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  1. #221
    Quote Originally Posted by Ghostile View Post
    With that logic, majority of the players won't be "done" anyway, so system like forging is fine.


    PS. I hated titanforging.
    Problem is nobody is ever done with titanforging, and the path to being done is luck rather than skill.
    Intshuffle
    <Arctic Avengers>
    Kazzak-EU

  2. #222
    Quote Originally Posted by Thelyron View Post
    Yes? I don't understand how this question comes up every single time a topic like this gets created. Of fucking course i'd rather have nothing to do and quit. I want to be able to ""complete"" the game, at least temporarily, to free up time for other things, other hobbies. No game should keep you on the hook the entire fucking time. Why would you not want that? Do you want to be addicted? To play the same game every single day?
    Sounds like you have the addiction problem if you feel you can't stop when you want to.

  3. #223
    There will always be gear RNG, get over it. I figured the crying about TF would result in something worse. TF was a great system, but people cried because they were never done gearing. Or people who didn't raid were getting good gear!! Now look at what you made everyone have to deal with instead.

    Don't blame the developers. Blame yourselves for being so whiny all the time. TF worked, it gave everyone a constant chance to upgrade a piece of gear. And if you guys think gear RNG is going away, it isn't. The whole point of gear, is RNG.
    I'm a thread killer.

  4. #224
    Legendary! Zka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nyjl View Post
    Yes, the idea of being able to somehow complete the game is atrocious.
    Not sure why - people used to roll alts in BC/LK when there was no way to perma-grind something on your main. It was so much more fun.

  5. #225
    I think RNG is pushing players to do smth instead of standing in city. If you know you can roll great affix may it push you to try as more chance to get loot as you can. Yeah thats shit but i bet thats the idea of RNG affixes. In some way its true but this made game better? Totally no. This made it more annoyin. Some can get mad because lootek thousand of items and get shit. Some can be excited because loot awesome item when just passing lvl cap :P Ive looted awesome BOE ring on normal nylotha witch is worth around 250.000 G. RNG is ok for the games like Diablo or POE where you are not time gated in RAID locks for a week. Ok i can spam myth+ but yeah i didnt have guarantee ill get any loot at the end xD
    Last edited by czarek; 2020-03-03 at 08:18 AM.

  6. #226
    Quote Originally Posted by blankfaced View Post
    There will always be gear RNG, get over it. I figured the crying about TF would result in something worse. TF was a great system, but people cried because they were never done gearing. Or people who didn't raid were getting good gear!! Now look at what you made everyone have to deal with instead.

    Don't blame the developers. Blame yourselves for being so whiny all the time. TF worked, it gave everyone a constant chance to upgrade a piece of gear. And if you guys think gear RNG is going away, it isn't. The whole point of gear, is RNG.
    There was enough RNG in Cata. That's when they nailed gearing and since then it's only gotten worse. Corrupted gear at least had the potential to be interesting, it failed when they added the damage procs(and leech/avoidance) to the pool and failed completely at tuning it(although that part should be expected at this point)
    99.9% of people already had a constant opportunity to get better gear previous to forging. The difference was you had to earn it instead of just getting lucky.
    Intshuffle
    <Arctic Avengers>
    Kazzak-EU

  7. #227
    The game shouldn’t need endless gear to keep people playing it. Games like CS GO etc doesn’t have any character progression but people still play it over and over again.

  8. #228
    ^ This!

    I am starting to think that the best solution should be an all out RNG-fest should happen in difficulties up until Heroic and then for Mythic onwards the gear shouldn't be a problem.

    The same mindset should be in PvP.

  9. #229
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaver View Post
    The game shouldn’t need endless gear to keep people playing it. Games like CS GO etc doesn’t have any character progression but people still play it over and over again.
    csgo isn't an rpg

  10. #230
    Quote Originally Posted by Kehego View Post
    csgo isn't an rpg
    You’re right, it’s not. But it is just an example of a game that strives solely on fun gameplay. Even an RPG game like WoW could learn something from that. Blizzard seem to think they need to make all these gear systems based on rng and infinite progression to keep people playing the game, but they don’t have to. I play a lot of high M+ keys but it is not because of gear. It’s because I actually enjoy the content and like the competitiveness of pushing keys.

  11. #231
    There are so many people saying "It's good to be done with a tier, it feels good", that people who don't know what it's like to be fully BiS geared think it's an easy task.

