It doesnt matter how good you are anymore

[Seranthor]

dude....2k+ guys? as if 2k+ is difficult? im timing 17s with no issue and healing 18s with no issue its the dps that are having trouble because there op gear isnt carrying them through the mechanics.

15s in time is 2k, 16s is 2.2k 17s 2.4k etc or something there or there abouts, 15 is not difficult AT ALL

the problem is terrible terrible players with gear boosts are getting into 17s because there gear has carried them through 15s/16s, skillwise they are nowhere near good enough for 17s/18s, they are failing on s1 mechanics

Then maybe its time to take some initiative and step up your group making skills.

[IceMan1763]

Well no shit. The first clue you should have had was the announcement of RNG distributed legiondaries and this quote from Ion:

"Random distribution of legendary items isn't a problem" (from Legion).

Also Ion and the same Dev team for ShadowLands:

"Legendaries will be returning in Shadowlands with an entirely new acquisition system. Developers have stated that although they liked how legendaries worked in Legion, they did not like their RNG-heavy acquisition methods."

This dev team is fucking clueless and I seriously have disdain for them. The pitfalls of their type of systems design should have been obvious the first time they were suggested in a dev team meeting and shot down right there. If they actually solicited feedback, they would have known how much the idea of RNG distributed legendaries was HATED by the community, especially when the reality of how powerful they actually were (despite purely lip service assurances this would not happen when concerns were immediately raised upon announcement of the feature) came to light. AP being infinitely grindable is another major bone I have to pick with this dev team. SHOCKER, check this out regarding Anima in Shadowlands:

"There's no infinitely grindable system in Shadowlands. We want there to be tons of different things you can do. You can do what you want to do for anima."

I seriously cannot believe the dev team did not have the foresight to see how negatively these two AWFUL systems decisions would affect Legion and BFA. Legion, with a deterministic Legiondary acquisition system and weekly caps for AP which allowed the full power of artifacts to be unlocked over the course of the entire expansion (at a reasonable pace per week... also cancel Concordance it was just another stupid grind with a passive RNG proc as a reward) would have made Legion their best expansion ever and brought sub numbers back up to the 6 - 10 million range, in my opinion. Although Legion did reignite the love of WOW for many, I think it also burned many people out and these types of "MAUs over everything" systems caused a lot who did come back to quit again. Obviously BFA still suffers from many of the same mistakes as Legion (infinitely grindable systems and way too much RNG in loot).

A major side effect of these systems was that RNG played a MUCH, MUCH bigger role in the type of performance you could expect at the expense of how large a role your personal skill played. Time investment and luck were both brought FAR more to the forefront. This turned off a lot of skilled players who saw the grinds being added as completely unfun chores that didn't challenge them at all. No wonder so many left to play other games that respected their time (and skill) more.

[Hellobolis]

He isn’t wrong, you are. It is VERY common in this new seasonal approach to wow, for solo and m+ players to be equally as geared as full time mythic raiders by the end of the patch. It’s designed to let everyone equalize in the end if they put in the time.

There’s no mythic only bosses with exclusive gear that would actually make players stand out

Everyone is wearing different variations of the same gear and that’s beyond boring

what's so bad about that? that means the average player has a great progression path that last most/all of the patch cycle.

casual players are typically 30+ ilvls behind mythic players by the end of the patch. (typically this is what queuable content limits you to)
solo/m+ players can catch up, but as you say it'll take them months. (limited to 1-2 chances at a "good" item per week)
mythic raiders will get very good gear in a few weeks after the patch releases. (full access to high ilvl loot sharing in a few weeks, and often more willing to do crazy shit like benthic farm)

[mauserr]

A DH in my raid has Twilight Devastation. I don't. I had more casts of Anni or Death Sweep/Blade Dance than he had, but Twilight Devastation was always his highest damage source, even on single target. Guess he's better, logs percentiles say so.

[kaminaris]

When I read topics like this I am wondering how bad education in your country must be

Honestly, math isn't that hard.

First of all, we are at like 3rd week when mythic was opened and people have multiple corrupted items. At this point in legion you had 1-2 leggos and both of them were shit unless you won on lottery. Which gave you superemacy over next 6 months over people who were unlucky. You could not buy them, you could not farm them because of leggo softcrap.

So no, acquisition RNG is nowhere near as bad as legiondaries was.

As for balance and overall power, yes, they are stupiditly OP. But there is a high chance you will get the one you need in a month or two. AND if you prefer to farm gold - this is also possible option. Just by selling consumables can earn you like 100-250k a week.

I suggest to listen what method said about corrupted items.

