None of BFA selling points turned out to be competently done.

[Checkt]

they didnt come out in Legion, otherwise you wouldnt need BFA prepurchase...

When were the high mountain, nightborn, lightforged, and void elves available for unlocking, again....?

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I actually have my own opinion and reason why Allied races except Mag'har/DID shouldnt be locked behind Legion rep.
Its kinda simple too - Blizzard included ALL allied races as BFA(!!! BFA !!!) features, which for me means it should be gated behind BFA content, not Legion one.

Without bying BFA there is no Allied races, at all. That mean they don't belong to Legion content, except for the lore reasons, and even then we unlocked them after we defeated Legion, so technically they are stuck in between Legion and BFA timeline wise.

Here goes all counter-arguments like "Why not put "Netherwing Drakes/other rare stuff from previous expansions in BFA then?".
Netherwing Drakes and other rare stuff from previous expansion we need to grind weren't positioned as stuff that belong to BFA expansion.

And for me the lore problem is pretty much meaningless. Contracts are fine now for Blizzard, so i don't see why not introduce "Allied Race Contract" that would allow player slowly get rep with, said, Argus Reach, enjoying current content.

Just my opinion though.

Your opinon, however, ignores the fact that what the said that BFA (!!!! BFA !!!!) content was is the ability to earn the favor of races and unlock them, verbatim...guess what BFA (!!! BFA !!!) gave you........ the ability to earn there favor, and unlock them.

[Thestuff1992]

WoDs gameplay wasn't actually as bad as BfAs is. I think this difference matters... a lot.

The content BfA offers is so so much better than WoDs. I leveled, played for 3-4 months and quit. Came back expecting the next patch to be better and you know how that went. I already see myself staying subbed until 8.1. What we see at blizzcon for 8.1 will tell me whether I’m going to continue that or not. I don’t trust any patches I haven’t seen and will not commit to any after what they did in WoD with the selfie cam.

However I agree that the gameplay is lacking for quite a few classes. Further pruning and removal of artifacts/legendaries which then shifted into existing talents (meaning we lost 1 thing to gain 1 thing, we’re at the same spot). I’m currently enjoying my class mostly but I’ve heard some are pretty dull.

Overall I don’t know how anyone can say BfA=WoD when BfA clearly has a lot more content in the first 3 weeks than WoD did in the first year. Once we get to week 4, WoD shouldn’t even be mentioned. Whether you find the content fun or not is up to you, I enjoy most of it.

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Isn't this where white knights like you chime in with "but muh Oculus vehicles?"

Regardless, it wasn't the biggest deal in the world because Wrath, despite all of the cut content, was still the best expansion put out to date. I wonder why people are being so much harder on BfA?

If I had the same mindset during Wrath that I have now I’d probably shit on its flaws as well.

Wrath for me was a pretty bad expansion with an awesome story. It had 2 great raids, the rest were either awful or just okay. The badge system was hilariously bad and allowed casuals or people who didn’t play to catch up pretty easily (similar to TF except tf is much worse imo) and it has great dungeons which BfA has as well. It did have some extra shit like argent tourney grounds which I enjoyed but that came later and would make this an unfair comparison. Gameplay in Wrath was decent for some classes, horrible for others and great for the rest, similar to BfA.

Can’t compare an expansion that went through its 1.5+ year cycle to an expansion that’s not even 3 weeks old. If we strictly compare gameplay and overarching systems, I’d say I prefer BfA personally. LFG is a cancer in the game imo and it single handedly hurt communities moreso than anything else in the game until LFR came out which spawned from LFG.

Overall though, I’d like to wait and see where it goes. Currently I enjoy BfA and I’ll defintiely enjoy it until 8.1, but if 8.1 is shit then I won’t play even with mythic raiding being a big part of my playtime. The only negatives about BfA so far for me are: GCD, awful stat scaling and further pruning which are big problems, GCD is less of a problem than stat scaling and pruning though.

[Harbour]

When were the high mountain, nightborn, lightforged, and void elves available for unlocking, again....?

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Your opinon, however, ignores the fact that what the said that BFA (!!!! BFA !!!!) content was is the ability to earn the favor of races and unlock them, verbatim...guess what BFA (!!! BFA !!!) gave you........ the ability to earn there favor, and unlock them.

But we earn them through Legion content. Don't you find weird that we earn BFA-only content through Legion content (old content)? Its kinda unfair on Blizzard part. Which is the point of OP.

[Checkt]

But we earn them through Legion content. Don't you find weird that we earn BFA-only content through Legion content (old content)? Its kinda unfair on Blizzard part. Which is the point of OP.

Wow....what a unique, and totally never stated non-point.

