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  1. #201
    Quote Originally Posted by deviantcultist View Post
    Why you ask? Because Blizz has convinced the sheep that they can afford to "fix" what they should have fixed in BfA as a feature instead of a new class or a refreshing feature.

    Just look at how many will jump at you for asking for features in a paid expansion and argue that "fixing" is a formidable excuse for not getting enough.


    Or ppl would rather blizzard fix the game than come out with a new class and/or gimmick that they will push as a new “feature”

    I’m personally hoping this is more of a maintenance expansion. Fix all the problems, and just have a solid expansion w/o the bullshit gimmicks.

    Or we can have no class and legion class design minus the weapon like they tried to do in bfa. Trash azerite system, boring islands and warfronts. Terrible gearing, leveling, professions, pvp etc.

    I would take this expansion without the tower and covenant stuff as long as they fixed all the problems with the game.

  2. #202
    Quote Originally Posted by Pebrocks The Warlock View Post
    This is objectively wrong. The guy you quoted is right that they're much more than simply reps.
    No, they are not. You do quests and you get rep with them. The more you grind the more rewards you get. They are the same as the reps we have had since TBC.

  3. #203
    Legendary! FuxieDK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrA View Post
    As the title says, why are we not getting a new class.
    One simple reason: We don't want or need more classes!
    Fact (because I say so): TBC > Cata > Legion > MoP > BfA > WoD = WotLK

    My pet collection --> http://www.warcraftpets.com/collection/FuxieDK/

  4. #204
    Quote Originally Posted by durenas View Post
    Why do we need a new class every other expansion, though? Is there a point where we have too many classes to balance properly?
    Because part of what we pay for is new content. Some of that new content involves playing new classes and new races. Blizzard is delivering neither of those things this time, and people are asking why not.

  5. #205
    Quote Originally Posted by Aggrophobic View Post
    No, they are not. You do quests and you get rep with them. The more you grind the more rewards you get. They are the same as the reps we have had since TBC.
    What part of this sounds like the reps we've always had?
    When players reach maximum level and have explored the first four zones, they'll be able to pledge themselves to a Covenant. Each Covenant offers its champions abilities based on their choice, including class-specific abilities for each Covenant, and cosmetic rewards that can be unlocked through a Covenant Campaign—an epic storyline unique to the faction—and other activities over time. This alliance also gives the player access to a Covenant Sanctum, a city only open to players who have forged a pact with its rulers.
    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    If a man gets pregnant (and, while vanishingly rare, it has happened)
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    No, Antifa are the real heroes.

  6. #206
    Quote Originally Posted by Pandragon View Post
    Blizzard cant even balance what we have. We don't need new classes right now. And Shadowlands is bringing back focus on the classes we do have
    The hell? Theyve had 4 years to do that... What makes you think this time itll get fixed?

  7. #207
    Quote Originally Posted by Pebrocks The Warlock View Post
    What part of this sounds like the reps we've always had?
    All of it? Maybe with the slight, slight difference of having different rewards for different classes but thats already something we had with the order halls and artifacts. There is litteraly nothing new here.

  8. #208
    Quote Originally Posted by Zyky View Post
    Its for all players that it is lol. You can look for yourself, mid level players say 75th percentile have the same problem as 99th percentile players. Normal/Heroic raiding and low tier keys don't matter, if you want to do more in say M+ if you arent one of the huge meta specs you're fucked. But obviously you're trying to fit a BS narrative that class balance is fine in the low tier so who cares, so I'm just not going to bother reading anymore from you.
    When you know your argument is not supported by data, so you simply put your fingers in your ears and yell "lalala im not listening anymore lalala".

    The overwhelming majority of players would never do a +10, let alone a +20 or higher, so i hate to tell you this, but its the top 5% that are irreverent. The players running extremely high end content could leave tomorrow and no one would notice. The bulk of wows paying customers dont raid (majority) then LFR, then Normal partial clear / pugs, and then the numbers get so small they really dont matter.

    I know that causes some weird elitist chest banging furor from some of my mythic raiding brothers and sisters, but its a fact that cannot be denied - We are the tiny minorty, even when compared to other raid difficulties, and raiders in general are the minority of wow players.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FuxieDK View Post
    We don't want....
    We who??????

  9. #209
    Idk, but i would love to have a Necro.. oh well

  10. #210
    Quote Originally Posted by Pebrocks The Warlock View Post
    This is objectively wrong. The guy you quoted is right that they're much more than simply reps.
    Why because they have rewards? Other reps have rewards. Because they have a base of operations? Other rep factions have that. Because they are a part of the expansions narratives? Other......you get the idea.

