The hate on LFR

[salate]

Hate on LFR is really overrated.
I really avoid LFR and just dont think about that.

I've got a colleague who plays WoW only for current quest-lore-content, he completes every possible quest/main-lore campaign, does LFR and then unsub before next patch. He's happy to play like that.

He's a casual who wants to know more about Warcraft, who are we to say such people doesnt really deserve to play the game that way?

[Otimus]

I'm a LFR defender and I don't even bother with it anymore. It's so worthless to do more than once, (and that once is either for quests, or to see what it looks like) that it shouldn't even matter to most. It sure as hell doesn't matter to me. Unless you're so uber casual that you literally don't do anything in the game outside of LFR (Which I don't think really applies to anyone on this forum, tbh), it offers so little reward for the time invested, that, frankly... you pretty much already outgear the thing before it even unlocks, at least it does for me, and I'm someone who doesn't bother with raiding or Mythic dungeons. (Let alone Mythic+).

I don't really see how anyone could complain about it anymore, considering how absolutely worthless it is. If that type of content is stopping people from advancing further, then that's just kind of sad, and it speaks volumes as to how unpopular raiding really is if the only way to get anyone to do it is by bribing them, rather than the content itself being appealing. TBH, I think people are just being petty.

[Deleted]

Hate on LFR is really overrated.
I really avoid LFR and just dont think about that.

I've got a colleague who plays WoW only for current quest-lore-content, he completes every possible quest/main-lore campaign, does LFR and then unsub before next patch. He's happy to play like that.

He's a casual who wants to know more about Warcraft, who are we to say such people doesnt really deserve to play the game that way?

Exactly and if game would not have LFR he would be still playing game becouse you know unbeaten content. Tell me more how LFR keep players playing.

[RobertMugabe]

Could anyone explain to me all the hate on LFR? It's supposedly one of the worst things that happened to the game ever and all that. How so? The only incentive to do it is when you have no time at all to play the game just to see the raid, otherwise it's a waste of time (since the loot is pretty much worthless and you can get that level of gear without even setting a foot in a raid). Considering all the alternate gear sources (mythic dungeons that drop exactly the same item level and are doable by freshly leveled characters, low mythic+ keys, any rated PvP even if you have 0 rating, and of course warfronts), it's clear that getting decent gear from LFR is not an option, unless you're incredibly lucky.
So is the problem the idea of having people who don't play the game much witness the raids the worst thing that happened ever, or am I missing something? How does it affect the rest of the player base? I really don't understand the point behind all the hate it gets (especially given that I didn't run LFR even once during this expansion, since there are no worthwhile rewards for people who do other end game content).

Could you stop making threads about the most common topic in this forum? We see this same discussion every damn day, you haven't said anything new ffs

[Twdft]

Titanforging is the main problem in all of this. If someone doesn't have the time or the skill to raid, they shouldn't be put on the same playing field as those who do. Time investment should matter and it becomes hard to care for your character progression if someone who plays 2 hours a day is able to have higher ilvl than you just because they get lucky or the game is designed around them.

Can you show me even 1 character on the armory that only plays lfr and is equally equipped as a character with the same amount of boss kills on a higher difficulty?

[melodramocracy]

Could anyone explain to me all the hate on LFR? It's supposedly one of the worst things that happened to the game ever and all that. How so? The only incentive to do it is when you have no time at all to play the game just to see the raid, otherwise it's a waste of time (since the loot is pretty much worthless and you can get that level of gear without even setting a foot in a raid). Considering all the alternate gear sources (mythic dungeons that drop exactly the same item level and are doable by freshly leveled characters, low mythic+ keys, any rated PvP even if you have 0 rating, and of course warfronts), it's clear that getting decent gear from LFR is not an option, unless you're incredibly lucky.
So is the problem the idea of having people who don't play the game much witness the raids the worst thing that happened ever, or am I missing something? How does it affect the rest of the player base? I really don't understand the point behind all the hate it gets (especially given that I didn't run LFR even once during this expansion, since there are no worthwhile rewards for people who do other end game content).