[Raven]

He's saying being better or putting more effort into the game isn't rewarding. Having amazing luck is.

Sounds like how its always been.

[xuros]

My infinite stars is never that high 8(. At most on most mythic boss fights its 2-4% total damage on the best of days.

[msdos]

"It doesn't matter how good you are anymore". I've been feeling this. This is hugely a tank thing too, tanks feel this more than anyone right now. It doesn't matter how good of a tank you are, you aren't showing it in PVP, you aren't showing it in raid since all you do is taunt swap and you aren't showing it in M+ because the damage is tuned so high that all you can really do is mash your builder/spenders and nothing else.
Since deathgrip was neutralized and everything else from the kit was neutered or pruned, you do nothing skillful as a BDK other than proc OP corruption effects. All your traits are stack haste to the umpteenth degree, that's actually all BDK has been the past few expansions.

It also doesn't matter how high my IO was in any of the seasons and AOTC doesn't matter for anything except 1 week into the current tier. Basically nothing you do matters unless you you can full clear Mythic raid and if you can do that, you don't really pug, so outside of your vacuum, basically nothing matters, everyone is playing in their own little instances not interacting with each other.

People in this thread will ignore everything that doesn't personally affect them though, that's what hilarious about video games.
"Oh I'm sorry you have bad luck, no guild, new to the game, broke and don't know what you're doing, I guess you're just bad a video games lul and there's nothing wrong at all"

[Ange]

corruption is far worse than legion legos because there is no blp.

THATS THE WHOLE POINT OF 8.3.

To show the players that there is no alternative to a baseline titanforge/warforge gear system or the outliers just KILL EVERY HINT OF BALANCE.

If you hate the situation right now, because it sucks if 1/3 or more of your performance is just relying on drop luck, then just remember this feeling the next time some twitch/yt-influencers demand a CHANGE for the COMMUNITY.

I suggest you just chill a bit, enjoy what you can with the last patch of the expansion and don't take it seriously, because this patch right now is meant to be a clownfiesta.

No class balance even for the last raid tier, no corruption balance with its introduction should have been a clear sign what to expect.

[chronia]

That's always been the case with wow. It's just been more or less obvious at different times.

Lets take classic as an example.

Two warriors duel, ones been lucky to get asscandi the other hasn't. Asscandi war slaps the other in a few shots, who's the better player? Fuck knows, gear has always counted for more than skill (except during templates in legion but yall hated that)

Only thing that's ever really changed is the number of avenues to powerful gear and time taken to obtain it.

Thats oversimplifying it though.

Up to halfway through MoP there was only one form of RNG, you got a item or you didn't. If it dropped that item always had the same power level. For example, take a MC ring of spellpower, if this drops today, tomorrow, or in a year, it always has 33 spellpower.

What happens now is:

1. Does the itemdrop?
2. If it drops, did it corrupt?
3. If it corrupted, did it have a good corruption
4. if it had a good corruption, did it have a good tier of said corruption.

Thats already 3 extra layers of RNG.
Then you also have sockets, tertiary stats.

While its good to have multiple avenues to get gear, the amount of RNG to get gear you actually want is getting more and more out of hand.

[odamienskii]

When I read topics like this I am wondering how bad education in your country must be

Honestly, math isn't that hard.

First of all, we are at like 3rd week when mythic was opened and people have multiple corrupted items. At this point in legion you had 1-2 leggos and both of them were shit unless you won on lottery. Which gave you superemacy over next 6 months over people who were unlucky. You could not buy them, you could not farm them because of leggo softcrap.

So no, acquisition RNG is nowhere near as bad as legiondaries was.

As for balance and overall power, yes, they are stupiditly OP. But there is a high chance you will get the one you need in a month or two. AND if you prefer to farm gold - this is also possible option. Just by selling consumables can earn you like 100-250k a week.

I suggest to listen what method said about corrupted items.

How can you say all of that after saying "math isnt hard" neither is logic.

You were GAURANTEED to get all legos, you are not guranteed to get the corruption you want because it is totally rng, it will continue through the season because you can be damn certain the corruption wanted is going to be duplicating on slots for some while others its going to land perfectly, not to mention actual item stats. imagine rank 3 stars on an item with your worst possible stats ring,

if your lucky then bfa is better, if your unlucky then bfa is far worse

[Monster Hunter]

Thats oversimplifying it though.

Up to halfway through MoP there was only one form of RNG, you got a item or you didn't. If it dropped that item always had the same power level. For example, take a MC ring of spellpower, if this drops today, tomorrow, or in a year, it always has 33 spellpower.