You got the chance to unlock 4 allied races during legion. When the content was relevant. That's when these races were introduced, and if you played the game, you likely had the achievements to unlock them anyway.

if you weren't there, you get to go back and earn them if you wish...you don't if you don't.

BFA will include more races, that will be unlocked during BFA, and therefor will be tied to BFA achievements to unlock them. It's not a hard point to grasp, and you're getting what you paid for.

Start grinding, or don't unlock them.....

[Camthur]

I don't feel like the Azerite system is awful, just pointless. Most of the abilities are mediocre and verge on being the annoying crap like we used to have in our talent trees. (like those awful passives that added 1 percent to whatever)

Expeditions get old fast. They want you to think it's some massive system with all these pieces. It really isn't. Do them just a few times and you see the same stuff over and over. The AI is pretty dimwitted too for something that was supposed to be "revolutionary".

[Gadzooks]

Same things were said at the start of the Legion too and we all know how that worked out too - i.e. things were actually great.

BfA will be more than fine because it's literally Legion 2.0 systems-wise.

I don't recall the same things being said at the start of Legion, at all.

[Toho]

It's too late to outright remove the Allied Race requirements (i.e. "I did it, why shouldn't you?").

At this point, at most I can see them allowing Honorbound/7th Legion to also unlock the 7.3.5 races. That would be a reasonable compromise.

Why do you say this?

[Deleted]

+1 literally nothing in the expansion features is available , i dont get surprised why bfa got so little hype

[wildcardNS]

Unfortunately I pretty much agree with this assessment and then on top of it we have the ap grind via wq. The one bright side I would say is that the world itself and the dungeons are a tier above what we had in Legion.

I quit in early cata, taking a peek under the hood. Can you--or someone--explain the acronyms AP and WQ?

[Hexme]

omfgod, if you hate the game, just stop playing.

I'd rather all of the SJW White Knights quit instead, **** might actually get done to bring back WoW as thee top dog of MMOs when it was a Juggernaut in TBC/Wotlk days."Oh your class is borked, give us a few months instead of 2 years to fix it", you know how exciting it was to play as a survival hunter or outlaw in Legion? it was like playing a balance druid in vanilla WoW aka it sucked ***.

As a Shadow Priest BfA hasn't even started for me cause Blizzards lazy *** decided to not do anything at all during beta/alpha and said "oh you will get some changes in 8.1" which is most likely not tell Nov...YAY!!!...

If any other MMO dev pulled that crap it would be a riot in the gaming community, in fact one of them did not to long ago back in June, you know the Bless devs which Blizzard did the same crap they did yet the industry does nothing about it.

[Darleth]

I quit in early cata, taking a peek under the hood. Can you--or someone--explain the acronyms AP and WQ?

AP stands for Artifact Power, WQ for World Quest(s).

Honestly, OP is somewhat right. Island Expeditions, while working and playable, arent worth doing that much, not even for pets or transmog, as the Droprates are abyssmal. It is one of the most boring systems in the game and even the so called "intelligent" AI isn't that intelligent, but some of them are rather annoying (Void Priest that just spams his Nova and heals himself for 40% of max HP and the list goes on).

Allied Races - Only 4 of those were available in Legion because of pre-order access. Of course people could have done them in a few days/weeks, but I can see not wanting to do those anymore as it isn't current content anymore, and thats a huge point: its not CURRENT content. Allied races ARE a selling point of this expansion and them basically being locked behind a rep grind that isn't current anymore is just stupid, but so are other things like unlocking flying in Draenor. Blizzard honestly should just reduce it to Revered/Honored, as those are easier to reach at least for Highmountain and Nightfallen, Argus on the other Hand might take a while longer. Another solution would be to increase the rep gained for those races via WQs by just a bit.

Warfronts obviously are just another way to gear your character up faster. The only real reason for them to exist is to give access to another World Boss and more achievements. I dont think the whole system will be that awesome to play after the initial release at all.

Azerite Armor right now is just... boring. The grind for just another passive bonus isn't that great, that was one of the flaws which Artifact Weapons had after they've increased the levels, and even before that just to reach 54. Crucible made it mandatory to REACH 75, which was a whole other point though. The biggest flaw with Azerite Armor currently is, that most class based perks are pretty bad for most classes, while neutral perks are extremely strong. There are a ton of perks which are either a HUGE dps increase for almost EVERY class or just completely unwanted (Thundering Blast comes to mind which is BiS for a lot of classes).

Not to mention some classes are almost unfinished or got screwed over a ton during beta in terms of development time (Shadow Priest and Enhancement Shaman for example).

[TheRogue]

A rep grind is 100% fine for a cosmetic reward. I think people are too used to being able to spend $20 to unlock skins with no effort.
The amount of whining you read in General/Trade chat is quite high about this subject.

This is how it will be, the crybabies just have to get used to it, you don't get it handed to you by whippin' out your CC.

