Star Wars Episode IX: The Rise of Skywalker

[Tabrotar]

I really like how anyone who dares to complain about the new SW "movies" is automatically labeld a "hater" where anyone who loves them is ofc right and has the right opinion and isn´t just a fucking stupid fanboy blinded by whatever makes it "good" to him.

[cyberglum]

I mean...considering how nearly universally panned the prequels were by Star Wars fans (who only now look back on them fondly because it gives them an excuse to shit on the dreaded Disney), I don't see why they can't be dismissed.

They had plotted out the 3 movies to tell one, over arching story. Whether you enjoyed them or not that excludes them from being dismissed from the argument.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

Being honest here, I wouldn't pick any of the new trilogy movies as my favorites either. But this hate industry against it is real. I mean this one guy puts out a video daily and I don't even need to click on it. He used to be someone I enjoyed watching a review of content with or listen to a conversation on franchises on. Nerdrotic or something like that? Then around the time of the second to last GoT season he turned into a hate machine. Three, four, five videos a week often pounding on the same 4 points over and over again. Once GoT seem to fall out of fashion a couple months after the show ended it switched gears to three, four, five videos hating some Star Trek show that I didnt even know existed. Now it's three, four, five videos a week hammering Star Wars. I unsubbed from the dude. Stopped watching. But YouTube keeps shoving his content at me. I did attempt to find others like he USED to be but they all turned into "how I hate this thing" channels. Come to find out most of them are part of some "alliance" of channels that get together and obviously group up to magnify the hate machine.

So the whole thought videos on the movie biz have become pure shill media or pure hate media. It's sad. Get bombarded with both now that this movie is coming out and its just annoying.

[eschatological]

Being honest here, I wouldn't pick any of the new trilogy movies as my favorites either. But this hate industry against it is real. I mean this one guy puts out a video daily and I don't even need to click on it. He used to be someone I enjoyed watching a review of content with or listen to a conversation on franchises on. Nerdrotic or something like that? Then around the time of the second to last GoT season he turned into a hate machine. Three, four, five videos a week often pounding on the same 4 points over and over again. Once GoT seem to fall out of fashion a couple months after the show ended it switched gears to three, four, five videos hating some Star Trek show that I didnt even know existed. Now it's three, four, five videos a week hammering Star Wars. I unsubbed from the dude. Stopped watching. But YouTube keeps shoving his content at me. I did attempt to find others like he USED to be but they all turned into "how I hate this thing" channels. Come to find out most of them are part of some "alliance" of channels that get together and obviously group up to magnify the hate machine.

So the whole thought videos on the movie biz have become pure shill media or pure hate media. It's sad. Get bombarded with both now that this movie is coming out and its just annoying.

It's almost like YouTube has changed from a vlog site to an outrage-clickbait site because of the money to be made.

Except with even less standards than tabloids and cable news.

[Kokolums]

It's almost like YouTube has changed from a vlog site to an outrage-clickbait site because of the money to be made.

Except with even less standards than tabloids and cable news.

As the saying goes "If you can fake authenticity, you have it made".

One way to fake authenticity is to purchase a reputable web site or network or media outlet and then quietly twist it into a tabloid. You go to a site for hard news and then one day you notice the front page is all about horoscopes, aliens, and glamour tips and hints.

[Zaktar]

It's almost like YouTube has changed from a vlog site to an outrage-clickbait site because of the money to be made.

Except with even less standards than tabloids and cable news.

I wonder if this says more about the people getting this stuff shoved in their face though. I spend an... unreasonable amount of time on youtube, and most of the Star Wars stuff that gets shoved in my face is positive. I assume it's because I don't watch the haters, have no interest in their shit. Pretty sure most of this supposed industry of complainers has low view counts, excepting the ones that were made shortly after TLJ came out and there was a massive hate-wagon.

[Skulltaker]

I mean, Star Wars has always been made up movie-by-movie and the closest they've ever gotten to a "grand plan" was the prequels.

A New Hope was made as a solo film, no expectation of a sequel.
ESB was made expecting a third, but includes the Luke and Leia french session.
And RotJ retconned them into being siblings.

Yeah, but that was some time ago, and a completely different company. One might think that Disney, with all their experience and ressources, would write at least guidelines. And I actually think that happened, too. I assume the story around Rey and Kylo Ren was outlined befor they started filming TFA, and Johnson had to continue with it, while imprinting his... unique flavor to the side stories.

Anyway, if memory serves me right, Yoda and Obi-Wans conversation towards the climax of Empire at least hint on Luke and Leia being siblings. "That boy is our last hope." "No, there is another." Something that wasn't expanded on in Empire. It could, of course, have been a segway to introduce another character. Are there any notes on that from Lucas, per chance? I'd not call it a retcon, just 'one possible scenario being picked'. Yes, the kiss remains awkward.

