Official High Elf Discussion Megathread

[Obelisk Kai]

Disconnected, yes. For many, its not just about their character looking Thalassian. They tried to compromise with Void Elves, but ultimately missed the mark, at least for some. The High Elves players want were those with unwavering devotion to the Alliance.

Void Elves gave the Alliance a Thalassian option from a group a lot of Alliance players did not want to draw from in the first place. If High Elves are the even keeled, mellow Thalassian Elves, Void Elves are the super reckless cousins of the Blood Elves that even the Blood Elves thought were too reckless. The compromise, in theory, could be expanded to include High Elves, forever loyal to the Alliance, accepting the Void, thus giving Void Elves High Elven cosmetic choices while remaining completely and totally Void Elven. It would still be a compromise. It would still NOT be a High Elf, at least not anymore, but that has been the point all along.

As I have expressed elsewhere, there is ample evidence that Void Elves can convert other Elves into being Void Elves and that former Alliance High Elves are among their numbers. More to the point, there is nothing that says that isn't the case. The option to play your Void Elf as one who has always been dedicated to the Alliance is therefore present.

I note however your important caveat you place in regards to your suggested compromise, giving Void Elves 'high elven' cosmetic choices. Given how often I am told that it is the lore the pro High Elf community wants, I find myself continually unsurprised that the lore always seems to involve the traditional aesthetic of a high elf. The best you will get is a Void Elf that looks like a Void Elf, but used to be an Alliance High Elf and never called themselves a Blood Elf.

However, the aesthetic of the void elves is a direct consequence of their transformation, you cannot separate one from the other. A Void Elf is a thalassian elf infused by the void, not an ordinary thalassian elf who wields the powers of the void as that would make any Blood Elf shadow priest a void elf. Yes, Alleria can switch between her Void Elf form and a normal looking form, but Alleria also came by her powers in a highly unique way that is clearly not replicable (fallen Naaru appear to be exceedingly rare). Void Elves who are created now will be done so using the conversion process demonstrated in the void elf recruitment scenario and during the world quest when void elves turn ravasaurs into void ravasaurs i.e. blasting them with void energy.

Secondly, the Void Elf aesthetic is the point. They are MEANT to look different from Blood/High Elves. Their skin tones are a feature, not an oversight. It is meant to differentiate Void Elves from Blood Elves, with Void Elves representing the variant and Blood Elves representing the High Elf ideal.

Blizzard, or more specifically (more than likely) Ion does not want the Alliance to have High Elves.
Obviously there is a vocal contingent of the playerbase that still want playable High Elves. There's been a handful of current or former Blizzard employees voice support for playable High Elves, so the sentiment against playable High Elves must come from higher up. Whether or not Ion is completely against playable High Elves or its just the consensus reached by the upper echelon, he is the one out speaking for them, and saying the all to famous "the Horde is waiting for you".

Do you have any evidence for this highly questionable assertion?

An interview with a developer?

A quote?

Anything that proves that Alliance High Elves are being denied due to the capricious whim of one man? I believe that if such a quote or piece of evidence existed, it would have worked it's way into this debate long before now, but if you happen to have it I'd like to see it.

What I would like to suggest is that you probably don't have evidence. What you are doing is scapegoating one person and holding him entirely responsible for the decision not to add Alliance High Elves. Not only does this provide a focus for your complaints, but it also feeds the fantasy that when Ion moves on (as he inevitably must) his successor will be more open to adding Alliance High Elves. The flaw with this approach is that it is, for want of a better word, immature.

One big bad man is not blocking this. In fact, far having a deep seated hostility to Alliance High Elves, when discussing the vague idea of what became the Allied race system in 2014 Ion mentioned High Elves off the cuff as a possible sub-race.

Any sentiment that emerged against Alliance High Elves emerged when they were, as they certainly were, considered as an Allied race by the team. They were rejected because they are essentially already playable as a Horde race. To give Alliance players something, a variant was created. That was actually a huge success.

