#MorallyGrey

[VladlTutushkin]

Nah, im sure alliance is using work-safe sterilised version of void. Just add anduin to mix and voila.

And undeath dooms your soul to eternally hang in the worst hell in existance, so bad actaully that certain whore is ready to throw entire world under the bust only to avoid it. I would prefer oblivion to such existance.
P.S.
Plus animal souls doesnt really matter.

[Combatbutler]

No I mean, why would the soul be anywhere near a coprse this old? Necromancy specifically brings the soul back to the corpse. We have no indication the void can do that. Attach it to something living and sure, it will try to eat it.

Why shouldn't it be able to? Again the void is the primary consumer and corrupter, it is the most vile thing in existence, everything necromancy can do the void should be able to do as well, so if necromancy can form a link to a soul from a long dead body the void should be able to do the same. Simply because the void loves to consume every soul it can gets it claws on.

There really is no reason to assume the void merely animates stuff, because it goes against its very nature.

[Zandalariprelate]

I mean he was turning as we spoke so I assume undeath very much had touched him. And we did not consult the Light until the end (the others were Remulos and Alexstrasza). When we did call for the Light we went directly to the source so to speak.

Mind you, we have no idea what "paradise eternal" is. For all we know it can be oblivion within the Light by losing all individuality.

Uuna questline has her parents showing up and asking if she wants to go to the light paradise, pretty sure there is one at least in the benevolents part of each cosmic forces(I imagine the death one in the shadowlands is like the elyseum and the arcane is some elevated plane where emotions like pain doesn't exist)

[FelPlague]

As the expansion has ramped up, Sylvanas burning Teldrassil has hardly been the only evil "morally grey" thing that has been done. Let's gather this all up in one place, post any example you can find of things you, or your faction, have done! For postcount, previous expansions and things you personally did that aren't canon also count!

Gogogo!


source: https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comment..._great_for_my/

since this is still going

they never said sylvanas was morally grey
they said azeroth is a land of morally grey choices

[Malikath]

Uuna questline has her parents showing up and asking if she wants to go to the light paradise, pretty sure there is one at least in the benevolents part of each cosmic forces(I imagine the death one in the shadowlands is like the elyseum and the arcane is some elevated plane where emotions like pain doesn't exist)

arcane isn't a spiritual force, there's no arcane afterlife realm other then the created realms of the titans who're light/arcane affiliated.
arcane energy itself(mana) is a byproduct of the interaction of light and void energies.

[VladlTutushkin]

since this is still going

they never said sylvanas was morally grey
they said azeroth is a land of morally grey choices

Even if they didnt said that outright about her they said many times that "both factions will be justified" or something and basically sang songs avout how this war will be 100% ambiguous in terms of morality and show both sides as good and bad. What scares me? if they think that this is Alliance's "grey" then they very well might place a non existant "choice" in the end - Alliance sucking it up again and asking Horde to work with them or "being mean, racist and non-progressive" and telling Horde to fuck off (of course we will only get first choice as canon.)

[Zandalariprelate]

arcane isn't a spiritual force, there's no arcane afterlife realm other then the created realms of the titans who're light/arcane affiliated.
arcane energy itself(mana) is a byproduct of the interaction of light and void energies.

As far we know, the blood elves has an afterlife that doesn't look like the light paraside and they aren't big light worshipers. Also being a cosmic force surely has a lot to do in their own sphere, if life and death has their own afterlife like the dream and shadowlands which basically capture souls that are bidden, then why arcane or the void can't do the same? There is a shadow priest where we rescue from the void in her afterlife during the priest hall questline.

[Powerogue]

Y'know I make excuses for the lore a lot. At the end of the day I'm OK with rule of cool > consistency to a certain threshold, and things happening primarily because they're needed to progress the plot in a certain direction.

BUT ON MY HORDE PANDAREN.
THIS?
SERIOUSLY?!





It's a good thing I have this hat, because my only justifiable explanation at this point is being mind controlled at inopportune times without my knowledge.

(Previously it was getting drunk.)

[Maxilian]

Y'know I make excuses for the lore a lot. At the end of the day I'm OK with rule of cool > consistency to a certain threshold, and things happening primarily because they're needed to progress the plot in a certain direction.

BUT ON MY HORDE PANDAREN.
THIS?
SERIOUSLY?!

The quest do point out that the blade compels you to bring it to Sylvanas, so yeah, your character was not completely on its right mind at the moment (regardless of keeping the Nzoth gift, though i would assume that it is supposed for hte player to still have Nzoth gift by the moment you do this quest)

- - - Updated - - -

As far we know, the blood elves has an afterlife that doesn't look like the light paraside and they aren't big light worshipers. Also being a cosmic force surely has a lot to do in their own sphere, if life and death has their own afterlife like the dream and shadowlands which basically capture souls that are bidden, then why arcane or the void can't do the same? There is a shadow priest where we rescue from the void in her afterlife during the priest hall questline.

