DKs rock bottom again in Dazar'alor?

[Zyky]

Hi, just checked out Warcraftlogs and while these numbers are subject to change due to a relatively small sample size compared to Uldir what the hell happened?

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/21/

Last I checked FDK was king in Uldir (dmgwise) and now both Frost and Unholy are pretty far down making DKs the worst dps-class once again (closely followed by monks).

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/st.../21#dataset=90

You're data even proves that you're wrong. You have Unholy which is fairly respectable in terms of other melee and frost lower down because the fights aren't designed towards frost being strong like it was in Uldir. If you're going to make a whiny post at least have correct information.

[prwraith]

Meh I really wish they'd do away with even this attempt at class balance. I miss MMO's where you rolled a class because you wanted to be good at A thing. Not good at everything. Or the classes that were ok at lots were never great in anything.

[Th3Scourge]

Meh I really wish they'd do away with even this attempt at class balance. I miss MMO's where you rolled a class because you wanted to be good at A thing. Not good at everything. Or the classes that were ok at lots were never great in anything.

Exactly. I have no problems with where DKs are at in relation to Shadow Priests because the fights just favour Shadow Priests right now

[Galathir]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/st.../21#dataset=90

You're data even proves that you're wrong. You have Unholy which is fairly respectable in terms of other melee and frost lower down because the fights aren't designed towards frost being strong like it was in Uldir. If you're going to make a whiny post at least have correct information.

First: Your data.

Second:

What you fail to realize is that you are quoting a post that is several weeks old when numbers were looking quite different than today, as I myself acknowledged in the post you quoted.

[...] and while these numbers are subject to change due to a relatively small sample size [...]

Not as if the numbers currently were a lot better. The only class that is worse off are mages.

You are the second one not to look at the date of my post.

[Kaver]

The class was designed to be one the hardest hitting in the game with the tradeoff being that we're slow...now we don't excel anywhere. Realistically speaking Death knights should always be near the top; it hurts even more when raids are designed to be catered to ranged.

I feel your pain, but unless Blizzard hire new people this will always be the case. Look at ele shamans.. they started undertuned, but now they are back to the Legion version with completely broken overpowered AOE. Blizzard just cant balance certain specs.

[msdos]

Meh I really wish they'd do away with even this attempt at class balance. I miss MMO's where you rolled a class because you wanted to be good at A thing. Not good at everything. Or the classes that were ok at lots were never great in anything.

You can't even have this anymore because the way they design encounters now is very twitchy, like every fight seems to have an enrage timer? Someone quoted Ion in another thread talking about how WoW is not a "twitch shooter" but everything they do to dungeons and raids edges more towards relying on twitch reflex.

Random interval casts that need to be interrupted = twitch reflex
Random interval things that need dispelled/soothed = twitch reflex
Nerf tank threat = more twitch reflex
Nerf tanks = healers need more twitch reflex
Snapshot windows = twitch reflex

But in order for classes to be good at a thing, you need those in your encounters, otherwise you just have mobility and dealing damage, that's it.
The point is the developers don't know what they want to do. They keep changing philosophy randomly.

Like how about since DKs do bad damage, just give them back AMZ baseline to help out the raid/tanks? How about give them Hysteria back to help out a DPS??
The players could design the classes better at this point.

[Yagyu4k]

Many people didn't realize that Blizzard is a really bad developer for many years already.
Blizzard don't care about the players as long they earn their money.

[prwraith]

You can't even have this anymore because the way they design encounters now is very twitchy, like every fight seems to have an enrage timer? Someone quoted Ion in another thread talking about how WoW is not a "twitch shooter" but everything they do to dungeons and raids edges more towards relying on twitch reflex.

Random interval casts that need to be interrupted = twitch reflex
Random interval things that need dispelled/soothed = twitch reflex
Nerf tank threat = more twitch reflex
Nerf tanks = healers need more twitch reflex
Snapshot windows = twitch reflex

But in order for classes to be good at a thing, you need those in your encounters, otherwise you just have mobility and dealing damage, that's it.
The point is the developers don't know what they want to do. They keep changing philosophy randomly.

Like how about since DKs do bad damage, just give them back AMZ baseline to help out the raid/tanks? How about give them Hysteria back to help out a DPS??
The players could design the classes better at this point.

Really I wonder if anyone is even paid anymore to ask "is this fun" having progressed through mythic g'huun before patch there were a ton of fights in there that were just a slog.

With how small the top end raiding culture is i'm honestly starting to think they should make raids somewhat challenging (ala current heroic level) but focus far more on just making them entertaining.