What is wrong with hope? Besides, if Blizzard is disconnected from the part of the playerbase they attempted to placate, there still exists the chance they will attempt another compromise in the future and give the Void Elves a portion of High Elven lore. It may not make everyone happy, but that is the essence of a compromise.

Which should just mean making explicit the fact that some Alliance High Elves can become Void Elves, aesthetics and all. After all, if the lore is what matters to you, what they look like is immaterial, correct?

[Frenchvince]

The blood elves and the void elves have one thing in common: they are stereotypes of the caster, eager for magic. All that concerns these two races brings us to this conclusion.

That is why the High Elves would be a breath of fresh air as a new race of Thalassian elves, they would be closer to the archetype of the ranger, it is this potential that must be put forward to differentiate them from their cousins ​​"more magical" that's all, the examples of this thread go in this direction.
I think Blizzard is aware of that.

[Neverafter]

As I have expressed elsewhere, there is ample evidence that Void Elves can convert other Elves into being Void Elves and that former Alliance High Elves are among their numbers. More to the point, there is nothing that says that isn't the case. The option to play your Void Elf as one who has always been dedicated to the Alliance is therefore present.

I note however your important caveat you place in regards to your suggested compromise, giving Void Elves 'high elven' cosmetic choices. Given how often I am told that it is the lore the pro High Elf community wants, I find myself continually unsurprised that the lore always seems to involve the traditional aesthetic of a high elf. The best you will get is a Void Elf that looks like a Void Elf, but used to be an Alliance High Elf and never called themselves a Blood Elf.

However, the aesthetic of the void elves is a direct consequence of their transformation, you cannot separate one from the other. A Void Elf is a thalassian elf infused by the void, not an ordinary thalassian elf who wields the powers of the void as that would make any Blood Elf shadow priest a void elf. Yes, Alleria can switch between her Void Elf form and a normal looking form, but Alleria also came by her powers in a highly unique way that is clearly not replicable (fallen Naaru appear to be exceedingly rare). Void Elves who are created now will be done so using the conversion process demonstrated in the void elf recruitment scenario and during the world quest when void elves turn ravasaurs into void ravasaurs i.e. blasting them with void energy.

Secondly, the Void Elf aesthetic is the point. They are MEANT to look different from Blood/High Elves. Their skin tones are a feature, not an oversight. It is meant to differentiate Void Elves from Blood Elves, with Void Elves representing the variant and Blood Elves representing the High Elf ideal.

You assume that the conversion that took place when the first Blood Elves became Void Elves is the only process that can ever convert Thalassian Elves. I am saying through a small quest chain, the process can be refined and include more "ordinary" options, akin to Alleria. No, her process cannot be replicated on a massive scale, but another "safer" option could be found while Void Elves study the void.

Do you have any evidence for this highly questionable assertion?

An interview with a developer?

A quote?

Anything that proves that Alliance High Elves are being denied due to the capricious whim of one man? I believe that if such a quote or piece of evidence existed, it would have worked it's way into this debate long before now, but if you happen to have it I'd like to see it.

What I would like to suggest is that you probably don't have evidence. What you are doing is scapegoating one person and holding him entirely responsible for the decision not to add Alliance High Elves. Not only does this provide a focus for your complaints, but it also feeds the fantasy that when Ion moves on (as he inevitably must) his successor will be more open to adding Alliance High Elves. The flaw with this approach is that it is, for want of a better word, immature.

One big bad man is not blocking this. In fact, far having a deep seated hostility to Alliance High Elves, when discussing the vague idea of what became the Allied race system in 2014 Ion mentioned High Elves off the cuff as a possible sub-race.

Any sentiment that emerged against Alliance High Elves emerged when they were, as they certainly were, considered as an Allied race by the team. They were rejected because they are essentially already playable as a Horde race. To give Alliance players something, a variant was created. That was actually a huge success.