[Hexme]

A rep grind is 100% fine for a cosmetic reward. I think people are too used to being able to spend $20 to unlock skins with no effort.
The amount of whining you read in General/Trade chat is quite high about this subject.

This is how it will be, the crybabies just have to get used to it, you don't get it handed to you by whippin' out your CC.

Oh look another SJW Blizzard White Knight, sorry kid you're wrong on so many lvls it's pretty sad. Pandas, Worgen, Goblins, BE and Draenei had 0 requirements to unlock. DH's and DK's only required to have 1 max lvl character, which the DK has been removed since Cata or MoP.

I've played over 18 MMO's since 2003, you know how many had some stupid requirement to unlock a new race? maybe one and that was EQ2 which was a server wide achievement to unlock. The sad thing is these allied races aren't even new or original, they are literally copy and paste of existing models/skeletal structures that have the same emotes, dances and you have one that's a lesser resolution than the others (NB).

What's even more sad is people like you defending this crap, it's like watching someone defend loot boxes but with time gating content that was literally a selling point for previous WoW expansions and other MMO's since the dawn of the genre.

[Deleted]

Too bad the drop rates on those weapons/pets/mounts are fucking abysmal.


Yes we do. You do realize that people had access to Warfronts on the beta, right?


Who cares?

What do you expect, 3 weapons and 2 pets per expedition?

People did have access to warfront, as did I, and yet just because I experienced it a certain way doesn't mean people will run it the same as I did.

And I care that I like it, but since this whole topic is "THIS IS SHIT THIS IS TERRIBLE AND THIS IS BAD" with no argument or logic behind it, why do you care.

[TheRogue]

Oh look another SJW Blizzard White Knight, sorry kid you're wrong on so many lvls it's pretty sad. Pandas, Worgen, Goblins, BE and Draenei had 0 requirements to unlock. DH's and DK's only required to have 1 max lvl character, which the DK has been removed since Cata or MoP.

I've played over 18 MMO's since 2003, you know how many had some stupid requirement to unlock a new race? maybe one and that was EQ2 which was a server wide achievement to unlock. The sad thing is these allied races aren't even new or original, they are literally copy and paste of existing models/skeletal structures that have the same emotes, dances and you have one that's a lesser resolution than the others (NB).

What's even more sad is people like you defending this crap, it's like watching someone defend loot boxes but with time gating content that was literally a selling point for previous WoW expansions and other MMO's since the dawn of the genre.

You seem REALLY MAD that you cant get what you want when you deem it to be to appropriate. Which is weird since you called them nothing but reskins with existing animations which is true.

I guess you just like to be mad, and no one can change that.

Wah wah wah cries the sooky baby. Cant get something he doesn't even think is good.

[khitranegg]

You seem REALLY MAD that you cant get what you want when you deem it to be to appropriate. Which is weird since you called them nothing but reskins with existing animations which is true.

I guess you just like to be mad, and no one can change that.

Wah wah wah cries the sooky baby. Cant get something he doesn't even think is good.

You'd be upset too if you can't get something you don't like in a game you're forced to play.

[webzagar]

Allied Races are fine. If you want to unlock them, Argus is literally right there. You get more gold from Legion WQs anyway so it is worth it. Heck Horde actually have it easier since Highmountain and Suramar have way more quests, and guess what? You can quest through Suramar at 110 and gain Experience and Rep. Or just wait until the Darkmoon Faire and get a 10% buff and then do all the quests in an hour at 120. Take a bodyguard and it takes no time since the bodyguards are 120 too.

Heck if you want a quick 15 minute diversion, go to your Garrison and do an invasion at 120. I scored 2400 last night because all the garrison guards are 120 now and they one shot the invaders and take no damage. I probably could have AFKed and still hit Platinum. (Still have mounts to get out of there)

All the people complaining about running out of content... turn on War mode. There's your content right there.

[TheRogue]

You'd be upset too if you can't get something you don't like in a game you're forced to play.

You. I like you.

[Deleted]

In your opinion, that is. You just forgot to add that part.

90+% of whatever you say or think is true actually is just opinion. So you could use "in my opinion" in 90% of the sentences you ever say. Not practical.

[Berndorf]

I quit in early cata, taking a peek under the hood. Can you--or someone--explain the acronyms AP and WQ?

Artifact power which in Legion leveled up the artifact weapons to unlock extra powers and in BfA levels up your amulet to unlock Azerite traits on armor. WQ is world quests which are one of the main ways to farm it.

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90+% of whatever you say or think is true actually is just opinion. So you could use "in my opinion" in 90% of the sentences you ever say. Not practical.

The difference is that many people are under the impression that nearly every opinion they have is actually correct and that people with a differing opinion are wrong.