1. #36041
    Quote Originally Posted by downnola View Post
    My point wasn't just that Biden won Florida's delegates, my point is that it wasn't even close to being close. They (Florida democrats) played a big role in nominating Biden and he's the sort of Democrat that should appeal to a purple state. That he didn't win isn't all that surprising considering Dems had their clocks cleaned there in 2018. Obama won the state by less than 1% in 2016 and if you step back and look the big picture the state has only gone to democrats 3 times in the last 30 years and hasn't had a Democratic governor in over 20 years.

    Meanwhile Biden flipped Georgia, Arizona, won back the rust belt, and almost flipped Texas. Yeah, let's use Florida to argue Biden was somehow a bad choice in 2020.
    He didn't "almost flip Texas"... that's specifically a thing he failed to do. He was off by 6% when it was rated a battleground. Texas is slowly trending more blue over time, but Biden completely failed to move the needle any more than it was already going to.

    And winning back voters Hillary lost isn't progress lol. She was supposed to appeal to the middle as well, remember?

    The primary is utterly irrelevant, do I really have to explain why? But you're right to point out that FL Dems saddled you with a candidate who washed out in FL. Kind of raises some pointed questions, doesn't it?
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    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
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  2. #36042
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    https://thehill.com/blogs/in-the-kno...-amid-pandemic

    At least we know Trump has time for the truly important things while trying to obliterate faith in American democracy: He's still gonna pardon a turkey.
    Like this turkey?


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  3. #36043
    Quote Originally Posted by Levelfive View Post
    I'm not sure what you're saying was disproved in 2016 and 2020--Biden (re)flipped the "blue wall" and Arizona, and took Nevada (which is something like a red, red, blue, blue, red, red, red, now blue state), which affirms what I said above.
    Okay, so you're counting an establishment candidate re-taking blue states that were lost by the previous establishment candidate as a glowing endorsement of establishment candidates?

    Biden won NV, which was rated light blue anyway, meanwhile he just barely managed to snag 2/6 swing states, while utterly wiping out in the two biggest: OH and FL.

    Continuing to run candidates whose sole claim to the role is "electability" but get annihilated in FL and OH is a losing strategy, I'm sure I don't need to tell you that. If you can't win OH and FL then your claims of electability are completely bunk.

    The conventional wisdom of the establishment wing is not working, period. It can't explain Trump's successes, and it can't explain Hillary and Biden's failures. You have two elections running to prove that to you now, it's time to open your eyes before it's too late.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by BloodyAxe View Post
    Yeah and besides the fact that the left has been burning down buildings and assaulting people, they also threatened the two republican election officials in Wayne County to change their votes "or else." Nice democracy you got going there.
    The right literally invited the mother of a murderer to CPAC to fete her, and is pouring money into his legal defence fund.

    But oes noes, property damage!

    ...that was caused by a total breakdown of law and order under Trump.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by BloodyAxe View Post
    I get that this is a libtard echo chamber so I expect to get banned for stating the facts, but anyway, you're all pathetic and I can't wait to come back here when Trump resumes his 2nd term January 21st, 2021. By crybabies!
    Please please please do come back on Jan 21st 2021. Remind me of this conversation when you do.
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    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
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  4. #36044
    Quote Originally Posted by Kathranis View Post
    Voter suppression is a much, much bigger issue than fraudulent ballots or even human error and glitches. Actual cases of fraud are exceedingly minor, typically lone individuals who added no more than a few votes illegally, and it occurs on both sides. Most of these issues are discovered and remedied before certification.
    Fraud generally isn't an issue. However, a malfunctioning voting machine increases voting times and makes long line ups. In 2018 Georgia gave urban districts less voting machines to begin with but those machines constantly fucking up added to the problem. Biden's victory in Georgia was partially due to updated voting equipment that was set up in 2019. It helps that Georgia's current SoS appears to want more honest elections.

  5. #36045
    Elemental Lord Kathranis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivanstone View Post
    Fraud generally isn't an issue. However, a malfunctioning voting machine increases voting times and makes long line ups. In 2018 Georgia gave urban districts less voting machines to begin with but those machines constantly fucking up added to the problem. Biden's victory in Georgia was partially due to updated voting equipment that was set up in 2019. It helps that Georgia's current SoS appears to want more honest elections.
    Yeah, but again, you can argue that refusing to update or replace outdated machines is just another form of voter suppression. The Republicans want it to be hard to vote in counties that lead Democrat. Plain and simple.

