Has Warcraft 3's story ever been topped in WoW?

[Kul Tiras]

You know, if you play Warcraft 3 (play it, not read about the story like a fucking pussy then make dumb claims about it like pandaren having played a pivotal role in the campaign), there's actually not that much dialogue or things happening in between cutscenes.

There's not much happening at all to be honest in between big lore moments. However, most everything that does happen is memorable, well written, suscint and evocative.

Even the cinematics, you have a guy stabbing someone with a sword, but everything that stabbing represents and how it is done, makes this cinematic alone more memorable than pandaria, warlords and legion put together:



It's no secret that Wrath ended with Bolvar saying "Tell them only that the Lich King is dead, and that Warcraft, died with him", however, since I am an open minded, polite and argumentative being capable of accepting differing opinions, is anyone in the mind that WC3's story has been topped by anything in WoW, or by WoW itself, as a whole?

I mean hell, to this day even in Legion, they're citing and bringing back characters and events from WC3, because they had such long lasting impact on the story.

[ArMeD_SuRvIvOr]

In a sense, no, because WoW cannot do what an RTS can do: because of players, WoW is limited in what it can do storywise. They went ballsy and burned Teldrassil, but for that they had to make the Forsaken lose Undercity or players would riot, and that's just one example.

In an RTS it's like a book, you do your missions and the story plays out as the writers intended. In WoW you cannot do that, and in that sense WoW is below Warcraft 3.

For example, if WoW had been set during the Third War, and had Lordaeron been the human starting area, it would have never fallen to the Scourge/demons, because without it you don't have a game with lordaeran players. It just doesn't work. During Pandaria, if it had been an RTS, the Alliance would have dismantled the horde in the ending. Dismantling the horde in WoW would mean the basis for the game (factions) is gone and you don't have a game anymore.

[Dastreus]

In a sense, no, because WoW cannot do what an RTS can do: because of players, WoW is limited in what it can do storywise. They went ballsy and burned Teldrassil, but for that they had to make the Forsaken lose Undercity or players would riot, and that's just one example.

In an RTS it's like a book, you do your missions and the story plays out as the writers intended. In WoW you cannot do that, and in that sense WoW is below Warcraft 3.

This exactly. The reason FFXIV can do stories, is purely because their Story Mode is single player with occasional dungeons. I do however, love all the Old God shit, and that was only hinted in wc3.

[Kul Tiras]

In a sense, no, because WoW cannot do what an RTS can do: because of players, WoW is limited in what it can do storywise. They went ballsy and burned Teldrassil, but for that they had to make the Forsaken lose Undercity or players would riot, and that's just one example.

In an RTS it's like a book, you do your missions and the story plays out as the writers intended. In WoW you cannot do that, and in that sense WoW is below Warcraft 3.

Why not? ESO has some pretty good in-game storytelling, as does TOR, which is a storytelling masterpiece, dumb side grind aside.

[Khaza-R]

Yes and no.

An MMO is an inferior medium for telling a story. Since the story is central to your character but your character is left intentionally ambiguous for role playing reasons. That said, most of the WarCraft universe as we know it today (Old Gods, Titans, Pandaria, Broken Isles, etc) have all been fleshed out in WoW and not WCIII. Its really apples and oranges at the end of the day.

[Kul Tiras]

This exactly. The reason FFXIV can do stories, is purely because their Story Mode is single player with occasional dungeons. I do however, love all the Old God shit, and that was only hinted in wc3.

Old God shit is indeed pretty damn sweet, though I think they were talking about them in WC3, even if they only showed some faceless ones in the game.

[ArMeD_SuRvIvOr]

Why not? ESO has some pretty good in-game storytelling, as does TOR, which is a storytelling masterpiece, dumb side grind aside.

No idea about TESO but in WoW you can't do certain things because it would trample on player territory and on game mechanics. For example, you CANNOT dismantle a faction in the story because that would mean the basis of the game (alliance vs horde, factions in general) is gone. You CAN do it in an RTS mainly due to no player interaction; the player is just a bystander or observer in an RTS.

