Solution to faction bias

[TheImperios]

So we've heard much about how the Alliance is overlooked in terms of lore, how they're always passive and all the attention is given to the Horde. That's fair; I can see the reason for the complaints. The question is, are you willing to pay the price for the kind of "attention" the Horde is given?

Imagine, if you please, such a situation. The Alliance is allowed to win. All the attention is given to it, the story is about them and their characters, they move the plot, they burn down Orgrimmar, Thunder Bluff, Silvermoon, while the Horde only reacts to it all. You even get better racials. However:

• For four expansions, you will be ruled by evil tyrants, who start wars at the slightest provocation and talk about how they want to destroy all hope in the world
• Your faction commits two large-scale genocides (let's say Thunder Bluff and Suramar are both razed to the ground) and numerous smaller war crimes, like enslaving orc children with Light magic and forcing them to work in salt mines or something.
• Leaders of your faction like Gelbin and Tyrande defect to the Horde because they see the Aliance losing its way. In faction war storylines, instead of fighting the Horde, you fight to restore the Alliance's honour. And you will eventually restore it with Horde help, only for the next High King to commit another genocide soon thereafter.

Would you enjoy such a storyline?

[Grazrug]

The alliance isn't even overlooked actually. Their fans have just the wrong priorities. Big love to op for the irony. Lol. When you write it down like that, nobody with a sane mind can possibly like that storytelling.

[Kwento]

So we've heard much about how the Alliance is overlooked in terms of lore, how they're always passive and all the attention is given to the Horde. That's fair; I can see the reason for the complaints. The question is, are you willing to pay the price for the kind of "attention" the Horde is given?

Imagine, if you please, such a situation. The Alliance is allowed to win. All the attention is given to it, the story is about them and their characters, they move the plot, they burn down Orgrimmar, Thunder Bluff, Silvermoon, while the Horde only reacts to it all. You even get better racials. However:

• For four expansions, you will be ruled by evil tyrants, who start wars at the slightest provocation and talk about how they want to destroy all hope in the world
• Your faction commits two large-scale genocides (let's say Thunder Bluff and Suramar are both razed to the ground) and numerous smaller war crimes, like enslaving orc children with Light magic and forcing them to work in salt mines or something.
• Leaders of your faction like Gelbin and Tyrande defect to the Horde because they see the Aliance losing its way. In faction war storylines, instead of fighting the Horde, you fight to restore the Alliance's honour. And you will eventually restore it with Horde help, only for the next High King to commit another genocide soon thereafter.

Would you enjoy such a storyline?

There’s another thing. They aren’t gonna be allowed to win wars, only battles.

[SoulForge]

So we've heard much about how the Alliance is overlooked in terms of lore, how they're always passive and all the attention is given to the Horde. That's fair; I can see the reason for the complaints. The question is, are you willing to pay the price for the kind of "attention" the Horde is given?

Imagine, if you please, such a situation. The Alliance is allowed to win. All the attention is given to it, the story is about them and their characters, they move the plot, they burn down Orgrimmar, Thunder Bluff, Silvermoon, while the Horde only reacts to it all. You even get better racials. However:

• For four expansions, you will be ruled by evil tyrants, who start wars at the slightest provocation and talk about how they want to destroy all hope in the world
• Your faction commits two large-scale genocides (let's say Thunder Bluff and Suramar are both razed to the ground) and numerous smaller war crimes, like enslaving orc children with Light magic and forcing them to work in salt mines or something.
• Leaders of your faction like Gelbin and Tyrande defect to the Horde because they see the Aliance losing its way. In faction war storylines, instead of fighting the Horde, you fight to restore the Alliance's honour. And you will eventually restore it with Horde help, only for the next High King to commit another genocide soon thereafter.

Would you enjoy such a storyline?

I think I would just prefer no factions and battlegroup vs battlegroup pvp, kinda like GW2 does it.

[Zandalariprelate]

I would love both factions could keep their assholes, the world would be very boring without them but also we need people to keep them in line, I would love some light/void zealotry in the alliance, same with the elements and arcane magic in the horde

[Nathasil]

So we've heard much about how the Alliance is overlooked in terms of lore, how they're always passive and all the attention is given to the Horde. That's fair; I can see the reason for the complaints. The question is, are you willing to pay the price for the kind of "attention" the Horde is given?

