Don't collect tax at all !
Not even sales tax. This tax thing is confusing !
If the government needs money, just writes a check !
Don't collect tax at all !
Not even sales tax. This tax thing is confusing !
If the government needs money, just writes a check !
I feel like you almost make a better argument about status quo here, than about principle.
I think I understand the point you're trying to make, maybe I don't, but it seems that while the base of what the left fights for is always justice, what is considered worth fighting for changes as societal views change.
I never said the left would not be fighting for justice in 50 years, I said that what that justice looks like will be VERY different in 50 years, so much so that current left wing justice will be downright right wing in comparison. So different that former democrats might become republicans as they age, because they no longer understand liberalism anymore.Of course that would depend on the state of the republican party at said time as well.
Maybe, it could be very different. Every generation thinks that we're nearing a pinnacle in terms of understanding the world and then someone comes up with an entirely new idea that smashes everybody's prior assumptions.
"The left" is more about an equality principle though so the "progressives" in 5,000 years may not even care about financial equality as there could easily be a superior means of increasing everybody's quality of life even if financial equality is plummeting because some octillionaire is rapidly increasing the amount of planets they own.
Last edited by PC2; 2020-05-19 at 06:52 AM.
The rhetoric will change, but the paradigm will not. Even during what we call the dark ages, civilization actually had significant progress. You can’t stop progress, the best you can do is mitigate it.
That’s socialism..."The left" is more about an equality principle though so the "progressives" in 5,000 years may not even care about financial equality as there could easily be a superior means of increasing everybody's quality of life even if financial equality is plummeting because some octillionaire is rapidly increasing the amount of planets they own.
Folly and fakery have always been with us... but it has never before been as dangerous as it is now, never in history have we been able to afford it less. - Isaac Asimov
Every damn thing you do in this life, you pay for. - Edith Piaf
The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command. - Orwell
No amount of belief makes something a fact. - James Randi
"What justice looks like" doesn't change. Society is unjust. We may have addressed some injustices, the most glaring ones, but that does not mean we've reached the goal, by any means.
It's like if you start a charity to cure cancer, and your funding manages to find one treatment that has 30% efficacy on one particular type of cancer. And you don't think that's nearly enough. And yet, a lot of people are trying to tell you "hey, you developed one treatment! Why are you trying to find any more?" Because you haven't cured cancer. You haven't achieved the goal you set out to achieve. And you're going to keep working towards that goal, until you do.
The idea that a half-assed partial attempt is "good enough" and we should accept the remaining injustices in society is completely fucking baffling to people who actually stand on values and principle. No, we're not going to compromise our integrity and goals because other people lack such things.
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Left-wing views are fundamentally rooted in the concept of equity, not equality. They aren't similar concepts, even if they're spelled similarly.
Okay well tell that to the leftists who mainly only talk about equality rather than equity. Equity is more debate-able because what is fair and impartial is very hard to judge, where as you can't argue that a homeless person with zero wealth doesn't experience massive inequality compared to Jeff Bezos who has $100 billion in wealth.
Yeah I think it's impossible to stop progress over the long-term because it's guaranteed that if people don't make enough progress(new knowledge) then society will collapse and people would go extinct.
Pretty sure most of them are saying the same thing I'm saying.
Equality of opportunity and equality of treatment always gets misconstrued by right-wingers as if we're talking about equality of outcome, which nearly nobody is ever actually talking about.
Equality pretty much only ever gets introduced when equality is what brings about equity, in that particular context. The fundamental root goal is still always equity.
Not particularly, no. The concept of justice dates all the way back to Hammurabi, at a minimum. This isn't exactly a new idea.Equity is more debate-able because what is fair and impartial is very hard to judge
Maybe but I rarely ever hear the word equity where as I hear equality all the time. *shrug*
I don't think anyone is debating that here.
Yes but since justice relates to morality the important part is getting everyone to agree one the same interpretations and implementations of justice, which is obviously very difficult. Future people will probably understand justice in a much better way then we understand it right now and there's no way of knowing how they will interpret justice in the future.
Last edited by PC2; 2020-05-19 at 03:51 PM.
It was mostly meant as a joke, so don't take it too serious
Also yeah I am conservative, in my own country, where we run a surplus and a strict tax policy that always makes sure of that. So we have had conservative governments raise taxes, because we are more concerned about the reality of not going bankrupt as a country (because that already happened once), than boo hoo my paycheck doesn't afford me a Porsche.
So don't lop me in with your republicans, because frankly that's an insult to any other conservative in the world at this point.
Formerly Howeller, lost my account.