So Sylvanas must be pretty displeased with Saurfang (spoilers)

[Talon8669]

Saurfang has the opportunity to kill Malfurion, but refuses because he wounded him with a dishonorable attack. He gets imprisoned in the Stormwind Stockade, and when Rokhan and Thalyssra are on their way to free Zul and some other chap they also free Saurfang. Except he'd rather stay in jail than rejoin Sylvanas.

Sylvanas must be pretty displeased. She's captured and tortured Koltira Deathweaver for less. Will she punish him? And if she does, how would the Horde feel about Sylvanas executing one of their most beloved heroes?

Also would it not be a great way to get someone inside the alliance by pulling what Saurfang does. He is a prisoner but if the war turns south for the alliance they will at least keep him at arms reach with limited freedoms. He won't be in prison forever and he could be a real threat that close to the king.

[iamthedevil]

Problem with that is even if Sylvanas dies in mak'gora she has val'kyr to ress her.

"10 reasons why Sylvanas cheated in Mak'gora"
-101,437,123,632 views

[Friendlyimmolation]

Hmmm, who would they choose to follow

Renowned orc hero who they've known their entire lives

Or

Crazy undead lich queen who plagues everything she sets foot on and raises their former comrades as undead monstrosities

Just cuz she's warchief doesn't mean they'll follow her no matter what she does. Garrosh proved that.

You don't know orcs very well if you think they'd pick Saurfang if he's staying in jail. Death before imprisonment, I'm surprised Saurfang didn't take his own life in that cell because death is preferred to being a prisoner for orcs.

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Of course it's him. Saurfang saw what happened when you let a tyrant Warchief go unchallenged, you get Garrosh. He's learnt that lesson, he's not going to bow his head until it's too late this time, not only am I confident Sylvanas will die at some point in the future, I have a feeling it will be Saurfang doing it. He embodies the best of the Horde, what it should be - he's the one who should bear the mantle of Warchief.

Sorry bud, Warchiefs don't willingly stay in Prison, he's less likely than Baine at this point to be WC.

[Raetary]

I´m confident he will be the new warchief soon.
He believes in honor, which is a strong Horde value.

Sylvanas has n honor.

he has so much honor that he abandons the horde and lets his people be ruled by a warchief he believes is not a good ruler.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Civilians are an equal threat than a demon lord now? I don't think so.

Information is information. But keep up the feigned ignorance and generalizations.

[Jastall]

Everything Saurfang has done so far is odd. How can one honorable guy like Nazgrim go do with the ship, and then another honorable like Sarfang just give up so easily? Throughout the many Horde's, one thing that kept them powerful was that they all did their jobs, even if they disagreed. Saurfang is acting like he just wants to be dead.

They botched his character, is all. Old Saurfang never gave up, was a skilled general and wasn't against some shady tactics like disguises and flanking attacks to get the job done. New Saurfang is a whiny bitch who takes honor to the point of monstrous stupidity (no attack from the back allowed on a battlefield, really?), doesn't have an argument against Sylvanas other than muh honor, and quits because she said mean words to him.

[Friendlyimmolation]

They botched his character, is all. Old Saurfang never gave up, was a skilled general and wasn't against some shady tactics like disguises and flanking attacks to get the job done. New Saurfang is a whiny bitch who takes honor to the point of monstrous stupidity (no attack from the back allowed on a battlefield, really?), doesn't have an argument against Sylvanas other than muh honor, and quits because she said mean words to him.

A good point, he's willing to send an army in from behind to rip apart the Alliance's army, but he cries when he has the chance to kill one of the Alliance's greatest assets. Plot induced stupidity aside it feels like someone new is incharge of Saurfang's character, or just never actually bothered to read about Saurfang.

[Katie45]

You're right. It's not like Deathwing or Onyxia ever pretended to be someone they weren't. And it's not like Balnazzar or Detheroc ever pretended to be someone they weren't. Or even Vanessa Vancleef...

The Devs aren't above using NPCs with false identities all over WoW.

Maybe A Good War has already been rewritten... but maybe not.

everyone mean to sylvanas is a dreadlord lol

[iamthedevil]

They botched his character, is all. Old Saurfang never gave up, was a skilled general and wasn't against some shady tactics like disguises and flanking attacks to get the job done. New Saurfang is a whiny bitch who takes honor to the point of monstrous stupidity (no attack from the back allowed on a battlefield, really?), doesn't have an argument against Sylvanas other than muh honor, and quits because she said mean words to him.

Maybe he's getting "reverse Old godded" where it makes you depressed instead of insane. N'zoths secret power is crippling depression.

[Jastall]

A good point, he's willing to send an army in from behind to rip apart the Alliance's army, but he cries when he has the chance to kill one of the Alliance's greatest assets. Plot induced stupidity aside it feels like someone new is incharge of Saurfang's character, or just never actually bothered to read about Saurfang.

Yeah, that was the thing that stuck out to me. Using a convenient smuggler's tunnel to bypass an army? 100% honorable, would honor again with honor. Blindsiding an enemy leader about to kill your Warchief literally the same day or something? 0% Honor rating, commit seppuku or gtfo. Staying in his cell is just as bad. The very epitome of Orckind decides, among all available options, to rot in a dungeon? That's like Gallywix donating his entire fortune to charity tomorrow morning.

