

Well they are the Wrath of the Lich King San'layn models, a mixture of blood elf and night elf models.
I am sure Blizzard could come with many cosmetic ideas for undead rangers / vampiric elves.
These are the undead elves existing in WoW lore, that is why i mentioned them.


actually they tried to give the vampiric look to void elves, as their haircuts seem inspired in the dracula franchises.

[Sorrior]

I admit, I actually really like the painted elf look from WC2. Runes, rangers, runestones, and sleek ships. Elves were quick and deadly, and not all about arcane mastery, but knowledge and skill borne from long lifespans and countless hours of practice. Bring that feel, and I'll support High Elves.

Sadly seems very few remember elven rangers

[Traycor]

Racial Ability Ideas:

On The Move: Increases flight path speed by 10%.
Perception: Increases your stealth detection.
Nimble Feet: Increases your Agility by X (scales with level).
Troll bane: Experience gains from killing trolls increased by 20%.
- An ability similar to Hunter Disengage?
- Bring back Mana tap?

Your thoughts and ideas?

[Martymark]

Meanwhile in other threads, Alliance fans post about how their Allied races are just Humans and Elves and it's unfair Horde Bias they they don't have more monster races like Vulpera and Sethrak.

[Jastall]

How about Alliance gets High Elves:

And for the counterpart, horde gets Undead Elves (dark rangers, San'layn):

No. Enough freaking elves. There's four flavors of them to choose from now, far more than any other species, and we just got back from the most elf heavy expansion ever. Let other races get some love for pete's sake, and if you want to play a High Elf roll Horde and have fun.

[FlubberPuddy]

Firstly because I am curious to see what the experience is like on the other side of being accused of twisting a dev's words. I mean Ion came out and said High Elves were already playable when asked about playable High Elves and pro High Elfers have been falling over themselves to twist HIS words to mean High Elves still might happen. I suspect you'll do much the same thing in response or ignore this point.

No pro-helf person is twisting his words. His literal quote is, "High Elves? Spoilers guys, Blood Elves are pretty much High Elves. Void Elves also are another flavor of High Elves." That's it, that's his quote. We're not twisting anything. We're just saying "pretty much" doesn't satisfy the High Elf crowd. That's all the position have taken from his quote. When you can look at Mag'har and see all the customization they're getting, with multiple orc clans. No compromise. Therefore, that fact that Ion 2014 as you mentioned, spoke about Mag'har and High Elves hand-in-hand. Should show that High Elves induction as a playable race shouldn't have any compromises either.

Actually I think you'll find you are the one being intentionally obtuse. After all, I am not saying that they were lying or that they were wrong. Merely that what they said does nothing to contradict my supposition Void Elves are a compromise to give the Alliance a High Elf model without giving them High Elves. I'd only be obtuse if I was saying that what the devs were saying is flat out wrong and they don't really mean that, which I am not.

You're trying to say their reasoning doesn't contradict your "Void Elves are a compromise to give Alliance High Elf model without High Elves" yet you're using this reasoning to justify not adding High Elves. That is what contradicts your supposition. You're trying to call Void Elves a compromise yourself when the devs didn't mention it as so. This is your own made up point. That's what's being disproved: they are not a compromise to High Elves, since player feedback was never a consideration when creating them.

You are passive-aggresively saying their wrong by continuing to say, "Void Elves are the compromise for High Elves." So yeah you are being obtuse at this point. You don't need to explicitly state you think they're wrong, your opinions/comments on the matter show this implicitly.

You should talk to Northem. He was predicting Alleria's return for years. As the racial leader of Alliance High Elves. You are right that an elf counterpart was needed to Nightborne;but you still seem desperate to avoid the logical conclusion as to why Void Elves were created as that counterpoint, rather than High Elves.

Who cares if a person was predicting how Alleria would return? Does he work for Blizzard? Does he know Blizzard's story ideas 2-4 years into the future? NO ONE could suspect Void Elves being a thing, it's completely out of the blue. There's nothing desperate about this, Vereesa is the one leading the Silver Covenant, why the hell would Alleria have to be the one bringing High Elves back? Besides it doesn't take a rocket science to say that Alleria's story took the turn it did to bring about Void Elves, not the other way around unlike most of the other Allied Races. Void Elves seem to be added to fit into the Allied Race system rather than naturally being absorbed into it like the other races.

