Mega-Thread: Coronavirus Pandemic

[Gorsameth]

I don't know how much you know about public schools but there are severely overcrowded. 20-30 students in a room maybe a little bigger than a master bedroom. There's no way to safely distance them. Viruses travel through classes, well like viruses through classes. You can literal see the progress as one kid gets sick then kids around them get two days later, then kids around them a day later, etc. That's with viruses like influenza where people have flu shots and resistance to, COVID19 would ru through a school like wild fire.

People keep saying kids don't catch/spread COVID19 except there's clear that when they are exposed to it they catch it like anyone else. Do we expect kids to cover their mouths and was their hands all the as they should? Can't get adults to do it, let alone irrational impulse driven minds that don't know any better. Do you know how many kids has asthma or not to far from getting rid of bronchitis. A shit ton. Those kids are going to die or suffer long term problems because in the year 2020 leaders can't come up with remote solutions. They only had 7 months...

Officials aren't at the top aren't pushing for safe reopenings, they are calling for full restoration of schools as if we were in 2018. They are also setting up school districts for a huge headache when superintendents say there's no way they are going to to have traditional classroom settings in a month.

Schools have re-opened in varies parts of Europe and it has not appeared to have caused new breakouts.

I'm no virologist, I don't know how it works. But sofar it doesn't seem like schools (for young children) appear to be potential infection hubs.

[PACOX]

Schools have re-opened in varies parts of Europe and it has not appeared to have caused new breakouts.

I'm no virologist, I don't know how it works. But sofar it doesn't seem like schools (for young children) appear to be potential infection hubs.

Schools have been closed since ~Feb-March. If you are talking about in places outside of the...well that's because their cases are down in general with a population can/does take necessary precautions. If the US could be expected to take necessary precautions the matter wouldn't even be up for debate - the US would not be stuck in its super wave.

Public schools are were viruses go to spread. That's a fact.

[szechuan]

Trump Cultists.

[Elegiac]

Trump Cultists.

I don't think these people have quite yet realised that the stupid shit they've said publicly for the past four years is effectively graven in stone due to the internet never forgetting. If they're hoping for another post-Bush reset, they'll be quite sorely disappointed.

[Stormspark]

I don't think these people have quite yet realised that the stupid shit they've said publicly for the past four years is effectively graven in stone due to the internet never forgetting. If they're hoping for another post-Bush reset, they'll be quite sorely disappointed.

They aren't sentient. In all seriousness, I doubt most of them are actually people at all, just sockpuppet accounts.

[Draco-Onis]

Schools have re-opened in varies parts of Europe and it has not appeared to have caused new breakouts.

I'm no virologist, I don't know how it works. But sofar it doesn't seem like schools (for young children) appear to be potential infection hubs.

it's not the young kids that you need to worry about, any parent will tell you that schools are super spreader spots. This is even without COVID flu season is a nightmare one kid gets sick it's only a matter of time before all the families catch something. And various parts of Europe have greatly modified how schools are, US schools are overcrowded, underfunded and Trump wants them to open as cheaply as possible it's a recipe for disaster.

[bmjclark]

Schools have re-opened in varies parts of Europe and it has not appeared to have caused new breakouts.

I'm no virologist, I don't know how it works. But sofar it doesn't seem like schools (for young children) appear to be potential infection hubs.

It's worth noting that Arizona alone has more daily cases than all of the EU combined. You're honestly just comparing 2 very different situations. Anywhere that opens in places like Florida or Texas right now has a huge chance to cause spread just because of the sheer number of cases that are out there. Most European countries put the work in to get this under control, the US absolutely did not.

[PhaelixWW]

It's not, its related to their perception of reality. Visual information is prioritised over other information...

First of all, it's personal experience, not just "visual information". The other senses all play their part. In fact, scent is more closely linked to memory, so it's arguably more informative than sight.

...the psychological response of being in the middle of hurricane is always different then the ones that come from knowledge. You can actually see it on people that suffer from phobias, lets say, arachnophobia (fear of spiders), those phobias are always associated with high psychological responses that are very close to survival instinct. However, when you have such reactions with something associated with knowledge (for example, fear of germes) the psychological is alongside of a obsessive-compulsive disorder, not a phobia.

You don't have to be in a hurricane to fear being in one. Personally experiencing a hurricane may make the fear of a similar future experience more visceral and its attendant reaction more pronounced, but personal experience is not in any way required for any sane person to trust the knowledge of what a hurricane can do and to not willingly walk into one.