In regards of the 'no one is really gone!' phrase, it somewhat strengthens my belief that what we might get towards the end is more of a battle of wills, something akin to an extension of the Emperors evil into a place in space where Force and reality meet, and we see echoes of people past - The Emperors will manifests in the form of Star Destroyers, and the heroes in the form of friends and allies long gone. The Original Falcon with its round dish, the Ghost, the lone StarFortress Bomber that might have been the one that belonged to Rose's sister, there's so many old ships from different eras in that shot, and they said 9 would tie in all movies.

[Dextroden]

I wonder if this says more about the people getting this stuff shoved in their face though. I spend an... unreasonable amount of time on youtube, and most of the Star Wars stuff that gets shoved in my face is positive. I assume it's because I don't watch the haters, have no interest in their shit. Pretty sure most of this supposed industry of complainers has low view counts, excepting the ones that were made shortly after TLJ came out and there was a massive hate-wagon.

Counterpoint: People that push the positive opinions are untrustworthy because of the ones who are sponsored or want free shit like trips to Galaxy Edge in return for positive videos.

Everyone's a mercenary on YouTube.

[Chinese Bootlickers]

The only thing a Star Wars fan loves more than Star Wars is shitting on it.

[Zaktar]

Counterpoint: People that push the positive opinions are untrustworthy because of the ones who are sponsored or want free shit like trips to Galaxy Edge in return for positive videos.

Everyone's a mercenary on YouTube.

It's almost like stuff costs money and people have to make it. What do I care what their motives are? Am I afraid I'll vote for the wrong Star Wars party?

[Dextroden]

It's almost like stuff costs money and people have to make it. What do I care what their motives are? Am I afraid I'll vote for the wrong Star Wars party?

Just inquiring if you only mistrust to people negative of star wars or if you actually didn't like people making money on either train.

So, people paid to say only the good are trustworthy opinions?

[Fabinas]

I also can't take the "they couldn't find tall people" argument seriously.

They could create Jabba the Hutt and the Cantina band with practical effects, but they couldn't put wookie actors in platform shoes under the hair as part of the costume?

Why you're comparing characters with seconds of appearance to characters with dominant and active participation in the 3rd film is beyond me.

[Zaktar]

Just inquiring if you only mistrust to people negative of star wars or if you actually didn't like people making money on either train.

So, people paid to say only the good are trustworthy opinions?

If someone provides worthwhile analysis of a subject I'm interested in, I enjoy it and try to watch more of it. If they provide a boring and/or poor analysis, I stop watching and ask youtube not to recommend their shit to me in future. (Technically not just analysis videos, bad lip reading is a good example of something pointlessly fun, but whatever that's what we're talking about). Who is doing so out of pure joy vs commission means nothing to me. For some people this their main income stream, why in the world would I begrudge them making a living?

This process has caused youtube to recommend mostly positive or purely entertaining videos. I don't need a 50th take on why TLJ was garbage unless they've found a way to make it engaging. That's it though, my filter is: was it quality and does the subject interest me. Either the people hating on it make shittier videos, or I'm broadly not as interested in hate.

- - - Updated - - -

Why you're comparing characters with seconds of appearance to characters with dominant and active participation in the 3rd film is beyond me.

You know I just noticed that detail - putting actors in platform shoes... can you imagine those forest scenes all shot with people in carpet costumes and platform shoes? So many broken ankles...

[Dextroden]

If someone provides worthwhile analysis of a subject I'm interested in, I enjoy it and try to watch more of it. If they provide a boring and/or poor analysis, I stop watching and ask youtube not to recommend their shit to me in future. (Technically not just analysis videos, bad lip reading is a good example of something pointlessly fun, but whatever that's what we're talking about). Who is doing so out of pure joy vs commission means nothing to me. For some people this their main income stream, why in the world would I begrudge them making a living?

This process has caused youtube to recommend mostly positive or purely entertaining videos. I don't need a 50th take on why TLJ was garbage unless they've found a way to make it engaging. That's it though, my filter is: was it quality and does the subject interest me. Either the people hating on it make shittier videos, or I'm broadly not as interested in hate.

- - - Updated - - -



You know I just noticed that detail - putting actors in platform shoes... can you imagine those forest scenes all shot with people in carpet costumes and platform shoes? So many broken ankles...

And we need people that can tell why that product is good without advertising lootboxes and star wars razors that implies the movies are 10/10 as long as the check clears and the reviewer gets to go to the release party.

Blind rage is just as useless as paid for reverance.

[Zaktar]

And we need people that can tell why that product is good without advertising lootboxes and star wars razors that implies the movies are 10/10 as long as the check clears and the reviewer gets to go to the release party.

Blind rage is just as useless as paid for reverance.

Heh, my only exposure to what you're talking about is the nerd crew. Had to look up what they were parodying when I first saw it, somehow YT misses me with that trash too

[Dextroden]

Heh, my only exposure to what you're talking about is the nerd crew. Had to look up what they were parodying when I first saw it, somehow YT misses me with that trash too

And I didn't get a torrent of rage videos for watching the Plinkett reviews. And they aren't sparkling reviews.

How strange.