    Newsflash, it's not.

    There have been only 2? 3? times in my 15 year long WoW career that my char has been 100% BiS geared - as a feral Maintank with close to 100% raid attendance in TBC, and as a feral Maintank with close to 100% raid attendance in WOTLK.

    My guild raided 3-5 days/week in TBC and 2-4 days/week in WOTLK. Serious dedication was required to get full T6, full T6.5 off-set pieces from SWP, and full 277 Heroic T10 from ICC. It was not an easy task, it took constant gameplay (refer to near-100% raid attendance) and it took being an active member of a respectable guild. I would argue it took MORE effort to get full best-in-slot in TBC and WOTLK, simply due to the fact that raids dropped MUCH less items. TBC and WOTLK were so close to their Vanilla starting roots that bosses in 25man raids dropped 2-3 items per kill. 1 tier token, 1 piece off the loot table, maybe a 2nd piece, maybe a recipe.

    Regarding the myth that "When people are full BiS and done they log off till next tier" that's complete and utter horseshit. The people who a) care enough to get full BiS and b) are respected enough by their guilds to be GIVEN that full BiS gear-set when it drops are NOT the people who will log off and disappear till the new raid. No no no no no.

    They are the people who will attain full BIS, will realise attaining full BIS on a character is a GUILD EFFORT, and they will continue going to raids so they can help their mates & guildies ALSO get full BiS. What guild would appreciate the Maintank that gets his full BiS and then fucks off, never to be seen again for the next 3 months, unavailable to tank raids for the guild who geared him up? Oh that's right, noone.

    TL : DR, people were more engaged and more active when there were set BiS lists to get, because of the nature of the game, and what "getting full BiS" entailed. A massive amount of group effort.
    Last edited by Dalinos; 2020-03-03 at 11:45 AM.

  12. #232
    Quote Originally Posted by Dalinos View Post
    There are so many people saying "It's good to be done with a tier, it feels good", that people who don't know what it's like to be fully BiS geared think it's an easy task.

    Newsflash, it's not.

    There have been only 2? 3? times in my 15 year long WoW career that my char has been 100% BiS geared - as a feral Maintank with close to 100% raid attendance in TBC, and as a feral Maintank with close to 100% raid attendance in WOTLK.

    My guild raided 3-5 days/week in TBC and 2-4 days/week in WOTLK. Serious dedication was required to get full T6, full T6.5 off-set pieces from SWP, and full 277 Heroic T10 from ICC. It was not an easy task, it took constant gameplay (refer to near-100% raid attendance) and it took being an active member of a respectable guild. I would argue it took MORE effort to get full best-in-slot in TBC and WOTLK, simply due to the fact that raids dropped MUCH less items. TBC and WOTLK were so close to their Vanilla starting roots that bosses in 25man raids dropped 2-3 items per kill. 1 tier token, 1 piece off the loot table, maybe a 2nd piece, maybe a recipe.

    Regarding the myth that "When people are full BiS and done they log off till next tier" that's complete and utter horseshit. The people who a) care enough to get full BiS and b) are respected enough by their guilds to be GIVEN that full BiS gear-set when it drops are NOT the people who will log off and disappear till the new raid. No no no no no.

    They are the people who will attain full BIS, will realise attaining full BIS on a character is a GUILD EFFORT, and they will continue going to raids so they can help their mates & guildies ALSO get full BiS. What guild would appreciate the Maintank that gets his full BiS and then fucks off, never to be seen again for the next 3 months, unavailable to tank raids for the guild who geared him up? Oh that's right, noone.

    TLR, people were more engaged and more active when there were set BiS lists to get, because of the nature of the game, and what "getting full BiS" entailed. A massive amount of group effort.
    BiS also meant the playing field for ranks was much more even later in the tier. Now that never happens, and this tier it's going to end up being full of degenerate corruption RNG and Spark of Inspiration funneling/simp shaman(probably mostly from Asia)
    Intshuffle
    <Arctic Avengers>
    Kazzak-EU

  13. #233
    I also don’t think we need 3 different systems that gives us “talents”. Instead of having Azerite gear and Essences they should just expand the standard talent system and make some more interesting choices. There is no need to attach talents to gear in multiple different system. Just give us ONE great system.

  14. #234
    Quote Originally Posted by Casperite View Post
    Sounds like you have the addiction problem if you feel you can't stop when you want to.
    I did stop when i wanted to. Unsubbed during that 2 boss raid last year. But if you really feel like you're not being left behind every time you don't play, you're lying to yourself.

