Mega-Thread: Democratic 2020 Primaries

[Edge-]

I am assuming you wrote in for the 2016 Election then correct?

Also (using Texas Senate race from 2018 *Texan here* and your principled logic), means I could not vote for Beto, because why would I vote for someone who caught a DUI and fled from the scene? And well who the hell likes Ted Cruz?

What does having a DUI in the past (and he didn't flee) have to do with people being racist/sexist? I mean, I'm no fan of Beto, but that's an odd comparison to make.

[Skroe]

Fair enough. You seem at least informed and I would engage with you in conversation, but im afraid from your previous posts that you are unable or more like unwilling to listen to anyone who is not on "your team." And as a fellow Engineer (5G Networks and Cloud Systems), I am intrigued at your binary approach to things.

Unwilling. The time for conversation and finding common ground has passed, as I said, the latest a week after Charlottesville. This is the time for punishment. And indictment of Trump by the House is an indictment of those who put him in the White House and an indictment of those who continue enable him over defending the Constitution. Impeachment will not succeed in removing Trump, but as I wrote, that is not remotely the point. The point is to inflict damage, defend the rule of law and the Constitution, create precedent and honor the founders.

I was active in the conservative movement for years before Trump came to the scene. I have donated thousands of dollars to Conservative causes and politicians over the years. And in fact, I used to never discuss my politics here, instead keeping my postings focused on foreign policy and budgeting (hobby interests). Trump brought about me being political here in this manner.

The binary approach to things, as you put it, has come about as a year long campaign followed by 8 months of Trump's Presidency failing far short of the standards that our country set for its Presidents, but his defenders still standing by their man. This cult of personality is unsuitable for the United States. As far as impeachment now, I am unabashedly a Constitutional zealot. The rule of law doesn't give a shit who you are. Trump commited clear offences against them. He must be held to account.

Seeing so many on the right be less doctrinaire and outright cowards about it is not surprising in the least. Those of integrity have long since left the Republican Party. I speak from first hand experience. I was active in local Republican politics, and I was among the last of some of my friends to officially leave the local party in June 2018. I decided the party wasn't worth saving anymore. And consequently I donated $2000 to Democrats running for office in 2018 and voted for Elizabeth Warren for Senator. Because country first is an actual thing for some of us.

Also, as far as it is a "me thing" I use the most powerful weapon I have. My vote.

That's nice. There are more powerful things than votes now. Like money and influence campaigns.

My PAC focuses on influence campaigns. I've worked with them developing software to that end. Other people who are qualified in that sort of thing do the messaging.

I would like to point out that 2020's vote (however it may go) will be a referendum on hard-line pushing (whether it be to the left or right). My hope is that one day we can all figure out a way to coexist in a better manner than we have in the last now 11 years. I don't have a team. I do however have leanings to categories, some conservative, some liberal. I don't really feel the gravitational pull as you do but hey everyone is different and that's what makes us better.

I'm not interested at all in co-existing with the people who brought us Donald Trump and letting them off the hook. They are most definitely on the hook for what they did. Forever. Their political choice was unacceptable. Their President is illegitimate.

I'm interested in dominating them and extracting value from them. When a Democrat wins, be it in 2020,2024 or 2028, I will do my part to campaign for inflicting injury through the budgetary process to Trump's America.

Basically, let's rage fuck yokels of rural America into the dirt.

Reconciliation will not be in the cards. Because the Trumphadi cult is emphatically in the wrong and have committed a grave and unforgivable moral treason to this country. There is no world in which Donald Trump's racism, sexism, authoritarianism, no-knowthingism and committing obstruction of justice and seeking foreign interference in our elections is excusable. But they did it. And they'll be going down for it. Hard.

They will pay a price for betraying the Constitution, the founders and our national interest. We are not all in this together. There are two sides: those who honor those things, and those who make excuses for Trump.

I know what side I am on. I am proud of it and everything we have done. We will fail to remove Trump as President. But we have already broken his power as President and left the deplorables of America with little more than a squatter in the White House with no agenda, little power, and no meaningful future.

And that brings a smile to face.

[Tehshocka]

What does having a DUI in the past (and he didn't flee) have to do with people being racist/sexist? I mean, I'm no fan of Beto, but that's an odd comparison to make.