I am going to assume you read the first line or two and didn't bother to read my entire post, and instead took the opportunity to pounce on what you assumed was low hanging fruit. I did not say Ion was solely responsible for the lack of playable High Elves. I said that decision comes from the higher echelons of Blizzard, which Ion as the most vocal person for Blizzard, especially in development areas, bears the brunt of. Ghostcrawler before him was saddled with hate and vitriol directed at him either for things he never said (someone else in Blizzard may have said) or the community interpreted him as saying (having never actually said anything remotely close to that). Whether deserved or not, as the public "face" for Blizzard, Ion bares the brunt of public backlash.

The idea that if Ion or any one person was to leave Blizzard that everyone would be fixed is stupid and would be immature. Luckily that wasn't what was being discussed.

Which should just mean making explicit the fact that some Alliance High Elves can become Void Elves, aesthetics and all. After all, if the lore is what matters to you, what they look like is immaterial, correct?

Why should what they look like be separated from the lore? If the process of transformation is further refined, and a small number of Alliance High Elves decide to forgo any farce of neutrality and decide to join the Void Elves once a process to let them look more "normal" is devised, and join the Alliance to fight against the Horde, why can't they retain some of their High Elven cosmetics? They will still enter their Void form in battle when the racial procs, they will still have all the racials of a Void Elf, they will be completely and totally a Void Elf. Orc's didn't stop being orcs when they gained the option for straighter posture, and that didn't involve a quest line or lore justification.

This would build on the small amount of lore Void Elves currently have, not detract from possible High Elven lore in the future, and originate from High Elves of the Alliance and not the Blood Elves of the Horde. Very few resources would have to be diverted to make a simple questline, and it would further the idea of Void Elves being a High Elven compromise.

[Strippling]

It just shows the disconnect the Blizzard developers has with their players.

Not really. It shows the disconnect helfers have with the game. They're willing to jeopardize faction identity and blur faction lines simply so that they can play a light skinned elf on the alliance.

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High elves can be made distinct enough in appearance and faction characteristics as to not infringe on the Blood Elves' "Uniqueness". Lorewise, it can be because they abstained from consuming fel energy that they look different (more disheveled feel, tattoos, different full beards, different body stances and animations, etc). There is a precedent of (almost) the same race looking a lot different in Kul Tirans and Humans. Everyone claiming otherwise is just ignorant or lacks imagination.

High elves would not only detract from the physical uniqueness of blood elves, they'd also detract from the thematical uniqueness. Woodland elf? Check. The farstriders already fill that roll. Silver Covenant magi or priest? Check. Blood elves already fill this thematic.

Also, if you want to use the Kul Tiran example then why don't you petition for high elves who are 10x fatter than blood elves? That'd be more of physical distinction than tattoos or hair changes. Of course you wouldn't, then they wouldn't be the pretty light skinned elf you're wanting. The Horde is waiting for you..

That said, Blizzard just does not want to, Ion does not want to do that, by what idiocy I do not know.

Just because Blizzard (the game developer) can see the issues with high elves that you're too blinded to see, does not make them "idiots".

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Whether or not Ion is completely against playable High Elves or its just the consensus reached by the upper echelon, he is the one out speaking for them, and saying the all to famous "the Horde is waiting for you".

You realize that Ion doesn't dictate every decision in WoW right? Decisions of significance (such as new races, classes, storyline, etc..) are without a doubt decided on by consensus. You seem fixated on Ion, but the reality is it's a collective decision of the WoW development team to not include high elves as a playable race. The reason why? Well Ion (the spokesman for the WoW development team) already told you why.

[Obelisk Kai]

You assume that the conversion that took place when the first Blood Elves became Void Elves is the only process that can ever convert Thalassian Elves. I am saying through a small quest chain, the process can be refined and include more "ordinary" options, akin to Alleria. No, her process cannot be replicated on a massive scale, but another "safer" option could be found while Void Elves study the void.

It is the only process demonstrated we know of that can be replicated, given the method Alleria used is likely unique. Asserting 'there maybe another method' is an appeal to the creators to make one up that would, as you claim, produce a Void Elf with normal skin tones.

