Datamined race intros shows Blizz set on whitewashing Horde.

[Zuben]

A bit too much heroism there. Realistically nations exist for themselves, not to protect the planet like they're Justice League. Protecting Azeroth is what we do when faced with an existential threat, otherwise we've been happy killing each other and seeking power. It's a weird narrative angle for new players.

[Super Dickmann]

Absolutely.
Though i guess Blizzard not adding a climactic fitting end to the faction war story in BfA at all mitigates it slightly. Unlike previous expansions i don't think a new player misses anything by not being told that BfA ends with N'zoth.
And to be honest, possibly even worse. What is a new Forsaken player going to think of the story when they see it, first being told they are actually good on the inside, being shown nothing to contradict that, and then being told in Shadowlands that your race was part of the main driving force behind killing thousands in brutal ways and then ressurecting the dead to kill even more people.

You could cut every mention of N'zoth out of the proceedings if you're compiling a War Campaign greatest hits and lose nothing. As for the Forsaken, they've pretty much said that the race of undead in the expansion about the land of the dead to confront the former leader of the undead won't have much of a role.

@Syegfryed

Curses, foiled again.

[TheRevenantHero]

No. Quel'thalas left the Alliance, refused to help Lordaeron deal with the plague and requested help only once Lordaeron was destroyed. The Blood Elves are those who agreed with all of this while the High Elves refused and disagreed with the refusal to help the Alliance.

I don't know why I even bother. Alliance fans ALWAYS view the lore in their own way so that it makes the Alliance look better so I'm not even going to bother responding to you after this.

[Syegfryed]

You could cut every mention of N'zoth out of the proceedings if you're compiling a War Campaign greatest hits and lose nothing. As for the Forsaken, they've pretty much said that the race of undead in the expansion about the land of the dead to confront the former leader of the undead won't have much of a role.

@Syegfryed

Curses, foiled again.

you could say one day sylvanas left the undead to go after Bolvar, Saurfang died by old age, Thrall came to the funeral and stick around, and erase everything else and the story would be the fucking same, pointless piece of shit expansion, at least WoD impact the game someway somehow.

[Super Dickmann]

you could say one day sylvanas left the undead to go after Bolvar, Saurfang died by old age, Thrall came to the funeral and stick around, and erase everything else and the story would be the fucking same, pointless piece of shit expansion, at least WoD impact the game someway somehow.

BFA did have some relevance - it brought in new races, and a faction war expansion would've been good, but given what Sylvanas's plan turned out to be it could just as easily be completed if she did nothing but fondle herself and waited for N'zoth to do his thing post-sword, then pissed off.

None of this crap was necessary and wrangling her to the Warchief spot ruined her, ruined her race and wasted Vol'jin meaning that the dude who has a massive backstory regarding troll unity, the Zandalari and his dynamic thereof as well as being an actual troll is reduced to a ghost investigating his own murder (to no result of course) instead of where he should be. Hell, with Vol'jin as Warchief, you could still have the faction tension shit and the Battle for Dazar'alor, just cut the Undercity and Teldrassil bits entirely given how they're never referenced and only open sinkholes that make the rest of the plot nonsensical.

BFA has got me to the point where I'm defending Vol'jin as Warchief. It's all ogre.

[Yarathir]

This is hilarious.

Especially in 2 expansions when the Forsaken try to wipe out all the living again.

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It's so cute how they are removing all the Teldrassil references, this way Horde newbies can feel like they are not genocidal maniacs.

Of course, it sucks that the biggest tragedy in night elf history is being completely ignored, as if it never happened, but at this point night elf fanboys should be used to being ignored.

Fairly sure everyone was already aware and expecting it to just be brushed under the rug the moment Blizzard did a heel-turn on this whole war thing when it became inconvenient, 'concluded it', then had Tyrande be cast as some kind of maniacal warmonger for wanting vengeance for having her people nearly wiped out and not just bowing down to kiss orc toes the moment they decided to stop trying to murder the Alliance.

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Gonna be real awkward when you transition into BFA and spend the next 50 levels waging war on the Alliance.

Forsaken in particular. Maybe less "fight for the living" and more "fight for themselves and their living allies."

Member when life and hope were described as a curse and a burden? I member.

[Varodoc]

Forsaken: We fight to protect the living.
Also Forsaken NPCs: Beware the living.

[Yarathir]

You realize that the alternative to concentration camps would have been to kill them all, correct?

No, you don't get it. The big bad bigoted evil human pigs just saw a race of space aliens being peaceful and loving and minding their own business and just said "Wow, we should put them in camps haha wouldn't that be funny."

There were no invasions, no conquering, no murdering, no nothing. Just a bunch of peaceful non-human nomads trying to find a new life on a different planet.