Ehhhh might want to check this: https://www.politifact.com/texas/sta...wi-flee-scene/

Both cases show an extreme failure of judgement, and the point was to show how a blanket argument can look silly when it comes to principles and politicians.

[Machismo]

Voting for Gary Johnson is the same as not voting.

No, it's the same as voting for Gary Johnson. If none of the candidates are worth voting for, then why the fuck would you vote for any of them? That's like someone offering you a choice between a shit sandwich, and a shit sandwich with pickles. You are swearing you must eat one or the other. Meanwhile, I've decided I'd rather go have a PB&J.

Here's the thing that Trumpsters don't seem to get, I'd rather be right, than win. I'm not going to throw my support behind a racist or a sexual assaulter, just because I think I may be able to laugh at the libs.

It's really not that complicated:

I don't vote for racist trash.

[Skroe]

Here's the thing that Trumpsters don't seem to get, I'd rather be right, than win. I'm not going to throw my support behind a racist or a sexual assaulter, just because I think I may be able to laugh at the libs.

It's really not that complicated:

I don't vote for racist trash.

Bingo /10char

Donald Trump is a racist.

[Kujako]

No, it's the same as voting for Gary Johnson. If none of the candidates are worth voting for, then why the fuck would you vote for any of them? That's like someone offering you a choice between a shit sandwich, and a shit sandwich with pickles. You are swearing you must eat one or the other. Meanwhile, I've decided I'd rather go have a PB&J.

Here's the thing that Trumpsters don't seem to get, I'd rather be right, than win. I'm not going to throw my support behind a racist or a sexual assaulter, just because I think I may be able to laugh at the libs.

It's really not that complicated:

I don't vote for racist trash.

I tend to vote third party, for the following reasons.
1. I want a third party to hit the magic 5% margin.
2. I'm in CA, a winner take all state that will go for the Democrat. So my vote doesn't matter much.

[Tehshocka]

Unwilling. The time for conversation and finding common ground has passed, as I said, the latest a week after Charlottesville. This is the time for punishment. And indictment of Trump by the House is an indictment of those who put him in the White House and an indictment of those who continue enable him over defending the Constitution. Impeachment will not succeed in removing Trump, but as I wrote, that is not remotely the point. The point is to inflict damage, defend the rule of law and the Constitution, create precedent and honor the founders.

I was active in the conservative movement for years before Trump came to the scene. I have donated thousands of dollars to Conservative causes and politicians over the years. And in fact, I used to never discuss my politics here, instead keeping my postings focused on foreign policy and budgeting (hobby interests). Trump brought about me being political here in this manner.

The binary approach to things, as you put it, has come about as a year long campaign followed by 8 months of Trump's Presidency failing far short of the standards that our country set for its Presidents, but his defenders still standing by their man. This cult of personality is unsuitable for the United States. As far as impeachment now, I am unabashedly a Constitutional zealot. The rule of law doesn't give a shit who you are. Trump commited clear offences against them. He must be held to account.

Seeing so many on the right be less doctrinaire and outright cowards about it is not surprising in the least. Those of integrity have long since left the Republican Party. I speak from first hand experience. I was active in local Republican politics, and I was among the last of some of my friends to officially leave the local party in June 2018. I decided the party wasn't worth saving anymore. And consequently I donated $2000 to Democrats running for office in 2018 and voted for Elizabeth Warren for Senator. Because country first is an actual thing for some of us.







That's nice. There are more powerful things than votes now. Like money and influence campaigns.

My PAC focuses on influence campaigns. I've worked with them developing software to that end. Other people who are qualified in that sort of thing do the messaging.


I'm not interested at all in co-existing with the people who brought us Donald Trump and letting them off the hook. They are most definitely on the hook for what they did. Forever. Their political choice was unacceptable. Their President is illegitimate.

I'm interested in dominating them and extracting value from them. When a Democrat wins, be it in 2020,2024 or 2028, I will do my part to campaign for inflicting injury through the budgetary process to Trump's America.

Basically, let's rage fuck yokels of rural America into the dirt.

Reconciliation will not be in the cards. Because the Trumphadi cult is emphatically in the wrong and have committed a grave and unforgivable moral treason to this country. There is no world in which Donald Trump's racism, sexism, authoritarianism, no-knowthingism and committing obstruction of justice and seeking foreign interference in our elections is excusable. But they did it. And they'll be going down for it. Hard.

