Another "I can't breath" death: Police Reform & Protests in the USA

[Machismo]

"It's not fascism, it's simply blessed authoritarian rule."

[Edge-]

3: Police jumping out of unmarked vehicles and detaining rioters and suspected rioters for questioning is legal. I know you like to call it kidnapping, but it really isn't.

It is, when a group of unknown, armed men jump out of an unmarked vehicle, grab you, and drag you in the unmarked vehicle without ever identifying themselves or stating why they are detaining you.

That people seem so eager to defend this as "legal" or any other reason is truly disturbing to me. Especially considering these people are being told that they must sign away their First Amendment right if they want to be released.

https://www.bellingcat.com/news/amer...e-of-portland/

This is a pretty good timeline of events and how the escalation was primarily coming from the federal authorities, and prior to that Portland police.



Look at this siege they laid on a defended federal building. A few small commercial fireworks like you see regularly lit off in neighborhoods across the country on July 4 (which...is the day the video was shot).

It is interesting that 99% of all of this is actions of city police. City police that (at least per their unions) are mostly democrats, in cities that have been under democrat super control for decades, and the problem is the feds? The problem is the GOP? The problem is Trump?

Portlanders have long hated their local police, who have a long history of excessive force, brutality, and abuse.

Citation on the city police being Democrats, though I'm not sure that's much of a defense. Being a Democrat doesn't mean you can't be a piece of shit.

Having a Democrat controlled city doesn't mean that the police don't wield tons of power, we have extensive reporting and long histories of departments threatening local officials who refuse to back funding. They will harass them and those in their districts, they will threaten to (or actually) refuse to respond to 911 calls in those areas, or intentionally delay their responses. It's the behavior of organized criminal organizations.

And in this instance, yes, the feds are a big part of the problem as they went into to escalate things unnecessarily. The problem is the GOP who have been shilling the "VIOLENT RIOTERS AND THIS IS THE GREATEST THREAT TO DEMOCRACY!" strawman lies. The problem is Trump, who ordered the feds be sent in and has repeatedly bragged/threatened to "liberate" cities, recently ordering more federal officers into other cities like Detroit despite the fact that there don't appear to be reports of any significant rioting or violence relating to the protests there.

Don't carry water for authoritarians.

[Saltysquidoon]

Just going to point out. Although I love laws as much as the next guy, when people are protesting against the government they are in effect protesting against laws they see as unjust. It would follow that simply saying well technically what the police are doing is legal isn't a defence it's the problem.

Also, I'm pretty sure the guy in charge of the bundling people into unmarked vans basically admitted what they were doing was dodgy.

[Masark]

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/police-...united-states/

It varies by state, but generally 2-6 months apparently.

Average is 843 hours.

More detailed information.

The first year of police education in Norway is focused on the role of police in society and ethics.

Whereas in the USA, they spend about 8 hours on ethics (table 6 on page 5).

[JohnBrown1917]

Well, good luck in your fight against this, ermmm, Gestapo. Just don't burn your own house down.
You said that USA is incapable of fighting the pandemic. I think that USA is incapable of far, far more than that. Like having a healthy dialog and not an overwhelming us vs them attitude in everything.
.

Yeah, i'm sure that is possible with the police beating the shit out of you. Is this also how you view the protestors in Hong Kong?

[wunksta]

Ramos was shot and killed after someone called 911 and requested that police come to an apartment complex because people in a car were either doing or making drugs. The 911 call also reveals that the caller reported that a man had a gun to a woman's head. Investigators did not find a gun on Ramos or a gun in the car after he was shot.

When police first arrived, Ramos stepped out of the car and put his hands up. Then, police shot him with a bean bag shotgun round. Ramos got back into a car and started to drive away from officers when Officer Christopher Taylor opened fire, killing him..

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime...ng/ar-BB17fimk

[Edge-]

Imagine being so fucking terrified of a black man standing with his arms up that you need to pre-emptively shoot him with a beanbag for no reason, and then straight up kill a person for simply fleeing.

All those cops should be in jail.

[Endus]

Imagine being so fucking terrified of a black man standing with his arms up that you need to pre-emptively shoot him with a beanbag for no reason, and then straight up kill a person for simply fleeing.

All those cops should be in jail.

