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  1. #741
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    That's just nonsense really and you know it. I am not terribly sure why people are pushing this BS.

    Yeah, I can totally see random Billy screaming in rage when he gets a nice item he did not expect.

    Reality is - the said casuals - who are a vast majority - don't really give much of a damn about WoW to have these heartbreaks over item ilvl - they just get what they get, wear what they wear - do an activity or two here and there and go off. So no, nobody is shaking their head in disappointment when they get a lucky good item, except for maybe OP and a small squad of forum extremists who for some reason see this as THE ISSUE.
    No it isnt nonsense. And you completly contradict yourself. First you sai it isnt issue for casual audience than you say casuals dont really care about items they get which is exactly problem of current gearing. You want casual players to care about it. If they dont care they start quiting game. Lesa you care about gear you getting less you are invested in charachter = less you are invested in the game = players quit. You have to make players care about gear.

    This only shows thay you ate mythic raider and you have no clue what mmorpg casual audience actualy want. Ofc you think it is no issue when as top end player ot doesnt affect you.

  2. #742
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    That's just nonsense really and you know it. I am not terribly sure why people are pushing this BS.

    Yeah, I can totally see random Billy screaming in rage when he gets a nice item he did not expect.

    Reality is - the said casuals - who are a vast majority - don't really give much of a damn about WoW to have these heartbreaks over item ilvl - they just get what they get, wear what they wear - do an activity or two here and there and go off. So no, nobody is shaking their head in disappointment when they get a lucky good item, except for maybe OP and a small squad of forum extremists who for some reason see this as THE ISSUE.
    true, nobody "is shaking their heads in disappointment" when they get a good item.
    Nevertheless it still is "THE ISSUE" because the amount of gear you get inflates ilvl to the point where it's meaningless. This creates 2 major problems: firstly, alternative measuring systems are popping up unrelated to gear(raider.io) and secondly it takes away any sort of progression, because while you do get better gear, that gear doesn't unlock anything due to first problem.

  3. #743
    Quote Originally Posted by Elias01 View Post
    No it isnt nonsense. And you completly contradict yourself. First you sai it isnt issue for casual audience than you say casuals dont really care about items they get which is exactly problem of current gearing. You want casual players to care about it. If they dont care they start quiting game. Lesa you care about gear you getting less you are invested in charachter = less you are invested in the game = players quit. You have to make players care about gear.
    Casuals don't care about the gear to the extent you, Preach, OP and maybe even I do.

    They will be happy to get an odd high ilvl item (and I just don't understand why you think someone would be sad over it, aside from special snowflakes), but on the other hand they don't really get that many of those for it to be a real factor in overall balance of things between dedicated players and casuals.

    Casuals care about all kinds of stuff, there is plenty of "all kinds of stuff" in WoW aside gear that's why there are so many casuals. Some like pet battles, some like transmog, some like odd dungeon runs here and there and some like bloody ERP. Gear is not end all be all thing, but it is a positive thing for a casual when they get some nice item.

    I think you make a terrible amount of logic leaps, but the issue is that you are not really casual and/or don't really have casual mindset, that's why you are so laser focused on one thing, disregarding that WoW is bigger than that.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ToxicFlame View Post
    true, nobody "is shaking their heads in disappointment" when they get a good item.
    Nevertheless it still is "THE ISSUE" because the amount of gear you get inflates ilvl to the point where it's meaningless. This creates 2 major problems: firstly, alternative measuring systems are popping up unrelated to gear(raider.io) and secondly it takes away any sort of progression, because while you do get better gear, that gear doesn't unlock anything due to first problem.
    Progression is pretty clear, because Mythic in the end IS where the best stuff drops consistently and in some cases only place where such stuff drops at all.

    Anything less than that is a free for all. Heroic and M+ are the major gear sources for ilvl 400 stuff with odd WF or World Boss once in a blue moon giving one shot at the same quality gear.

    That's why no matter how much people huff and puff, Mythic players have higher average ilvl and gear quality than anyone else. Looks like OK progression to me, unless you want the gap to be huge, which it's not and for a good reason.

  4. #744
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    Progression is pretty clear, because Mythic in the end IS where the best stuff drops consistently and in some cases only place where such stuff drops at all.

    Anything less than that is a free for all. Heroic and M+ are the major gear sources for ilvl 400 stuff with odd WF or World Boss once in a blue moon giving one shot at the same quality gear.

