Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[FlubberPuddy]

A sense that since they are such corporate shills that they'll do it for a couple of extra quid because they'll do anything?

You ask this in the wake of them letting go of a bunch of their employees because their overall profits have been decreasing? really now.

Answer this then. If money was the motivating factor, why not just give the Alliance High Elves and be done with it? Why go to the bother of creating Void Elves?

It's simple economics and one other companies have used for a long time that it shouldn't come as a surprise honestly: Release something similar to what's actually wanted so you see who bites first, then release the actual thing people wanted. Double profits and even more if the early buys also buy into the later product.

Apple for instance has been doing this with their phones for a while now: release the 1st iteration, then release a 2nd "improved" iteration the following year and have people double dip.

For game development, it's not unheard of for companies to release a side game to a franchise to gauge interest in that franchise: See games like Nosgoth to gauge interest in Legacy of Kain franchise, or a really great example is the Kingdom Hearts franchise (how many people have been waiting over a decade for KH3 to release? and in the meantime they've released like 6 or so games on various platforms which were purchased and played by fans of the franchise until finally releasing KH3).

The KH example is a huge one as it's the exact example of showing that a company makes more money in the long-term by teasing out the wait rather than blowing their load immediately

[Aldo Hawk]

I am not quite certain what point you are trying to make here. Using the phrase 'would have ever done' is used to draw a comparison between something that actually happened and what might have happened, which implies 'some' damage and is therefore an implicit admission that the concept of Alliance High Elves as an AR does damage the Blood Elves.

If what you intended to say was that Void Elves did damage to Blood Elf lore but that High Elves as an AR would have done none, why didn't you just say that? So I interpreted it as everyone would have interpreted it and trying to walk back what you said by attempting to obfuscate what you wrote only leads to confusion.

Yeah, my bad, i confused words and would is the past tense of will, i truly meant could. More damage that those could have ever done. But even, the meaning didn't changed that much to understand the message with a bit of good will.

Yes, that is what a Void Elf is. And? There is a degree of difference between Blood/High Elves and Void Elves as a result. Which is the point.

The point is Void elves are not more than Blood elves highly using void magic, that's their special thing. Assuming that because VE are purple they don't damage the Blood elves is denial, it's very inception damaged the Blood elf lore.

As for damaging the lore, how? Blizzard has established the Sunwell is a font of light energy since the Burning Crusade. Blizzard has established all thalassian Elves require the Sunwell to live since Warcraft 3. Blizzard has established that the light and shadow are diametrically opposed forces within the Warcraft cosmology for years, formalised in the great chart listing the spheres of magic.

Thalassian elves don't -need- the Sunwell to live, it's an addiction, not a necessity, they can overcome it and live without tapping magic, they aren't like the pre-Arcan'dor Nightborne.

That Blood Elves are reckless and pushing the bounds of magic is a characteristic of the race. But it is a position with no nuance to claim that the only way the Blood Elves can behave was to ignore their self interest and pursue shadow magic as far as they could.

In the magical society of Quel'thalas, learning and understanding about Void magic would had been praised and encouraged, even more having into account that their power source contains holy light and knowing that it interacts in a volatile way with the void.

Banning and exiling researchers is completely out of character for Sin'dorei.

Firstly, there is precedent. The Blood Elves did not use fel magic as a substitute for their addiction, those that did became felblood Elves. The reason the Blood Elves didn't directly imbibe fel energy was they were aware of the consequences, even if they used fel magic indirectly. By your logic, the Blood Elves should have gone all in on fel magic because their recklessness with magic should have overridden their common sense.

Some Blood elves did siphoned Fel to get a fix from time to time, and getting a fix do not turn you into a felblood elf, in order to turn into a felblood elf you have to drink demon blood and/or expose to high quantities of Fel energy, which is a completely different thing.

And no, that's not my logic, you are again making another strawman. In the Thalassian society magic is an everyday thing where everyone gets basic instruction about the matter and the most dedicated students learn fondly about different kinds of magical forces, some learn about even more than one. Hell, there is magic about using blood and Sin'dorei practitioners that you can find in the Blasted lands. In no means investing in the discovering of a magical force means Sin'dorei will definitely change their society based on it.

Secondly, they have common sense. They will push the boundaries further than almost any other race on Azeroth, but most of them aren't stupid. And to think that they wouldn't endanger the Sunwell they need to live by banning deep research into the shadow and the void because it goes against their character is daft. After everything they went through, the preservation of the Sunwell is their overriding priority.

Again, they don't -need- it to live, they will not wither out and become dust if Blizzard decides to pull out the Sunwell's plug.

It's -completely- out of character for them to ban a research about a magical force that reacts like that with the Sunwell instead of learning more about it in order to know better how to protect their power source from something like that, the stupid thing was to exile Umbric and his students.