They should be in prison for Murder in the 2nd Degree, 1st if subpoenas show any murderous sentiments in their text messaging with friends and colleagues and the like (it means they were planning on a killing, and waiting for a convenient victim).

Any officer who supported or defended their actions, at any level of seniority, should be summarily dismissed from their position, and barred from working in law enforcement anywhere.

Oh, and as you say, these cops shouldn't be walking free waiting for the DA. They should be in a cell, like anyone they'd arrest. And it shouldn't be taking a week or more to decide whether to charge these officers; it should've been a quick interview on a "explain your justification, and you'd better have hard, verifiable evidence or we're pressing charges" basis. The shooting was on Monday? Charges should've been filed on Tuesday, or the DA should've been able to announce that there was a clear justification to shoot, and explain that accordingly.

Sure, if the guy spins around while shouting "DIE, PIGS" and you see something black in his hand, your body camera will clear you, even if that's a cell phone and not a handgun. I'm not calling for all shootings to be criminal. But if you had not identified a weapon and the suspect was not hostile? You do not have fucking grounds to murder him, you jackbooted fuckstain. No, a phone call saying he's armed does not fucking count.

[Masark]

Track down the bastard who made that call too.

[Specialka]

Imagine being so fucking terrified of a black man standing with his arms up that you need to pre-emptively shoot him with a beanbag for no reason, and then straight up kill a person for simply fleeing.

All those cops should be in jail.

Obviously, they lack training and self control. I guess it depends on the US law, but in France, they did have the law for them in shooting a fleeing car if the car was not threatening someone. But I would like to remind people here that law enforcement is not easy, especially on a country where everyone can have a gun.

[Xyonai]

Obviously, they lack training and self control. I guess it depends on the US law, but in France, they did have the law for them in shooting a fleeing car if the car was not threatening someone. But I would like to remind people here that law enforcement is not easy, especially on a country where everyone can have a gun.

That doesn't really explain why they felt it necessary to shoot a clearly unarmed man who was complying with a bean bag round.

[Specialka]

That doesn't really explain why they felt it necessary to shoot a clearly unarmed man who was complying with a bean bag round.

Stress, and the fact that the guy was panicking, adding to their own panick. I guess the guy with the shotgun thought it was a good idea to shoot him to make him cooperate.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Stress, and the fact that the guy was panicking, adding to their own panick. I guess the guy with the shotgun thought it was a good idea to shoot him to make him cooperate.

That just sounds like some one who should have never have been a cop in the first place Being abusive, so a failing on all possible accounts.

[Specialka]

That just sounds like some one who should have never have been a cop in the first place Being abusive, so a failing on all possible accounts.

You clearly can see they lack control of the situation, it seems like no one is in charge. Imo, I would say that they did have enough training (which is kinda true if the duration of 2-6 months are true).

But I would not be as certain as you are as he should have not be a cop (because it is stupid to say so). Would you have fare better ?

[Mayhem]

Stress, and the fact that the guy was panicking, adding to their own panick. I guess the guy with the shotgun thought it was a good idea to shoot him to make him cooperate.

Don't panic on cops probably shooting you, because your panic might induce panic in them and then they'll shoot you.

Shoot him to make him cooperate. - Seriously, what the fuck?!

[Specialka]

Don't panic on cops probably shooting you, because your panic might induce panic in them and then they'll shoot you.

Shoot him to make him cooperate. - Seriously, what the fuck?!

Why do you think he shoot him then ? Do you a better explanation ?

[Santti]

Why do you think he shoot him then ? Do you a better explanation ?

Because US cops are trained to do that, and little else. It's not to make him cooperate. The cops perceive a threat, which is bullshit, and they respond by neutralizing said threat.

Nobody, anywhere, shoots someone for the purpose of making someone cooperate.

[Mayhem]

Why do you think he shoot him then ? Do you a better explanation ?

Not saying you're wrong, it's just fucking insane to even come up with such a reason.

[Xyonai]

Stress, and the fact that the guy was panicking, adding to their own panick. I guess the guy with the shotgun thought it was a good idea to shoot him to make him cooperate.

Someone needs to lay off the Devil's Advocate juice for a little while.

[Cizr]

That doesn't really explain why they felt it necessary to shoot a clearly unarmed man who was complying with a bean bag round.

They shot him because he was not complying. They literally said "you are going to get impacted if you dont listen" and he did not listen.