Henril Cavill Hesitant to Date in #MeToo Era

[Guchie]

I don't agree accusations are just that accusations, and the court of law not opinion is what is important, people forget that because of all the loudmouths everywhere.

So what you're saying is, Listen and Believe is a bunch of BS?

Should be Listen but dont rush to conclusions cause we dont know the whole story?

Should we keep allegations out of the newspaper than as it has potential to harm someone without a court to prove it? We all know an allegation can destroy a career without a court of law.

[Lucavian]

I don't mean hurt feelings. My point is that he hasn't lost his job or been deported, which indicates that all this worrying is overblown.

It's not overblown. Look at Chris Hardwick. How much money do you think he lost from all the things that were pulled at the suspicion that his exgf was making an accusation specifically about him, even though she didn't even mention his name. So Cavil has a point, within his context as being a person with media attention, that he has to tiptoe because one accusation, either direct or not, leads to swift and merciless 'guilty verdicts'.

[Fencers]

Dude can harass & double standard (wink wink) me anytime.

More seriously, I tend to like a lot of what I read from Cavil. Obviously, I would not support actual harassment or assault. Who knows if the particulars of what he said in the article/interview.

Accusations mean jack shit without a conviction.

[Endus]

Isn't that part of the issue though? You can't legally define attractive. The things an 'attractive' man can get away with around a woman as opposed to an 'ugly' man is the difference between cheeky flirting and a restraining order.

You can't have different rules for ugly and attractive. Those things are too subjective.

This is a moderately ridiculous point.

If she finds you attractive, you flirt with her, she flirts back, this is consensual interaction.

If she doesn't find you attractive, you flirt with her, she shuts you down, you flirt with her again, she calls HR.

The difference is consent. Whether she wants to participate in that kind of interaction with you, or not. This isn't complicated. Your efforts to complicate it only work because you completely ignore that the woman in question is a person too, and can decide whether she wants to be flirted with by a particular guy or not.

[Guchie]

This is a moderately ridiculous point.

If she finds you attractive, you flirt with her, she flirts back, this is consensual interaction.

If she doesn't find you attractive, you flirt with her, she shuts you down, you flirt with her again, she calls HR.

The difference is consent. Whether she wants to participate in that kind of interaction with you, or not. This isn't complicated. Your efforts to complicate it only work because you completely ignore that the woman in question is a person too, and can decide whether she wants to be flirted with by a particular guy or not.

Be Attractive.
Be Handsome
Don't be unattractive.

Seriously though, dont prowl in the workplace. No good can come of this.

[grexly75]

I don't agree accusations are just that accusations, and the court of law not opinion is what is important, people forget that because of all the loudmouths everywhere.

You know full well that with how society is now, just an accusation without having 100% concrete proof is enough to destroy that persons life, career and so on..

[Doctor Amadeus]

So what you're saying is, Listen and Believe is a bunch of BS?

Should be Listen but dont rush to conclusions cause we dont know the whole story?

Should we keep allegations out of the newspaper than as it has potential to harm someone without a court to prove it? We all know an allegation can destroy a career without a court of law.

You pretty much nailed it on the head. We need to get away from judging people’s personal lives and whether we like or dislike someone to treat people differently.

Opinions are fine, but I think protections should be afforded the accused as well. Until the matter is cleared up. Some private businesses and institutions or what not might be difficult deal with.

Some have morality clauses, which since I’m not a lawyer don’t know if matters guilt or innocence. Like if you work for Coke and get busted drinking Pepsi. You didn’t break the law but if there are agreements like that how can you force a company or anyone else from protecting their image or brand.

I think that’s what some mean about consequences and in that event I think the wrongly accused need to have legal protection also.

[Guchie]

You pretty much nailed it on the head. We need to get away from judging people’s personal lives and whether we like or dislike someone to treat people differently.

Opinions are fine, but I think protections should be afforded the accused as well. Until the matter is cleared up. Some private businesses and institutions or what not might be difficult deal with.

Some have morality clauses, which since I’m not a lawyer don’t know if matters guilt or innocence. Like if you work for Coke and get busted drinking Pepsi. You didn’t break the law but if there are agreements like that how can you force a company or anyone else from protecting their image or brand.

I think that’s what some mean about consequences and in that event I think the wrongly accused need to have legal protection also.