  6. #36046
    Scarab Lord PhaelixWW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivanstone View Post
    Fraud generally isn't an issue. However, a malfunctioning voting machine increases voting times and makes long line ups. In 2018 Georgia gave urban districts less voting machines to begin with but those machines constantly fucking up added to the problem. Biden's victory in Georgia was partially due to updated voting equipment that was set up in 2019. It helps that Georgia's current SoS appears to want more honest elections.
    What does it say about this country when that's even a question?

    What does it say about a country when the number of people who want "more honest elections" isn't approaching 100%?

    Fuck the Trumpzi Party, their voter suppression tactics, their sinister lies, their political enablers, and their hatred of Americans disguised as "patriotism".


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  7. #36047
    Quote Originally Posted by Resurgo View Post
    Not sure about you but from my observations, that’s exactly how the vast majority seem to be.

    Take that $1200 stimulus we got in May.
    I took that as an extra cushion ‘just in case’ because I had no idea if things would get worse, I could make a mortgage payment, buy food, etc.
    Around here, pretty much every big screen TV sold out. Shelves in electronics were bare
    well the full intent was to get people to spend that money anyway they could to keep the economy semi alive.

    as far as inventory that was more as a result of china and the rest of asia shutting down for a few months vs actual increase in sales
    Buh Byeeeeeeeeeeee !!

  8. #36048
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    Alright so I need to make a list now, and I need people to help me. Maybe @Breccia can offer his expert services.

    Come Jan 21, we can expect to see:

    Republicans who didn't care about the debt or deficit for the last 4 years suddenly scream about how in trouble our government's budget is, sounding alarm bells for how awful our national debt is, and how it's Biden's fault.

    The unemployment rate is going to jump from 6% to 60% because why not? We all know that when Trump became president that @Ghostpanther and many others claimed that unemployment went from 60% to 6%, so why not the other way around?

    That covid business that wasn't such a big deal, suddenly Republicans will care about the thousands of deaths. And yes, the bodies from the last 10 months will be piled on Biden's doorstep and Republicans will demand answers as to why Biden has not retroactively saved those people.

    Any other thoughts on what Republicans will flip flop on come Jan 21?
    "Nazis are like cats. If they like you, it's probably because you're feeding them." -John Oliver
    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    I don't care if he committed tax fraud. Scoring political victories and crushing the aspirations of your political opponents is more important than adhering to moral principles.
    Knadra finally just admitting Trumpkins care more about political victories than morals.

  9. #36049
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cthulhu 2020 View Post
    Any other thoughts on what Republicans will flip flop on come Jan 21?
    With a Democrat in the White House, they'll probably say that a lack of law and order is causing the cities to be overrun by dangerous undesirables, protesting and rioting.

    Oh, wait... they already do say that.


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  10. #36050
    So those Wayne County republicans who at first didn't want to certify the results only to back down after public outcry.

    It appears they may want to rescind their certifications now.

  11. #36051
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    Quote Originally Posted by Corvus View Post
    So those Wayne County republicans who at first didn't want to certify the results only to back down after public outcry.

    It appears they may want to rescind their certifications now.
    From what I read about this, it looks like they can't 'Take Backsies' their votes once the measure to certify passes or fails (rather then just ties).

    So either they're dumb enough to think they can (likely), or they're just acting like it was outside of their control so Trump Voters don't start sending them death threats en masse like they've been so happily doing towards election officials for the last couple of weeks.

  12. #36052
    The Unstoppable Force Kaleredar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cthulhu 2020 View Post
    Alright so I need to make a list now, and I need people to help me. Maybe @Breccia can offer his expert services.

    Come Jan 21, we can expect to see:

    Republicans who didn't care about the debt or deficit for the last 4 years suddenly scream about how in trouble our government's budget is, sounding alarm bells for how awful our national debt is, and how it's Biden's fault.

    The unemployment rate is going to jump from 6% to 60% because why not? We all know that when Trump became president that @Ghostpanther and many others claimed that unemployment went from 60% to 6%, so why not the other way around?

    That covid business that wasn't such a big deal, suddenly Republicans will care about the thousands of deaths. And yes, the bodies from the last 10 months will be piled on Biden's doorstep and Republicans will demand answers as to why Biden has not retroactively saved those people.

    Any other thoughts on what Republicans will flip flop on come Jan 21?
    I'd have to imagine that Biden and whatever crew he's been whipping up are prepared to do as much as possible without Republican cooperation.

