Another "I can't breath" death: Police Reform & Protests in the USA

[Endus]

Wisconsin law clearly states you may use lethal force in self defense if you're on fear of death of grievous bodily injury. That you linked to the law but don't understand his is your failing.

Rittenhouse was not in any way in danger of either at the time he shot Rosenbaum. Rosenbaum wasn't armed and hadn't even hurt him. Plus, every indication we have is that Rosenbaum is the one who was acting in defense, there, in trying to stop someone who was threatening lethal force against peaceful protesters.

He attempted to, he approached police with his arms raised.
He only walked past him when they ordered him away. You can hear it on the video are you deaf? He 'fled the state' because he went home, right on the other side of the state lines, he wasn't ordered to stay.

None of that is turning yourself in to the police. I have no idea where the hell you're even getting that.

[Bodakane]

So I'm clear Rittenhouse is innocent because.....

He was illegally armed, gloved to prevent fingerprints, underage, past curfew and with a white nationalist militia but was there to just 'keep the peace". He was then attacked even though he wasn't harmed, threatened or touched so he was justified in killing two people and almost a third and even tried to turn himself in even though he left the scene and state.

That's the argument you guys are going with? Fucking really?

[Belize]

So I'm clear Rittenhouse is innocent because.....

He was illegally armed, gloved to prevent fingerprints, underage, past curfew and with a white nationalist militia but was there to just 'keep the peace". He was then attacked even though he wasn't harmed, threatened or touched so he was justified in killing two people and almost a third and even tried to turn himself in even though he left the scene and state.

That's the argument you guys are going with? Fucking really?

No one even claimed that those defending white nationalist terrorism made sense.

[Themius]

I mean we know for a fact that the cops were thanking and aiding the white nationalist militia. But yeah, something, something, echo chamber...Sure thing...

We decided to not call them militias anymore.

Gangs, or terror cells... I'd say terror cells being the FBI has called these "militias" a major domestic terror threat and plus they seem to be killing hundreds each year.

[Aurrora]

While repeatedly lowering his arms to adjust his weapon.

And once the police went passed him, he made no apparent effort to turn himself in at the police station. If he did...he would have been in custody and giving his statement in Kenosha, not being arrested in Illinois for fleeing across state lines.

How can you even argue this?



You got sauce for the police ordering him away? Did they say to leave the area? The city? The state? Why would you leave the scene of a shooting and go to another state if you are not fleeing?

It's right here.
He makes contact with the police he was going for before being assaulted and they order him away. You can go pull up a google maps of Kenosha and see that it's right on the state border and his home is in Illinois. You idiots are trying to make this out like this was some grand escape attempt because he crossed a border that is mostly meaningless in the 21st century and that tens of thousands of people cross each day without even giving it a second thought.
[Infraction]

[Themius]

It's right here.
He makes contact with the police he was going for before being assaulted and they order him away. You can go pull up a google maps of Kenosha and see that it's right on the state border and his home is in Illinois. You idiots are trying to make this out like this was some grand escape attempt because he crossed a border that is mostly meaningless in the 21st century and that tens of thousands of people cross each day without even giving it a second thought.

they ordered the terrorist to move into a specific area and then incidentally pushed protesters towards that same area.

[Endus]

It's right here.
He makes contact with the police he was going for before being assaulted and they order him away. You can go pull up a google maps of Kenosha and see that it's right on the state border and his home is in Illinois. You idiots are trying to make this out like this was some grand escape attempt because he crossed a border that is mostly meaningless in the 21st century and that tens of thousands of people cross each day without even giving it a second thought.

That video shows him walking past the officers and does not show him even talking to them, let alone turning himself in.

Try checking your own sources before posting them.

[Easo]

I mean if you want to quote where I made or even implied that accusation then you'd have a point, but since I didn't;t, you don't.

Again, we know, for a fact, there were Kenosha police on the scene who thanked and aided the white nationalist militia. That fucking happened, so I'm not sure what your angle is, but it isn't acute.

Funny, but I am pretty sure none of those things cops did are illegal (aside from letting Rittenhouse pass at the end, but even that is under a lot of questions due to all the confusion). Plus from what I understand it was a single squad giving water/thanking, not the whole department. Looting and rioting is an actual problem, so this being USA gun nuts are out in the force. And that... is legal. Morally wrong, but absolutely legal (USA reaps what it sow). As evidenced by this thread, there is a lot of discussions about legality of Rittenhouse actions, so clearly we apply the law in all cases, yes?

My angle is pretty simple - look at the overall picture, dont generalise, be objective. Screaming about all cops being bad does nothing.

Back to screaming, then. And I will laugh if he goes free.

[Bodakane]

It's right here.
He makes contact with the police he was going for before being assaulted and they order him away. You can go pull up a google maps of Kenosha and see that it's right on the state border and his home is in Illinois. You idiots are trying to make this out like this was some grand escape attempt because he crossed a border that is mostly meaningless in the 21st century and that tens of thousands of people cross each day without even giving it a second thought.

What do you think leaving the crime scene means?

[Edge-]

It's right here.

"Get out of the way"?

That's your fuckin argument, one of the officers nebulously yelling at people, not specifically Rittenhouse to "Get out of the way" so their vehicles can get by is the cops telling him to leave?

Man, this is either one of the worst takes of all time and you're honestly confused as fuck, or this is a brazen lie that's really, really, really bad.