Class design is a black hole that I don't think we'll ever dig back out of though.

[Raiz]

I don't really understand all of you...

The difference in DPS is NEGLIGIBLE. You're crying about 15% difference at best (not counting the top one because there will always be an exception).
You know what's even more laughable ? That most of us, even myself, can't play at our best. Which means we could've narrowed the gap especially since our class is easier to play than some of the top ones.

For Eff Sake, I think you guys need to take a break.

Edit : Just realized I said exactly the same thing a few post earlier. I guess it went in deaf ears. Which is pretty ironic considering I'm deaf... Oh well, I guess I'll avoid this thread for a while then.

[msdos]

I've been complaining about encounter design and my traits. I actually am doing decent damage despite it all, especially now that I cleaned my traits up.

When I say "allowed to DPS", I mean not screwed over by the fights mechanics and design. Like tonight, on Conclave, everytime I started cooking, I got the hex, a lot of times I got it back to back. It's just annoying when you're already struggling. Same thing on Grong. Right when things start rolling, it's time to switch to the add way over here.

[jayinjersey]

Right when things start rolling, it's time to switch to the add way over here.

Convince your RL that since you are slow it is better if you stay with the Tanks, so that the one Tanking (IE not getting thrown) never has to worry about getting feared.


Worked for me

[RuneDK]

Convince your RL that since you are slow it is better if you stay with the Tanks, so that the one Tanking (IE not getting thrown) never has to worry about getting feared.


Worked for me

Im surprised raid leaders havent been doing that since last expansion. I was lucky enough with my guild that they knew DK mobility was horrendous so unless it's forced mechanics or an absolute priority target i could focus the bosses....I really hope they address DK mobility in the next expansion but i doubt they will.

[NERDZILLA]

Im surprised raid leaders havent been doing that since last expansion. I was lucky enough with my guild that they knew DK mobility was horrendous so unless it's forced mechanics or an absolute priority target i could focus the bosses....I really hope they address DK mobility in the next expansion but i doubt they will.

If you're in a reasonable guild with some leadership that actually somewhat pays attention to class strengths/weaknesses, they should definitely let DK's just DPS if they are able to.

They probably won't address the mobility, something something "class fantasy".

[Terion]

They probably won't address the mobility, something something "class fantasy".

That is class fantasy - be a bottom dps and slow as a turtel that cant reach the water, lol. I really have lots of fun playing DH now, bosses are so arcade and fights are so fast that I cant imagine how to play dk with its class fantasy right now. Abolutely total shit. That is first time from LK that I started to play another class in a raid tier Normally 1 of 2 specs was playable, now only myth + as a tank.

[msdos]

Originally I was just ignoring the adds on Grong if they were too far away, but then they just kept screaming, "get on adds, get on adds", so I just do it to appease them. I'm also like a top 5 dps in our raid somehow, so they notice if I don't dps stuff, weak.

[Shelly]

I've been complaining about encounter design and my traits. I actually am doing decent damage despite it all, especially now that I cleaned my traits up.

When I say "allowed to DPS", I mean not screwed over by the fights mechanics and design. Like tonight, on Conclave, everytime I started cooking, I got the hex, a lot of times I got it back to back. It's just annoying when you're already struggling. Same thing on Grong. Right when things start rolling, it's time to switch to the add way over here.

That's pretty much a sign you need to be more on the ball with regards to CD timing.

[Th3Scourge]

Lol I take back my previous statements about being content where DKs are. My own experiences have been relatively positive in pugs and guild runs (but I might have more gear, or be a better player than guildies/pugs) but when you compare all logs it's a bit of a joke. If you take out Champions of the Light, unholy is near bottom for most fights and is plum last for Stormwall and Jaina.

We don't have it as bad as some but I feel if I was a RL or creating a pug group there is zero reason for me to want to take a DK over any other class

[msdos]

That's pretty much a sign you need to be more on the ball with regards to CD timing.

Yeah I've literally only killed the boss once on heroic. Missed last week from over sleeping.

[Shelly]

Yeah I've literally only killed the boss once on heroic. Missed last week from over sleeping.

Happens to the best of us. :-)

Doesn't help that for unholy at least our CDs are a tad longer and seldom really line up with trinkets.

Also a pain that there's no real stat priority for DKs. I think it really impacts performance when you can't specialize.

Frost might have it a tad easier.

[Unholyground]

i liked it, it was so simple lol

Well, DW Frost overtook Blood quite easily and left it in the dust. So it was only king for one patch cycle which was Ulduar and a bit of ToC.