  11. #211
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    not reskins.
    LF Draenei, Dark Iron Dwarfes, Highmountain Tauren, Mag'har Orcs are reskins. All you change on them is textures, and the only different "shapes" are their hairstyles / horns which parent races have different shapes as well... They could be as well an option within a parent race with little to no difference. Void Elves are also very close to Blood Elf reskin.

    Nightborne and Zandalari male have actually model alterations from the "parent race" and Vulpera use Goblin skeleton but have different model. Zandalari female is a Darkspear female reskin.

    If all you do is change hairstyle, skin colour and paint some tattoos, that makes is a reskin. You can make for example 1:1 parallels between the faces of normal Draenei and LF Draenei, same with Ironforge Dwarf and Dark Iron Dwarf variant.

    Sad part is all the hairstyles could be given to both parent and "allied" race instead we get half half. But I guess in your eyes the extra hairstyles make it not a reskin?

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    Quote Originally Posted by arkanon View Post
    The overwhelming majority of players would never do a +10, let alone a +20 or higher, so i hate to tell you this, but its the top 5% that are irreverent. The players running extremely high end content could leave tomorrow and no one would notice. The bulk of wows paying customers dont raid (majority) then LFR, then Normal partial clear / pugs, and then the numbers get so small they really dont matter.
    I'm yet to hear any argument why better class balance would harm a casual. If it improves the experience of hardcore player but doesn't affect a casual who "doesn't care about it" then it's a net gain.

    The only people "harmed" by balancing changes are people who are informed enough to know what's OP and abuse it - so not casuals.
    Last edited by Marrilaife; 2019-12-08 at 12:26 AM.

  12. #212
    Quote Originally Posted by Elkfingers View Post
    Even if windwalker='punchy shaman' (which seems like a big 'ol straw grasp), I fail to see how in any material sense that would mean that Monk stripped Shaman of any abilities.

    DHs got Meta. People had a fit, but it hardly means that any new class would just be cobbled together from other classes' assets. Legit, people love to blow stuff out of proportion on here.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jamie081 View Post
    This is the biggest reach I've read in a while. The only complaints I've ever seen about Monk taking from other classes is when Rogues would whine that they had loot competition and someone had more mobility than them. That's fine since Rogues have had broken utility for the last 2 expansions so they can't complain anyway.
    To clarify: It stripped a theme. Enhancement shaman at the same time went less wind and lightning oriented, to more fire and molten lava themed. Monk got the winds, and still salty about it. Meanwhile, their abilities are summoning aid from elementals (the pandaria looking elementals) in some cases, dealing (elemental type) damage with this attack and that. It wasn't until WoD that shamans got some lightning theming back, and Legion for a good return to theme.

    As to the topic of classes: If they stripped ghoul and various undeads from DKs to make Necromancers, people would loose it. If they stripped some hunter abilities for tinkerers, people would loose it. Etc. I am sure blizz doesn't want another predictable shit show.
    Last edited by Dastreus; 2019-12-08 at 03:31 AM.

  13. #213
    Quote Originally Posted by Enan1981 View Post
    The hell? Theyve had 4 years to do that... What makes you think this time itll get fixed?
    Define "fixed."

    Because I promise at no point in this game's 15 year existence has class balance ever been "fixed." This idea that suddenly Blizzard will design the game perfectly and all players will be 100% satisfied with how their class plays in 100% of all situations is a myth and it's frustrating to see players pretending like this is a reasonable achievable goal for Blizzard to have.

  14. #214
    Quote Originally Posted by Marrilaife View Post

    I'm yet to hear any argument why better class balance would harm a casual. If it improves the experience of hardcore player but doesn't affect a casual who "doesn't care about it" then it's a net gain.

    The only people "harmed" by balancing changes are people who are informed enough to know what's OP and abuse it - so not casuals.
    Because the only way to balance classes is to dramatically reduce the number of abilities, and make everything play boring as fuck. Name a game with as many abilities as wow that has better balance in similar content. And this pursuit of "balance" already has harmed the game - read the forums - call it what you want; pruning, simplification, homogenization - it all comes from one core problem - a desire to obtain balance between the specs. This cannot happen when an arms warrior is an endless wrecking ball of AOE death and destruction, but an assassination rogue only has ST attacks - who gonna bring the rogue to M+ or on those bosses with AOE priority packs? So they pruned and pruned, and changed it so everyone was average at everything - and now thats all we have - competitive classes that all play really boring and all do the same thing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dastreus View Post
    To clarify: It stripped a theme. Enhancement shaman at the same time went less wind and lightning oriented, to more fire and molten lava themed. Monk got the winds, and still salty about it. Meanwhile, their abilities are summoning aid from elementals (the pandaria looking elementals) in some cases, dealing (elemental type) damage with this attack and that. It wasn't until WoD that shamans got some lightning theming back, and Legion for a good return to theme.