    That's why no matter how much people huff and puff, Mythic players have higher average ilvl and gear quality than anyone else. Looks like OK progression to me, unless you want the gap to be huge, which it's not and for a good reason.
    mate, you can't say progression is pretty clear and in the very next sentence say anything bellow mythic is a free for all.
    although what I was trying to get at is, that getting a higher ilvl doesn't unlock stuff anymore, heroic, mythic+0 dungeons and lfr are basically free from the moment u ding at cap by just doing a couple of WQ, and WB, m+ requires r.io, mythic raid pugging isn't a thing to my knowledge, so you are left with normal and heroic raids to work towards, and in my experience for heroic raids people only care about curve for heroic which in my experience leaves you with normal raids that get "unlocked" by getting a high enough ilvl.

  5. #745
    Quote Originally Posted by ToxicFlame View Post
    mate, you can't say progression is pretty clear and in the very next sentence say anything bellow mythic is a free for all.
    although what I was trying to get at is, that getting a higher ilvl doesn't unlock stuff anymore, heroic, mythic+0 dungeons and lfr are basically free from the moment u ding at cap by just doing a couple of WQ, and WB, m+ requires r.io, mythic raid pugging isn't a thing to my knowledge, so you are left with normal and heroic raids to work towards, and in my experience for heroic raids people only care about curve for heroic which in my experience leaves you with normal raids that get "unlocked" by getting a high enough ilvl.
    What you have described now certainly sounds like progression there. You aren't going to be pugging M+10 and Heroic raids from the moment you ding, you do need to get some gear and clout there to pass the initial checks, so yeah you do LFR, Normal, M+(x<10).

    There are various shortcuts like guild/friends/cash, but this is a progression right there.

    You may say yeah, maybe it should have been more clear, but imo it makes sense - you do normal/lowbie M+ and ramp up the difficulty as you go and get more geared/more clout.

  6. #746
    Quote Originally Posted by Mightytasty View Post
    He is one of the more positive WoW content creators. It’s not like he shits on the game like Asmongold. Even Tal & evitel have critiques of BfA.
    He shits it on it hard. I've watched a few of his vids and I couldn't take it anymore. He's nitpicking everything apart and he's being negative whenever he gets the chance. He's one of the people I would tell to get lost. I don't mind people being negative but just leave and don't make a scene.
    Whenever I get tired of WoW I just unsub, that's bloody it.

  7. #747
    Quote Originally Posted by Raysz View Post
    He shits it on it hard. I've watched a few of his vids and I couldn't take it anymore. He's nitpicking everything apart and he's being negative whenever he gets the chance. He's one of the people I would tell to get lost. I don't mind people being negative but just leave and don't make a scene.
    Whenever I get tired of WoW I just unsub, that's bloody it.
    How'd he get his moneys from donations then???

    It's his job and he knows full well what his audience wants to hear, so he shoves it down their throats.

  8. #748
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raysz View Post
    He shits it on it hard. I've watched a few of his vids and I couldn't take it anymore. He's nitpicking everything apart and he's being negative whenever he gets the chance. He's one of the people I would tell to get lost. I don't mind people being negative but just leave and don't make a scene.
    Whenever I get tired of WoW I just unsub, that's bloody it.
    That's interesting considering that he liked Blizzard's attempts at itemization in the new raid (even if he considers it to be somewhat undertuned) and keeps mentioning that he expects new patch to turn BFA around. But sure, he's so negative that you can't take it anymore.

    Either your threshold for negativity is extremely low or you're cherrypicking the worst parts and filling in the blanks.

  9. #749
    Quote Originally Posted by HordeFanboy View Post
    Blizzard should just remove garbage unnecessary RNG and titanforge/warforge BS.
    totally agree.

  10. #750
    Quote Originally Posted by KaPe View Post
    That's interesting considering that he liked Blizzard's attempts at itemization in the new raid (even if he considers it to be somewhat undertuned) and keeps mentioning that he expects new patch to turn BFA around. But sure, he's so negative that you can't take it anymore.

    Either your threshold for negativity is extremely low or you're cherrypicking the worst parts and filling in the blanks.
    I've watched several video's of his and those were mostly negative. So he made one positive video amongst mostly negative ones. He's feeding off of the negative vibe he and others created, gets him more views. Can't stand the guy, but you're probably a regular viewer, that's ok. I just wish people that were done with the game, move on and find something else instead of creating such a negative atmosphere. I get that you're passionate, but you are just one person. So is that annoying Preach, yet he seems to think he speaks for a lot of people, that's the main issue I have with people like that. And then he goes on to monetize his dislike. Disgusting.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    How'd he get his moneys from donations then???

    It's his job and he knows full well what his audience wants to hear, so he shoves it down their throats.
    His job is what, to be a negative Nancy and ride the negativity train? If you look at most threads here on MMO Champ, I'm sure he has a big audience, doesn't make him right though.