Well we see some void users end up in the Shadowlands (like the Draneai we fight in Auchidon in Alternative draenor and the Mantid Queen).

Note: Also... what's the detail about it in hte questline? having in mind that Alleria uses the void to transport from one place to another, makes me think is more like another plane or realm that, if you delve to much into it without the knowledge, could end up trapped there -like the poor horde soldiers that get pulled there by the Void Elves-)

[Zandalariprelate]

Well we see some void users end up in the Shadowlands (like the Draneai we fight in Auchidon in Alternative draenor and the Mantid Queen).

Note: Also... what's the detail about it in hte questline? having in mind that Alleria uses the void to transport from one place to another, makes me think is more like another plane or realm that, if you delve to much into it without the knowledge, could end up trapped there -like the poor horde soldiers that get pulled there by the Void Elves-)

The table missions are probably non canon, in the BTS book Alonsus and Calia has zero combat experience, despite of being followers that can be send into said missions.

About the dimensions, chronicles confimed the void lords exist outside from the warcraft universe aka the dark beyond just like the Nether, so probably they have their own dimension like the burning hells or the high heavens from diablo and considering the shadowlands has many levels and it's the realm of the dead, I am sure this applies to every cosmic forces, after all even Aluneth comes from another dimension.

[Powerogue]

Just three words.



I followed them.

[Maljinwo]

Just three words.
I followed them.

Clearly, Thrall was rebelling already.
How DARE him go to Nagrand and become a Farmer

[The Stormbringer]

I honestly never knew about the quest where LADY LIADRIN, a PALADIN OF THE LIGHT and CHOSEN OF THE ASHBRINGER has you murder non-combatants and injured, unarmed soldiers. What the fuck, Blizz?

[therealstegblob]

I honestly never knew about the quest where LADY LIADRIN, a PALADIN OF THE LIGHT and CHOSEN OF THE ASHBRINGER has you murder non-combatants and injured, unarmed soldiers. What the fuck, Blizz?

It's the same on both sides; at least I assume you mean the world quest? It's just a generic WQ objective attached to a generic DO THIS TASK FOR THE HORDE, CHAMPION voiceline. I'd look at it as barely being canon, really.

Anyways, in response to this thread in general: I get so tired of seeing people not understand what moral greyness really is. It's more than a character who does a bad thing and then a good thing (if they had clear black and white morals for both reasons and it was a purely good/bad thing, the character is NOT morally grey, they are morally loose/conflicted at best). Moral Greyness is a decision or character who has no obvious right or wrong answer.

For instance, picture a village elder who is living in a village deep in a jungle. A young girl in the village gets a rare sickness that can only be cured by medicine made out of a flower that only grows in the most dangerous part of the jungle. The village elder has to choose: does he send his three best warriors on a quest to hopefully retrieve a flower, risking their lives and the safety of the collective village; or does he choose to let the girl perish?

That's a morally grey decision, because there's no obvious right or wrong answer and you can make a moral argument for each. A character who is full blown morally grey would be like a police officer who punishes everyone to the fullest and fairest extent of the law, regardless of the severity or context of their crimes. Sure, putting a man in jail because he stole bread to feed his starving children is a dick move; but it was also the law. There's a moral argument you can make for both standpoints.

Warcraft has very, very few Morally Grey characters and Sylvanas is not really one of them (one of the only ones is Orgrim Doomhammer. King Pernolde of Alterac would've been another strong morally grey characters but they ruined that in the novels he was in by turning him into a weasley bad guy). Sylvanas started out actually very morally grey with a lean towards morally black, but recently she's just been shoehorned into doing more and more villainous things. I was on board with the burning of Teldrassil, because it made sense from a grey morals standpoint (on one hand she was killing civilians, on the other hand she was ridding Kalimdor of a very powerful enemy base and ensuring the Alliance wouldn't be able to easily ship arms and weapons across the sea- it's a very, very morally grey situation despite how badly they portrayed it) but recently she's basically just evil while the writers are ensuring us she isn't.

It's classic "I'm the writer and I don't intend for this character to be this way despite the fact I fucking wrote it explicitly like that, maybe it's because I have an insight that I failed to get across through the writing, which is still entirely my fault".

[Evaddon]

The "Safe Heaven" is the only cinematic and event I can agree with that isn't #morallygray nor makes sense, unless she needs Thrall for some reason. This is completely out of left field

[Powerogue]

Ashvane now (as thanks for making azerite weapons for the naga to fire upon the Horde):



I feel like those "mutual interests" involved tentacles. But, as per my other thread, that finally means us and Sylvanas agree on something! Hooray!