    As to the topic of classes: If they stripped ghoul and various undeads from DKs to make Necromancers, people would loose it. If they stripped some hunter abilities for tinkerers, people would loose it. Etc. I am sure blizz doesn't want another predictable shit show.
    No seriously, its the biggest reach since the pc launch of reach. Monk and Shammy have next to nothing in common, there really couldnt have been a WORSE example.
    Last edited by arkanon; 2019-12-08 at 04:20 AM.

  15. #215
    Quote Originally Posted by MrA View Post
    As the title says, why are we not getting a new class. The way expansions worked in the past has been quite consistant.

    Vanilla - all original classes and races
    BC - New races
    Wrath - New class
    Cata - New races
    MoP - Both new class and race
    WoD - nothing due to MoP offering both
    Legion - New class
    End of Legion, Almost all of BFA - New races.

    In keeping with tradition, we should be getting either a new class or both a class and race. I wonder what gives. I did see a youtube video where someone alluded to a new class (necromancer) but I think that is doubtful. Does anyone else think there might or might not be a new race for a specific reason. I personally wanted a new class but I know that an overhaul of the current classes and leveling is more important. Let me know what yall think.
    One could argue that all the allied races we got throughout the expansion would be the reason for lack of races/classes this time around. Same logic as WoD.
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  16. #216
    Stood in the Fire EntertainmentNihilist's Avatar
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    To everyone talking about "balance":

    "Balance" is anti-fun. The only way to achieve perfect balance is to completely homogenize everything. It's boring. In order to have cool, fun, interesting stuff going on, there *must* be some imbalance.

    Unless one class/spec is so much better than another that nobody plays it (or nobody will take it to raids, etc.), it's fine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mellrod View Post
    One could argue that all the allied races we got throughout the expansion would be the reason for lack of races/classes this time around. Same logic as WoD.
    Races are almost entirely (aside from racials which...you know) art assets. And the allied races are heavily based on the existing ones to start with. They don't require starting zones or class design. A new race shouldn't =/= no new class. Same visa versa.

  17. #217
    Quote Originally Posted by Pandragon View Post
    Blizzard cant even balance what we have. We don't need new classes right now. And Shadowlands is bringing back focus on the classes we do have
    Things are currently more balanced than they have ever been before, to be fair.

  18. #218
    Quote Originally Posted by otaXephon View Post
    Define "fixed."

    Because I promise at no point in this game's 15 year existence has class balance ever been "fixed." This idea that suddenly Blizzard will design the game perfectly and all players will be 100% satisfied with how their class plays in 100% of all situations is a myth and it's frustrating to see players pretending like this is a reasonable achievable goal for Blizzard to have.
    It's like me, who thinks that classes was so well designed in Legion and was so happy that I had 14 chars that I played regularly. But then we have my buddy Mick McBuffin who thought it was horrible so he wanted to go back to WotLK design. I said sure, it was pretty good then, but then my other friend, Larry O'Nerfin told us he wants the devs to go back to class design because it fucking sucks in BfA. It was then our good old buddy down the street, Brian Fixit told us that he wants the GCD change to be removed for Shadowlands and we all nodded, silently agreeing.


    11 pages now, no graph. I feel a bit robbed.
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  19. #219
    Quote Originally Posted by otaXephon View Post
    Define "fixed."

    Because I promise at no point in this game's 15 year existence has class balance ever been "fixed." This idea that suddenly Blizzard will design the game perfectly and all players will be 100% satisfied with how their class plays in 100% of all situations is a myth and it's frustrating to see players pretending like this is a reasonable achievable goal for Blizzard to have.
    Fixed is not the same as 100% balanced.
    2 different issues.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MHMabrito View Post
    Things are currently more balanced than they have ever been before, to be fair.
    Which ironically is also the reason so many people complain and why so many specs feel so Meh.

  20. #220
    Warlords 2.0 hype. I guess new customisations are equivalent to new models.
    https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...lopment-thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Nevcairiel View Post
    If you are suggesting to take my Night Elfs Shadowmeld away, then please find some pike to run yourself through, tyvm.

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