There's a certain breed of player who loves the idea of being able to exclude others who they feel aren't "worthy" for whatever reason.

LFR negates the ability of these players to act as gatekeepers, so you see all sorts of rage about it. That's really all there is to it.

[Ashleyxoxo]

Much of the social interaction is gone thanks to being able to instantly queue up LFR.

[melodramocracy]

Can you show me even 1 character on the armory that only plays lfr and is equally equipped as a character with the same amount of boss kills on a higher difficulty?

He can't, but he's certainly heard that some guy on an EU server is like 385 just from doing world quests. So it's totes legit.

[AceofH]

There's no way to make people suddenly like raiding.

Overall, for the majority of gamers, raiding sucks. It's time-consuming, it's too social, etc. That's why it's a dying freature - even Mythic+ is more popular.

if they don't care about raiding, then they shouldn't care about the gear from it.
the entire game is time consuming. it's designed that way. what do you expect?
social? are you serious? the game is called an MMO - Massively Multiplayer Online.

if you want to really know why wow is dieing today, its because blizzard is trying to cater to two crowds (mmo fans and non mmo fans) and that sucks for both.

[Deleted]

He can't, but he's certainly heard that some guy on an EU server is like 385 just from doing world quests. So it's totes legit.

And why would he need that gear? What for? So he can up difficulty and do it all over again ? You serously think that anyone with healthy brain will do that? No they will not. Grind gear so you can up difficulty and grind gear again for sake of increasing difficulty? Thats one of the worst content progression you can desing. Who cares about gear when in couple of weeks you will earn 370itemlvl gear from LFR? Nobady. Gear is pointless. You literaly wasting your time to farm gear only to keep incresing difficulty of the game.

[Sencha]

It used to be very simple

Not enough time? No raid for you
Not skilled enough? No raid for you
Not in a guild/lead a guild? No raid for you
Bad reputation on server? No raid for you

But the casuals are the demographic now so they cater to them as they are the majority

This ^

Over time WoW has been more and more tailored for casuals, supposedly to get more subs. LFR is just one of the many elements put in place to cater to this new crowd.

The result? The amount of veteran players leaving the game was higher than the amount of casual players gained. So subs are decreasing expansion after expansion. And classic was (re)born.

The future? Retail WoW will keep losing subs, but partly compensated by players returning for classic, then TBC reborn, then WOTLK reborn. In 2024, WoW will not have enough subs and will go F2P, but no new expansion will be released. Later, in 2028, they will shut down the servers when in-game paid services will not be high enough to cover maintenance costs.

End of the story.

[Deleted]

There's no way to make people suddenly like raiding.

Overall, for the majority of gamers, raiding sucks. It's time-consuming, it's too social, etc. That's why it's a dying freature - even Mythic+ is more popular.

MMOS are not about raiding. WoW become about raiding becouse Blizzard make raiding so accessible while rest of the game is just no meaning that WoW get this perception that everybody should raid. No raiding isnt what makes mmo great. Raiding is last thing you should do when you run out of content after months doing non raiding content. Raiding should not be even in your mind when you join game.

[Mazinger-Z]

LFR wouldn't suck so bad if they actually had some barrier to entry beyond ilvl.

A majority of the mechanics can be outright ignored or powered through until you run into one that is a legitimate blocker like the orbs on G'hunn or the changing rooms in MOTHER.

Then suddenly you have to have the following:

1) 1 person willing to herd the cats
2) a group willing to listen

I usually tank LFR, but I ended up re-queuing as DPS just to run the orbs.

- - - Updated - - -

MMOS are not about raiding. WoW become about raiding becouse Blizzard make raiding so accessible while rest of the game is just no meaning that WoW get this perception that everybody should raid. No raiding isnt what makes mmo great. Raiding is last thing you should do when you run out of content after months doing non raiding content. Raiding should not be even in your mind when you join game.