Again, this approach sidesteps certain important considerations. The most glaring of which is that Void Elf skin tones are a feature, not an oversight. They are meant to look different. If they intended Void Elves to look like Blood/High Elves, they would have just given you Blood/High Elves. But they look different because not giving the Alliance a duplicate of a core Horde race was the point of making them.

Also, there is no 'safe' way of studying the void. Both Silvermoon and Dalaran view the practice extremely negatively. This is why the researchers have to study it in isolation inside Tel'rogus.

I am going to assume you read the first line or two and didn't bother to read my entire post, and instead took the opportunity to pounce on what you assumed was low hanging fruit. I did not say Ion was solely responsible for the lack of playable High Elves. I said that decision comes from the higher echelons of Blizzard, which Ion as the most vocal person for Blizzard, especially in development areas, bears the brunt of. Ghostcrawler before him was saddled with hate and vitriol directed at him either for things he never said (someone else in Blizzard may have said) or the community interpreted him as saying (having never actually said anything remotely close to that). Whether deserved or not, as the public "face" for Blizzard, Ion bares the brunt of public backlash.

The idea that if Ion or any one person was to leave Blizzard that everyone would be fixed is stupid and would be immature. Luckily that wasn't what was being discussed.

I am afraid that does not tally with what you wrote.

Blizzard, or more specifically (more than likely) Ion does not want the Alliance to have High Elves

It is hard not to think you are singling out Ion when you go the bother of singling out Ion. Accepting that you meant the upper echelons of Blizzard though still peddles fantasy, that it is a case of out of touch higher ups stopping those who love the game doing what the players want. This neatly allots the pro High Elf position to the developers (yay!) and the anti High Elf position to the mean , uncaring bosses who are ruining the game (boo! hiss!).

After all, if we are to look at what the 'upper echelons' are traditionally accused of being, it is of placing profit before the game which has led to it's dumbing down and increased casualisation. Given that motivation, why would the upper echelons block Alliance High Elves considering one of the reasons pro High Elfers argue High Elves are inevitable is because $$$$. Wouldn't they be all in favour of it? More to the point, why would they care about in game races to that degree?

No, this was not a case of the 'upper echelons' standing in the way of the poor, oppressed developer. The likelier explanation is more prosaic. The developers took a look at High Elves, realised they are identical to Blood Elves, and felt that it was pointless adding the same race to the game again and so created a variant for the Alliance instead. Occam's razor in other words. The simplest explanation is the correct one.

Why should what they look like be separated from the lore? If the process of transformation is further refined, and a small number of Alliance High Elves decide to forgo any farce of neutrality and decide to join the Void Elves once a process to let them look more "normal" is devised, and join the Alliance to fight against the Horde, why can't they retain some of their High Elven cosmetics? They will still enter their Void form in battle when the racial procs, they will still have all the racials of a Void Elf, they will be completely and totally a Void Elf. Orc's didn't stop being orcs when they gained the option for straighter posture, and that didn't involve a quest line or lore justification.

This would build on the small amount of lore Void Elves currently have, not detract from possible High Elven lore in the future, and originate from High Elves of the Alliance and not the Blood Elves of the Horde. Very few resources would have to be diverted to make a simple questline, and it would further the idea of Void Elves being a High Elven compromise.

There is no evidence the process can be refined. Quite the contrary, the Void Ravasaurs in Zuldazar are also 'voided out' and no Void Elf seen so far has looked different from the others, despite it being incredibly likely they have already expanded well beyond the initial group.

There is plentiful evidence that the Void Elf aesthetic is the inevitable outcome of the process. Void Elves now possess a unique theme and aesthetic. Diluting that would be a mistake and would defeat the point of creating Void Elves in the first place. Let Void Elves be Void Elves.

As Blizzard suggested, if the looks really matter to you that much then the Horde is waiting for you, where you can play a traditional style High Elf.

And the compromise was the Alliance receiving the model. Asking for more is somewhat greedy.

[Strippling]

The blood elves and the void elves have one thing in common: they are stereotypes of the caster, eager for magic. All that concerns these two races brings us to this conclusion.