Again, why does he not turn himself in at a local station? Why does he make no apparent further attempt to make contact with police to provide a statement? He was a former cadet apparently, and he idolized the cops, so it's not as if he would be completely unfamiliar with the procedures in a situation like this, which is for police to take statements from everyone involved as a part of that investigation.

Instead, he fled the state.

He makes contact with the police he was going for before being assaulted and they order him away.

That video is after the shootings...

You can go pull up a google maps of Kenosha and see that it's right on the state border and his home is in Illinois. You idiots are trying to make this out like this was some grand escape attempt because he crossed a border that is mostly meaningless in the 21st century and that tens of thousands of people cross each day without even giving it a second thought.

Literally nobody is trying to make it out like that. We're pointing out that he factually, and knowingly, crossed state lines. You may not want that to matter because you see determined to defend his actions, but it matters.

If state borders were meaningless, they'd go away. But they have incredible meaning still, like it or not.

[Themius]

There are reports that Blake is handcuffed to his bed.. he wasn't charged with a crime why is he handcuffed at all? Also he's paralysed.

[Bodakane]

Funny, but I am pretty sure none of those things cops did are illegal (aside from letting Rittenhouse pass at the end, but even that is under a lot of questions due to all the confusion). Plus from what I understand it was a single squadd giving water/thanking, not the whole department. Looting and rioting is an actual problem, so this being USA gun nuts are out in the force. And that... is legal. Morally wrong, but absolutely legal (USA reaps what it sow). As evidenced by this thread, there is a lot of discussions about legality of Rittenhouse actions, so clearly we apply the law in all cases, yes?

My angle is pretty simple - look at the overall picture, dont generalise, be objective. Screaming about all cops being bad does nothing.

Back to screaming, then. And I will laugh if he goes free.

Are we speaking different languages?

I didn't;t say it was illegal, i didn't say the whole department.

You keep making up my argument while ingorning the things I'm actually saying.

I mean kudos for an ironclad way to win an argument, but...really?

[Aurrora]

Rittenhouse was not in any way in danger of either at the time he shot Rosenbaum. Rosenbaum wasn't armed and hadn't even hurt him. Plus, every indication we have is that Rosenbaum is the one who was acting in defense, there, in trying to stop someone who was threatening lethal force against peaceful protesters.



None of that is turning yourself in to the police. I have no idea where the hell you're even getting that.

Really? That's your defense? Rosenbaum wasn't attempting to attack him despite throwing something at him and then continuing to charge at him, and that even if he was maybe he was attacking in self defense at a fleeing person? Your bias is ridiculous. Rosenbaum was clearly seen earlier attempting to instigate fights.

[Edge-]

There are reports that Blake is handcuffed to his bed.. he wasn't charged with a crime why is he handcuffed at all? Also he's paralysed.

From the waste down. BUT YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT HE COULD BE DOING WITH HIS HANDS! HE COULD HANDWALK OUTTA THAT PLACE!

https://chicago.suntimes.com/2020/8/...-bed-handcuffs

[Endus]

Really? That's your defense? Rosenbaum wasn't attempting to attack him despite throwing something at him and then continuing to charge at him, and that even if he was maybe he was attacking in self defense at a fleeing person? Your bias is ridiculous. Rosenbaum was clearly seen earlier attempting to instigate fights.

Tossing something in someone's general direction, particularly when that something isn't remotely close to a weapon, yeah, that's not an "attack".

Nor is running at someone.

Those are simple facts. Try telling the cops you shot a guy because he ran towards you and missed you with a water balloon; that's the level of nonsense you're arguing.

And Rosenbaum was taunting armed militia dorks, while being unarmed. If you think he's the "instigator", there, you're the one being completely unreasonable. "Unarmed man is impolite to armed belligerents, clearly he's the problem." Come the fuck on.

Edit: For "grievous bodily harm", you need "if I don't immediately stop this guy, he's going to permanently disfigure/maim me" levels of violence. Just getting your ass beaten would not qualify. Even if that's what would've happened, which you have no way of knowing.

[Deus Mortis]

You got sauce for the police ordering him away?

Warning video contains graphic content.
https://banned.video/watch?id=5f461c12838dfb0597d10755
At the 4:39 time mark you hear the command of "get out of the road", at the 4:45 mark it looks like he tries going up to the window to the cop car but you hear muffled commands. Still does not excuse him from fleeing the state. He could of easily just called 911, saying "hey I shot someone" and then gone into a police precinct to turn himself in.

[draynay]

There are reports that Blake is handcuffed to his bed.. he wasn't charged with a crime why is he handcuffed at all? Also he's paralysed.

Bullet theft?

[Captain N]

Bullet theft?

Surviving a police shooting while black?

[Aurrora]

That video is after the shootings...

You just misread it, he was headed for the police and was assaulted while making his way to them, is that better for you?

The video is continuous and contains Kyle's attempt to make it to to law enforcement, the second attack and his defense, and him making contact with law enforcement. They first order him out of the way, then they order him out of the street, he goes to the side of the police cruiser still attempting to make contact and they order him away.

[Easo]

Are we speaking different languages?

I didn't;t say it was illegal, i didn't say the whole department.

You keep making up my argument while ingorning the things I'm actually saying.

I mean kudos for an ironclad way to win an argument, but...really?

Then what was YOUR angle? And it is hard to imply anything else when you said "Kenosha police". At least mention some, squad, few, whatever. Otherwise it sounds like you implicate the whole force of being chummy with militias. Which is perfectly legal, if dumb and morally questionable.