Thirdly, the Void Elf group and those Blood/High Elves who are now following in the path of becoming Void Elves clearly show that some Thalassians do think the way you suggest all of them should, that no avenue of magic should be closed off to them. Given the experiences during both the Void Elf and Nightborne introductory scenarios however, it is clear that Rommath is right for being cautious given the well established in lore threat the Void Elves would pose to Quel'thalas.

Oh right, now it's something that i suggested instead of a well know established behavior of the Sin'dorei, what a twist huh?

If you want to pretend that the exile of Umbric and his followers successfully protected the Sunwell, you cannot be more wrong, if the Sin'dorei already knew what the void would have caused when Alleria went there, they would had not permitted such proximity. But how not, the only one speaking out about the dangers of Alleria's visit was Rommath, the one who banned knowledge about the void and expected others to be aware.

All in all, your arguments for why the Void Elves 'damage' Blood Elves are nonsensical, with the behaviour of both groups and their attitudes reflective of long developed storylines.

What long developed storyline, the Ren'dorei one? With what we have about them a pocket book of 20 pages can be filled being generous. And taking into account that the Void elf introduction came with a retcon on Blood elf characterization i would be more aware of what i call nonsensical if i were you.

Frankly it feels like more sour grapes, still upset Void Elves replaced Alliance High Elves and determined to paint Void Elves as failures on every level because of what they weren't.

If you don't want to accept that the only success of Void elves is their popularity that's your own problem.

You already know why Void elves are a failure, if you want to play Devil's advocate in order to go against the HE request i'm not gonna follow that nonsense and i suggest the same to anyone else.

Nope, the only thing you can cite in opposition to 'Blood Elves are High Elves' is the political affiliation of those Alliance High Elves. I have always said the sole difference between the two groups is that affiliation, and that it is nowhere near enough to justify a separate AR.

Opposition that Blood elves are High elves?

I'm gonna take the bothering to answer this utter stupidity the most clear, short, and explanatory way i can:

High elf and Blood elf is not an interchangeable term, Silver Covenant elves are not called Blood elves for a reason, while Blood elves can be called High elves, it's not a common thing to do but they are.

Asking for High elves is asking for a lore supported character option to be played on the alliance, not any invent pulled out of thin air.

[Amaterasu65]

The 'they'll definitely do it for the money' excuse is just another false hope propagated by the pro High Elf community and it's one I've seen bandied about for years now. Activision Blizzard has proven extremely resistant to this mythical pot of money that's just there for them to take apparently.

What's your evidence? A feeling in your water? Some kind of mystical sixth sense? A sense that since they are such corporate shills that they'll do it for a couple of extra quid because they'll do anything?

Answer this then. If money was the motivating factor, why not just give the Alliance High Elves and be done with it? Why go to the bother of creating Void Elves?

I'll tell you why. Because either the amount of money they'd make isn't as much as you think they'd make, because the damage they feel it would do to the game isn't worth it (proving that some spark of artistry remains which we should be grateful for, I am not sure how hoping Blizzard really are money grubbing shills is a good thing) or because they feel Void Elves allow them to maintain the integrity of the games whilst getting most of that money.

It's likeliest to be the third option by the way. Having their cake and eating it.

First of all, you reaaaaaally need to calm down as you seem too fanatic against the whole idea. It's still a video game cosmetic addition. This isn't a false hope, Blizzard said they intend to consider High Elf appearance at least for VE. Ion said there wouldn't be HE at all but we've already seen more diplomatic responses from Blizzard.

[Priestiality]

Reminder that High Elves are already in the game, they're called Blood Elves now and live in Silvermoon City, per Chronicle.

[Aldo Hawk]

Reminder that High Elves are already in the game, they're called Blood Elves now and live in Silvermoon City, per Chronicle.

I don't see High elves in the race or Allied race section for the Alliance, what are you talking about? are you drunk? are you on something bad?

Someone please call the emergency services!

[Garfurion]

Once they realised they couldn't add High Elves, due to them being playable as a Horde race, they set out to create a new and cool variant as a compromise.

When did they realize they couldn't add playable High Elves and what specifically made them realize it?

As far as I know Blizzard creates the game and the lore. There is nothing they cannot realize within the game.

[DeicideUH]

No, the issue is sorted.

As sorted as "there will be no classic servers" was.

[Goldielocks]

idk how this isn't obvious to the HE zealots still. The team doesn't want to do it. This isn't about what the lore permits, nor is it about how much money they'll make. The devs bend the lore all the time, and Activision is constantly hounding Blizzard to make more money.

Y'all need to accept reality. The current devs don't want to make HEs.

