I am interested in Dark Souls but I have no controller.

[Beefhammer]

If you're gonna compare it to Witcher 3 or an FPS game your argument holds no weight. You're literally comparing an apple(game designed with M/KB in mind) to an orange(a game that gives no fucks about M/KB and it's support is an afterthought so much that it still shows controller prompts even without using one).

Japanese games in general are terrible on M/KB, they are made with controllers in mind. This isn't something exclusive to Souls just a reflection of where the games are made as nobody gives a fuck about PC gaming in Japan. All of the devs play games on controller there is literally no one on the teams to show them how to do things better for M/KB support on ports.

I've played DS3 and Sekiro on PC with a Razer key pad and mouse. Had zero issues.

[Tech614]

I've played DS3 and Sekiro on PC with a Razer key pad and mouse. Had zero issues.

And I could literally stick some razer blades in my mouth.

Doesn't mean it's something you should do, it's more so your own stubbornness refusing to adapt.

Also why the hell are we bringing up Sekiro now? I assume based off your post you actually haven't played it and just assume it's similar cause it's from software. Playing Sekiro is closer to playing a game of Bop It then playing a Dark Souls game.

[Vilendor]

If you're gonna compare it to Witcher 3 or an FPS game your argument holds no weight. You're literally comparing an apple(game designed with M/KB in mind) to an orange(a game that gives no fucks about M/KB and it's support is an afterthought so much that it still shows controller prompts even without using one).

Japanese games in general are terrible on M/KB, they are made with controllers in mind. This isn't something exclusive to Souls just a reflection of where the games are made as nobody gives a fuck about PC gaming in Japan. All of the devs play games on controller there is literally no one on the teams to show them how to do things better for M/KB support on ports.

Where do you see me comparing anything? I just told him "just buy a controller" is not a good advice. I didn't even mention DS. I know my english isn't the best but i have no idea how could you misread those few lines so hard

[Tech614]

I didn't even mention DS.

Read the thread you're posting in, your English is definitely good enough for that.

[Vilendor]

Read the thread you're posting in, your English is definitely good enough for that.

Ohhh, i see now, you argue for the sake of arguing. Have a nice day sir

[valax]

What's in it that makes it bad without a controller? The Witcher 3 worked perfect for me with mouse and keyboard. Are they similar?

Absolutely nothing. Like every game you just have to customize the controls to fit yourself , who says the game is not good without controller a controller is just dumb.. I've played the trilogy exclusively with keyboard and mouse and beat it (yes even 2 , for how much annoying enabling/disabling double clicks for every boot of the game I still killed all bosses dlc included ) .
It's just easier with a controller but the souls series is all about being challenging , the witcher in comparison is a walk in the park

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Why people say DS2 is the worst? I watched Asmongold played it and it has really stupid hit box.

They say it's the worst because it was not directed by Miyazaki , the one who made demon souls , ds1 bloodborne and ds3 . The bosses are easier to kill than the trash you have to get past and they are almost all some sort of knight while ds1 and 3 have more variety . The pc port is mediocre as it doesn't even have translated menu prompts for pc.. so you have to remember which key you bound to the xbox commands ( a/b/x/y) and it has some input lag unless you enable and disable a setting every time you start playing .
As for the game itself I enjoy the early stages of it more than the other 2 because of limited consumable healing items and the zones are the most beautiful in the series .

If you play from 1 to 3 you'll get to 3 prepared but if you play 3 first the other two will seem a joke to you because the fights ars objectively slower paced

[Hyral]

God...I'm full of advice today.

Don't play Nioh or The Surge. Play The Surge 2, and Nioh 2 comes out early next year.

If you mean the OP yeah good advice, I dunno if I would say skip them because they can be fun, but definitely play Surge 2 it's a complete improvement and Nioh is coming soon!

If you mean me already played them and will play it when it comes out. I was just replying to the person and my comment of Surge and Nioh were in reference to how I started liking DS2 during that timeframe when DS3 was done and souls-like was starting to become a genre. I started liking 2 because of wanting more souls but not having many options outside the franchise.