  11. #751
    Quote Originally Posted by Raysz View Post
    He shits it on it hard. I've watched a few of his vids and I couldn't take it anymore. He's nitpicking everything apart and he's being negative whenever he gets the chance. He's one of the people I would tell to get lost. I don't mind people being negative but just leave and don't make a scene.
    Whenever I get tired of WoW I just unsub, that's bloody it.
    I have paid pretty close attention to Preach since returning to the game and would have to disagree with your description. I think too many people have a tendency to allow hyperbole and outrage to turn the volume up on any rhetoric used to describe the game, good or bad. He does offer criticism of the game and he also talks about aspects he enjoys. He also talks respectfully of aspects he understands that other's enjoy that are not his cup of tea.

    I tend to be more critical about things I really enjoy because I really enjoy them and want them to be their best.

    I can't say for certain, but I would guess that Preach feels similarly, based on what I have seen, and if the game ceased to be any fun whatsoever--he would leave. One of the things that concerns him is when people he enjoys playing with leave the game since he enjoys playing with friends--thus criticizing with the hope things will get better and become a better social experience as well as game experience.

    YMMV

  12. #752
    Quote Originally Posted by Raysz View Post
    His job is what, to be a negative Nancy and ride the negativity train? If you look at most threads here on MMO Champ, I'm sure he has a big audience, doesn't make him right though.
    That's how you get audience nowadays. I mean you could open a thread hammering WoW to dust over nonsense and you'd get an instant circle-jerk here.

    I'd say BfA has its share of faults for sure, but shit here totally flies off the handle with people somehow managing to accuse of WoW being WoW and such - apparently even stuff that was a thing since almost forever is somehow turned into "what's wrong with BfA".

    In short, cesspool of nonsense with occasional legitimate concerns.

  13. #753
    High Overlord Mightytasty's Avatar
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    This thread’s still alive? Y’all must have a serious hate boner for Preach. It’s not healthy, man.

  14. #754
    Quote Originally Posted by PapaV View Post
    I have paid pretty close attention to Preach since returning to the game and would have to disagree with your description. I think too many people have a tendency to allow hyperbole and outrage to turn the volume up on any rhetoric used to describe the game, good or bad. He does offer criticism of the game and he also talks about aspects he enjoys. He also talks respectfully of aspects he understands that other's enjoy that are not his cup of tea.

    I tend to be more critical about things I really enjoy because I really enjoy them and want them to be their best.

    I can't say for certain, but I would guess that Preach feels similarly, based on what I have seen, and if the game ceased to be any fun whatsoever--he would leave. One of the things that concerns him is when people he enjoys playing with leave the game since he enjoys playing with friends--thus criticizing with the hope things will get better and become a better social experience as well as game experience.

    YMMV
    I can make this very short, just check his positive to negative ratio as far valueing the current state (insert whatever state) of WoW is. Spoiler alert, most of his videos are overly long essays on how he thinks WoW could be better. What he thinks would make Wow better isn't necessarily what I would agree with or whoever. But he feels he's the authority to make that judgement. And if that weren't bad enough he's asked to comment on the world first race by Method, commenting basically on a game he mostly doesn't like. He's such a sellout. I really dislike the guy, to put it mildly.

  15. #755
    Quote Originally Posted by Raysz View Post
    I can make this very short, just check his positive to negative ratio as far valueing the current state (insert whatever state) of WoW is. Spoiler alert, most of his videos are overly long essays on how he thinks WoW could be better. What he thinks would make Wow better isn't necessarily what I would agree with or whoever. But he feels he's the authority to make that judgement. And if that weren't bad enough he's asked to comment on the world first race by Method, commenting basically on a game he mostly doesn't like. He's such a sellout. I really dislike the guy, to put it mildly.
    Fair enough, I am not trying to get anyone to like or dislike the guy. I don't consider his critiques to be "shitting" on the game, I consider them fair and not hyperbolic. By and large, for my time, he seems to enjoy some aspects of the game. His authority to speak on the game comes from his play time and those of us that click on his videos to hear his take.

    Based on the advise that many have given on this very thread, it seems that if they didn't want Preach to get any more traction they would do the equivalent of "unsubbing" and stop commenting. The only thing left in this soon to be 40-page thread would be either people who see merit in discussing the video or sycophants.
    Last edited by PapaV; 2019-03-19 at 11:42 PM. Reason: typo correction

  16. #756
    So this thread
    50% attacks on preach because...idk
    45% claiming it's mythic raiders wanting to be special snowflakes
    4% saying they unsubbed and the game is Dead
    1% discussing video

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by PapaV View Post
    Fair enough, I am not trying to get anyone to like or dislike the guy. I don't consider his critiques to be "shitting" on the game, I consider them fair and not hyperbolic. By and large, for my time, he seems to enjoy some aspects of the game. His authority to speak on the game comes from his play time and those of us that click on his videos to hear his take.