[DeicideUH]

Classic servers were a business movement as much as it was a movement to protect their IP. High Elves do not offer anywhere near as much.

Classic servers have been an on going request for a long time, as was the request for High Elves/Blood Elves. However, one movement is backed by several thousand; or is it couple hundred thousand (I forget the exact amount), and the other is backed by a small minority. This comparison really doesn't work the way some people use it, as it shows exactly why High Elves have not shown up. The support for it that people claim is there, isn't quite where they would have people believe.

High elf allied race is also way cheaper to do than classic servers. And will give them lots of money in subs + character services.
If you think void elves are successful, there's a lot of reason to expect just as much from high elves.

Blizzard is constantly saying we should talk about what allied races we want. Well, we want high elves.

idk how this isn't obvious to the HE zealots still. The team doesn't want to do it. This isn't about what the lore permits, nor is it about how much money they'll make. The devs bend the lore all the time, and Activision is constantly hounding Blizzard to make more money.

Y'all need to accept reality. The current devs don't want to make HEs.

Which is why we insist. They can do it if they want to do it. We will keep asking until they change their minds or we stop playing and caring.

[DeicideUH]

This part is my opinion; feel free to disregard if you want, but I feel anyone of those (or two if they want to keep the release balanced) would make for a more interesting and compelling story with what's going on and potentially coming, than introducing HE's into the VE and BE narrative their working on.

Well, and everyone has the right to ask for what they like. I don't feel like those are all competing. Vulpera are a certain thing at this time, all but confirmed. Junker gnomes have a big chance of being added, despite not having any big hype towards them. There's a lot of room in the future.

[FlubberPuddy]

Yeah, some people want HE's. Just like some want Vulpera, some want Tuskarr, some want Mecha-Gnomes, some want Broken, some want Vrykul, some want Ethereals, etc etc.

This part is my opinion; feel free to disregard if you want, but I feel anyone of those (or two if they want to keep the release balanced) would make for a more interesting and compelling story with what's going on and potentially coming, than introducing HE's into the VE and BE narrative their working on.

Aside from Vulpera, none of those other races have had the same following and highlighted discussion surrounding themselves to the level that High Elves have. You sure can find other races compelling, everyone can. But in terms of popularity, the High Elf request is one of the most, if not the most, popular.

And this is after the introduction of Void Elves, for a year + after the introduction of Void Elves. I'd say they're definitely an easy egg in the basket that Blizzard could pluck out whenever they want, if they ever want to. I don't think the same could be said for some of the other options you've listed.

As far as the Classic thing - Blizzard has literally came out and said it happened due to the requests for it. It was in an interview around the time of the last Blizzcon 2018. I'm too lazy to look for it but it's on Wowhead. Believe me or not, don't care. I've already done so many interview huntings numerous times before.

[DeicideUH]

As far as the Classic thing - Blizzard has literally came out and said it happened due to the requests for it. It was in an interview around the time of the last Blizzcon 2018. I'm too lazy to look for it but it's on Wowhead. Believe me or not, don't care. I've already done so many interview huntings numerous times before.

WoW Classic had a matter of people offering it since Blizzard didn't, thus providing competition. So, in order to compete, Blizzard needed its own Classic servers.

Maybe if someone offered a server with high elves instead of void elves, lol...

[Obelisk Kai]

The point is Void elves are not more than Blood elves highly using void magic, that's their special thing. Assuming that because VE are purple they don't damage the Blood elves is denial, it's very inception damaged the Blood elf lore.

Void Elves are not more or less than Blood/High Elves. They are different. This is the consequence of their transformation. Transformation means to change from one thing to another thing, and to stop being what you previously were to become what you now are. By becoming Void Elves, those Elves who went down that path stopped being Blood/High Elves. As a result, the racial identity of the Blood Elves is preserved and not undermined by the existence of Void Elves within the Alliance. The aesthetics of the Void Elves, (they are actually predominantly gray and chalk white with one blue skin and some purple overtones) are a by-product of the much deeper transformation they have undergone.

Thalassian elves don't -need- the Sunwell to live, it's an addiction, not a necessity, they can overcome it and live without tapping magic, they aren't like the pre-Arcan'dor Nightborne.

What is your evidence for this? Illidan told Kael there was no cure for the addiction, and without a source of magic they would inevitably fall prey to their hunger. Without the well they began wasting away, and the youngest and oldest elves died. We also saw the lengths the Blood Elves went to to replace their lost sources of magic. The loss of the Sunwell was an existential threat for the Blood/High Elves, one that simply could not be overcome by 'willpower'. Blood/High Elves are dependant on the Sunwell. It is the central anchor of their entire civilization, their very existence. It is mind-boggling that you are arguing that limits on research into a form of magic that threatens the Sunwell is somehow out of character.