So why not now? The storyline could easily have been written to have Alleria come back and lead the Alliance High Elves. Why create Void Elves from almost nothing instead? If they hadn't added either you could argue High Elves were being held in reserve. It seems to be they almost bent over backwards NOT to add them.

You're asking me to give you reason only Blizzard can know, they're the one that controls the main storyline for WoW. Again, no one knew that Void Elves were coming, that Alleria's return to story would be like this, this is completely new lore we're stepping into. No one but Blizzard can know that.

Well they are playable now. Ask Ion. You are of course in favour of listening to what the devs say right? I mean Ion was even flat out asked and he sniggered.
As for the interview you quote, again, where do I say that what they are saying is wrong? Nothing they say contradicts what I have said elsewhere.

I am in favor of taking what the devs say at face-value. Even though this has time and again been proven to not likely be the real truth as well. Case in point, Zandalari Druid dino forms, where Ion also literally said only their Travel form would be Dino specific because they considered Bear and Cat form to be about those animals specifically. Lo and behold we have all Dino related forms for Zandalari Druids. This is more recent than his HE quote as well, so just because devs say one thing doesn't mean that's something they'll always follow through with, just like regular people they change their minds.

High Elves are incredibly unlikely to be added to the Alliance. You have made a big show of taking the developers at face value whilst pushing your point. It is hypocrisy to discount the most senior developer ruling out Alliance High Elves on the grounds that they are already playable.

As for you trying to predict what Allied races are coming next based on a sixth sense of Blizzard's business model...now that IS reaching.

It's also hypocrisy to discount a Blizzard Producer (the person paying Ion's checks) say as well. The fact of the matter is this: High Elves weren't added. Lots of High Elf fans still want them, Void Elves do not satisfy that niche. Blizzard asked their players tell us which races you would like to see. The High Elf fans are thus giving their feedback, just like anyone else who wants any other race to be playable.

No one cares about how many years you've spent arguing against the fact, this isn't about you or me or anyone in particular. High Elf fans are letting Blizzard know, "hey VEs, they don't cut it. we don't want exiled Blood Elves, we want actual Quel'dorei like Silver Covenant etc that have been loyal to Alliance since WoW's inception."

And lmao it doesn't take a sixth sense to know that when any company is unveiling their "new shiny" they're only going to be discussing and focusing on that "new shiny". If Ion even mentioned that High Elves were coming down the line then that would be a PR shit-storm/shooting yourself in the foot. Also doesn't take a sixth sense to know that Blizzard likes to pace their content, this entire expansion has been about content pacing. Any MMO business works off of pacing. This is not sixth sense stuff, this is common sense stuff. I'm sorry if you are not that shrewd in this aspect.

Feedback on Void Elves are already showing their unsatisfying, this much is obvious. It's only a matter of time until High Elves like the Silver Covenant are added. No other race deserves an Allied Race spot as much as them, this system is pretty much designed for them. No other race also has been requested for this long and still hasn't died down. Void Elf release didn't do anything to quell the request for High Elves, it added more fuel to the fire.

[Traycor]

Sadly seems very few remember elven rangers

Thematically, I think they could call Silver Covenant Warriors, Rogues, and Hunters by the title of Ranger. They all fit, really. It would be sweet if NPCs called High Elves of those three classes by Ranger in quest dialogue instead of their actual class. If they could earn the title of Ranger, that would be sweet!

- - - Updated - - -

As every other allied race, they could have only one mount, ground mount.. lets not fan fictioning about new species we never heard about in warcraft. The unicorn mount would do.

While the player only gets 1 racial ground mount, the races themselves have their specific kind of air mount for flight paths at encampments and quest hubs. It's part of the design flavor of the race and does make a difference. They make up new creatures/models all the time, so I don't see the harm in suggesting a new air mount that fits their theme well and creates strong racial identity separate from Blood Elves.

[RangerDaz]

Thematically, I think they could call Silver Covenant Warriors, Rogues, and Hunters by the title of Ranger. They all fit, really. It would be sweet if NPCs called High Elves of those three classes by Ranger in quest dialogue instead of their actual class. If they could earn the title of Ranger, that would be sweet!

Warcraft 1 elves were priests. They should also be priests and mages as well (after all they were highborne outcasts from night elf society). I would take warriors off, as the original blood elves from Burning Crusade expansion weren't warriors. The blood elves also learnt the paladin way after abusing the light powers of a naaru, so I would cut off paladins as well.