They will pay a price for betraying the Constitution, the founders and our national interest. We are not all in this together. There are two sides: those who honor those things, and those who make excuses for Trump.

I know what side I am on. I am proud of it and everything we have done. We will fail to remove Trump as President. But we have already broken his power as President and left the deplorables of America with little more than a squatter in the White House with no agenda, little power, and no meaningful future.

And that brings a smile to face.

This is the type of coastal elitism that brought us Trump to begin with...

[unfilteredJW]

This is the type of coastal elitism that brought us Trump to begin with...

Not even fucking close.

[Muzjhath]

Christianity and the Constitution has been its common Myth... now Christianity is all but dead, or is a Creed, and the Constitution is seen as a work of Racists and Bigots that should be changed...etc...

Most of the founding fathers wanted the construction changed instantly.
Thus the bill of rights.
This isn't new, and some of yhe FF were already abolitionists. You keep trying to have an extremely simplified view of reality where things are black and white or shades of gray.
When reality is thst with mixes of pink, green, a random elephant and yellow.

[Machismo]

This is the type of coastal elitism that brought us Trump to begin with...

Opposing racism and white nationalism... and thinking those things to be utterly despicable, doesn't make one a coastal elite.

[Tehshocka]

Not even fucking close.

Then you need to leave your echo chamber and listen to those folks.

[Skroe]

This is the type of coastal elitism that brought us Trump to begin with...

You're damn right it's coastal elitism. I am absolutely of the elite. Unapologetically. Highly educated. Worldly. Traveled. Cosmopolitan. I went to prep school where George W Bush and his father went to school. I live in a 4600 square foot home in a town with a median income of over $180,000. I have a post-graduate degree in Software Engineering and robotics. I have a career, not a "job". I am of the elite and proud of it. I worked my ass off to get get to where I am. As did my father and grandfather (an immigrant from Latin America).

Better that then appeal to the small town know nothingism of the knuckeldragging deplorables. The plumbers and landscapers of America will not be running America. They have the right to vote but I whole-heartedly embrace the patrician tradition of this country, rather than this populist idioicy. They are not fit to run anything. They can barely run themselves.

But we have another name for ourselves.

"The Money".

And it's high time we, the payers, had complete say over who it is spent, rather than the rural moochers.

[Tehshocka]

Opposing racism and white nationalism... and thinking those things to be utterly despicable, doesn't make one a coastal elite.

Again more blanket statements.

63 million people are not ALL racists or support white nationalism. Just like all liberals/Progressives dont wear pussy hats and want everything for free. These are tropes. Be better.

In 2016, A LOT of people in the heartland of America felt like they were either getting left behind or unheard. Instead of rallying around someone of class and civility, they rallied around someone who could bring the entire system down.

Trump isnt Hitler, he is the Joker.

[unfilteredJW]

Then you need to leave your echo chamber and listen to those folks.

I live in a county that went 82% Trump. I know exactly why these coal rolling, angry white hillbillies voted for him.

[Machismo]

Then you need to leave your echo chamber and listen to those folks.

You mean the farmers who want more welfare, and turn around and whine about socialism? Or the "rugged individuals" in the coal sector who want government bailouts? How about the anti-gay, pro-lifers, and nationalists who claim to want the government out of our lives? You mean the so-called fiscal conservatives who are cheering on spending increases, higher taxes, and a skyrocketing deficit?

[Skroe]

Again more blanket statements.

63 million people are not ALL racists or support white nationalism. Just like all liberals/Progressives dont wear pussy hats and want everything for free. These are tropes. Be better.

In 2016, A LOT of people in the heartland of America felt like they were either getting left behind or unheard. Instead of rallying around someone of class and civility, they rallied around someone who could bring the entire system down.

So fuck 'em. Fuck the heartland.

No compromise. No deals. Value extraction and domination.

You're not making your argument better. You're making it worse.

[Machismo]

Again more blanket statements.

63 million people are not ALL racists or support white nationalism. Just like all liberals/Progressives dont wear pussy hats and want everything for free. These are tropes. Be better.

In 2016, A LOT of people in the heartland of America felt like they were either getting left behind or unheard. Instead of rallying around someone of class and civility, they rallied around someone who could bring the entire system down.