  15. #235
    Quote Originally Posted by Tradu View Post
    BiS also meant the playing field for ranks was much more even later in the tier. Now that never happens, and this tier it's going to end up being full of degenerate corruption RNG and Spark of Inspiration funneling/simp shaman(probably mostly from Asia)
    Now that's an aspect I never personally really bothered with, but I get where you're coming from. When every single Rogue & Feral druid in the raid had 100% armour penetration in WOTLK, you could start comparing classes. When casters got all their gear up to par, they would even have intra-guild competitions where the top 5 DPSers would pool 100g per bossfight, and whoever got 1st would get the 500g prize. For me, I vaguely remember being told once "Omg Dali, you got an amazing parse on Sindragosa, you were #81st bear tank in the world!" to which my response was "Oh really? Nice, I guess".

    So..not really my cup of tea, but I can still see how it's exciting for people and how you absolutely NEED to have static items that do not change their stats in order for that race/comparison/leaderboard to make any sense whatsoever.

  16. #236
    Because Blizzard devs and management are fucking retards.

  17. #237
    Quote Originally Posted by Elias01 View Post
    So you think making flat square would be better desing? No obstacles, no caves, etc..? Do you realize that incovinience do not exist just to make make stuff take more time right? They exist becouse they create bealiaveable and immersive world. If you create cave what is coviniently put infront of you and you dont have to navigate at all it stopes being immersive becouse you start realize that its there becouse devs put it there no becouse that cave was created by nature process which is everthing but not covienient.

    And if you dont care about non of that than you dont like mmorpg games and you clearly play wrong game.
    Oh i'm clearly not playing it anymore. It was boring to no end and i found games that are more fun to play. I would just like dor it to actually improve.

    Imersion is such an abstract concept that varies from person to person. As part of imersion my character should have to go to the shitter every 5 hours or this game sucks! Imersion does not equal fun, it equals chore. I live in a real world, i play games to have fun, not to replicate a real world. I explored the world and am imersed in it in the leveling experience alongside the narrative. There is nothing imersive about repeating the same WQ's over and over like a looney toon house and then say to riding there again and again is "imersive".
    Sorry, bunch of snowflakes. I don't recognise your opinion, but you can have it of course.

  18. #238
    Quote Originally Posted by ano2024 View Post
    There is content, you do that content, you get gear. The more difficult the content the better the gear with better stats. A good formula, it worked for ages.

    Now, I'm not one to stifle progress. You want to add new systems to freshen things up, fine. But it's already been many, many years of systems after systems that have been very poorly received. Criticized ceaselessly by both casuals and hardcore players.

    And yet they haven't learned at all. Instead they seem to be doubling down, creating even shittier systems. It's like when they say they'll get rid of a certain annoying part of the game, they somehow make it worse. Like with removing titanforging which was supposed to make the game less RNG, to adding corruption which is more RNG. Is this company just completely out of touch? So they hire a lawyer as a game director to use his lawyer-speak and constantly put out fires that he started with his own lies.
    Because its boring? ! WE did gear just gear for many expansions, it's boring as hell after a while, I much prefer these other systems, wow is much more than just logging to go to your raid and pick up ypur tier set, thnx bye.

    While it is there to keep you subscribed, it als o keeps playing regualrly rewarding and more interesting. It's a pain when you don't have time to do as much as you want though and can't be bothered to have a new grind every patch because you already did that alot. But how else will they keep you subscribed and or interested?

    You may be ocontent with just normal vanilla gear, but many people get bored fast, and it becomes stale fast. Besides if itwasn't for al lthis, the nostalgia and enjoyment of classic wouldn't be so pronounced. You have to have moved away from something for a long time for people to have fond memories and want to have a go at the old system.

    Calssic provides that now, but it would be disastrous for live to go back to that, and boring as hell. Live's average age is also younger than classics. And there is a reason new players are a lot more on live than classic. you can't just cater to the past, gotta look to the future.

  19. #239
    anyone get denied a guild application because they didn't have titanforging?

    anyone get kicked out of a run because it wasn't socketed?

  20. #240
    I think it comes down to fear.

    Fear that their playerbase has changed so drastically over the years from them catering to the instanst reward crowd that they no longer have faith that there is a large enough player pool that progresses for their old systems to work.

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