[Kul Tiras]

No idea about TESO but in WoW you can't do certain things because it would trample on player territory and on game mechanics. For example, you CANNOT dismantle a faction in the story because that would mean the basis of the game (alliance vs horde, factions in general) is gone. You CAN do it in an RTS mainly due to no player interaction; the player is just a bystander or observer in an RTS.

I mean...Southshore, Theramore, Nethergarde...there's a thread about the ludicrous amount of Ally settlements that got destroyed in WoW with no repercussion.

[ArMeD_SuRvIvOr]

I mean...Southshore, Theramore, Nethergarde...there's a thread about the ludicrous amount of Ally settlements that got destroyed in WoW with no repercussion.

That's not central or instrumental to the game as a whole, mechanics or foundations or otherwise. Also, remember how many settlements the horde loses in return. It's always a 50-50 in WoW.

[Khaza-R]

I mean...Southshore, Theramore, Nethergarde...there's a thread about the ludicrous amount of Ally settlements that got destroyed in WoW with no repercussion.

Thats not what he means though.

Those are just settlements. You can't for instance destroy the Alliance, or even Stormwind for that matter, without major gameplay repercussions that don't exist in RTS game.

[Goldielocks]

It hasn't been topped. Probably never will be.

I mean...Southshore, Theramore, Nethergarde...there's a thread about the ludicrous amount of Ally settlements that got destroyed in WoW with no repercussion.

Let's not turn this thread into an Ally whinefest

[Deleted]

For me personally the biggest difference is that in wc3 we played the heroes, now we're the supporting noname knights/grunts. What happened to Arthas or Grom for example felt bigger cause we were them for a while, now we just witness things happen simply because that's how it's gotta be in an mmo.

As a personal opinion i think the story of Arthas was amazing and they did pretty well with how they ended his story in wow. On the other end of the spectrum for me is Illidan who was resurrected twice and in general turned a great arc into a pretty terrible redemption story, a redemption he never should have needed.

[ArMeD_SuRvIvOr]

Personal opinion but I think the game story would improve if Blizzard went ballsy enough and did things no one would expect. Sudden twists, unlikeable characters that achieve their goals, kill main characters and such. However, this would be such a hassle to do since players would rise up in arms, lol.

[Deadmedic]

Each end boss scene has been pretty epic, the voice acting in the last moments is always pretty amazing, I dont know about Better than wc3, but at least on par. Of note I would say a few where pretty memorable, Kalec and Anveena sending KJ back in the sunwell. Arthas, after Tririon breaks the ice. Deathwing with the Dragon aspects imbuing their power into the demon soul. Each of those moments where real like goosebumpy moments for me the first time I saw them. What hurts wow is the fact that typically these epic events get watered down feeling because we end up farming the bosses and repeating them over and over again.

[Super Kami Dende]

Yes, most of MoP was more exciting storywise than WC3

[bmjclark]

Honestly I think the old god stuff in general is just better than wc3 story in a lot of ways. I don't think anything has sparked more debate in this games lore than like 8 quotes from ilgynoth.

[A Chozo]

You need to play Warcraft 3, dude. It's not the apotheosis of writing that you think it is. Of course you would not know better simply from reading from the wowpedia, but WoW's storyline got moments that were on part or better than WC3.

Also, the importance of the character in WoW is on your eyes, since you'r the person interpreting it, and it's even harder to make a history work in a mmo-rpg because of the group content.

FFXIV manages to have a better story with good mechanics that WoW simply lacks.

[Peacemoon]

In Wow’s defence storytelling has never been great in MMOs. At the time WoW was released they were really sandbox games. I think from MoP onwards the storytelling has become a lot better and improved with every expansion. Legion had a very good story, with a lot of cool cutscenes and cinematics. If Warcraft 4 was created to tell the Legion storyline, they would have a lot of material to work with and expand upon.

What would be great is if Blizzard releases a RTS version of an expansion near the end of its life (like now for Legion for instance) where they could tell the story through a different medium.

[tankbug]

Main story line? No. Even the fall of Arthas was a bit...tame and disappointing.
The good thing is that a lot of the smaller quest chains, and the atmosphere/feeling has made up for it many times over.
WoW has been a more rewarding "single player" experience overall for that reason.

[nothingsjim]

Warcraft RTS doesn't really have a good story. It's just relatively better than WoW, mostly due to the limitation of WoW's MMO nature.