In the magical society of Quel'thalas, learning and understanding about Void magic would had been praised and encouraged, even more having into account that their power source contains holy light and knowing that it interacts in a volatile way with the void.

Banning and exiling researchers is completely out of character for Sin'dorei.

The Sunwell was primarily an Arcane energy source in the past, but become a mix of light and arcane upon it's restoration. Perhaps study of the void was encouraged in the past, but once the Sunwell was restored measures were taken to ensure no possible threat could come to it and those Elves who rejected this strictures followed Umbric. Regardless, I struggle to accept your point because it's just not plausible.

You are arguing that they should have praised and encouraged research into the void, despite the clear and credible threat is poses to the Sunwell, because your mental image of the Blood Elves is that they believe their should be no limits on their research even when they know pursuing such lines of research could easily kill them all?

That mental image lacks nuance and common sense. They go further than most races in regards to magic but they aren't going to put themselves into a position of annihilating themselves.

And no, that's not my logic, you are again making another strawman. In the Thalassian society magic is an everyday thing where everyone gets basic instruction about the matter and the most dedicated students learn fondly about different kinds of magical forces, some learn about even more than one. Hell, there is magic about using blood and Sin'dorei practitioners that you can find in the Blasted lands. In no means investing in the discovering of a magical force means Sin'dorei will definitely change their society based on it.

Ironically, this statement is an actual strawman. I have not said the Blood Elves won't follow any and all magic research in search of power and the consequences be damned, the existence of the Void Elves proves that. What you are saying is that existence of any kind of prohibition does not make sense within Blood Elven society, despite the fact the void poses a threat to the light based Sunwell.

Again, they don't -need- it to live, they will not wither out and become dust if Blizzard decides to pull out the Sunwell's plug.

Yes they will, that is literally what happens if they don't have a source of magic. Elves died from withdrawal following the Sunwell's destruction. Where did you get this idea that they don't need it to live? Even if you were correct, which you aren't, the Sunwell is still awfully convenient as it allows them safe, unlimited power to sate that addiction. Why would they put that at risk?

It's -completely- out of character for them to ban a research about a magical force that reacts like that with the Sunwell instead of learning more about it in order to know better how to protect their power source from something like that, the stupid thing was to exile Umbric and his students.

No it's not. They need the Sunwell to live, light and shadow don't mix and will never mix, simplest solution is to ban deep research into the void. How is out of character to be prudent?

If you want to pretend that the exile of Umbric and his followers successfully protected the Sunwell, you cannot be more wrong, if the Sin'dorei already knew what the void would have caused when Alleria went there, they would had not permitted such proximity. But how not, the only one speaking out about the dangers of Alleria's visit was Rommath, the one who banned knowledge about the void and expected others to be aware.

And he was ignored. There seems to be a running joke in Warcraft about Rommath offering good advice and everyone ignoring him.

I What long developed storyline, the Ren'dorei one? With what we have about them a pocket book of 20 pages can be filled being generous. And taking into account that the Void elf introduction came with a retcon on Blood elf characterization i would be more aware of what i call nonsensical if i were you.

The long developed storyline of the Sunwell and the Blood Elves, as well as the void-light cosmology they've fleshed out since Mists of Pandaria.

If you don't want to accept that the only success of Void elves is their popularity that's your own problem.

Yet other pro High Elfers have in this same thread and in the past day have argued that Blizzard will introduce a High Elf AR because of the money they will get for it. If Void Elves are popular, they got the money and they get to avoid the negative consequences of adding Alliance High Elves. A win-win for the development team.

You already know why Void elves are a failure, if you want to play Devil's advocate in order to go against the HE request i'm not gonna follow that nonsense and i suggest the same to anyone else.

Just because I don't like Void Elves doesn't mean they are a failure. Their design brief was clearly to give the Alliance a thalassian elf model that didn't detract from the Blood Elves. In that they were clearly successful. Their popularity also shows they have been successful with the community. The only people they haven't been successful with is the hardcore pro High Elfers, who happen to be the loudest at complaining.

Opposition that Blood elves are High elves?

I'm gonna take the bothering to answer this utter stupidity the most clear, short, and explanatory way i can:

High elf and Blood elf is not an interchangeable term, Silver Covenant elves are not called Blood elves for a reason, while Blood elves can be called High elves, it's not a common thing to do but they are.

Asking for High elves is asking for a lore supported character option to be played on the alliance, not any invent pulled out of thin air.

High Elves and Blood Elves aren't interchangeable terms.