That's entirely reasonable, its a shame it doesnt exist.

All it takes is one tweet to blow up and someone is having to defend an allegation. Which can be very damaging, and the accused has little to no recourse in recovering damages.

[Doctor Amadeus]

You know full well that with how society is now, just an accusation without having 100% concrete proof is enough to destroy that persons life, career and so on..

Yeah I’ll concede on this point a bit. You’re separating the theory from the practice.

In theory unless someone is convicted despite opinion popular or not a person should be innocent. The practice is different sometimes people who are just stupid or assholes can be convicted without process and this is not the way it supposed to be.

[exochaft]

It's not overblown. Look at Chris Hardwick. How much money do you think he lost from all the things that were pulled at the suspicion that his exgf was making an accusation specifically about him, even though she didn't even mention his name. So Cavil has a point, within his context as being a person with media attention, that he has to tiptoe because one accusation, either direct or not, leads to swift and merciless 'guilty verdicts'.

Highly public people can be ruined or damage just by public opinion and media perception, actual convictions in courts don't necessarily have to happen. You can even see in these forums how people like to jump to judgement concerning people in the public based upon news headlines or just a little info in a story, when a little digging would show details or facts that completely negate the headline or story. That's the whole idea of the court of public opinion: perception is everything, details and facts just 'get in the way'.

This can even extend outside of highly public figures and into the workplace, as well. It's kind of a funny story now, but it was pretty bad at the time: my wife's old workplace thought I was beating her and the cops were called on me because she came into work with a black, swollen eye. What had happened was my son (who was a toddler at the time) was sleeping next to her in bed and smashed his head into her face while sleeping, causing her her black eye. She went into work the next day, and despite her telling everyone and her bosses what happened, I ended up getting visited by the cops anyways. Even after the cops said nothing was wrong and I was clear of wrongdoing, I couldn't visit her office anymore or security would kick me out While this isn't necessarily a dating story, it does point out the same mentality that Cavil brings up: there are people out there who will jump to conclusions and condemn you despite all the evidence to the contrary, solely based upon an accusation.

I did technically have a bunch of dating stories that kind of lined up with the theme of this post, but I'll just pick a few. Been accused of several things way back in my younger days of school, including a girl that claimed I stalked her and robber her house... fortunately, my reputation was well known so no one believed her. Even had a girl constantly obsessed that I was cheating on her, and she kept telling my friends/co-workers that I was sleeping around with other women and men and not her (even tried to install tracking software on my computer at one point). My now-wife nearly beat the living daylights out of her when she went on a tirade in public, crazy enough, that's probably how we started becoming friends and eventually got married. Anyways, my saving grace is that I always build up people to surround me that know and trust me, as they'll always have my back (and I'll have their backs, as well).

[Nihilist74]

If you are rich and famous, no matter what the climate is, you have to be very careful when you date anyways.

[Doctor Amadeus]

That's entirely reasonable, its a shame it doesnt exist.

All it takes is one tweet to blow up and someone is having to defend an allegation. Which can be very damaging, and the accused has little to no recourse in recovering damages.

True especially with famous people because all someone famous has to be guilty of is not being the person everyone else thinks they should be then it’s off with their heads.

No it’s bullshit and however popular or not. I support protecting people from BS like that.

- - - Updated - - -

This is a moderately ridiculous point.

If she finds you attractive, you flirt with her, she flirts back, this is consensual interaction.

If she doesn't find you attractive, you flirt with her, she shuts you down, you flirt with her again, she calls HR.

The difference is consent. Whether she wants to participate in that kind of interaction with you, or not. This isn't complicated. Your efforts to complicate it only work because you completely ignore that the woman in question is a person too, and can decide whether she wants to be flirted with by a particular guy or not.

Meh I’m of too minds about this. Speaking as an ugly guy not worried about this. I will admit there is a double standard.

Which is why all of it is better left not at work

[Biomega]

I like the whole part that's essentially 'you have to be careful what you say or people will just, like, twist it into a noose for you', to which social media immediately reacted by twisting it into a noose for him. QED, tumblr warriors. QED.

[Deleted]

Man makes comments about the #metoo movement

#metoo movement completely proves his point by over reacting

Man forced to apologise


Like, I don't even know how many levels of alternate reality you've got to be on to not notice this.