What happens now is:

1. Does the itemdrop?
2. If it drops, did it corrupt?
3. If it corrupted, did it have a good corruption
4. if it had a good corruption, did it have a good tier of said corruption.

Thats already 3 extra layers of RNG.
Then you also have sockets, tertiary stats.

While its good to have multiple avenues to get gear, the amount of RNG to get gear you actually want is getting more and more out of hand.

Like I said the forms and avenues change, how obvious it is changes.

But fundementaly this game is and always will be about who is lucky and gets the better gear far more than any level of skill.

[bullseyed]

Love it.

Now I just need to get Infinite Stars on my DH instead of on my alts.

IS is only valuable on single target fights, of which there are realistically none in the raid, but kind of 3.

For example, Maut is mostly single target, but there are adds and if your IS RNGs onto one of the adds, you'd be better off with different corruption.

[msdos]

Like I said the forms and avenues change, how obvious it is changes.

But fundementaly this game is and always will be about who is lucky and gets the better gear far more than any level of skill.

Unless you're playing an expansion earlier than Cata, then your statement isn't accurate.

[Sharby]

I mean I can kinda' see the OP's point.



So many chumps think they're hotshit and I check their damage breakdown and top two are both corruptions.



After EV got nerfed I noticed keys were getting burnt a lot more because these people weren't getting carried by them anymore. At this point even I.O is kinda irrelevant because so many people have inflated corruption IO's.

[bullseyed]

That's always been the case with wow. It's just been more or less obvious at different times.

There has always been RNG in giving more rewards to bad players (since master loot was removed, mostly)

In the past that RNG reward wasn't 20%+ of your damage the primary factor in determining your output.

A TF on normal raid outpacing a mythic raid item was fine because that player was unlikely to actually get more DPS out of the item than the mythic player would have. With corruption, the normal raider with RNG is likely to outDPS the mythic raider now.

- - - Updated - - -

Honestly raiding is kind of a dead scene for more and more people these days. Yeah, groups exist out there but their numbers are dwindling.

Gotta love this kind of fake news.

Warcraftlogs went down last night due to over 350,000 people livelogging at the same time, the highest number EVER recorded for WoW.

[taishar68]

dude....2k+ guys? as if 2k+ is difficult? im timing 17s with no issue and healing 18s with no issue its the dps that are having trouble because there op gear isnt carrying them through the mechanics.

15s in time is 2k, 16s is 2.2k 17s 2.4k etc or something there or there abouts, 15 is not difficult AT ALL

the problem is terrible terrible players with gear boosts are getting into 17s because there gear has carried them through 15s/16s, skillwise they are nowhere near good enough for 17s/18s, they are failing on s1 mechanics

Blizzard should not be designing content or loot around making the game convenient for people pugging M+ dungeons. If you're as good as you claim to be, find a group of other superstars and schedule your runs. Like any other pug instance in this game's history, it's a crap shoot as to what you'll get, and you know it.

You said you paid 1.5 million for your gear, is that correct? Seems like that was money poorly spent based on your current satisfaction level.

[bullseyed]

What exactly are you demanding they 'sort out'?

Not OP, but, IMO they should have had us "unlock" corruption effects with the coins from Horrific Visions instead of buying talent upgrades and sockets.

The other currency we use to buy vessels would have instead been used to buy the talents. This would have been interesting because you could choose to buy more runs or buy better talents in fewer runs. It would have been exactly the kind of tradeoff consideration they want us to do with corruption.

This would mean that the top corruptions could have been locked behind Horrific Vision runs, basically. People would have started out with bad ones and eventually unlocked EV and TD after weeks of progress. This would have basically been a slow nerf to the content where you can farm harder to get it faster (which should be the goal of every design in every RPG).

[Justpassing]

Gotta love this kind of fake news.

Warcraftlogs went down last night due to over 350,000 people livelogging at the same time, the highest number EVER recorded for WoW.

It was probably all BWL raids.

[Monster Hunter]

There has always been RNG in giving more rewards to bad players (since master loot was removed, mostly)

In the past that RNG reward wasn't 20%+ of your damage the primary factor in determining your output.

A TF on normal raid outpacing a mythic raid item was fine because that player was unlikely to actually get more DPS out of the item than the mythic player would have. With corruption, the normal raider with RNG is likely to outDPS the mythic raider now.

- - - Updated - - -



Gotta love this kind of fake news.

Warcraftlogs went down last night due to over 350,000 people livelogging at the same time, the highest number EVER recorded for WoW.

It was. There's always been OP as fuck items in wow that do way more than just 20%

Also plenty of bad players got those best items simply by sucking the raid leaders cock.