As i said before, the examples you gave work in diferent ways, THEY NOT THE SAME.

What a ridiculous statement. Things don't have to be the same in order to be compared. In fact, they never really are, because the comparison would be stupid: "they're the absolute same".

Things are compared in one or more aspects, just as they can be contrasted in one or more aspects. You can compare an apple and an orange by saying "they're both fruit" and that's a valid comparison. You can contrast an apple and an orange by saying "one is crisp and the other is pulpy" and that's a valid contrast.

A comparison is valid if you're comparing two things in a manner in which they're similar. You don't need to have personally experienced a hurricane to have your sense of self-preservation tell you to shelter from the danger. You don't need to have personally experienced a deadly virus to have your sense of self-preservation tell you to avoid contamination. Both reactions are informed by knowledge and intelligence, unless the person allows their intelligence to be overridden by another conviction: namely stupidity.

[Granyala]

I don't know how much you know about public schools but there are severely overcrowded. 20-30 students in a room maybe a little bigger than a master bedroom. There's no way to safely distance them.

You do not have to. You separate the CLASSES as groups but not the kiddos inside the classes. Obviously the curriculum needs to be crisis-adjusted and cross class courses cannot be taught like they used to. If you have smaller groups, you can then employ aggressive contact tracing if some infection happens.

Naturally, you need a low case # in the first place, in order for contact tracing to be viable.

[Forogil]

I don't know how much you know about public schools but there are severely overcrowded. 20-30 students in a room maybe a little bigger than a master bedroom. There's no way to safely distance them. Viruses travel through classes, well like viruses through classes. You can literal see the progress as one kid gets sick then kids around them get two days later, then kids around them a day later, etc. That's with viruses like influenza where people have flu shots and resistance to, COVID19 would ru through a school like wild fire.

Covid-19 is not like the flu.

People keep saying kids don't catch/spread COVID19 except there's clear that when they are exposed to it they catch it like anyone else.

They don't catch it like anyone else.

Not only are children less likely to get infected, but:

When children and teens get sick with COVID-19, their symptoms appear to be milder than in adults.

https://www.webmd.com/lung/coronavir...ies-children#1
(There are also rare cases of a separate disease in children, possibly likely linked to Covid-19.)

That seems related to the fact that studies have found that school closures have little or no effect on the spread.

Do we expect kids to cover their mouths and was their hands all the as they should? Can't get adults to do it, let alone irrational impulse driven minds that don't know any better.

Children are evolved to be learners, so I would expect that it would be easier to teach kids to cover their mouths than adults - and that it would have a lasting effect for the future.

I understand that all of this (school closures, evolution, etc), is politicised in the US.

- - - Updated - - -

Schools have re-opened in varies parts of Europe and it has not appeared to have caused new breakouts.

I'm no virologist, I don't know how it works. But sofar it doesn't seem like schools (for young children) appear to be potential infection hubs.

That is true, but scientists don't really know why.

Some try to explain it, and the simpler explanation is that it is due to less ACE2 in the nose (reduces risk infection), and more(?!) ACE2 in the lungs (reduce lung damage): https://www.researchgate.net/publica...19_in_Children
The Sars-Cov-2 virus normally enters the cells through the ACE2 receptors, but the role of ACE2 seems more complicated than that.

There are also other possible explanations, and this is yet another of those things we don't fully understand yet.

- - - Updated - - -

https://www.msn.com/en-xl/news/other...ns/ar-BB16E1n0
New worldwide record of cases, on a Sunday.

Normally there is lower reporting during the weekends (including Mondays), so breaking a record is an ominous sign.

[Draco-Onis]

You do not have to. You separate the CLASSES as groups but not the kiddos inside the classes. Obviously the curriculum needs to be crisis-adjusted and cross class courses cannot be taught like they used to. If you have smaller groups, you can then employ aggressive contact tracing if some infection happens.

Naturally, you need a low case # in the first place, in order for contact tracing to be viable.

No they kind of have to because the funding isn't there and Trump is refusing to provide it and that was before the pandemic now he just wants it to be done on the cheap. If it's not obvious by now the federal government has no plan they are hoping to open up schools get an economic boost long enough to help Trump's sagging poll numbers to win the election.

[PACOX]

No they kind of have to because the funding isn't there and Trump is refusing to provide it and that was before the pandemic now he just wants it to be done on the cheap. If it's not obvious by now the federal government has no plan they are hoping to open up schools get an economic boost long enough to help Trump's sagging poll numbers to win the election.