That is why the High Elves would be a breath of fresh air as a new race of Thalassian elves, they would be closer to the archetype of the ranger, it is this potential that must be put forward to differentiate them from their cousins ​​"more magical" that's all, the examples of this thread go in this direction.
I think Blizzard is aware of that.

You've just described the farstriders... who are blood elves.

While many of their brethren focus on magical supremacy and the wonders of the arcane, the Farstriders retain some of their forebears' connection to nature, feeling at home in the forests and finding allies in the wilderness - while Silvermoon has many political divisions, in nature the Farstriders find allies that do not know deceit.[14] Intimately bound to the wildlands,[2] the Farstriders are experts at their craft and know the forests of Quel'Thalas like no others, outclassing even their ancient enemy the Amani in terms of woodsmanship and stealth.

[Frenchvince]

You've just described the farstriders... who are blood elves.

While many of their brethren focus on magical supremacy and the wonders of the arcane, the Farstriders retain some of their forebears' connection to nature, feeling at home in the forests and finding allies in the wilderness - while Silvermoon has many political divisions, in nature the Farstriders find allies that do not know deceit.[14] Intimately bound to the wildlands,[2] the Farstriders are experts at their craft and know the forests of Quel'Thalas like no others, outclassing even their ancient enemy the Amani in terms of woodsmanship and stealth.

The void-elves are already damaging the thematic uniqueness of blood elves, they just have the color and the magic used that are different but they both remain in the magical elf theme. There are the nightborne who are also on the magic theme, it's already three races of efles focused on magic, it's a lot I think.

The high elves are not in the same delirium of extreme magic practice, they will necessarily have a different theme,
that's what I meant.

And the theme of the Ranger wearing towards nature will be perfect for them.

Who does not dream of having his high-elf with his racial armor of Ranger blue and silver riding his unicorn Quel'dorei? There is already me

[Ielenia]

Not really. It shows the disconnect helfers have with the game. They're willing to jeopardize faction identity and blur faction lines simply so that they can play a light skinned elf on the alliance.

No, it doesn't. But nice try.

The entire shpiel about "faction lines" was thrown right out the window from the thirteenth floor with void elves and nightborne, and the "small population" excuse was also thrown out that same window thanks to void elves.

If "faction lines" is about lore, then void elves blur those "lines" so much they're pretty much invisible, considering that void elf lore is the exact same as blood elf lore up to the moment they became void elves. Which was yesterday, so to speak.

If "faction lines" is about models, then void elves and nightborne blur those "lines" so much they're pretty much invisible, considering there is no way to distinguish which is which (be/ve, ne/nb) before their outline/name/health color clues you in.

[Strippling]

The void-elves are already damaging the thematic uniqueness of blood elves, they just have the color and the magic used that are different but they both remain in the magical elf theme. There are the nightborne who are also on the magic theme, it's already three races of efles focused on magic, it's a lot I think.

The high elves are not in the same delirium of extreme magic practice, they will necessarily have a different theme,
that's what I meant.

And the theme of the Ranger wearing towards nature will be perfect for them.

Who does not dream of having his high-elf with his racial armor of Ranger blue and silver riding his unicorn Quel'dorei? There is already me

Firstly, I already provided you a source showing that a group of blood elf rangers (ie fartstriders) already have the woodland thematic. It's not unique to alliance aligned high elves.

Secondly, the lodge is the only place we see a ranger theme for alliance aligned high elves. The lodge literally only consists of a handful of high elves, mixed with Draenei.
The Silver Covenant is the largest group of alliance aligned high elves (and they're already a small group as is), and the SC don't really boast any ranger theme. It would make no sense to focus the thematic (ranger theme) for alliance aligned high elves around a tiny group residing in a lodge, whom we've had no interaction with since Cata (a decade ago). Hence why there's no good in making alliance aligned high elves playable, cause they bring nothing new and would only detract from blood elven thematics and uniqueness in every aspect.

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No, it doesn't. But nice try.