[SirCowdog]

DS2 combat is jank as hell. Enemies track for days and hit boxes are about as accurate as a 90 lb grandma trying to shoot a shotgun. Then on top of that I frames are calculated based on your ADP and its easily the most jank game from software has made in the last decade. You can really tell it was the B team that made that game when you compare it to DeS, DS1, DS3, and BB.

The tracking is probably the most annoying part of it. But once you get used to the logic of the game instead of riding on expectations of DS1 and DS3, it actually does start to get fun, especially a bit into the game when your build starts to come together. No doubt, though, the early game is pretty rough.

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If you mean the OP yeah good advice, I dunno if I would say skip them because they can be fun, but definitely play Surge 2 it's a complete improvement and Nioh is coming soon!

If you mean me already played them and will play it when it comes out. I was just replying to the person and my comment of Surge and Nioh were in reference to how I started liking DS2 during that timeframe when DS3 was done and souls-like was starting to become a genre. I started liking 2 because of wanting more souls but not having many options outside the franchise.

I mean anyone, really. Don't start with Nioh or the Surge 1. Go straight to the second game on both accounts.

[Beefhammer]

And I could literally stick some razer blades in my mouth.

Doesn't mean it's something you should do, it's more so your own stubbornness refusing to adapt.

Also why the hell are we bringing up Sekiro now? I assume based off your post you actually haven't played it and just assume it's similar cause it's from software. Playing Sekiro is closer to playing a game of Bop It then playing a Dark Souls game.

Played both beat both felt no need to use a controller. If I did I would. I have been using a keypad and mouse in lieu of a controller for over 10 years now. I find it more comfortable and easier to use for action games than a controller. Has nothing to do with stubbornness. Sekiro because the controls are similar but gameplay is much quicker and requires faster reflexes for parrying. But go on and tell me how being confined to a controller and limiting yourself by the set up or having to use the claw grip is better than having all the buttons in easy reach of my fingers.

You do you. I'll do me, I was just sharing how I played for someone else who is a life long KB/M guy.

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Ohhh, i see now, you argue for the sake of arguing. Have a nice day sir

Yup, he's the mayor of the video game forum here.

[SirCowdog]

Oh, btw.... whatever you do, don't play Dark Souls 3, then go back to 2. You will feel a great sense of disparity and shock at the difference in how the game controls. Prefer whichever one you want, you can really feel the difference in the release dates.

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I have been using a keypad and mouse in lieu of a controller for over 10 years now.

I was just sharing how I played for someone else who is a life long KB/M guy.

I'm a 43 year old gamer. I've played everything from the Descent series of games with ONLY a keyboard, to becoming a PC master race KB+M elitist that looks down on peasants who use a controller. And everything in between.

Literally around 30 years of keyboard and mouse on the PC as my preferred input method, but prefer a controller for souls games. But I also play with inverted camera control(flight sim), but can switch to normal with only around 10 minutes of play to adjust(I do this when on a friend's machine to avoid messing up their controls). My brain can adjust on the fly almost.

That being said: Use whatever you find most comfortable. That is the only rule. I once watched a guy with only 1 arm defeat Street Fighter 2. I've seen a friend beat the hardest raid in World of Warcraft(WotLK) by clicking and keyboard turning. There's a youtube video of someone beating DS3 using a fucking Dance Dance Revolution floor pad, FFS!

Some games, like the Dark Souls series of games are designed to be used with a controller, and that means you're likely to have a better time if you use one. But that doesn't mean you have to. As I said earlier in the thread, the games are already hard enough without fighting the controls. And by choosing to use something other than a controller you'll be willfully deciding to play on hard mode.

But if you're getting better results and more fun out of using a KB for souls game, DO IT THAT WAY!

[Beefhammer]

Oh, btw.... whatever you do, don't play Dark Souls 3, then go back to 2. You will feel a great sense of disparity and shock at the difference in how the game controls. Prefer whichever one you want, you can really feel the difference in the release dates.