Trump isnt Hitler, he is the Joker.

For the record, I did not say they are all racist. I said they voted for a racist. Maybe you should ask them (and you) why they voted for a racist.

So, why did you vote for a racist?

You asked people to get out of their echo chamber, so let's hear it. I want to know exactly why you did.

[Tehshocka]

You're damn right it's coastal elitism. I am absolutely of the elite. Unapologetically. Highly educated. Worldly. Traveled. Cosmopolitan. I went to prep school where George W Bush and his father went to school. I live in a 4600 sqare foot home in a town with a medium income of over $180,000. I have a post-graduate degree in Software Engineering and robotics. I have a career, not a "job". I am of the elite and proud of it. I worked my ass off to get get to where I am. As did my father and grandfather (an immigrant from Latin America).

Better that then appeal to the small town know nothingism of the knuckeldragging deplorables. The plumbers and landscapers of America will not be running America. They have the right to vote but I whole-heartedly embrace the patrician tradition of this country, rather than this populist idioicy. They are not fit to run anything. They can barely run themselves.

But we have another name for ourselves.

"The Money".

And it's high time we, the payers, had complete say over who it is spent, rather than the rural moochers.

I live in DFW and if we compared salaries in terms of COL (I am guessing you are in San Francisco or of the vicinity) I actually make roughly the same as you and graduated from a New Orleans public High School and went to UT-A. But I act nothing like you.

Those rural moochers grow our food btw.

- - - Updated - - -

For the record, I did not say they are all racist. I said they voted for a racist. Maybe you should ask them (and you) why they voted for a racist.

So, why did you vote for a racist?

You asked people to get out of their echo chamber, so let's hear it. I want to know exactly why you did.

Why I voted for Trump in 2016 or why im not voting in 2020?

I voted for Trump in 2016 because he made promises to shrink the government, bring troops home, and immigration reform.

I am an Isolationist/Constitutionalist. I despise the known fact we sent many men and women to die in the ME for oil fields and used a national tragedy (9/11) as the precursor for it. Yes I am well aware a Republican President did this. Again, I don't have a team.

- - - Updated - - -

So fuck 'em. Fuck the heartland.

No compromise. No deals. Value extraction and domination.

You're not making your argument better. You're making it worse.

From the beginning, I have been VERY aware you are so entrenched in some really really scary ideology that we would never find common ground.

[DarkTZeratul]

I voted for Trump in 2016 because he made promises to shrink the government, bring troops home, and immigration reform.

I am an Isolationist/Constitutionalist. I despise the known fact we sent many men and women to die in the ME for oil fields and used a national tragedy (9/11) as the precursor for it.

And he has either failed to uphold those promises or done the exact opposite. Or, in the case of "sending many men and women to die in the ME for oil fields," openly bragged about doing explicitly that in Syria. And frankly, a great number of people predicted precisely that outcome in 2016 given Trump's rhetoric and personal history of being a terrible human being who somehow managed to spend his entire life failing upwards.

[Machismo]

I live in DFW and if we compared salaries in terms of COL (I am guessing you are in San Francisco or of the vicinity) I actually make roughly the same as you and graduated from a New Orleans public High School and went to UT-A. But I act nothing like you.

Those rural moochers grow our food btw.

- - - Updated - - -



Why I voted for Trump in 2016 or why im not voting in 2020?

I voted for Trump in 2016 because he made promises to shrink the government, bring troops home, and immigration reform.

I am an Isolationist/Constitutionalist. I despise the known fact we sent many men and women to die in the ME for oil fields and used a national tragedy (9/11) as the precursor for it. Yes I am well aware a Republican President did this. Again, I don't have a team.

- - - Updated - - -



From the beginning, I have been VERY aware you are so entrenched in some really really scary ideology that we would never find common ground.

Great, so you are admitting that you were willing to vote for a racist, because he totally promised to do the things you wanted (even though he didn't hardly do jack shit).

You of all people should be outraged, and feel like you were conned by a racist charlatan. 63 million others are in the same boat.

Meanwhile, I'll be over here, proud, that I did not vote for racist trash.

Your supposed decision to not vote in 2020 seemingly indicates that you realize you got conned by Trump. Are you admitting to having been conned?