Imagine, if you please, such a situation. The Alliance is allowed to win. All the attention is given to it, the story is about them and their characters, they move the plot, they burn down Orgrimmar, Thunder Bluff, Silvermoon, while the Horde only reacts to it all. You even get better racials. However:

• For four expansions, you will be ruled by evil tyrants, who start wars at the slightest provocation and talk about how they want to destroy all hope in the world
• Your faction commits two large-scale genocides (let's say Thunder Bluff and Suramar are both razed to the ground) and numerous smaller war crimes, like enslaving orc children with Light magic and forcing them to work in salt mines or something.
• Leaders of your faction like Gelbin and Tyrande defect to the Horde because they see the Aliance losing its way. In faction war storylines, instead of fighting the Horde, you fight to restore the Alliance's honour. And you will eventually restore it with Horde help, only for the next High King to commit another genocide soon thereafter.

Would you enjoy such a storyline?

You 100% missed the point...the interesting part is how many players of the OTHER faction that does not receive ANY development for those 4 expansions would faction change to see the interesting stories instead of watching them on Youtube. Except for that one young, lighthearted Blood Elf boy, who goes on a venture and is actually a really nice person....but of course that means he has to be gay.

[CasualNoob]

Do it.
Also, you forgot "alliance gets five new unique mounts, horde gets five new raptors" part. And OP racials, ofc.

[Malikath]

ITT: delusional fanbois pretend that the faction imbalance is caused by story to make the proven claims of statistical and tactical advantage horde racials have had since BC onward look absurd by straw-manning the argument.
an ultimately futile effort now that the game is dying due to a combination of blizzard's laziness, and incompetence with a healthy dose of activision's blind greed.

wildstar defenders mocked critics to, i spent the last few weeks linking my posts from launch on the forums rubbing the salt deep into the wound.

[Deleted]

snipit

Again not a fair comparison as you incert a horde style storyline into the alliance.
The horde has a history of being agressors to the point of genocidal conquerers. Even in vanilla they had a very tribalistic and agressive attitude on top of attacking neutrals and alliance everywhere. So theirs more of a build up to such things.

Majority of the horde either didn't care or enjoyed their agression in Garrosh war until vol'jin got backstabbed and blizzard went over the top in having the horde experiencing it by turning it on itself.
If alliance had the entire experience to the point of Vol'jin being backstabbed it would be received more negatively by alliance playerbase as they are much more focused on the noble paladin narative since vanilla.

Another story element is that one faction is gaining more lands and progression while the other is only stagnant and loses stuff.

[TheImperios]

ITT: delusional fanbois pretend that the faction imbalance is caused by story to make the proven claims of statistical and tactical advantage horde racials have had since BC onward look absurd by straw-manning the argument.
an ultimately futile effort now that the game is dying due to a combination of blizzard's laziness, and incompetence with a healthy dose of activision's blind greed.

wildstar defenders mocked critics to, i spent the last few weeks linking my posts from launch on the forums rubbing the salt deep into the wound.

Racials need to be balanced, same with mounts. Not my topic though.

[Deleted]

ITT: delusional fanbois pretend that the faction imbalance is caused by story to make the proven claims of statistical and tactical advantage horde racials have had since BC onward look absurd by straw-manning the argument.
an ultimately futile effort now that the game is dying due to a combination of blizzard's laziness, and incompetence with a healthy dose of activision's blind greed.

wildstar defenders mocked critics to, i spent the last few weeks linking my posts from launch on the forums rubbing the salt deep into the wound.

It's really hard to say how much story is influencing the faction imbalance. Their is some element of faction pride and constantly being beaten down element.
But the much bigger element is from gameplay and which side has better performance to escalate the situation (whatever the reason may be that faction performs better from gameplay point of view)

[Varodoc]

Likewise, you complain that the Horde has paid a price for being on the spotlight. Let's see if you would like it if it were overshadowed by the Alliance. Let's see if you would like it if:

- It is led by a 18-yo-old Gary Stu who leads the army even though he is surrounded by characters who are much older, wiser and more qualified than him;
- Has one of their settlements erased from history at the beginning of every expansion;
- Has a race that looks like a complete joke and fails to stop enemies in their own territory;
- Is constantly written like retards just so the evil Alliance dictator can have their way;
- Is always overshadowed by the Alliance in terms of storytelling and merely serves as their sidekick in bringing down the evil Alliance dictator;
- Has to spy on the walls of Stormwind commanding a small robotic cat while the Alliance goes through two epic sieges accompanied by the great heroes of their founding.