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I'm a 43 year old gamer. I've played everything from the Descent series of games with ONLY a keyboard, to becoming a PC master race KB+M elitist that looks down on peasants who use a controller. And everything in between.

Literally around 30 years of keyboard and mouse on the PC as my preferred input method, but prefer a controller for souls games. But I also play with inverted camera control(flight sim), but can switch to normal with only around 10 minutes of play to adjust(I do this when on a friend's machine to avoid messing up their controls). My brain can adjust on the fly almost.

That being said: Use whatever you find most comfortable. That is the only rule. I once watched a guy with only 1 arm defeat Street Fighter 2. I've seen a friend beat the hardest raid in World of Warcraft(WotLK) by clicking and keyboard turning. There's a youtube video of someone beating DS3 using a fucking Dance Dance Revolution floor pad, FFS!

Some games, like the Dark Souls series of games are designed to be used with a controller, and that means you're likely to have a better time if you use one. But that doesn't mean you have to. As I said earlier in the thread, the games are already hard enough without fighting the controls. And by choosing to use something other than a controller you'll be willfully deciding to play on hard mode.

But if you're getting better results and more fun out of using a KB for souls game, DO IT THAT WAY!

That was pretty much my point. But someone obviously has a stubborn opinion that it should only be played one way. I've tried on controller and it just doesn't jive for me as much as my keypad and mouse.

[SirCowdog]

That was pretty much my point. But someone obviously has a stubborn opinion that it should only be played one way. I've tried on controller and it just doesn't jive for me as much as my keypad and mouse.

Just copy/paste this:

"Someone beat DS3 with a dance pad. Your argument is invalid!"

[Texan Penguin]

Honestly, I'd just go ahead and invest in a controller even as a PC gamer. I have my console's shared XB1 controller for games that don't have Playstation button mappings (which sadly is a lot of pre-2014 stuff that has controller support), my main controller- a dedicated 20th Anniversary DS4- and a Hori Fighting Commander for FighterZ/MK11 and retro gaming (since it's basically a six-button Genesis controller.).

Seriously. Even with a KB/M some stuff is still designed to be played with a controller. The Assassin's Creed games really need one if you want to play smoothly. Dead Cells, in big red letters, recommends one on the main menu. Third-person shooting/aiming heavy games could go either way, but anything that requires precision is going to be easier with a mouse. Like for GTA V it really depends on what you're doing- I've heard of people alternating between them.

You get the chilled out convenience of console controls and the sweet, sweet performance of a PC all in one convenient package.

[Lazuli]

KB+M is a terrible setup for anything except MMO's, FPS's that only use a couple buttons, and RTS's. Third person games just do not work with a KB+M. The main issue is you lose analog movement. The only time it works is when you need the mouse for fine aiming (FPS), you need the mouse for selecting things (RTS), or when you just need access to a TON of abilities that are far too numerous for a controller (MMO). I certainly couldn't go without a controller on my gaming PC.

That's not true LOL I play tons of rpgs with kb & mouse, only the shitty ports that don't support it well 'require' a controller like sekiro and dark souls are better with one. I would never play the witcher series, elder scrolls, fallout, etc. on controller ..

But anyway as a PC gamer you should have every viable option at the ready. Get a damn controller dude. Order one of those cheap $10-20 ones off amazon if money is that tight. Just don't expect it to last .. and don't throw it cuz it WILL break.

Investing in a nice one is 100% worth it, especially since if it wasn't designed for PC, odds are it will have shit port controls because they are designed for peasant machines. Controllers are just nice too to sit back in your chair sometimes and kick your feet up.

[SirCowdog]

. Just don't expect it to last .. and don't throw it cuz it WILL break.

Investing in a nice one is 100% worth it, especially since if it wasn't designed for PC, odds are it will have shit port controls because they are designed for peasant machines.