[ringpriest]

I mean, Star Wars has always been made up movie-by-movie and the closest they've ever gotten to a "grand plan" was the prequels.

A New Hope was made as a solo film, no expectation of a sequel.
ESB was made expecting a third, but includes the Luke and Leia french session.
And RotJ retconned them into being siblings.

Not to mention Ewoks being tossed into the third film to sell toys to kids, ship and vehicles designed with an eye to selling toys, etc. The OT isn't the high-principle auteur's vision some fans pretend it is. The special effects were groundbreaking, the story has always been janky.

The best thing about the OT (especially ANH and Empire) is that Lucas was still getting (and recieving) useful criticism; by the time the prequels rolled around, he was the proverbial "wave without a shore" - no one around him was willing to give him even the mildest pushback. And while we're all used to it now, the "he's actually my brother" is a very flat ending to a pretty decent love triangle.

Story-wise, ANH and Empire are also pretty pure Space Opera/Sword & Planet (RotJ not quite so much) - he had Leigh Brackett do the first draft of the Empire script! (The recountings of Lucas calling Leigh are hilarious - he was reaching out to her on the basis of her credentials as an SF writer, and asked her if she had any familiarity with scriptwriting, not realizing she was also the same Leigh Brackett who'd been doing scripts since The Big Sleep.) There are elements of that classic SF feel in the prequels - chrome space-ships with airfoils, alien queens as romantic interests, clones, the planet-spanning city - but I think Lucas failed to hang it all together the way the prequels did (no feedback, as mentioned above). Additionally, whether deliberately or accidentally, the prequels lost the "lived-in future" feel of the orignal trilogy - something that the sequels (and Rogue One) got back, along nods to everything from Lensmen (more Lensmen, that is - the Jedi are basically samurai Lensmen to begin with) to Horatio Hornblower.

Even in this era when various flavors of SF are dominating our media, Star Wars offers a fairly unique echo of the genere's origins; I wonder if that is a part of its appeal that neither its creators nor fans are consciously aware of?

[Zexaniro]

TLJ is arguably the most exhilarating Star Wars film. TLJ wasn't made by a board of executives. It's not Star Wars on autopilot; it was made by a real artist. The Last Jedi is art. It holds up with the original trilogy, and might be the only one of the new trilogy that will do so. TLJ expanded on preexisting plot points and made the universe all the more richer. TLJ is a near perfect blockbuster film

fuck your nostalgia!

- - - Updated - - -

Being honest here, I wouldn't pick any of the new trilogy movies as my favorites either. But this hate industry against it is real. I mean this one guy puts out a video daily and I don't even need to click on it. He used to be someone I enjoyed watching a review of content with or listen to a conversation on franchises on. Nerdrotic or something like that? Then around the time of the second to last GoT season he turned into a hate machine. Three, four, five videos a week often pounding on the same 4 points over and over again. Once GoT seem to fall out of fashion a couple months after the show ended it switched gears to three, four, five videos hating some Star Trek show that I didnt even know existed. Now it's three, four, five videos a week hammering Star Wars. I unsubbed from the dude. Stopped watching. But YouTube keeps shoving his content at me. I did attempt to find others like he USED to be but they all turned into "how I hate this thing" channels. Come to find out most of them are part of some "alliance" of channels that get together and obviously group up to magnify the hate machine.

So the whole thought videos on the movie biz have become pure shill media or pure hate media. It's sad. Get bombarded with both now that this movie is coming out and its just annoying.

The new sequels' hate cave is a very small albeit loud one. The two sequels we've received so far were widely acclaimed by critics and are generally adored by fans of cinema. It seems to be the older nostalgia fueled fans that rally against it, due to the expansion of the lore in TLJ, and the new thematic direction the films took.

[kidstechno]

https://youtu.be/5ECwhB21Pnk

The definitive TLJ review.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

TLJ is arguably the most exhilarating Star Wars film. TLJ wasn't made by a board of executives. It's not Star Wars on autopilot; it was made by a real artist. The Last Jedi is art. It holds up with the original trilogy, and might be the only one of the new trilogy that will do so. TLJ expanded on preexisting plot points and made the universe all the more richer. TLJ is a near perfect blockbuster film

fuck your nostalgia!

- - - Updated - - -



The new sequels' hate cave is a very small albeit loud one. The two sequels we've received so far were widely acclaimed by critics and are generally adored by fans of cinema. It seems to be the older nostalgia fueled fans that rally against it, due to the expansion of the lore in TLJ, and the new thematic direction the films took.

I am cool with different opinions and I don't nessessarily weigh a critics voice over others. In particular when they are directly compensated with earily viewings, tickets, flights, and hotel rooms for example. At the same time it's pretty obvious to me the haters hate so hard to get views and clicks to make money as well.

I wouldn't pick TLJ or TFA as a favorite for me. But that doesn't mean I think they are total trash either. Which seems to be the issue with the internet / social media era movie reviews. It's always total trash to appeal to that side or its total God tier to appeal to that side. Not much real world views on these things anymore in my opinion.