The entire shpiel about "faction lines" was thrown right out the window from the thirteenth floor with void elves and nightborne, and the "small population" excuse was also thrown out that same window thanks to void elves.

If "faction lines" is about lore, then void elves blur those "lines" so much they're pretty much invisible, considering that void elf lore is the exact same as blood elf lore up to the moment they became void elves. Which was yesterday, so to speak.

If "faction lines" is about models, then void elves and nightborne blur those "lines" so much they're pretty much invisible, considering there is no way to distinguish which is which (be/ve, ne/nb) before their outline/name/health color clues you in.

That is your opinion, and it is wrong. Blizzard have deemed that high elves would blur faction lines.. they have not deemed void elves/NB as doing so. This is their game, they're the creators... yet somehow you feel your opinion is above them.

You're opinion against the word of the creators... I need say no more.

Faction lines are shaped by two factions (Horde/Alliance), each comprising of distinct and unique races. These races are essentially one of the key defining factors that make Horde/Alliance unique. Each race brings it's own lore, it's own thematics, it's own aesthetics. The AR system essentially brings new "sub-races" to each faction, with each "sub-race" essentially offering a flavor twist to existing core races (ie existing playable races) on both factions. From LF Draenei to DID, HM Tauren to Zandalari, each AR adds a unique flavor to their parent race. The parent race of high elves would naturally be blood elves. Yet, high elves bring no unique flavor to the table that blood elves don't already bring. This is because they are the exact same bar political views... but we already know that their has to be a physical uniqueness to an AR if it's to be implemented... every AR so far has had so. And how to you add some physical flavor to high elves?? The answer was void elves.

Unfortunately, as much as you don't like to hear it, blood elves are high elves...thus high elves are already playable. Yes, there is a small group of high elves aligned with the Alliance...but the differences between them and their blood elf kin are practically naught, so making this minor group of alliance high elves playable would do nothing but impede on the identity of blood elves (who are the legacy of high elves today).

[Ielenia]

Faction lines are shaped by two factions (Horde/Alliance), each comprising of distinct and unique races.

Right off the game, that affirmation is false. As of BfA, it has become false, thanks to void elves and nightborne.

Skin color is not distinction enough, for the simple reason that you simply will not know a blood elf from a void elf, or a nightborne from a night elf, before their health bar, name, or outline color tells you who they are.

[Strippling]

Right off the game, that affirmation is false. As of BfA, it has become false, thanks to void elves and nightborne.

Skin color is not distinction enough, for the simple reason that you simply will not know a blood elf from a void elf, or a nightborne from a night elf, before their health bar, name, or outline color tells you who they are.

Yea your opinion isn't convincing anyone.

Faction identity is emphasized from the moment you click the create character button. The very first thing you notice when creating a new character is the visual and thematical distinct between each race... including ARs. Wearing armor has absolutely zero to do with faction identity,,, it's simply a part of the gameplay. HOWEVER, each race is clearly distinguished from another when you choose to create a new character. WHY is this? What's Blizzard telling you??

From the very first moment you start this game you are given a choice of one or two factions. What does that tell you? The game is about two factions. The next choice you have is to pick a race. Each race is visual distinct from each other. What does that tell you? The racial identity is an important feature of this game. You'll also notice that both Horde and Alliance have different races to choose from (apart from Pandaren who were introduced as neutral as that was a unique feature of MoP). What does that tell you that both factions have different races? That both Horde and Alliance comprise unique and distinct races. As a new player you'll notice that there are ARs that you can choose too. You'll notice that these ARs are obviously a flavor twist to a core race. What does that tell you? Yea you get the jist...

Your opinion on the matter is nothing more than that....an opinion. From the very moment one starts this game, they're given a clear message... this game revolves around two factions who are noticeably distinct and unique from one another.... and this strongly manifested in the races available in each faction.

[Goldielocks]

As of BfA, it has become false, thanks to void elves and nightborne.

You are literally the only one I've ever seen with this opinion. Nearly everyone else can see distinct visual differences between the Nightborne and Night Elves, along with the distinct visual differences between the Void Elves and the Blood Elves.