I'll say this for the switch pro controllee: It's sturdy as hell. I admit I raged a couple times during my Deathless attempts of Dark Souls 3 and smashed it against the desk in anger. Thing held up pretty well, and I'm a full grown man. 3rd time I had to take it apart and re-assemble it, but it still works perfectly.

And as long as you're running steam, it gets full support. No problems.

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DS2 combat is jank as hell. Enemies track for days and hit boxes are about as accurate as a 90 lb grandma trying to shoot a shotgun. Then on top of that I frames are calculated based on your ADP and its easily the most jank game from software has made in the last decade. You can really tell it was the B team that made that game when you compare it to DeS, DS1, DS3, and BB.

After reading all this souls stuff I decided to try DS2 again. I never finished the DLCs because I got frustrated with the jankiness.

There's definitely some weird logic to it. But it's a bit like riding a bike. Once you grow accustomed to it it starts to make sense and you notice it less.

But DS2 pvp? Omg that NEVER gets good. Laggy shitfest. People swinging 10 feet away from you and still hitting. So bad! Definitely play offline or burn lots of effigies to prevent invasions.

[Nihilist74]

I would recommend you get an Xbox controller and use it on your pc for dark souls. On the first one you should get the newer version of it that is remastered. Better control features for it.

[Vash The Stampede]

That's not true LOL I play tons of rpgs with kb & mouse, only the shitty ports that don't support it well 'require' a controller like sekiro and dark souls are better with one.

Sekiro gave me a huge problem with using keyboard and mouse because I had a controller plugged in, and that puts my mouse and keyboard into gamepad mode and everything felt wrong until I unplugged the controller. Japanese games ported to PC are usually done terribly, though I enjoyed playing Sekiro using mouse and keyboard. I can't imagine doing it otherwise.

I would never play the witcher series, elder scrolls, fallout, etc. on controller ..

The only reason for anyone to play games with a controller is because their minds are too acclimated to use a gamepad, and can't wrap their minds around using a keyboard and mouse. I grew up on Nintendo, Sega Genesis, N64, and etc type of controllers and I can't imagine anyone playing most games on gamepads.

Investing in a nice one is 100% worth it, especially since if it wasn't designed for PC, odds are it will have shit port controls because they are designed for peasant machines. Controllers are just nice too to sit back in your chair sometimes and kick your feet up.

Its something I have for emulators and nostalgia, but otherwise I play 99% of my games with keyboard and mouse. I played Breath of the Wild with keyboard and mouse and felt overpowered because I could literally aim at things while a gamepad felt like I was meandering my aim. I have a PS4 gamepad for the motion control moments needed in the game.

[Tech614]

Its something I have for emulators and nostalgia, but otherwise I play 99% of my games with keyboard and mouse. I played Breath of the Wild with keyboard and mouse and felt overpowered because I could literally aim at things while a gamepad felt like I was meandering my aim. I have a PS4 gamepad for the motion control moments needed in the game.

Imagine aiming with the sticks in BoTW when the game specifically tells you to use the gyro to do so, which is far more accurate then a shitty emulated stick movement with mouse mind you.

[Vash The Stampede]

Imagine aiming with the sticks in BoTW when the game specifically tells you to use the gyro to do so, which is far more accurate then a shitty emulated stick movement with mouse mind you.

When it came to the puzzles that required motion controls, at first I got away with it using a mouse but after a while it became impossible and I turned to using a smart phone to do it. Eventually I got a PS4 controller that just so happens to work as a motion controller for BoTW.

[Lazuli]

Sekiro gave me a huge problem with using keyboard and mouse because I had a controller plugged in, and that puts my mouse and keyboard into gamepad mode and everything felt wrong until I unplugged the controller. Japanese games ported to PC are usually done terribly, though I enjoyed playing Sekiro using mouse and keyboard. I can't imagine doing it otherwise.

It was probably due to steam controller mode, which is an annoying piece of shit.. gotta turn that off when using kb & mouse. I never unplug my controller, it should recognize which one you're using.