The term High Elf is more or less defunct, in the same way Marathon chocolate bars in the UK bear a defunct name and now everyone calls them Snickers. And just as you may occasional find an ancient, inedible Marathon bar in the garage nobody has laid eyes on for over twenty years, you'll occasionally encounter the rare Elf that still clings to the defunct moniker of 'High Elf'. And they cling to that moniker for a political reason. Not cultural, not philosophical, not biological. Political. There are no other differences.

Blood Elf has replaced and supplanted High Elf. A Blood Elf is a High Elf redefined. Therefore, High Elves are in fact playable and the culture, theme and aesthetic of that race is not only available to all players, but they are now intrinsic parts of the Horde faction.

An Alliance High Elf, aside from being extremely rare (numerous citations to that fact) is just a Blood Elf who never embraced the name change and who betrayed their people. That's it.

[ercarp]

I don't have anything to add, I'm just glad to see that this thread is still going after so long. Keep up the good fight, we'll get our high elves eventually.

[Obelisk Kai]

First of all, you reaaaaaally need to calm down as you seem too fanatic against the whole idea. It's still a video game cosmetic addition. This isn't a false hope, Blizzard said they intend to consider High Elf appearance at least for VE. Ion said there wouldn't be HE at all but we've already seen more diplomatic responses from Blizzard.

It's rich to be accused of fanaticism from a representative of a community that has attempted to affect a change in the game for over fifteen years now and still won't take the hint.

And Blizzard never said that regarding High Elf skins on Void Elves. This is the kind of wilful misinterpretation of the facts that leads the pro High Elf community to think they are making progress only to crash against the hard rocks of reality.

Firstly, Blizzard didn't volunteer that information themselves. That was a question asked by the Lost Codex guys who asked if it was possible and got the response, yes it's possible. ANYTHING is possible. Possible is not a promise. And Ion also said 'anything is possible in future' so why Alex saying 'Anything is possible, don't give up hope' is more diplomatic than what Ion said just seems to be feeding a false narrative of progress. This is exactly the same thing that happened this time last year where the pro High Elf community worked itself into a collective frenzy in thinking they were making actual progress and then they smashed into the wall of the April Q and A.

Secondly, they didn't say High Elf exact. They said High Elf like. That could easily led to a monkey paw of a result.

Thirdly, why would they even do it? The reasons they didn't give Void Elves High Elf skins still stand, that that infringes the aesthetic of a Horde race and blurs the faction boundaries. If they attempt to give a halfway house, such as void mottled skin, that still won't satisfy the hardcore and it undermines what is unique about the Void Elves.

I wouldn't be surprised that if they did give Void Elves a second look...and there is absolutely no promise or indication that that is on the cards...they'd leave them well enough alone on the grounds that no changes to the Void Elves could satisfy you and their own internal red lines regarding faction diversity.

- - - Updated - - -

As sorted as "there will be no classic servers" was.

That is such a sad and tired counter-point, and an example of blind, deranged faith. That Blizzard gave in to one demand they will inevitably give in to yours (You should talk to the people who want flying at all times without having to earn it and see how successful they've been).

These are not the same things. Classic servers were conceded due to unprecedented demand, due to a movement within the MMO industry to bring back older versions of MMOs and because they twigged they could tie classic to the current subscription model and considerably boost both revenue and the value of their product.

Take a look at this.

This is the change.org petition for classic servers.

https://www.change.org/p/mike-morhai...raft-community

This was signed by 280,000 people.

This is the change.org petition for Alliance High Elves.

https://www.change.org/p/high-elven-...on-hazzikostas

This was signed by 704 people.

Both of these petitions have been regularly linked in wow forums. One of them was successful.
Your demand, your community, is vastly smaller than the movement that successfully achieved classic.

It's like arguing a random pebble had as much chance of wiping out the dinosaurs as the several kilometre wide asteroid that actually did because they are both rocks.

Oh, and as a comparison

https://www.change.org/p/blizzard-en...ld-of-warcraft

That was signed by over three thousand people. Four times as many people cared about making a seasonal mount permanent.

Not only that, Blizzard gave the Alliance a thalassian elf model in the Void Elves. That they aren't what you wanted is irrelevant, they are now there and just as Blood Elves pretty much ensured the addition of Alliance High Elves was impossible, Void Elves made it unlikelier still. So once again, they provided a solution to the problem.
You didn't like the solution.

That's a you issue.

[elbleuet]

It's rich to be accused of fanaticism from a representative of a community that has attempted to affect a change in the game for over fifteen years now and still won't take the hint.

And Blizzard never said that regarding High Elf skins on Void Elves. This is the kind of wilful misinterpretation of the facts that leads the pro High Elf community to think they are making progress only to crash against the hard rocks of reality.