Just the fact that ally players aren't happy with Void Elves looking so different already makes your argument look really dumb.

[Aldo Hawk]

@Strippling It's also your opinion that HE would break what the factions mean or are. One could easily say that they wouldn't because they can't since those are not the exact same (Yes, Thalassians, no, not Blood elves) and the Horde would still be the Horde and the Alliance would still be the Alliance.

Also Night elves are wood elves, and Void elves also have rangers as we can see in the siege of Lordaeron.

Edit: Even Nightborne have rangers. It's an elven thing to do.

We don't have to agree with you for it to be plausible. We already know it is because even if you don't want to accept it or despite whatever you may say, we have seen and compared everything we could and found that at the end of the day HE are a matter of if you like them or not. And it shows when you clearly don't like them and are searching for any excuse to shut them down.

Also pretending that any request has to be completely flawless is delusional since you are creating a false scenario where it seems that everything that has been added to the game is perfect and we should request for a perfect thing related to it that doesn't exist. However, it is perfect for others, not everything has to please you. Despite whatever you may say, this is the most popular AR ever requested.

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You are literally the only one I've ever seen with this opinion. Nearly everyone else can see distinct visual differences between the Nightborne and Night Elves, along with the distinct visual differences between the Void Elves and the Blood Elves.

Nightborne do look very similar to Night elves. You can confuse them unless you are in a static situation and look closely or hover your mouse over them to see what they are or if you see that they are using druid or warlock spells.

They at least gave them a different stance when standing still, they would be even more similar if not. You know why? Because silhouettes are the first thing you search for when differentiating the playable races. And they have already brought both factions the silhouette of the other one.

Take into account that WoW is not a static game. It's easy to see an screenshot or having a moment where players don't have much info happening in the screen and take time to point with your finger without anything else happening.

[Strippling]

@Strippling It's also your opinion that HE would break what the factions mean or are. One could easily say that they wouldn't because they can't since those are not the exact same (Yes, Thalassians, no, not Blood elves) and the Horde would still be the Horde and the Alliance would still be the Alliance.

It's not my opinion, it's Blizzard's declaration... and I just so happen to agree with it.

Also Night elves are wood elves, and Void elves also have rangers as we can see in the siege of Lordaeron.

Night elves have sentinels, which resemble more an amazonian warrior than a "woodland elf ranger". However, I do agree that night elves in general do in part encompass the woodland theme. As do the farstriders.

As for nightborne and void elven rangers, they're not relevant to what we're discussing. We're discussing a "woodland elf" thematic... neither of which NB nor VE rangers resemble.

Also pretending that any request has to be completely flawless is delusional since you are creating a false scenario where it seems that everything that has been added to the game is perfect and we should request for a perfect thing related to it that doesn't exist. However, it is perfect for others, not everything has to please you. Despite whatever you may say, this is the most popular AR ever requested.

I never said a request has to be perfect. I don't know where you got that idea from? But you're right, a request doesn't have to be 'flawless'... however, if the request doesn't conform to one of WoW's key features (such as faction identity) then it isn't an appropriate or valid request. WoW was founded on a two faction system... a system thay from day 1 has emphasized the importance of faction diversity, faction distinction, faction identity. Playable high elves would damage this key aspect of the game, there's no denying it.

[Aldo Hawk]

It's not my opinion, it's Blizzard's declaration... and I just so happen to agree with it.

Doesn't make it true.

As for nightborne and void elven rangers, they're not relevant to what we're discussing. We're discussing a "woodland elf" thematic... neither of which NB nor VE rangers resemble.

They are relevant since they show how elves share a culture about rangers and forests even if their main theme is not about it.

I never said a request has to be perfect. I don't know where you got that idea from? But you're right, a request doesn't have to be 'flawless'... however, if the request doesn't conform to one of WoW's key features (such as faction identity) then it isn't an appropriate or valid request. WoW was founded on a two faction system... a system thay from day 1 has emphasized the importance of faction diversity, faction distinction, faction identity. Playable high elves would damage this key aspect of the game, there's no denying it.