My feeling is that the closest high elves are to plate classes are spell breakers (warcraft 3):
http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Blood_Elf_Spellbreaker


So i would make the following classes:
- hunter;
- rogue;
- monk (any race can learn monk, as long as they are friends with the pandaren);
- priest;
- mage.

Possibly death knight.


For the horde undead elves (dark rangers / san'layn) i would choose the following classes:

- death knight
- hunter
- rogue
- priest (shadow)
- mage
- warlock


**** UPDATE *****

After reading comments below, i agree warrior and paladin should be High Elf Classes, Warrior also an Undead Elf Class, and Death Knights only for Undead Elves.

[The Stormbringer]

Sadly seems very few remember elven rangers

Pepperidge Farm remembers.

Elven Rangers were big back in the hayday of WC2. They started as simple 'Archers' but upgraded to 'Rangers' with that awesome +3 damage, while trolls got passive regeneration. And of course, their ships were the backbone of the navy with the sleek Elven Destroyers and their Unicorn emblem. Admittedly it sounded like they were manned mostly by Humans, but the construction was clearly 'superior' quality.

If I had to go with Racials, I think I'd go with an ability similar to Shadowmeld or Camouflage (with a similar Night Elf boost to Stealth for Stealth classes), something to increase movement or mounted speed, a boost to herbalism perhaps, and maybe even a straight-up boost to attack range (by 3-5 yards) for most abilities. It might be a good race to open up a new profession, Runecrafting. Could be a sort of fusion of Alchemy, Inscription, and Enchanting.

[Traycor]

Warcraft 1 elves were priests. They should also be priests and mages as well (after all they were highborne outcasts from night elf society). I would take warriors off, as the original blood elves from Burning Crusade expansion weren't warriors. The blood elves also learnt the paladin way after abusing the light powers of a naaru, so I would cut off paladins as well.

My feeling is that the closest high elves are to plate classes are spell breakers (warcraft 3):
http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Blood_Elf_Spellbreaker


So i would make the following classes:
- hunter;
- rogue;
- monk (any race can learn monk, as long as they are friends with the pandaren);
- priest;
- mage.

Possibly death knight.

Assume you mean Warcraft 3? But yes, priests and mages are a must as well. I would main a Quel'dorei mage. However, there was an armored high elf swordsman in WC3. They also had engineers that built towers and such, but we don't have a tinker class. Paladin also seems right, but it might be offering too many classes.

Death Knight makes a lot of sense because of all the High Elves the Lich King wiped out. And many would have been at least loosely loyal to the Alliance at their time of death.

[Jokubas]

Now that it's marinated for a bit, I think these designs with a unicorn tabard (new design) and feathers on the belt would work nicely. Maybe if the feathers were added so they hung down over the pants. Just two or three feathers would be enough.

Like this maybe?

I did one light feather, and one feather based off the color of Alleria's cape. The unicorn logo was taken from the high elven ships. In Warcraft II and World of Warcraft, that crest was white, but I dulled it a bit here so it didn't stand out too much.

[Traycor]

Like this maybe?

I did one light feather, and one feather based off the color of Alleria's cape. The unicorn logo was taken from the high elven ships. In Warcraft II and World of Warcraft, that crest was white, but I dulled it a bit here so it didn't stand out too much.

These changes look great! The feathers help. If Blizzard does go with the unicorn logo, I assume they would update it to look like a sunrunner horn instead of a straight horn.

[Andromedes]

Looks good, maybe too simple but i like it. Now i was thinking what about use this symbol on current silver covenant tabard? Make the unicorn blue and slap it on the white spot, which represents sun i guess? I mean it is just an idea, it was not meant to be command i would do it myself, if i had access to PC right now.

[Traycor]

If I had to go with Racials, I think I'd go with an ability similar to Shadowmeld or Camouflage (with a similar Night Elf boost to Stealth for Stealth classes), something to increase movement or mounted speed, a boost to herbalism perhaps, and maybe even a straight-up boost to attack range (by 3-5 yards) for most abilities. It might be a good race to open up a new profession, Runecrafting. Could be a sort of fusion of Alchemy, Inscription, and Enchanting.

If they had Shadowmeld/Camouflage and movement speed, they would be too similar to Night Elf racials. The boost to attack range seems VERY interesting, and would work well with all their themes. Me likey.

