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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Brewshine View Post
    I can’t remember when the date was, I could be wrong but I remember blizz devs saying for some classes people got the builds for them wrong.
    it was during cataclysm. i remember that blue post which gave an example of boomies not using a certain glyph for firelands raid etc.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Most rotations in Vanilla aren't too intricate enough to cause massive discrepancies in player DPS. This was true then, and it's true now.

    Logs are only as valuable as the person using them, and if you actually enjoy playing with the people you're playing with, it's pretty simple to correct behavior and effectively make it so loot distribution largely doesn't matter.

    This isn't to shit on Vanilla (quite the opposite), but the biggest difference between players is generally effort put forth on the consumable front. If you're lazy and don't want to pot twice, use a flask, or use food on the live version of the game you might at best lose out on 5-6% of your damage. Depending on the tier in Vanilla, the difference between somebody without consumables, and somebody with consumables could be 40-50%+. Not advising that every caster farm flask of supreme power for Molten Core, but the difference between someone with and without is enormous.

    At the end of the day it's just logs. Damage meters were available incredibly early in Vanilla 15 years ago, and this is just an extension of them. People commonly handed out loot in loot council guilds based on performance and attendance, damage meters were part of that process then, and will be part of that decision making process now. Even in a world without damage meters, it's pretty easy to pick out bad players by how often they die.

    Like somebody else said, it's not going to matter. People pushing to do this shit as soon as possible aren't going to have these issues, and anybody else will probably just be happy to fill a 40 man raid. If you have issues with peoples performance (especially if it's rotational due to ignorance), it's way easier to just point that out then attempt to replace.
    Cool blog. I guess we agree it isn't worth much. I just got it out without wearing out the keyboard and getting worked up about loot on... an forum..

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Low Hanging Fruit View Post
    Cool blog. I guess we agree it isn't worth much. I just got it out without wearing out the keyboard and getting worked up about loot on... an forum..
    Since it's about the game it seems like an appropriate response for this forum.
    - Bring back my damn zoom distance/MoP Portals - I read OP minimum, 1st page maximum-make wow alt friendly again -Please post constructively(topkek) -updated 2/8/2019

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by taishar68 View Post
    Just curious...why is this important for Classic?
    You're one of those hybrid dps who will get carried I assume

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by taishar68 View Post
    I guess I don’t see the point; I fail to see the type of guild that will find this useful:

    Extremely competent world first types will roll through these raids without breaking a sweat.

    Good guilds that are striving for ASAP clears will find gear a much bigger roadblock than whether specific raiders do X damage or handle Y mechanic.

    Average guilds who are pushing progression will have a harder time fielding 40 people, and thus can’t afford to nitpick about performance. They’ll be lucky to get 40 in the door.

    Below average and/or casual guilds won’t be helped or need the logs, and will have similar issues as the average and good guilds, gear and attendance will be bigger problems.

    Of course this is just my opinion, but I think people bringing that mindset into Classic are playing the wrong game. It really is about the journey, not the destination. But to each their own, and good luck on the way.
    The purpose of logs is not epeen. They're meant to serve as a tool for improvement. Even world first guilds need improvement.
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  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Drusin View Post
    Since it's about the game it seems like an appropriate response for this forum.
    You need to polish that white armor. Defense is a important role.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Low Hanging Fruit View Post
    You need to polish that white armor. Defense is a important role.
    k den

    /10kdens
    - Bring back my damn zoom distance/MoP Portals - I read OP minimum, 1st page maximum-make wow alt friendly again -Please post constructively(topkek) -updated 2/8/2019

  8. #28
    Brewmaster taishar68's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rainyhealz View Post
    You're one of those hybrid dps who will get carried I assume
    Mage then, Mage now, Mage again. Whether I get carried or not depends on who I’m playing with.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderball View Post
    The purpose of logs is not epeen. They're meant to serve as a tool for improvement. Even world first guilds need improvement.
    I never said, nor meant to imply, that logs were a way to stroke egos; I disagree that raids we have done before, or, where the knowledge base is so vast and mechanics so few, require an urgent review for improvement.