    Based on the advise that many have given on this very thread, it seems that if they didn't want Preach to get any more traction they would do the equivalent of "unsubbing" and stop commenting. The only thing left in this soon to be 40-page thread would be either people who see merit in discussing the video or sycophants.
    Blizzard has killed gearing and now you have players saying any who dare say it's bad is a terrible elitist.... for some reason

    The invisible checkbox for your toons ilvl
    The fact weapons are separated in that check box based on type of weapon
    The fact that master loot was removed because of a problem that for the most part was fixed in legion and the"trials not getting loot" stories were shown to be lies
    Azerite gear being shit
    The fact a 330 ring is better than a 385 ring
    The fact my alt who hasn't stepped foot in any non lfg content now has 386ilvl

    All of this is the gear problems I see and it hurts new players

    Let's say my mage was my main and I'm a new player
    I wouldn't get upgrades outside of like a +7 but in order for me to get a group I need to do one of two things.
    1. Run a mythic 0 that offers no upgrades and then run the key up to the +7 with likely multiple groups which takes time which is a big complaint amongst the vocal player base when talking about raider io
    2. Go into the lists and look for a dungeon and hope I get chosen despite no score

    Let's say 2 works
    I get into the group and since I have no previous experience in the dungeons...I die...a lot
    If I don't get kicked we may not hit the timer
    That means the player who owns the key is punished for judging by ilvl and I'm punished because I went into content the game said was appropriate for me.

    How do you stop from taking a chance burning a key?? Raider io is born

    Why?? Because blizzard had a broken gear system

    Jintara on aerie peak US

  17. #757
    Quote Originally Posted by Raysz View Post
    What he thinks would make Wow better isn't necessarily what I would agree with or whoever. But he feels he's the authority to make that judgement.
    Doesn't this apply to, I don't know, pretty much everyone who has written a single comment in this thread? That would mean you would hate every single person in this thread, and probably a lot more people who have yet to comment. Or no, I guess your hatred actually stems from him NOT being just one voice in the crowd on a fanboy forum that you can just ignore. It's because he puts a lot of effort into making his voice heard and because people willingly give their money to support it that you dislike him.

  18. #758
    Quote Originally Posted by zantheus1993 View Post
    Blizzard has killed gearing and now you have players saying any who dare say it's bad is a terrible elitist.... for some reason
    Yes damn those elitist casuals! Trying to take gear away from the casual casuals

  19. #759
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidax View Post
    What you have described now certainly sounds like progression there. You aren't going to be pugging M+10 and Heroic raids from the moment you ding, you do need to get some gear and clout there to pass the initial checks, so yeah you do LFR, Normal, M+(x<10).
    you're also not going to be pugging M+10+ unless you get your raider.io up ((or use shortcuts), you're not going to be pugging heroic unless you get your curve, you're not going to be pugging mythic beyond the first 2 bosses give or take if you are really lucky with your group. and everything else is, free the moment you ding.
    You can get a minimum gear for everything you could possibly pug within a weekend, that imo is a broken system.

  20. #760
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    Quote Originally Posted by justandulas View Post
    What tier? Secondly, the gear is replaced nearly the first week of new raid in BFA.

    Also, mounts and pets are no longer worthwhile rewards to justify the time jump and effort from heroic to mythic.

    Give real incentives such as.... A wing of the raid that only shows up in Mythic. Certain items only dropping on certain difficulties (higher you go, the more loot table opens up), or the only legendary in the expac dropping off mythic jaina, etc. Real, tangible rewards that have meaning and won't be replaced 3 months from now.

    Mounts aren't really worthwhile rewards anymore (unless they added affects to them like dragons having aoe breath) because we have HUNDREDS of them. The pool is so deluded that i honestly haven't even rode the last 20 mounts i earned in game. They don't mean much anymore compared to back in the day. To make matters worse, the best mounts of the expac are all store bought so... there's that.
    A whole raid wing for Mythic? Problem is very few would see it, sure sounds good to you, but if it covers important story then it ruins the experience for everyone else. Remember Cho'gall in WoD? Sure was fun having him disappear and never having closure, unless you were mythic of course. Mounts don't mean much, not because of rarity, but because there are hundreds of them these days.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elias01 View Post
    They gotta keep it for 1 patch. New raid tier always makes previous ones completly absolote to the point you can easly pug it. Ans yes even with 1% mount drop it is nowhere near being rare mount. Exclusive rewards doesnt hurt anyone. If you feel entilted to rewards just becouse you pai sub it is your problem not game. I really dont see any reslason why you should get rewards in absolote content when you clearly dont deserve them.
    Exclusive rewards cost resources. For example a unique gear set costs another set that everyone could have. Fact is an incredibly small amount of people doing Mythic, and leaving the rewards only for them means everyone else gets a boring, quickly ended experience.

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