Firstly, Blizzard didn't volunteer that information themselves. That was a question asked by the Lost Codex guys who asked if it was possible and got the response, yes it's possible. ANYTHING is possible. Possible is not a promise. And Ion also said 'anything is possible in future' so why Alex saying 'Anything is possible, don't give up hope' is more diplomatic than what Ion said just seems to be feeding a false narrative of progress. This is exactly the same thing that happened this time last year where the pro High Elf community worked itself into a collective frenzy in thinking they were making actual progress and then they smashed into the wall of the April Q and A.

Secondly, they didn't say High Elf exact. They said High Elf like. That could easily led to a monkey paw of a result.

Thirdly, why would they even do it? The reasons they didn't give Void Elves High Elf skins still stand, that that infringes the aesthetic of a Horde race and blurs the faction boundaries. If they attempt to give a halfway house, such as void mottled skin, that still won't satisfy the hardcore and it undermines what is unique about the Void Elves.

I wouldn't be surprised that if they did give Void Elves a second look...and there is absolutely no promise or indication that that is on the cards...they'd leave them well enough alone on the grounds that no changes to the Void Elves could satisfy you and their own internal red lines regarding faction diversity.

- - - Updated - - -



That is such a sad and tired counter-point, and an example of blind, deranged faith. That Blizzard gave in to one demand they will inevitably give in to yours (You should talk to the people who want flying at all times without having to earn it and see how successful they've been).

These are not the same things. Classic servers were conceded due to unprecedented demand, due to a movement within the MMO industry to bring back older versions of MMOs and because they twigged they could tie classic to the current subscription model and considerably boost both revenue and the value of their product.

Take a look at this.

This is the change.org petition for classic servers.

https://www.change.org/p/mike-morhai...raft-community

This was signed by 280,000 people.

This is the change.org petition for Alliance High Elves.

https://www.change.org/p/high-elven-...on-hazzikostas

This was signed by 704 people.

Both of these petitions have been regularly linked in wow forums. One of them was successful.
Your demand, your community, is vastly smaller than the movement that successfully achieved classic.

It's like arguing a random pebble had as much chance of wiping out the dinosaurs as the several kilometre wide asteroid that actually did because they are both rocks.

Oh, and as a comparison

https://www.change.org/p/blizzard-en...ld-of-warcraft

That was signed by over three thousand people. Four times as many people cared about making a seasonal mount permanent.

Not only that, Blizzard gave the Alliance a thalassian elf model in the Void Elves. That they aren't what you wanted is irrelevant, they are now there and just as Blood Elves pretty much ensured the addition of Alliance High Elves was impossible, Void Elves made it unlikelier still. So once again, they provided a solution to the problem.
You didn't like the solution.

That's a you issue.

Who cares about petitions btw ? I didn't even know these ones existed.

High elven costumisations are still a strong possibility. Don't give up folks. It's coming.

[Varx]

I haven't beaten my pony in a few days so here i go again.

I personally don't have an issue with neutra races and think that pandas were implemented fine.

That being said, lore wise belves and helves are just like tushui and houjin pandas. If blizzard won't reflect that gameplay wise then there's no way they'll make helves into a seperate race. Come on guys...

I disagree with neutral races blurring faction lines for players of its only 2, 3 tops.

I picture pandas, thalasian elves, and ethereals as the neutral trinity for playable races.

Replace belves with vrykul for the horde and then add an alliance kvaldir AR to balance out the nightborne and a horde panda varient to balance the velves.

[Aldo Hawk]

Void Elves are not more or less than Blood/High Elves. They are different. This is the consequence of their transformation. Transformation means to change from one thing to another thing, and to stop being what you previously were to become what you now are. By becoming Void Elves, those Elves who went down that path stopped being Blood/High Elves. As a result, the racial identity of the Blood Elves is preserved and not undermined by the existence of Void Elves within the Alliance. The aesthetics of the Void Elves, (they are actually predominantly gray and chalk white with one blue skin and some purple overtones) are a by-product of the much deeper transformation they have undergone.

Yeah, such transformation as turning purple, having tentacles (More like dreadlocks) in the hair and being infused in void magic, the rest is the same, the exact same.

It's just another demonstration of double standards.

What is your evidence for this? Illidan told Kael there was no cure for the addiction, and without a source of magic they would inevitably fall prey to their hunger. Without the well they began wasting away, and the youngest and oldest elves died. We also saw the lengths the Blood Elves went to to replace their lost sources of magic. The loss of the Sunwell was an existential threat for the Blood/High Elves, one that simply could not be overcome by 'willpower'.

A cure? who said anything about a cure? The loose of the well killed the most vulnerable ones, and, in the other side, it wretched the ones who did not control their addiction (don't forget, that happens by absorbing TOO MUCH mana in a SHORT TIME, not by not control the addiction itself). If that happened again, they would use the teachings from Outland to satiate the addiction from mana vermin.