    Furthermore, while I respect the concept that we all share different opinions on what the game is and/or should be, I don’t think that approaching the game with the mindset of a mythic raider is the best way to enjoy it, but that’s just me.
    If you can't be in athletics, be an athletic supporter.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Farah View Post
    Unsure if there was already a thread on this, but:
    https://twitter.com/KihraOfTemerity/...27332889276416

    https://twitter.com/KihraOfTemerity/...54249484374018

    As classic supports advanced combat logging, WCL is in development! Seems like we'll actually be able to gauge players properly (compared to 2005 etc.) - don't think early combat log parsers were a thing in the original classic? (earliest one I remember is Wowmeteronline in wotlk personally)
    Good for them. I dont see the point of it but hey, whatever. It is not hard to see where people fail with mechanics in vanilla/classic. And most people can not read meters today as it is.

  10. #30
    Not exactly needed for classic, but a good feature I guess.

  11. #31
    This will help a lot when it comes to recruitment. If you can't provide good logs in your application you should GTFO and stop wasting everyone's time.

  12. #32
    The data can easily be faked so these sites are pointless anyway. It won't change the ethos of Classic

  13. #33
    I am Murloc! Nnyco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by taishar68 View Post
    Just curious...why is this important for Classic?
    To improve on your dps?
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Crabs have been removed from the game... because if I see another one I’m just going to totally lose it. *sobbing* I’m sorry, I just can’t right now... I just... OK just give me a minute, I’ll be OK..

  14. #34
    Brewmaster taishar68's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nnyco View Post
    To improve on your dps?
    I am of the opinion that you don't need logs to improve vanilla DPS. just better gear. Some rotations are literally one button (Frost Mage comes to mind). How can a log improve that? And I as wrote earlier, on the whole I don't think guilds will benefit greatly from logs. I know it won't stop them from being used, and people can play the way they want, yada yada, but that's just my opinion.
    If you can't be in athletics, be an athletic supporter.

  15. #35
    Logs are not used just for parses...

    You can use them to make sure people are attacking the right targets, who's interrupting, who's healing what. Those are just a few examples but you get it.
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  16. #36
    Great, because analyzing this game to death and spreadsheet optimizing every piece of gear and ability is so much more fun than just discovering things on your own directly in the world.

    Kind of wish WoW would only ever have allowed addins that are purely UI-related. I have yet to see any gameplay-impacting addin that actually had beneficial effects on the game in the long run.

  17. #37
    It'll be a convenient method for tracking consumables usage & uptime, if specific people keep dying from not using them this will accurately point it out.
    Last edited by Oneer; 2019-06-09 at 07:23 PM.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by taishar68 View Post
    I am of the opinion that you don't need logs to improve vanilla DPS. just better gear. Some rotations are literally one button (Frost Mage comes to mind). How can a log improve that? And I as wrote earlier, on the whole I don't think guilds will benefit greatly from logs. I know it won't stop them from being used, and people can play the way they want, yada yada, but that's just my opinion.
    Lots of ways by showing uptimes, damage taken when procs were used and a host of information.

    You won't really see it outside of later raids so just don't use it if you dont want to.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by taishar68 View Post
    I am of the opinion that you don't need logs to improve vanilla DPS. just better gear. Some rotations are literally one button (Frost Mage comes to mind). How can a log improve that? And I as wrote earlier, on the whole I don't think guilds will benefit greatly from logs. I know it won't stop them from being used, and people can play the way they want, yada yada, but that's just my opinion.
    Mastering your rotations actually dont have that much to do with maximizing your DPS output.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by taishar68 View Post
    I am of the opinion that you don't need logs to improve vanilla DPS. just better gear. Some rotations are literally one button (Frost Mage comes to mind). How can a log improve that? And I as wrote earlier, on the whole I don't think guilds will benefit greatly from logs. I know it won't stop them from being used, and people can play the way they want, yada yada, but that's just my opinion.
    Mhm, yet people manage to press that one button up to 30% less times than the other guy.
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