It makes no sense, like most of the faction war writing. It's yet another case of butchering characters to obtain the desired current plot. It's possible that they ''redeem'' him later by showing he didn't stay in prison and was using it as an excuse to hatch some anti-Sylvanas plan or somesuch, but the damage will be done regardless.

[Broken Fox]

A good point, he's willing to send an army in from behind to rip apart the Alliance's army, but he cries when he has the chance to kill one of the Alliance's greatest assets. Plot induced stupidity aside it feels like someone new is incharge of Saurfang's character, or just never actually bothered to read about Saurfang.

The writing in BFA seems high on GoTisms and it seems they went full throttle with turning Saurfang into Ned Stark. Maybe Anduin will have him executed.

[cwowtbang]

I have made a post about this in the past. I still feel like Sylvanas tested Saurfang as she did with Varimathras killing his brothers as a test of loyalty. I guess we will find out how Sylvanas reacts to this. I'm interested. Now about Sylvanas and Mok'gora. I feel like it is beneath her since honor is a thing she doesn't adhere to, plus, its an orc cultural thing not a high elf one.

[seleri]

Saurfang being an impostor is probably the funniest theory I've heard in a while. How is that more likely than him just getting up out of the rubble of the inn?

For the sake of argument though, that would mean he's either an Alliance impersonating Saurfang (seems incredibly unlikely) in which case why keep whoever it is in disguise and in the prison? Or it's someone working for a third party (presumably Azshara/N'zoth) so why not kill Malfurion to eliminate one of Azeroth's greatest protectors and get in good with Sylvanas at the same time?

[The Emperor]

Hopefully Saurfang dies for good, or better yet, is made to betray his ideals and sent into the exile. Also he should take with him all the idiots that want war to be honorable. The concept of honorable war belongs in Middle ages at best. Victory for Sylvanas!

[Zyky]

Is it even Saurfang, though?

A Good War has him crushed under the inn at Astranaar before Sylvanas rescues him and starts her long duel against Malfurion. But he's perfectly healthy as he heads off to the Felwood and later comes down Darkshore from the North.

Is that story being rewritten? Or is Saurfang an imposter?

ya I feel like the lores are clashing and it's very confusing because we never hear about the duel from Saurfang vs Malfurion...in fact it's mentioned after the short chain of us clearing out Lor'danel(which will be happening next week) that he says "Sylvanas is dueling him alone?! We must rush to her aid" or something like that. So there was no mention of her saving him and it's super confusing overall.

[StationaryHawk]

She's captured and tortured Koltira Deathweaver for less.

Koltira is also a nobody that was missed only by Thassarian. Saurfang is the High Overlord and a revered war hero of the people she leads.

[Syegfryed]

Better to cut a potential gangrenous limb before it spreads to the body and that's exactly what was done.
.

by this logic, Thrall should kill/exile all the Forsakens, so Wrathgate/undercity never happen again

Cause many thing can count as a "potential gangrenous limb" if you enfuse with paranoia and fear

[JustRob]

You don't know orcs very well if you think they'd pick Saurfang if he's staying in jail. Death before imprisonment, I'm surprised Saurfang didn't take his own life in that cell because death is preferred to being a prisoner for orcs.

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Sorry bud, Warchiefs don't willingly stay in Prison, he's less likely than Baine at this point to be WC.

Right, which is why all those orcs in the internment camps took their own lives... Wait.

I think orcs will recognize that their High Overlord doesn't make a decision like this lightly. They too will see what he sees.

[Friendlyimmolation]

And as I've said countless times, how much tactical information would a civilian have? And even then, how could Sylvanas know they would divulge any. It's really simple, she murdered those people because they didn't want to belong to her anymore.

Undercity is navigated daily by the dead, those forsaken were in leadership positions of the forsaken, they ran the undercity in Sylvanas's absence. They would know what and where assets were in the city, they would know where things were kept, where the healers, blacksmith and so on were all situated. To even try to say information they had wouldn't count because they were civilians is silly.

You've said it countless times, doesn't make it all less silly.

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Right, which is why all those orcs in the internment camps took their own lives... Wait.

I think orcs will recognize that their High Overlord doesn't make a decision like this lightly. They too will see what he sees.

is it like a thing of pride for you to be so ignorant of the lore?

Do you remember what the lethargy of the orcs were, and how they thought it was a fate worse than death?

[JustRob]

Undercity is navigated daily by the dead, those forsaken were in leadership positions of the forsaken, they ran the undercity in Sylvanas's absence. They would know what and where assets were in the city, they would know where things were kept, where the healers, blacksmith and so on were all situated. To even try to say information they had wouldn't count because they were civilians is silly.

You've said it countless times, doesn't make it all less silly.

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is it like a thing of pride for you to be so ignorant of the lore?

Do you remember what the lethargy of the orcs were, and how they thought it was a fate worse than death?

If they thought it was a fate worse than death they could have ended themselves. None had the balls to do so.