Would you enjoy such a storyline?

[Mehrunes]

ITT: delusional fanbois pretend that the faction imbalance is caused by story to make the proven claims of statistical and tactical advantage horde racials have had since BC onward look absurd by straw-manning the argument.
an ultimately futile effort now that the game is dying due to a combination of blizzard's laziness, and incompetence with a healthy dose of activision's blind greed.

wildstar defenders mocked critics to, i spent the last few weeks linking my posts from launch on the forums rubbing the salt deep into the wound.

Except there's plenty of people that argue Blizzard is Horde biased on grounds of lore. So the straw-man here is yours. Also, Alliance's racials were dominant in PvP for nearly a decade.

[TheImperios]

Again not a fair comparison as you incert a horde style storyline into the alliance.
The horde has a history of being agressors to the point of genocidal conquerers. Even in vanilla they had a very tribalistic and agressive attitude on top of attacking neutrals and alliance everywhere. So theirs more of a build up to such things.
Majority of the horde either didn't care or enjoyed their agression in Garrosh war until vol'jin got backstabbed and blizzard went over the top in having the horde experiencing it by turning it on itself.
If alliance had the entire experience to the point of Vol'jin being backstabbed it would be received more negatively by alliance playerbase as they are much more focused on the noble paladin narative since vanilla.

Be aware than another part is that one faction is gaining more lands and progression while the other is only stagnant and loses stuff.

"Tribalistic = evil"? Nice racism here.

In Vanilla, you were actually attacked by the Alliance in starting Horde zones (Kul Tiran marines, Bael Modan), nothing similar happens in any Alliance zone. Neutrals attacked? You mean centaurs and quillboar? Alliance got gnolls and kobolds.

You miss the ultimate point of the Horde, the deconstruction of fantasy monster tropes. The idea behind the Horde is "what if the monsters in fantasy were actually people?". Of course, later expansions ruined that.

[Super Dickmann]

Fuck me, this thread made the LARPer salty enough to actually break character. Someone screen cap this shit.

[Nerovar]

"Tribalistic = evil"? Nice racism here.

In Vanilla, you were actually attacked by the Alliance in starting Horde zones (Kul Tiran marines, Bael Modan), nothing similar happens in any Alliance zone. Neutrals attacked? You mean centaurs and quillboar? Alliance got gnolls and kobolds.

You miss the ultimate point of the Horde, the deconstruction of fantasy monster tropes. The idea behind the Horde is "what if the monsters in fantasy were actually people?". Of course, later expansions ruined that.

Maybe they aren't people and we need to start building orc internment camps.

[Super Dickmann]

Maybe they aren't people and we need to start building orc internment camps.

There are more permanent solutions, if only you'd listened to them when you had the chance.

[Deleted]

"Tribalistic = evil"? Nice racism here.

In Vanilla, you were actually attacked by the Alliance in starting Horde zones (Kul Tiran marines, Bael Modan), nothing similar happens in any Alliance zone. Neutrals attacked? You mean centaurs and quillboar? Alliance got gnolls and kobolds.

You miss the ultimate point of the Horde, the deconstruction of fantasy monster tropes. The idea behind the Horde is "what if the monsters in fantasy were actually people?". Of course, later expansions ruined that.

Tribalistic doesn't equal evil. I actually wanted to avoid that equivelant. I rather wish you avoid spouting words like racism that quickly.
Tribalism brings a certain style with itself in a story, factionpride and not looking at your own mistake but rather focus on the other side and taking action against that. Tribalism also has cool elements in it as it can give a stronger identity of their about. I don't intend this to be compared into the real world.