They are trying to make it to the tax holiday (Florida) so Trump and his do boy DeSantis can say how good the economy is doing.

- - - Updated - - -

Updated easy to read info:

https://www.ucdavis.edu/coronavirus/...sk-65-percent/

Summary:

Mask do protect you

The virus is airborne and can be transmitted by talking - why masks and distance are important

It's actually really good at staying in the air in indoor environments

Surfaces seem to be a weak vector (way of being infected)

Length of exposure seems to matter

Physical barriers such as plexiglass might not as effective as thought

Children as half as susceptible to the disease as adults

Children can still get sick and still transmit the virus, just half as much as an adult

[Granyala]

Mask do protect you
The virus is airborne and can be transmitted by talking - why masks and distance are important

This is the kicker: Homemade masks do not prevent you from getting infected on their own.
As soon as virus loaded droplets land on your mask, you're basically sucking the viral particles right through the fabric.

Masks are only there to reduce the minimum distance needed and make social distancing more manageable.
Still, using crammed public transportation is a roll of the dice. Mask or no mask.

[formerShandalay]

So it turns out that there is the possibility that even an asymptomatic person can sustain damage through covid-19. The numbers of the tested people are still too few to say for sure, but there are several cases, where that is what happens. Further research is needed.




Also, the video from the other thread that was closed (because we have this one) once again, just because it's kind of impressive seeing things actually visualized that you usually don't see



There has also been a study about the protection masks grant http://ftp.iza.org/dp13319.pdf and the results indicate that masks are quite effective.

[YUPPIE]

assuming they aren't lying, how the fuck has South Korea contained COVID so well? The plausibility of it being controlled is from how I don't find much news of outrage. I mean, if a third world country can do it like that, I'm pretty lost how America is in such shambles.
[Infraction]

[Granyala]

assuming they aren't lying, how the fuck has South Korea contained COVID so well? The plausibility of it being controlled is from how I don't find much news of outrage. I mean, if a third world country can do it like that, I'm pretty lost how America is in such shambles.

Aggressive contact tracing, general mask wearing (Asians are used to it) and reacting a lot sooner.

Also, them not going all "muh freedom!!11" surely helps.

[Gorsameth]

assuming they aren't lying, how the fuck has South Korea contained COVID so well? The plausibility of it being controlled is from how I don't find much news of outrage. I mean, if a third world country can do it like that, I'm pretty lost how America is in such shambles.

Already common to wear masks, lack of land borders allowing for better control of what comes in combined with aggressive and early action.

Really not that difficulty to see why.

And South Korea is by no means a third world country, it is very much a first world country and has been for a while.

[EnclosedOne]

assuming they aren't lying, how the fuck has South Korea contained COVID so well? The plausibility of it being controlled is from how I don't find much news of outrage. I mean, if a third world country can do it like that, I'm pretty lost how America is in such shambles.

lol wtf are you smoking? South Korea is NOT a third world country by any means. as with most asian countries people actually give a shit about others and most are wearing masks and social distacing like they should for one thing plus the government is tracking/tracing down and enforcing quarantine to people found positive and those they've come in contact with. they're also, as far as i recall, enforcing quarantine to travelers (or they were, not sure about now)

asians tend to see themselves as a collective so they do what is necessary to protect everyone during times of need. they're not dumb like americans who see themselves as individuals and who have clearly shown they don't give two shits even about their own family members and think wearing a mask is infringing on their freedom.

[cubby]

assuming they aren't lying, how the fuck has South Korea contained COVID so well? The plausibility of it being controlled is from how I don't find much news of outrage. I mean, if a third world country can do it like that, I'm pretty lost how America is in such shambles.
[Infraction]

TRUMP.

Failure of leadership in literally every category.

Other nations have contained COVID-19 because their leaders acted swiftly based on available data. South Korea. Europe (most of them at least). New Zealand. Hell - NZ will be a case study in how to almost perfectly respond to a pandemic. They have at last count single digit numbers for their entire country.

A friend of mine happens to be a mid-level government official (emigrated), and he gave me NZ's run down on their response. They did a 3-5 year analysis on shutting down 100% for a month, and preventing anyone else from entering, and quarantining them for 14 days if they had to enter. Now they are slowly opening the country back up, with the same precautions. Their data told them that the impact on the country would be far less, long term, doing it this way.

[Granyala]

TRUMP.

Failure of leadership in literally every category.

To be blunt: I think it is too easy to blame this on only one man.
If he has that much power, your political system needs a revision.