Shadowlands Druid - the least hybridy hybrid?

[Segus1992]

So in an expansion where Warriors get Shield Block, Spell Reflect, Ignore Pain, Challenging Shout, and Paladins get Shield of the Righteous, Word of Glory, Blessing of Sacrifice, Auras, etc - in order to allow many classes to be more effective at their off roles for fringe situations, you'd think Druids (the class that was nothing if not a hybrid originally) would get even more.

Instead, the baseline Druid has almost nothing more than what they have in BFA, with the buffs to affinities entirely about increased utility in your primary form rather than stronger hybrid capabilities.

Even then, you have to choose an affinity to even be close to the hybridness all Druids used to have with all forms, whereas other classes are getting close to what they had, and in some cases even more than what was originally there. A Druid in Bear Form with Guardian Affinity is comparable to a baseline Fury Warrior if tanking for short periods, has to spend a GCD to get into Bear Form, and has given up any other off-role capabilities to do so.

Heart of the Wild is a great addition, which allows you to become a stronger hybrid than any other for a good while - but only for your chosen affinity. You still don't have any other capabilities, and it has a very long CD.

Just seems strange to me that Shadowlands - the expansion where class design seems to be entirely about bringing back an earlier edition of the classes - doesn't do more to bring that feeling back for Druid.


At this point, giving all affinities baseline (the way they are in BFA, not with the CC abilities in SL) while maybe nerfing the passives a little, and making HotW work for any form rather than just your selected one, wouldn't do much to make Druids OP, but would bring the old hybrid feeling back strong.

[Mystikal]

So in an expansion where Warriors get Shield Block, Spell Reflect, Ignore Pain, Challenging Shout, and Paladins get Shield of the Righteous, Word of Glory, Blessing of Sacrifice, Auras, etc - in order to allow many classes to be more effective at their off roles for fringe situations, you'd think Druids (the class that was nothing if not a hybrid originally) would get even more.

Instead, the baseline Druid has almost nothing more than what they have in BFA, with the buffs to affinities entirely about increased utility in your primary form rather than stronger hybrid capabilities.

Even then, you have to choose an affinity to even be close to the hybridness all Druids used to have with all forms, whereas other classes are getting close to what they had, and in some cases even more than what was originally there. A Druid in Bear Form with Guardian Affinity is comparable to a baseline Fury Warrior if tanking for short periods, has to spend a GCD to get into Bear Form, and has given up any other off-role capabilities to do so.

Heart of the Wild is a great addition, which allows you to become a stronger hybrid than any other for a good while - but only for your chosen affinity. You still don't have any other capabilities, and it has a very long CD.

Just seems strange to me that Shadowlands - the expansion where class design seems to be entirely about bringing back an earlier edition of the classes - doesn't do more to bring that feeling back for Druid.


At this point, giving all affinities baseline (the way they are in BFA, not with the CC abilities in SL) while maybe nerfing the passives a little, and making HotW work for any form rather than just your selected one, wouldn't do much to make Druids OP, but would bring the old hybrid feeling back strong.

I agree with what you've said, and particularly with your last point - however, I get the sneaking suspicion that this will end up being a Druid legendary item and may become baseline after Shadowlands.

If it does come in the form of an item, I will 100% be going for it... but it does feel unfair that we have to talent into more hybridness (hybridity?) whereas other classes get it baseline.

[Razion]

Balance Druids particularly suffer from not being able to cast all the heals in form, and to a much less extent not having Tranquility because as a spell-caster they kind of feel like they should be able to contribute as an off-healer more than say Feral or Guardian which is currently pretty backwards at least as far as Feral Predatory Swiftness goes. Maybe if Owlkin Frenzy proc'd on damage and gave you free heals to throw out in form like Predatory Swiftness, it would solve some of that.

Also, Feral and Guardian aren't interchangeable anymore. With the specs split apart, you can no longer switch on the fly base-line and passively be a good tank or dps just by switching forms anymore. Doing some dps or some tanking isn't really comparable to the old Wrath days of having both near fully and being able to adapt so dynamically whenever for as long as you want. Even with HotW AND Affinities baseline, it probably still wouldn't be enough unless Feral and Guardian merged again and could do either as freely as before.

As Balance I'd gladly throw away what ability I'd have to do Feral or Guardian things if it meant I could do more Resto things, and I'd gladly throw away more Balance and Resto things as Feral and Guardian if it meant I could do Feral and Guardian together again. But maybe that's just me - I think the Affinity choice giving players the choice of HOW they want to be a Hybrid is probably more important than the tactile feel of how powerful the versatility of the specs were.

[FlubberPuddy]

At this point, giving all affinities baseline (the way they are in BFA, not with the CC abilities in SL) while maybe nerfing the passives a little, and making HotW work for any form rather than just your selected one, wouldn't do much to make Druids OP, but would bring the old hybrid feeling back strong.

Do you have data to support this claim? Or is it feelycraft?

[Elestia]

Alot of class homogenization got driven by Druid and other hybrid classes' lack of direct parity with classes actually designed and initially built for the game. This is an issue that exists entirely outside of HotW.

The point of HotW isn't to provide parity with a form outside of your spec. It's when you intentionally know or have frequent enough scenarios where being another form other than your spec's main form gains utility and performance. If there's no gain in performance then you have no business taking HotW.

If you're taking HotW so you can emergency tank the boss at 5% ONE TIME in the entirety of the expansion, then let me be the first one to tell you you're doing it wrong.

[Segus1992]

Do you have data to support this claim? Or is it feelycraft?

Are you asking if I have any data to support a hypothetical scenario that's never happened? Interesting question.

It'd be a PvP buff for sure, but seeing as PvE Druids never use their affinities as it is (the only exception being Resto using Feral to DPS - they wouldn't use Balance or Guardian outside of fringe situations even if they were free), it can't possibly make them OP there.