Kul Tiran marines wern't alliance, I suggest playing WC 3 extra content where you play rexxar.
What I remember from Bael Modan was they were excating a location that was considered sacred to the nomadic taurens. The tauren who told them to stop, not wanting the spirits being disturbed, got ignored and chased off. In return the tauren send adventurers to stop them with explosives...... Bael Modan was probably the biggest one where alliance started the agression, although their was forts location could be considered being in Quilboar land rather than horde land as the horde only settled recently and working on their expansion into the barrens.

Because each side has their gnolls and quillbars i do not mean those. I mean the more peaceful intelligent humanoids like the high elves in the hinterlands for example. Or the ambermill owned by dalaran, or the cenarion circle enclaves.

Don't get me wrong that Warcraft 3 painted a completly different picture of the horde.

[Grazrug]

Likewise, you complain that the Horde has paid a price for being on the spotlight. Let's see if you would like it if it were overshadowed by the Alliance. Let's see if you would like it if:

- It is led by a 18-yo-old Gary Stu who leads the army even though he is surrounded by characters who are much older, wiser and more qualified than him;
- Has one of their settlements erased from history at the beginning of every expansion;
- Has a race that looks like a complete joke and fails to stop enemies in their own territory;
- Is constantly written like retards just so the evil Alliance dictator can have their way;
- Is always overshadowed by the Alliance in terms of storytelling and merely serves as their sidekick in bringing down the evil Alliance dictator;
- Has to spy on the walls of Stormwind commanding a small robotic cat while the Alliance goes through two epic sieges accompanied by the great heroes of their founding.

Would you enjoy such a storyline?

Such a writing stops the devs from turning said faction on the railroads every 5 minutes. ALSO, stop the dick size contest. Faction painted zones, on the map, mean crap for the overall Lore experience, and only matter for the questing parts, until you hit end level. That's why cataclysm would have happened sooner or later. Even all beta players prior to vanilla complained long ago about this inbalance and overall boring exoperience, because, as a Horde player, pre cataclysm you never left Barrens and co, until you hit max level in the plague lands. The Alliance dominated the Map on the other hand and had much more to chose from. LORE BIAS happens in the end game content when it comes to representation. And Blizzard can claim as much neutral content as they want but these characters here:

Jaina, Varian, Khadgar, Velen, Maiev, Tyrande, Malfurion, Turalyon, Alleria, Vereesa, Arator, Rhonin, Illidan and all of their sidekicks ARE NOT neutral.

Thrall had 15 minutes of fame in Cataclysm and that's it. Outside of this, there never had been a important Horde only Hero who saved the planet during neutral content. It was all Alliance. Always.

- - - Updated - - -

Tribalistic doesn't equal evil. I actually wanted to avoid that equivelant. I rather wish you avoid spouting words like racism that quickly.
Tribalism brings a certain style with itself in a story, factionpride and not looking at your own mistake but rather focus on the other side and taking action against that. Tribalism also has cool elements in it as it can give a stronger identity of their about. I don't intend this to be compared into the real world.

Kul Tiran marines wern't alliance, I suggest playing WC 3 extra content where you play rexxar.
What I remember from Bael Modan was they were excating a location that was considered sacred to the nomadic taurens. The tauren who told them to stop, not wanting the spirits being disturbed, got ignored and chased off. In return the tauren send adventurers to stop them with explosives...... Bael Modan was probably the biggest one where alliance started the agression, although their was forts location could be considered being in Quilboar land rather than horde land as the horde only settled recently and working on their expansion into the barrens.

Because each side has their gnolls and quillbars i do not mean those. I mean the more peaceful intelligent humanoids like the high elves in the hinterlands for example. Or the ambermill owned by dalaran, or the cenarion circle enclaves.

Don't get me wrong that Warcraft 3 painted a completly different picture of the horde.

They totally were Alliance. Thy only left them after Daelin was already dead and Stormwind broke the memo, that they can't afford troops for a war, because they were still rebulding.

[Deleted]

They totally where Alliance. Thy only left them after Daelin was already dead and Stormwind broke the memo, that they can't afford troops for a war, because they were still rebulding.

Which happened before WoW vanilla. Again play the rexxar campaign in WC3 where you have Jaina siding with the horde against Daelin. and the Kul Tiran soldiers in Duratar arn't from Theramore.