[grexly75]

Yeah I’ll concede on this point a bit. You’re separating the theory from the practice.

In theory unless someone is convicted despite opinion popular or not a person should be innocent. The practice is different sometimes people who are just stupid or assholes can be convicted without process and this is not the way it supposed to be.

Yeah it shouldn't be that way but with how things are now, the old adage "innocent till proven guilty" means squat.. Now it is a case of "guilty till proven innocent but still guilty anyway.."

Because these days the court of public opinion, the internet and so on have power to ruin, wreck and destroy someone for pretty much anything..

[Usagi Senshi]

Newsflash, psycho women have existed before #metoo. You really think they wouldn't shout "RAPE" if #metoo wasn't around?

And, yes, this is comming from me - a man who dated a woman for many years who slowly became a male-hating multiple DUI psychotic alcoholic, with my relationship endin with her smashing a beer can into my forehead over an argument about the ending of the movie Apt Pupil. I can't even begin to make up a story like her. =/

As someone who grew up in a house in Detroit where your step dad was selling illegal Russian arms with the help of an ex-Russian soldier, had their house raided several times (Their hiding spots were good tbh and the guns were never found), helped drag your step dad home as a 9 year old while being shot at, and your mom kept pipe bombs in the pantry, yes, yes I believe you. Because a lot of people find my stories hard to believe.

I won't even get into the 1995-1999 era of my life when I was a hyper sjw teen, with a couple gay friends, got called gay/sissy for my anime/videogames/comics, while living in a conservative hillbilly house out in the middle of nowhere in Howell, Mi.

[tankbug]

people twisting the movement and using it for the wrong reason (Ie find how to ruin people's lives to give themselves 15 minutes of fame)

it's ruined because it's been abused and twisted to such a degree, that almost nobody takes it seriously anymore. especially outside hollywood.
we've grown numb to it.

when half the metoo claims are shit like "our shoulders grazed when we crossed paths in a corridoor and he didnt ask for permission and now i've been raped" you know it has gone to shit.

which is a shame because it lessens the impact on the actual serious and real cases.


also its obvious you didnt read what cavil said because he never said shit like grabbing pussy is ok.
he said he's scared because one innocent wrong move with a woman, or a misread situation, and he's fucked for life. even if he doesnt do anything wrong.

I never claimed that he said that either. I said that when he's whining about being afraid of "chasing" women because of the "This guy actually raped me" movement, he shows no respect to the people who have suffered. Why? Because that's like complaining about not being able to tell racists jokes in public anymore, because of the civil rights movement. If he had empathy, he would say that "Hm, I can't be as forward or pushy on the dating scene as I was, but that's a small price to pay for women to feel safe and find support among the public when they dare to rise up after they have been harassed or raped". Nope! One of the biggest women magnets on this earth and public figure focuses on how dating doesn't have that old fashion romance anymore. Are we supposed to feel sorry for people like this? He needs to grow up!

Btw, I know you're not serious about half of the #metoo claims are about grazing shoulders in corridors, but still I don't see any evidence that the movement has moved into ridiculous claims. They are still about rape, pressure for sex, sexual harassment and so forth, nothing like "Colin Firth gave me a pat on the shoulder at this award ceremony, and I feel violated, give me justice!". It's just what becomes the truth for a lot of angry guys, after the movement has been discussed a million times and turned into a polarized issue on the most misogynistic place on earth, the internet forums.

[Video Games]

As someone who grew up in a house in Detroit where your step dad was selling illegal Russian arms with the help of an ex-Russian soldier, had their house raided several times (Their hiding spots were good tbh and the guns were never found), helped drag your step dad home as a 9 year old while being shot at, and your mom kept pipe bombs in the pantry, yes, yes I believe you. Because a lot of people find my stories hard to believe.

I won't even get into the 1995-1999 era of my life when I was a hyper sjw teen, with a couple gay friends, got called gay/sissy for my anime/videogames/comics, while living in a conservative hillbilly house out in the middle of nowhere in Howell, Mi.

That explains the trap fetish.

[kyoloco]

This is why we need Dave Chappelle's love contract.

[Azurenys]

Guys don't worry with all these movements and "empowering women" we'll eventually get to the point where they have to chase us as standard norm (so we don't get accused of shit)... Joke's on them!