East African Federation

[Techno-Druid]

(Link to Map)

How feasible do you think it is for the East African Federation to actually form?

For those of you that don't know, an EAF is basically an idea for a unified federation of East African states with a common colonial history and Bantu/Nilo-Saharan culture. Basically the member countries would include Kenya, Tanzania, Burundi, Uganda, Rwanda and South Sudan.


Do you think unification between these states is feasible? On top of that, would it be the right move for these countries to unify? I mean most of the borders of these countries were drawn up by the British (or in the case of Rwanda the Belgians).

[Logwyn]

Sure. Why not. Its been talked about since the 1960s.

[Sunseeker]

These countries are economically, socially, and governmentally unstable. You kinda need all those things in order to make a union.

[Techno-Druid]

These countries are economically, socially, and governmentally unstable. You kinda need all those things in order to make a union.

Kenya, Tanzania and Rwanda seem to be fairing well. I don't know that much about Uganda or Burundi though and South Sudan, well...

[Puupi]

A peaceful unification in Africa?

I'll believe it when I see it.

So far, only unification in Africa has seen has been caused by a military junta, a genocide or both.

[XDurionX]

They can't even keep their internal peace, much less an international one.

[Puupi]

Kenya, Tanzania and Rwanda seem to be fairing well. I don't know that much about Uganda or Burundi though and South Sudan, well...

Uganda is a nice place.

Idi Amin and Joseph Kony ring any bells?

[Techno-Druid]

Uganda is a nice place.

Idi Amin and Joseph Kony ring any bells?

That was in the past, same with Rwanda, which is actually one of the world's fastest growing economies.

[I Push Buttons]

Kenya, Tanzania and Rwanda seem to be fairing well. I don't know that much about Uganda or Burundi though and South Sudan, well...

What is your measure of doing well?

These countries are the poorest and least developed on Earth.

[XDurionX]

That was in the past, same with Rwanda, which is actually one of the world's fastest growing economies.

It's not hard to grow fast when your whole economy got wiped out in a genocidal civil war.

[Techno-Druid]

What is your measure of doing well?

These countries are the poorest and least developed on Earth.

They're definitely far from being the poorest and least developed countries on Earth, with Kenya being considered one of Africa's 'lion economies', being one of the fastest growing and economically dominant countries on the continent (alongside Ethiopia, Ghana, Nigeria, South Africa and Mozambique).

[Coolthulhu]

Absolutely not. Federations only work if the single states work on their own.

[Afrospinach]

They're definitely far from being the poorest and least developed countries on Earth, with Kenya being considered one of Africa's 'lion economies', being one of the fastest growing and economically dominant countries on the continent (alongside Ethiopia, Ghana, Nigeria, South Africa and Mozambique).

Well unfortunately that doesn't mean a great deal. This is the issue with knowing everything you know about a country via the internet.

I have lived in Ghana, Nigeria and Tanzania and "developed" is not really the word I would use. I can't remember if you are the guy who has a hardon for Botswana or if that was someone else, but this applies to them to some extent, too. There is a little clique of corrupt politicians and their many many nephews who pump up these various countries vital statistics where as the reality for MOST people who live there is about the same as anywhere else on the continent. Running water and flushing toilets are elusive.

Now Botswana is better than most but it is still not great. As some people have said fastest growing doesn't mean that much either. When you do nothing and start doing something then the % change is going to be impressive. The other countersink to this "great news" is the population growth rate.

Absolutely not. Federations only work if the single states work on their own.

There already exists SADC which really is as far as it should go. Federations are the hard on of the authoritarian utopian politikid.

[Techno-Druid]

Well unfortunately that doesn't mean a great deal. This is the issue with knowing everything you know about a country via the internet.

I have lived in Ghana, Nigeria and Tanzania and "developed" is not really the word I would use. I can't remember if you are the guy who has a hardon for Botswana or if that was someone else, but this applies to them to some extent, too. There is a little clique of corrupt politicians and their many many nephews who pump up these various countries vital statistics where as the reality for MOST people who live there is about the same as anywhere else on the continent. Running water and flushing toilets are elusive.

Now Botswana is better than most but it is still not great. As some people have said fastest growing doesn't mean that much either. When you do nothing and start doing something then the % change is going to be impressive. The other countersink to this "great news" is the population growth rate.


There already exists SADC which really is as far as it should go. Federations are the hard on of the authoritarian utopian politikid.

I never said that these countries were developed, they are obviously still developing countries, but I find it a ridiculous notion to ignore developments, no matter how small, and treat the region of East Africa as hopeless.

As for Botswana, I don't say I have a "hard on" for the country, but I do admire Seretse Khama from the stories I've heard of him and respect where they have gotten.

[Afrospinach]

I never said that these countries were developed, they are obviously still developing countries, but I find it a ridiculous notion to ignore developments, no matter how small, and treat the region of East Africa as hopeless.

Well hope is all yours. In my country the president is someone who was convicted of embezzlement before he even took office. Since he got there at the end of a term because the previous guy died in office the people had a rare "trial period" to see what he was made of. He stole like a motherfucker. The subsequent election was stopped mid counting when he was losing. Then he suddenly surged ahead after an inexplicable pause(all planned, they had an atypical referendum at the same time to excuse any irregularities). The referendum result was scrapped, it was about gay rights or something fairly innocuous in the grand scheme of things. Never anything riding on it really. EU ruled elections free and fair. As EU officials tend to do, they probably got pissed at a local bar, signed off and went home with a fat check from all interested parties.

They cannot even fix potholes on the road through which about 10% of global supply of copper flows an accounts for the lions share of the countries economy. I am talking a 30km stretch of broken tar that is impassable to regular road cars. Certainly not there by any virtue of competence. They did find a way to build a highway out to a ministers house though, in the middle of butt fuck nowhere. You guys talk about corruption but really you have no idea.

All this shit is straight up typical. Any suggestion of concentrating yet more power on to even less individuals in the region is remarkably ignorant. That is before you even consider the fact that sub Saharan Africa is the most ethnically diverse region on the planet and you know what? They do not get on. <= big euphemism

When the foundation is rotten to the core don't plan on expansion. Knowing what I know I do not see how any constructive discussion about unification in this part of the world can happen without some spectacular changes in social attitudes which won't happen in my lifetime and probably not yours either. In fact in a lot of ways they are backpedaling.

[Tackhisis]

I doubt that. The social development level is very low there, and people mentally stuck in villages and tribes cannot build federations (or even states).

[BloodyAngel12]

#Kony2012 .