8.1 DK .. PvP

[Cempa]

Choose between mitigation and damage ..

Looking at DK in general and Frost specifically, I don't get why they would force a choice between fixing a huge problem today -ability to survive- and damage .. Not only do they remove one of the most fun PvP abilities EVER in WoW 'Decomposing Aura' but they make the DK choose between Necrotic Aura (+8% Magic Damage) and one of the new x2 'survive' PvP talents. If that is not enough, they added a 50% snare to the DK when using it ..

So 15% less HP on target + 8% magic damage BOTH need to go just to get enough mitigation to kinda make it in PvP ..

The fix was simple and it was reduce Death Strike cost and increase its heal .. That is all they needed to do ..

Fix one thing and break x2 ..

[Exsaven]

DKs are looking good for 8.1 what are you on about?

[Malus416]

DKs are looking good for 8.1 what are you on about?

We currently have massive PvP talent bloat. Tons of them are absolutely necessary for survivability. So instead of being able to grab chill streak which might actually do some damage now, I'm forced to take lichborne, the death strike cost reduction and dark sim, etc. There's too much that ISN'T baseline, but is 100% needed baseline.

[Exsaven]

We currently have massive PvP talent bloat. Tons of them are absolutely necessary for survivability. So instead of being able to grab chill streak which might actually do some damage now, I'm forced to take lichborne, the death strike cost reduction and dark sim, etc. There's too much that ISN'T baseline, but is 100% needed baseline.

They're removing quite a few pvp talents across many classes (including DK) next patch, and changing old/adding new ones. Doesn't seem like too much of an issue to me.

And having to choose between offensive talents or defensive ones is, in my opinion, good design that should be applied to all classes and specs.

[Cempa]

DKs are looking good for 8.1 what are you on about?

The damage you see today from DK PvP wise is built on the following PvP talents:

Decomposing Aura (reduce enemy HP by 15%)
Necrotic Aura (increase magic dmg taken by enemy 8%)
Overpowered Rune Weapon (reduces CD of main burst CD by 50%)

8.1 deletes DA+ORW and makes NA a sacrifice and seeing how our MAIN issue is ability to survive (FDK will always get focused first hard CC on healer and die then or next full hard CC) IT MAKES NO SENSE for them to do so ..

Its a classic blizz head fake, the end result is if we want to survive like be viable then do SHIT damage .. WTF!!

Edit: Yes I play Frost. I only see one way forward which some/many others have already asked for, the new x2 talents to be combined into one ..

[Terion]

Why we have to choose survival talents to do shit dps and almost every other class in game is taking talents to do more damage over they do with nice survivability as a baseline? Why Blizz, WHY?

[Sarrgoth]

Blizz stopped liking death knights with MOP. Time to move on or get a crazy good healer and 2nd dps, cuz you can’t do 2s.

Take a look at the DK abilities. It’s bland, boring, uninteresting. They took an undead, juggernaut of Northrend and turned it into the fury warrior of vanilla and TBC, without charge/intercept. Class fantasy in an RPG game? Wouldn’t dream of it

[AlmightyGerkin]

Blizz stopped liking death knights with MOP. Time to move on or get a crazy good healer and 2nd dps, cuz you can’t do 2s.

Take a look at the DK abilities. It’s bland, boring, uninteresting. They took an undead, juggernaut of Northrend and turned it into the fury warrior of vanilla and TBC, without charge/intercept. Class fantasy in an RPG game? Wouldn’t dream of it

Class fantasy has been dead since cataclysm.

[msdos]

They took an undead, juggernaut of Northrend and turned it into the fury warrior of vanilla and TBC, without charge/intercept

Lmao, I've been saying this forever over on the official forums. Everyone here pretty much already knows. Frost plays almost identical to TBC Fury.
Deathstrike = Bloodthirst. Obliterate = Heroic Strike. Howling Blast = Whirlwind. Gathering Storm = Cleave. Pillar = Recklessness. With tiny little variations sprinkled in here and there. Knowing Blizz, they probably thought the playerbase would love this, like a throwback to the old Fury or something..

Too bad it's just lazy and boring. Oh and they're killing Frost in PVP with these changes btw.

[Nerovar]

Lmao, I've been saying this forever over on the official forums. Everyone here pretty much already knows. Frost plays almost identical to TBC Fury.
Deathstrike = Bloodthirst. Obliterate = Heroic Strike. Howling Blast = Whirlwind. Gathering Storm = Cleave. Pillar = Recklessness. With tiny little variations sprinkled in here and there. Knowing Blizz, they probably thought the playerbase would love this, like a throwback to the old Fury or something..

Too bad it's just lazy and boring. Oh and they're killing Frost in PVP with these changes btw.

Yeah, and UH is basically a dumbed down version of the old combo point system.

[Deleted]

We currently have massive PvP talent bloat. Tons of them are absolutely necessary for survivability. So instead of being able to grab chill streak which might actually do some damage now, I'm forced to take lichborne, the death strike cost reduction and dark sim, etc. There's too much that ISN'T baseline, but is 100% needed baseline.

100% this and the hole reason why most classes suck and are boring since expos. Just make the damn necrotic aura BASELINE for DKs so the bring some god damn ACTUAL raid utility. DH got the same so stop being fucking blind. Many more spells that should be baseline but ive given up with the class design. Only online for 2x raid evening per week thats it and im thinking about cutting it aswell. Pretty done with this game. Obvious choices that are not being made.

[msdos]

Yeah, and UH is basically a dumbed down version of the old combo point system.

Combo point system: decent, still in use today, makes sense.

TBC Fury: trash, boring, uninteresting, doesn't exist anymore, but you can relive it with Frost.

[Deleted]

U know u talks about Frost dk ? Uh dk will be the pvp class. It always meant to be with necrotic strike. However it IS true that most 8.1 mandatory pvp talents should be baseline, also uh dk needs a rework as the only triple resource spec ingame which makes an unpleasant play experience with lower dmg and survivability Than most simpler specs...

[Th3Scourge]

Unholy is looking good in 8.1, necromancer's bargain will add some much needed burst and pressure. Necromancer's bargain, followed with a few necrotic strikes will be hard for healers to handle and force some early defensives

[Ange]

I am still not sure how 8.1 can work out positive for us without a major damage buff to both specs. Not sure what you guys see in pvp, when I do my cap games in the low 1800 I see enhancement/assa/dh doing solid 10k+ DPS for the first minute while I can't even push 2/3 of that with zero CC and with mostly autoattack damage and a dot. Healers are able to deal with 10k+ melee dps specs, so the unholy/frost preassure is not that hot, esp. when most of its damage is from autoattack.

The defense side for 8.1 is done I guess. We stay shittier with zero IBF/LEGION-fullheal nor real deff cooldowns. But Frost is basicly Obliteration (minus BoS, minus Fury, minus ColdHeart - minus basicly every pve talent losing 7-8% with each pvp choice we HAVE to make) it would need, like in LEGION a solid 24-30% buff to make the spec viable. Unholy is lost I think, its the worst spec in pve (compared to EVERYTHING), relies on Army and is not even on the 8.1 buff list yet.

We had in LEGION IBF-fullheal with +30%-DPS Obliteration to counter other melee classes burst/defense, while everyone kept burst/defense from legion, the DK class won't be fixed with a gimmick pvp talent.