CoS - World First Thread

[dacoolist]

The longer a boss lives the more it favors guilds like Method. Guilds who can afford to take so much time off to beat their heads against a boss.

They're also starting to get paid for playing, basically. It would be very surprising to see them lose.

The funny part is pieces in the same region getting it first though ;D

Just goes to show that - when everyone is on equal playing field how WRECKED you can get ;D

[KaPe]

You must be new. Let's talk about vanilla, TBC bosses that lasted months and had like 2000-3000 pulls for guilds that raided hardcore.

Yeah, Mu'ru, the hardest boss ever... who died within 5 days or so. Funny how he still got nerfed with lasers no longer causing pushbacks. Damn Blizzard, even back in TBC they were nerfing raids for LFR heroes.

[Hubbl3]

You must be new. Let's talk about vanilla, TBC bosses that lasted months and had like 2000-3000 pulls for guilds that raided hardcore.

In Vanilla guilds were not dayraiding and no one used 2000 - 3000 pulls for any boss.

- - - Updated - - -

Yeah, Mu'ru, the hardest boss ever... who died within 5 days or so. Funny how he still got nerfed with lasers no longer causing pushbacks. Damn Blizzard, even back in TBC they were nerfing raids for LFR heroes.

No, according to these people 4HM or Ragnaros in MC are the hardest bosses ever!

[Jastall]

You must be new. Let's talk about vanilla, TBC bosses that lasted months and had like 2000-3000 pulls for guilds that raided hardcore.

I'm sure you have evidence of this.

[ryklin]

a lot of those bosses didnt have those pull numbers, it took way longer to rezz and/or run back as well as massive time spent reclearing trash
granted sometimes figuring out mechanics, then a strat was a lot harder back then.
seriously an entire guild was permabanned for exploiting game files just to be able to rezz and pull the boss again faster (cthun wall exploit, since some map files and interactables and collision were handled client-side back then), we're really far removed from how raiding went back then
yeah though those pull counts are hyperbole

also those bosses (cthun, kael, vashj, muru) were in unkillable or near unkillable states for months then got slaughtered when they were nerfed

[Hubbl3]

I'm sure you have evidence of this.

He doesn't because there is none. I mean if we do a little math and assume 5 mins (which, IDK seems short for vanilla bosses? Raggi fight was long) per pull in average for 3000 pulls we are talking about 31 days of 8h ONLY that boss per day. Sure thing. In vanilla. And that isn't even considering runback times/buffing/etc prior to each pull.

[ryjkur]

I'm sure you have evidence of this.

Well, currently Method has 500+ pulls on Uu'nat and they havent been there even a full week. Many hard bosses lasted months in vanilla, TBC so they could pull waaaay more.

[Jastall]

He doesn't because there is none. I mean if we do a little math and assume 5 mins (which, IDK seems short for vanilla bosses? Raggi fight was long) per pull in average for 3000 pulls we are talking about 31 days of 8h ONLY that boss per day. Sure thing. In vanilla.

And vanilla bosses were absolutely not 5 minute affairs between pulls either, given that the runbacks were super long (the C'thun one could take a good 20-ish minutes between pulls to release, rebuff, drink consumables) and that serious guilds often farmed consumables, world buffs and such as least as much as they actually raided, no one was putting in even half or a third of the hours Method is now pulling shit.

The italics denoted my sarcasm. That poster is full of it and there's absolutely no possible way that any boss in this game's history needed 2K+ pulls for a world first.

[Hubbl3]

The italics denoted my sarcasm. That poster is full of it and there's absolutely no possible way that any boss in this game's history needed 2K+ pulls for a world first.

He assumes that "time between kills in vanilla" is an indication of difficulty. So of course if you have 80 days between Twin Emps down and C'thun you gotta assume 80 days of 16h/day raids, right?! ;D

Paragon said that LK HC 25 took 150 wipes total. Which is not a lot considering it took some weeks to kill it after Putress.

[Jastall]

Well, currently Method has 500+ pulls on Uu'nat and they havent been there even a full week. Many hard bosses lasted months in vanilla, TBC so they could pull waaaay more.

Why would you assume (because that's what you do, you pulled a number out of thin air with no data) that the time between pulls in vanilla is the same as right now?

[ryjkur]

Paragon said that LK HC 25 took 150 wipes total. Which is not a lot considering it took some weeks to kill it after Putress.

ICC HC bosses had limited attempts and they got it after 5% raid wide buff.

[Hubbl3]

ICC HC bosses had limited attempts and they got it after 5% raid wide buff.

Yes, I know. The more important point is that no one ever* wiped 2000 or 3000 times on a boss in WoW, especially not in Vanilla or TBC.

*of the guilds who got WFs.

[Saiteck]

People these days dont know what progress really means, look at guilds back in molten core/bwl and naxx40, that was wiping on progress. Not even close to how fast guilds kill bosses now

[Aidy660]

Yes, I know. The more important point is that no one ever* wiped 2000 or 3000 times on a boss in WoW, especially not in Vanilla or TBC.

*of the guilds who got WFs.

Seem to wipe this much in every m+ pug.

[ryjkur]

Why would you assume (because that's what you do, you pulled a number out of thin air with no data) that the time between pulls in vanilla is the same as right now?

It's not from thin air, I can't find the actual proof yet. Just believe me.

[Bjay]

Well, currently Method has 500+ pulls on Uu'nat and they havent been there even a full week. Many hard bosses lasted months in vanilla, TBC so they could pull waaaay more.

There is not 1 boss that lasted months in vanilla or TBC because of their difficulty. Not one. They either lasted because they were broken (C'thun, Kael'thas, Ouro, Vashj) or because of modifiers other than difficulty, such as specific gear requirements (resist gear for Huhuran, Sapphiron, Viscidus, set bonuses for 4 horsemen, gated rep farm for Ragnaros etc).

Also, corpseruns and other things relating to wipe recovery could extend the time between pulls to 10+ minutes (even more with mind controlling fire resistance buffs for Raggy); resulting in way lesser pulls on average than in today's raids. Furthermore, comparing bleeding edge raiding guilds today with that of Vanilla or BC is literally comparing a tricycle to a dragster.

There's more I could comment on to showcase how irrelevant your comment is but I digress. Bottom line: If you're uncertain of Vanilla/BC history, it's best not to comment. (In before "I raided loads in vanilla and BC mimimi". Nobody cares, we all did. Some just remember clearer than others it seems.)

[Poe]

https://www.wowhead.com/news=291503/...tiable-torment

nerfed again (1 minute ago)

[Jastall]

It's not from thin air, I can't find the actual proof yet. Just believe me.

Of course, cupcake, I'll just believe you instead of my own experiences and (arguably rudimentary) knowledge.

[jce4ever]

Josh said an hour ago boss dead in 4 hours

That 12.7% wipe makes this boss look hard as nails wow.

[Makabreska]

It's not from thin air, I can't find the actual proof yet. Just believe me.

Ok, you convinced me.