    I think Obama went into his presidency with a very commendable, but in retrospect naive, view on cooperation in Washington. Biden will have had not only the past four years of the GOP yes-manning a god awful excuse for a human being in Trump to spite the democrats, but also first-hand experience dealing with their obstructionist ways in his eight years serving as Obama's VP, to see that such an angle is folly.

    I know he said in his president-elect speech that he thinks the country needs to "come together," but I don't for a second believe that his administration will be so blindly naive that they think the republicans will freely work with him.
    “Do not lose time on daily trivialities. Do not dwell on petty detail. For all of these things melt away and drift apart within the obscure traffic of time. Live well and live broadly. You are alive and living now. Now is the envy of all of the dead.” ~ Emily3, World of Tomorrow
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    Kaleredar is right...
    Words to live by.

  13. #36053
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaleredar View Post
    I'd have to imagine that Biden and whatever crew he's been whipping up are prepared to do as much as possible without Republican cooperation.

    I think Obama went into his presidency with a very commendable, but in retrospect naive, view on cooperation in Washington. Biden will have had not only the past four years of the GOP yes-manning a god awful excuse for a human being in Trump to spite the democrats, but also first-hand experience dealing with their obstructionist ways in his eight years serving as Obama's VP, to see that such an angle is folly.

    I know he said in his president-elect speech that he thinks the country needs to "come together," but I don't for a second believe that his administration will be so blindly naive that they think the republicans will freely work with him.
    Like the 'Coming Together' message is nice and all but... how? Like sure Democrats should be the bigger persons in the room and not stoop to the Republican's level of scumfuckery but, after this administration, that whole political party should be told to sit in time out until they can stop being a Conspiracy Riddled Death Cult.

    They've stacked the courts with unqualified shitheels and then start tearing up at the idea that Democrats might do the same just to patch up the damage they've done to our Judicial branch; they'll start sobbing about the Debt again as soon as COVID and Infrastructure bills start getting introduced after ignoring some of the highest deficit climbs in history, and fuck when Biden has to fix Trump's blunders with our overseas troop deployments they'll start gibbering about 'Endless Wars!!'.

    So you know what I say? Fuck 'em. Just steam roll ahead and play their game of not giving a shit about what the other side thinks. Unity can happen when this country isn't riddled with disease and debt that they helped spread as some dimwitted, bordering on psychotic effort to keep themselves in power.

  14. #36054
    The Undying Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cthulhu 2020 View Post
    Any other thoughts on what Republicans will flip flop on come Jan 21?
    Democrats need to basically capture every second of the next two months on video. I know some people are so blinded by their own intentional ignorance that even objective proof won't matter, but as we saw this election, there are enough swing voters to make a difference. In the lead-ins to 2022 and 2024 elections, Democrats need to open up that cache and say "This? This is what Trump handed us. Trump, the Republican candidate. Remember how shitty 2020 was? We spent the last (2/4) years trying to fix it. Since then, things have gotten better (show objective increases in everything) and we are making progress to undo the damage Trump did."

    Again, I know some people, namely the rabid fanbase, have proven willing to listen to claims like Trump/Spicer "it was 42% but now the numbers are real". That's...what's the word for "intentional self-inflicted mental illness"? Those votes are unwinnable. They're unsalvageable. They're not the target anymore. The goal is to hld onto the majority of Americans stil willing to listen to logic, reason, and facts.

  15. #36055
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    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    Democrats need to basically capture every second of the next two months on video. I know some people are so blinded by their own intentional ignorance that even objective proof won't matter, but as we saw this election, there are enough swing voters to make a difference. In the lead-ins to 2022 and 2024 elections, Democrats need to open up that cache and say "This? This is what Trump handed us. Trump, the Republican candidate. Remember how shitty 2020 was? We spent the last (2/4) years trying to fix it. Since then, things have gotten better (show objective increases in everything) and we are making progress to undo the damage Trump did."

    Again, I know some people, namely the rabid fanbase, have proven willing to listen to claims like Trump/Spicer "it was 42% but now the numbers are real". That's...what's the word for "intentional self-inflicted mental illness"? Those votes are unwinnable. They're unsalvageable. They're not the target anymore. The goal is to hld onto the majority of Americans stil willing to listen to logic, reason, and facts.
    And, yeah, I'll add this onto my post above: The Democrats need to stop governing with the Trump voter in mind. Sure vote to give them better health care, a more robust social safety net, more modern infrastructure, and cleaner air and water; but they shouldn't water down their approach so Jeb from Pidgeon Creek Arkansas doesn't have a hissy fit about 'Muh Socialism!!'.