[KrakHed]

Thread Suggestions So Far:
New standing animation
Different facial expression
New eye colors (purple, gold, yellow, white)
Wild, unkempt or messy hair
Jungle/forest hair
Tabard with Unicorn Design
Ear Variation (maybe with scars?)

Well, I felt I'd grace this thread with my own two cents as to why I feel blizzard made the choices they did.

Firstly, there's a clear biological distinction between Mag'har and green orcs. The difference between Blood Elves and High Elves is much less visible. Hell, High Elves used to be described as having green eyes. In the TBC beta, there was no physical distinction between Blood and High Elves until people created an extremely popular headcanon that the eye color was due to fel energies. And then that headcanon was promoted, and Alleria and other High Elves were no longer allowed to have green eyes.

Thing is, eye color doesn't actually matter to whether or not you're a Blood Elf. Any random High Elf could probably reintegrate any time they wanted, no change in eye color, and they'd fit right in. It's primarily a political distinction.

Because of this, I feel that Blizzard wanted to make a clearer physical distinction, not just eye color and a bit of paint. However, I feel the implementation was kind of silly. Really now. Void Elves? High Elf fans actually like the purity of their race so much that I've even seen them think the more tan complexions that Blood Elves can have are the result of Fel corruption.

But still, I'm a nitpicker myself. I've got my fair share of complaints about just about anything, so I don't really want to actively deny someone what they want even if I think that High Elves kind of distract from the Blood Elf story and that of other races on the Alliance that are actually playable. I think that as a playable race, things could get even worse in that department. Blizzard probably thinks on some level that they're supposed to be a few scraps, and that their culture is fading out. But I'm going to ignore that.

What are the real differences between High Elves and Blood Elves? Not much. High Elves have lower population, political views opposed to that of the Blood Elves, and are often those who spent more time outside Silvermoon. So your idea of them being more outdoorsy than most Blood Elves is a good start. The advantage of a small population that's separated from their main center of culture is also the potential to more radically change their ways or take up new ideas.

The Silver Covenant is a militant faction. Mostly soldiers of one kind or another, if you think about it. The kinds of Elves who left Silvermoon to participate in various conflicts. And what have they been doing lately? That's an important question, because I like the idea of things returning from previous expansions. The Silver Covenant was part of the campaign on the Isle of Thunder.

It'd be interesting if they actually picked up some Mogu sorcery and tech, even figured out how to empower themselves with it so that they wouldn't be dependent on the Sunwell if the Blood Elves ever decided to cut them off. Perhaps borrowing a few other influences that they liked. Then you can give their eyes actual lightning blue with spark effects or something. Maybe a few other features as well.

And hell, giving them big 80's hair could work if they've got an electrical charge built up! Go put sparks in it like Dark Irons have in their beards, but electricity.

[Traycor]

Looks good, maybe too simple but i like it. Now i was thinking what about use this symbol on current silver covenant tabard? Make the unicorn blue and slap it on the white spot, which represents sun i guess? I mean it is just an idea, it was not meant to be command i would do it myself, if i had access to PC right now.

I love alternatives, so how would you make it less simple? It needs to fit any class and be Quel'dorei iconic. More armor? Bigger pieces?

[Amaterasu65]

I'm Alliance and was kinda against the whole high elf thing, especially after we got the Void Elves.

However, Silver Covenant, an Alliance faction consisted by High Elf rangers makes sense. They are part of the Alliance, they've already been given focus with MoP. The faction should have been recruited by Jaina and Alleria. It's actually the best allied race that should side with the Alliance at the moment, even more than the Kultirans who had their ties cut off, while the Silver Covenant assisted the Alliance in the Isle of Thunder.

Even if game-play wise we've already gotten the BE recolors via Void Elf, it's still within Blizzard's grasp to give us those elves. They are part of the Alliance. Vereesa is an anti-Horde fanatic. This addition makes sense from all aspects.

[Traycor]

In the TBC beta, there was no physical distinction between Blood and High Elves until people created an extremely popular headcanon that the eye color was due to fel energies.

Actually this came from Warcraft 3. The early WoW models just didn't have the distinction, which was very annoying

Then you can give their eyes actual lightning blue with spark effects or something. Maybe a few other features as well.

And hell, giving them big 80's hair could work if they've got an electrical charge built up! Go put sparks in it like Dark Irons have in their beards, but electricity.

Ha! That would be awesome. I don't think it fits the Silver Covenant/High Elf theme very well, but it's a great suggestion and I like it. I can hear the Goku jokes now...