You imply it by comparing HE with almost anything already in the game and for any little nuance AR have.

And yes, there are things to deny about it. First of all. It's a faction game, and HE are another faction of Thalassians who are aligned with the Alliance. Please, tell me how that defeats the purpose of the factions instead of reinforcing it. Is not like copying BE into the Alliance since that's impossible given how AR are added. Every time with extra perks, a different selection of classes and a new set of racials and aesthetics. Also having into account what group we are talking about (Not Blood elves) and also taking into account that it would not be a classic race, but an allied one, with everything that it implies.

HE are Alliance identity.

[Ielenia]

Nearly everyone else can see distinct visual differences between the Nightborne and Night Elves, along with the distinct visual differences between the Void Elves and the Blood Elves.

I've yet to see one person be able to honestly claim they can tell the difference between a blood elf and a void elf, and between a nightborne and a night elf, in-game, while questing/exploring in world, before the health bar, name or outline color tells you which one they are.

Of course anyone can tell them apart if they stand still, and you're not doing anything else. But in the middle of the game? While you're doing something else (fighting or running) and/or they're doing something (fighting or running), you will not tell the difference between them.

[Frenchvince]

Firstly, I already provided you a source showing that a group of blood elf rangers (ie fartstriders) already have the woodland thematic. It's not unique to alliance aligned high elves.

Secondly, the lodge is the only place we see a ranger theme for alliance aligned high elves. The lodge literally only consists of a handful of high elves, mixed with Draenei.
The Silver Covenant is the largest group of alliance aligned high elves (and they're already a small group as is), and the SC don't really boast any ranger theme. It would make no sense to focus the thematic (ranger theme) for alliance aligned high elves around a tiny group residing in a lodge, whom we've had no interaction with since Cata (a decade ago). Hence why there's no good in making alliance aligned high elves playable, cause they bring nothing new and would only detract from blood elven thematics and uniqueness in every aspect.

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I'm talking to you about the general theme that is described for the race, the racial traits are part of it and they're all based on magic, it's all normal because the blood elves, the void elves and the nightborne are magic elves.


Having high elves in the image of the ranger, less addicted to magic and more nature will make the difference compared to other races of elves.

[Ielenia]

Wearing armor has absolutely zero to do with faction identity,,, it's simply a part of the gameplay.

Ok. I'll bite: define "faction identity", then, please.

HOWEVER, each race is clearly distinguished from another when you choose to create a new character.

Except for most of allied races... that are basically carbon-copies of another existing race's model with a different coat of paint? And in some cases, not that different.

Your entire post about races looking different from one-another is defeated by Blizzard themselves with the addition of nightborne and void elves. Those two have models, silhouettes and animations that once belonged to a specific faction.

That both Horde and Alliance comprise unique and distinct races.

Thanks for the laughs.

[Aldo Hawk]

Your entire post about races looking different from one-another is defeated by Blizzard themselves with the addition of nightborne and void elves. Those two have models, silhouettes and animations that once belonged to a specific faction.

And yes, i'm gonna repeat that Pandaren exist. And they were designed with low amounts of faction pride and nonexistent faction differences.

And.

Nothing happened.

High elves surpass Pandaren in faction distinctiveness by a mile.

Saying Pandaren were specifically designed as 'neutral' (Strange word usage of neutral btw, they choose faction. It's as strange as the use of race so calm down) further proves this. High elves would not be designed with the concept WoW has on 'neutral races' in mind. Which, for what we know, is the exact same carbon copy in both factions 1:1 with -zero- (0) [Z E R O] differences.

[Strippling]

I'm talking to you about the general theme that is described for the race, the racial traits are part of it and they're all based on magic, it's all normal because the blood elves, the void elves and the nightborne are magic elves.


Having high elves in the image of the ranger, less addicted to magic and more nature will make the difference compared to other races of elves.

Alliance aligned high elves are heavily magically orientated.

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Doesn't make it true.

Well yea it does make it true. It's their game.