    The real fight should be to market their policies to swing voters, and probably invest more in folks who can actually market these ideas in a way the GOP propaganda arm can't just strangle.

    (Author's note: I don't know if there's a town in Arkansas named Pidgeon Creek, or if anyone named Jeb lives there.)

  16. #36056
    The Undying Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xyonai View Post
    I don't know if there's a town in Arkansas named Pidgeon Creek
    It's in Alabama. It has a population of eight thousand.

  17. #36057
    The Unstoppable Force Kaleredar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xyonai View Post
    Like the 'Coming Together' message is nice and all but... how? Like sure Democrats should be the bigger persons in the room and not stoop to the Republican's level of scumfuckery but, after this administration, that whole political party should be told to sit in time out until they can stop being a Conspiracy Riddled Death Cult.

    They've stacked the courts with unqualified shitheels and then start tearing up at the idea that Democrats might do the same just to patch up the damage they've done to our Judicial branch; they'll start sobbing about the Debt again as soon as COVID and Infrastructure bills start getting introduced after ignoring some of the highest deficit climbs in history, and fuck when Biden has to fix Trump's blunders with our overseas troop deployments they'll start gibbering about 'Endless Wars!!'.

    So you know what I say? Fuck 'em. Just steam roll ahead and play their game of not giving a shit about what the other side thinks. Unity can happen when this country isn't riddled with disease and debt that they helped spread as some dimwitted, bordering on psychotic effort to keep themselves in power.
    I think his sentiment of "coming together" was a fairly generic presidential-pacification type sentiment. I'm almost entirely certain that, if you asked any American, no matter their political leaning, they'd say "yes, both sides need to work together more." However, there'd be a diametric split in people vis-a-vis which side they needs to do the compromising, and unfortunately many people would say "the left is far too radical! They need to move more towards the 'center' to work with the republicans more!"

    Of course, I believe Biden likely more specifically meant "Republicans need to work more closely with democrats," not the other way around. But he couldn't say that in a president-elect speech, that'd sound too divisive. And while I certainly agree that republicans need to work more with democrats (as opposed to being the absolute stick-in-the-mud shitheels the GOP are currently being,) it's obvious, as you note, that they absolutely will not if they aren't abjectly forced to. But I would expect Biden to know this at this point in time, and be planning to wield the house and his office to work around the senate as much as possible.

    But if by the grace of God the democrats can wrestle out those two senators in Georgia and tie up the senate, effectively placing it in their hands? Then yes. Full scorched earth on the GOP, for all I care.
    Last edited by Kaleredar; 2020-11-19 at 07:07 AM.
    “Do not lose time on daily trivialities. Do not dwell on petty detail. For all of these things melt away and drift apart within the obscure traffic of time. Live well and live broadly. You are alive and living now. Now is the envy of all of the dead.” ~ Emily3, World of Tomorrow
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Kaleredar is right...
    Words to live by.

  18. #36058
    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    Democrats need to basically capture every second of the next two months on video. I know some people are so blinded by their own intentional ignorance that even objective proof won't matter, but as we saw this election, there are enough swing voters to make a difference. In the lead-ins to 2022 and 2024 elections, Democrats need to open up that cache and say "This? This is what Trump handed us. Trump, the Republican candidate. Remember how shitty 2020 was? We spent the last (2/4) years trying to fix it. Since then, things have gotten better (show objective increases in everything) and we are making progress to undo the damage Trump did."

    Again, I know some people, namely the rabid fanbase, have proven willing to listen to claims like Trump/Spicer "it was 42% but now the numbers are real". That's...what's the word for "intentional self-inflicted mental illness"? Those votes are unwinnable. They're unsalvageable. They're not the target anymore. The goal is to hld onto the majority of Americans stil willing to listen to logic, reason, and facts.
    Yeah voters, especially swing voters seem to tend to have extremely short memories, and GoP politicans know it and take advantage like blaming Obama for the recession. We need to keep voter turnout out HIGH among dem's cause republicans politicans have no morals so there isn't anything they won't flip flop on, their voters care about nothing but triggering the libs. So we got to keep the intelligent part of the country, make sure they are reminded, and often. The cycle needs to be broken, because every single time, gop fuck it all up, people are like oh yeah, then they come out in a later election to vote for the dem's who are left to clean up the shit instead of progressing us forward in any meaningful way. which just leads them astray again because short term memory.

  19. #36059

  20. #36060
    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    For reference that's just below the population of Germany.

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