Also... Looking a bit into the encyclopedias you can see that magical addiction can be if not cured, treated easily. And that also the state of magical addiction after the restoration of the Sunwell is anything but unknown, we weren't told about it, if they just still use it the same way they did after the loss, or if they changed their relationship with it, and given the situation i would bet for the second option.

Blood/High Elves are dependant on the Sunwell. It is the central anchor of their entire civilization, their very existence. It is mind-boggling that you are arguing that limits on research into a form of magic that threatens the Sunwell is somehow out of character.

Well... Having cleared that they don't -need- it in order to survive as if they couldn't overcome it, i'm gonna add that the negative impact of another loss would be to face the addiction again (of course with knowledge from the past) and the loose of a source of power, not the annihilation of the race as you are implying here, dramatization is a very low to hit.

And again, yes, that was totally out of character, Blood elves don't do that, or did, if we take into account the new circumstances. The original Blood elf mentality was that of learning about what can damage you, not banning it, knowledge about magic is everything for them, the good and the bad, even necromancy, while detested, known one way or another (kinda similar to warlocks) if Blizzard adds the necromancer one day, Blood elves will have the option 100% because there's nothing that tell the contrary about them, is it?

The Sunwell was primarily an Arcane energy source in the past, but become a mix of light and arcane upon it's restoration. Perhaps study of the void was encouraged in the past, but once the Sunwell was restored measures were taken to ensure no possible threat could come to it and those Elves who rejected this strictures followed Umbric. Regardless, I struggle to accept your point because it's just not plausible.

Well, it's your opinion, i already stated why using Rommath as a gateway to create Void elves by the exile of void researchers was out of character for Blood elves.

You are arguing that they should have praised and encouraged research into the void, despite the clear and credible threat is poses to the Sunwell, because your mental image of the Blood Elves is that they believe their should be no limits on their research even when they know pursuing such lines of research could easily kill them all?

You are really focused on trying to make as the things you aren't interested are invents from other people, just calm down, it's common knowledge that even having Light as a primary source of magic, Quel'thalas is not a light driven society, it's just another power source, why researching the void would "kill them all"? Stop being dramatic, exaggerating things do not make them more true.

That mental image lacks nuance and common sense. They go further than most races in regards to magic but they aren't going to put themselves into a position of annihilating themselves.

If we take this into account and look at the past of the Blood elves we could just not help but to think that it's a miracle that Blood elves didn't annihilated themselves by developing on Fel magic in their most vulnerable time.

Really, is not that the lore lacks nuance and common sense, is that you don't like the way i'm presenting it to you. No more drama.

Ironically, this statement is an actual strawman. I have not said the Blood Elves won't follow any and all magic research in search of power and the consequences be damned, the existence of the Void Elves proves that. What you are saying is that existence of any kind of prohibition does not make sense within Blood Elven society, despite the fact the void poses a threat to the light based Sunwell.

No, is not a strawman, yours -is- a strawman, you were making as if my argument was that they should had gone "all Fel" or "all void" and that because they didn't i'm saying it's out of character. It's not true, it's a manipulation of the original argument.

Don't forget we are talking about this: https://gyazo.com/3b050c65eff69d6b61a9cbc9247d15de

And also that's a response from this one, where you shamelessly strawmaned me:https://gyazo.com/e940a031652faf0f10b2b5df223f972c

It's ridiculous.

Yes they will, that is literally what happens if they don't have a source of magic. Elves died from withdrawal following the Sunwell's destruction. Where did you get this idea that they don't need it to live? Even if you were correct, which you aren't, the Sunwell is still awfully convenient as it allows them safe, unlimited power to sate that addiction. Why would they put that at risk?

No, they won't, you are just yelling out loud that you will respect the lore as long as it fits you.

From where you can go from this: https://gyazo.com/539fb097d9b62169df448d4eeb9e74c1 . To say that Blood elves become dust and die when they don't have their source of power? It's stated on Blood of the highborne that only the weakest ones died, the addiction can be dealt with, Thalassians don't die when the Sunwell isn't there, they suffer, but not wither, decay, rot and die. I'm not even saying that the Sunwell is not convenient, please, pay attention.

No it's not. They need the Sunwell to live, light and shadow don't mix and will never mix, simplest solution is to ban deep research into the void. How is out of character to be prudent?

Who said the Light and Shadows should mix? Stop making out things, it's disgusting.

Banning research is not prudent, is naive, and Sin'dorei are a lot of things but naive. You just buy this nonsense in order to go against playable HE by denying the damage VE did to BE, it's pathetic.

And he was ignored. There seems to be a running joke in Warcraft about Rommath offering good advice and everyone ignoring him.