[Varodoc]

No, you don't get it. The big bad bigoted evil human pigs just saw a race of space aliens being peaceful and loving and minding their own business and just said "Wow, we should put them in camps haha wouldn't that be funny."

There were no invasions, no conquering, no murdering, no nothing. Just a bunch of peaceful non-human nomads trying to find a new life on a different planet.

Draenei started the war so I don't see how the orcs deserved to be imprisoned or even worse exterminated when they were the victims.

[matrix123mko]

Not that Horde saved Azeroth multiple times. They totally weren't fighting Scourge, N'zoth, Legion and Venture Co.

[Yarathir]

Draenei started the war so I don't see how the orcs deserved to be imprisoned or even worse exterminated when they were the victims.

Ah yes, the victims as they razed human and elf lands alike.

[matrix123mko]

A bit too much heroism there. Realistically nations exist for themselves, not to protect the planet like they're Justice League. Protecting Azeroth is what we do when faced with an existential threat, otherwise we've been happy killing each other and seeking power. It's a weird narrative angle for new players.

Yes. Players defend the planet but the races just exist to exist.

[Azerate]

I can't believe people are getting angsty because someone decided to use the real definition of "whitewashing" and not some meme definition used by 3 people on tumblr and probably a dog somewhere.


The only one that is really offensive out of those lines is the Forsaken one, because though I despise the Blood Elves I can believe they would jump through series of mental gymnastics to make themselves out to be heroic, but forsaken have never made themselves as a people out to be anything but hostile to the living.

There is no 'real' definition. Language is a living entity that evolves with time and through usage. Words change meaning all the time. Failing to catch up can't be explained as using the "real" meaning.

"Bitch" used to primarily mean "female dog". Doesn't mean that's the main (or "real") meaning of this word today.

[Yarathir]

There is no 'real' definition. Language is a living entity that evolves with time and through usage. Words change meaning all the time. Failing to catch up can't be explained as using the "real" meaning.

"Bitch" used to primarily mean "female dog". Doesn't mean that's the main (or "real") meaning of this word today.

Moral whitewashing is still a term that exists. People have to stop having race on the mind constantly. A term can have multiple definitions that exist simultaneously, which you can interpret by context.

One definition of whitewashing doesn't supersede the other.

[omeomorfismo]

Not that Horde saved Azeroth multiple times. They totally weren't fighting Scourge, N'zoth, Legion and Venture Co.

and it could easily be for selfish reasons instead of "protect the livings" no sense

[Yarathir]

and it could easily be for selfish reasons instead of "protect the livings" no sense

"We wanted to be the top evil. Screw all those other minor villains."

[Trassk]

This is ridiculous, lol. While it's always been irritating how alliance fanboys have wanted to label the horde as straight up evil since complexity is lost on many of them, this what blizzards done is just straight up ignoring the nuance and complexities of each race in what really looks like a babified take on the races.
Think about the race intros of vanilla wow how it was more honest about them, highlighting their pros and cons.

And it just occurred to me, this is being done because it's easier for blizzard to draw in newbies, especially those from China, rather then adding complex race summaries.

Here let me have a go.


"For years, the forsaken, raised into undeath by necromantic magics, originally controlled by the lich king, then later lead by the maniacal sylvanas windrunner, before her betrayal of the horde. Now leaderless, the forsaken must find their own path in a world that fears them, carving out their own destiny"

[Manariel]

I don't know why I even bother. Alliance fans ALWAYS view the lore in their own way so that it makes the Alliance look better so I'm not even going to bother responding to you after this.

It's not my fault you are making up stories and cries fool when you're handed the lore.

[Dagoth Ur]

I see this only keeps getting worse and worse. It also hints at what kind of stories we'll be served in the future. Only thing I'm wondering now is who'll be Azeroth's Nick Fury?

Also, in retrospective, I must say I now appreciate much more how Garrosh had gone out. Rip warchief.

[Zephire]

I mean... everything change. It would not be plausable to describe the Forsaken such as:
"Previously bount to Arthas. Freed from his hold by Sylvanas. Did terrible things in the past such as x, y and z. Also did this and that while pretending to be something else. They thave since then moved forward to embrace a more heroic view of life/death. It is at this point in history your character enters the world."

Take a newborn IRL. It's someone who grow up in the current timeline, the now. Not the past. Their being will be transformed and shaped by the current political, social and wordly climate that currently happens. Sure, they can be inspired by the past but it's not even close to how much more the present will affect them.

It's not washing anything. It's presenting the current situation. When done with the starting area, the player can go out explore their factions history, no? The presentation is just the springboard for the general setting, the present setting. After that, your character can be whom ever you want (at least in your own imagination).

I see nothing wrong with this at all.

Also, change the title... "whitewashing" does not apply.