This is equally true. Blizzard wanted to put all the gear behind raiding and M+ so the game no longer feels like an MMORPG, but a Dungeon Looter.

I really miss being able to craft decent weapons with sufficient time investment and doing challenging content.

[Otimus]

MMOS are not about raiding. WoW become about raiding becouse Blizzard make raiding so accessible while rest of the game is just no meaning that WoW get this perception that everybody should raid. No raiding isnt what makes mmo great. Raiding is last thing you should do when you run out of content after months doing non raiding content. Raiding should not be even in your mind when you join game.

There's a whole lot of truth in this, IMO

[Autumn]

As a raider, I use LFR on my main very occasionally - to practise off-specs/different talent builds, to tweak my UI or check out a new WA, and to check out abilities like orb-running just in case I'm ever asked to do it. Otherwise, I don't run it - I certainly have nothing against it.

On alts, it can be a good stepping stone to higher difficulties.

I hate the people who say things like "kick xxxx their dps is rubbish" - if you ever check out their character, they have the absolute minimum ilvl to get in the raid, appalling weapons and trinkets, and the ppl calling them out are like 30 levels higher with some pieces of good gear.

Overall, although I don't run it very often, I think it's a great addition to the game.

[Otimus]

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Blizzard wanted to put all the gear behind raiding and M+ so the game no longer feels like an MMORPG, but a Dungeon Looter.

This too has a lot of truth in it.

[melodramocracy]

And why would he need that gear? What for? So he can up difficulty and do it all over again ? You serously think that anyone with healthy brain will do that? No they will not. Grind gear so you can up difficulty and grind gear again for sake of increasing difficulty? Thats one of the worst content progression you can desing. Who cares about gear when in couple of weeks you will earn 370itemlvl gear from LFR? Nobady. Gear is pointless. You literaly wasting your time to farm gear only to keep incresing difficulty of the game.

If you truly bought into this notion, you'd simply stop playing once you'd seen heroic 5 mans and LFR, until the next patch arrives.

- - - Updated - - -

MMOS are not about raiding. WoW become about raiding becouse Blizzard make raiding so accessible while rest of the game is just no meaning that WoW get this perception that everybody should raid. No raiding isnt what makes mmo great. Raiding is last thing you should do when you run out of content after months doing non raiding content. Raiding should not be even in your mind when you join game.

While I do agree with you on what makes the genre great, this particular one has always had raiding as its pinnacle PvE experience. Always.

[Dziubla]

While I used to not understand it either, lately...Thing is, with LFR, Warfronts, weekly events for timewalks/mythics/whatever, giving people 340-355-370 gear for pretty much no effort at all, that's not including WF/TF...There are just more geared, but still clueless, players than ever before. I had 360-370 groups wiping on mythic0 while doing mount runs, because people are just THAT bad, not a single interrupt, zero situational awareness, running around like headless chickens at the first sign of aggro, pulling even more stuff in the process, mages/shamans not knowing what hero/bl/tw is (that's a personal favourite of mine)...Then you inspect those guys, and notice that sure, they have 360-370ilvl, and yet every single piece of gear they have is from LFR or Warfront or is Titanforged. You perform a Facepalm, and proceed to leave the group.

[salate]

Exactly and if game would not have LFR he would be still playing game becouse you know unbeaten content. Tell me more how LFR keep players playing.

He didnt even complete all mythics. Never started M+. But LFR is a part of game. And confirmed that its a part of "tourist mode". So, "easy story mode" never makes the game worse just because there is one feature for players who's (imho) never been part of community, the main reason "LFR is bad" because all we get = community divide? No? I dont know, people just like to look for problems and stuff

The main problem of WoW is > its too old, but for 14 years lifespan its really healthy (shockingly but undeniable fact tbh).
Azerite system made BfA really stupid. Thats it, but well, its my opinion.


Actually sometimes LFR is harder than some heroics raids, if you know what i mean

[Stellan]

People with very fragile egos become excited when they see other people getting stuff that they think only they should get. That we are talking about a game says it all.