Unimportant, he banned the research and paid for it, which at least has a good moral at the end: "Don't embrace ignorance". The bad thing is that now Blood elves have to carry that in their characterization whenever VE are present or similar situations happen, because if that doesn't happen again in a similar situation, it will be another nonsense after nonsense. VE damaged BE more than HE could have ever done, playable HE would not even modify the lore a single bit, while it seems VE needed to carve it's own hole in order to fit, and it happened to be somewhere BE have it's lore.

The long developed storyline of the Sunwell and the Blood Elves, as well as the void-light cosmology they've fleshed out since Mists of Pandaria.

This is the quote is answered: https://gyazo.com/20678160eccec7818122a15d50533967 . And i question again, what long developed storyline? Because no, don't say it in plural, Ren'dorei don't have a long developed storyline.

The true long developed storyline got stepped in the toes when VE entered in the warcraft lore, there was nothing way back in the Sin'dorei lore that would suggest such behavior in terms with the Ren'dorei. It's a fit Blizzard did in order to make sense out of Void elves.

Yet other pro High Elfers have in this same thread and in the past day have argued that Blizzard will introduce a High Elf AR because of the money they will get for it. If Void Elves are popular, they got the money and they get to avoid the negative consequences of adding Alliance High Elves. A win-win for the development team.

Don't come to me with tales, such statements are irrelevant to the discussion and you are just trying to make me dip into something i never mentioned and prefer not to.

Void elves failed outside being popular. Let's be honest, if Blizzard released red elves with half the lore Void elves have those would get popular too, popularity is not something from where you will get quality.

Just because I don't like Void Elves doesn't mean they are a failure. Their design brief was clearly to give the Alliance a thalassian elf model that didn't detract from the Blood Elves. In that they were clearly successful. Their popularity also shows they have been successful with the community. The only people they haven't been successful with is the hardcore pro High Elfers, who happen to be the loudest at complaining.

blah-blah-blah Hardcore pro High elfers blah-blah-blah VE over HE blah-blah-blah Popularity blah-blah-blah You are just the loudest blah-blah-blah I know what is the exact purpose of what Blizzard develops blah-blah-blah...

Pathetic. I'm getting tired of this shit.

High Elves and Blood Elves aren't interchangeable terms.

https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...1#post50898586

The term High Elf is more or less defunct, in the same way Marathon chocolate bars in the UK bear a defunct name and now everyone calls them Snickers. And just as you may occasional find an ancient, inedible Marathon bar in the garage nobody has laid eyes on for over twenty years, you'll occasionally encounter the rare Elf that still clings to the defunct moniker of 'High Elf'. And they cling to that moniker for a political reason. Not cultural, not philosophical, not biological. Political. There are no other differences.

The High elf name is defunct when you want it to be, of course, how not.

blah-blah-blah Chocolate bar name thing no one cares about blah-blah-blah

It is cultural. It is philosophical. It is definitely political. Nobody with their hand in their heart said it's biological.

Blood Elf has replaced and supplanted High Elf. A Blood Elf is a High Elf redefined. Therefore, High Elves are in fact playable and the culture, theme and aesthetic of that race is not only available to all players, but they are now intrinsic parts of the Horde faction.

The -reality- is that they didn't did what you said here, keep dreaming.

Sin'dorei are one thing, Quel'dorei are another thing, with similarities of course, but different and in the alliance, denying this is denying the lore itself.

An Alliance High Elf, aside from being extremely rare (numerous citations to that fact) is just a Blood Elf who never embraced the name change and who betrayed their people. That's it.

That's enough, you are the one viewing that as a problem, it's an opinion easily countered by what can be seen in game and in the lore, if they didn't returned to Quel'thalas they are still on the alliance, so... High elves are alliance, less rare than void elves, and with established lore.

[DeicideUH]

https://www.change.org/p/mike-morhai...raft-community

This was signed by 280,000 people.

This is the change.org petition for Alliance High Elves.

https://www.change.org/p/high-elven-...on-hazzikostas

This was signed by 704 people.

So what? We are a smaller part of the comunity, but we are not asking for dedicated servers and a different version of the game for ourselves.

We want an allied race. A very popular allied race. More popular than most allied races that ended up released, plus a very good cost/benefit for Blizzard. And I dare say it has potential to be the most popular allied race of them all.

[Evilfish]

So what? We are a smaller part of the comunity, but we are not asking for dedicated servers and a different version of the game for ourselves.

We want an allied race. A very popular allied race. More popular than most allied races that ended up released, plus a very good cost/benefit for Blizzard. And I dare say it has potential to be the most popular allied race of them all.

What you want is a clone of a race that's already playable on the Horde and happens to be the most popular. Please don't make it sound like it's no big deal.