Is Shadowlands redeeming WoW for you after BFA?

[Fetus Rex]

No, Shadowlands are WoD tier content. No new race and no new class, just a bunch of black skins and flowers.

[Khallid]

Personally I absolutely hated BFA.

I don't think any game or movie has ever pissed me off so much. Now with Shadowlands there are new features that I do admit look nice but after BFA it feels... wrong to me.

Especially since everything in BFA felt as though was pushed through so we can get this expansion.
How do you guys think about Shadowlands?

Was it all worth it with all these spoilers?

BfA was pretty meh. I didn't hate it, but I avoided a lot of the main features like Island Expeditions, Warfronts and War Mode. So it felt like a watered-down expansion to me.

Azerite Gear was quite bad, but I don't really care that much. I kill bosses, they drop gear, my dps goes up, and then I kill more bosses. The specifics on the gear is just extra fuss. Same with corruptions. It annoyed me how random it was, but I can still just wear the best thing I got and do enough dps with it.

The only things I genuinely dislike about BfA are things that will remain in Shadowlands: GCDs on cooldowns and forced personal loot.

Shadowlands isn't even out yet so I can't really judge it. Some changes seem pretty good, especially since it seems they are finally going to tone down the RNG a bit (I'm a bit skeptical about it to be honest), but the big features seem to be Covenants and Torghast, and I'm not really hyped about them.

Since they say switching Covenants will be difficult and you get them pretty early on, that just means I get a few new abilities while I progress the questline. That's fine, but it doesn't sound like a gamechanger in any way, we used to get abilities by leveling up. I don't really care about the RP value of Covenants.

Torghast runs seem to be a bit too long so I'm worried it's going to be a massive time sink. Hard to say for sure. Most likely it will be fine early on and bore me out of repetition later. Procedurally generated maps don't really fix that issue.

[ClassicPeon]

For its time I suppose. Relative to actual success though it's just the most recent in a line of bad expansions.

Legion stood head and shoulders above everything since MoP with one exception, the simplification of too many dps specs.

Hopefully shadowlands will add some of that back.

[kaminaris]

Just want to add here, you joined that guild day after they killed Nzoth first time, then you killed it 4 weeks later. 26% percentile. How much did you pay to do it? Just as last time? Left the other guild because they couldn't do it I suppose?

Why do you come to this forum to lie about your "achievements" and to "prove it's easier in BfA" LMAO? You bought corruption. So as you could buy legendaries. Just proves how disingenuous you are. Like "so much effort do get powered up in Legion" while having to do that times 4 in 8.3, while being boosted to kill last boss

You do realize I joined a guild, killed nzoth while being in middle of pack of DPS with alt (that became my main) I started gearing up like 3-4 weeks ago from almost zero?
While having like 20 wipes on it and doing pretty good.

Your pathetic personal attack attempts has turned against you. I left guild because of overwhelming toxic atmosphere that turned unbearable.

And no, you couldn't buy legiondaries, it was too late and everyone had everything already when vendor came in. It was shit system that blizzard apologized.

[Wheeler]

Who the fuck wasn't satisfied with Legion?

Compared to BFA I was more than satisfied with it, but it did introduce many of the issues that continued into BFA. Namely - Daily, timegated grinds that people are starting to get real sick of now.

And forgetting the Legion legendary launch disaster is a travesty. That was a top 5 all-time development disaster for Blizzard.

As it pertains to Shadowlands? I've been duped plenty of times by Blizzard. Outright lied to ("Item level will matter" in 8.1, then Benthic introduced in 8.2, where they doubled down on that with their promises for 8.3, where Corruption was introduced and WQ drops were BiS). RNG gearing out the wazoo, RNG outta caches, RNG RNG RNG. They need to prove to me they can design loot before I'll ever believe they can make this game a fraction of what it once was.

[kaminaris]

Not at all. Not even close to how the complaints are in BfA. And no, BfA will not be praised at all lol. The complaints in legion was mostly about ONE thing, and that wasn't really complained about after 7.1.5/7.2. Did you forget? How many power ups are people complaining about even at this time?

Yes, forums were filled with shitstorms, biggest I have ever seen, about legendaries, camera changes, burnouts etc.
It was hated.

No rng in Azerite gear. The vendor wants a word with you. Or wait 24 weeks for getting all 3 bis pieces.

Or get 2-3 static pieces from raid and static piece from vendor after 4-6 weeks done. No rng quick gearing.

Pretty confident that most people like Legion more than BfA yeah. I would strongly expect it to be 80 to 20 ration. At least.

Pretty confident that people hate legion otherwise shadowlands would be more like it and less like BfA. Turns out blizzard goes into opposite direction.

Strange, I did that from 7.1.5 since there was only AP to grind up, and the made sure that only the first points after added concordance and the RNGrucible were done within a week. Every point after that didn't matter. You know each point in the neck increase your dps with 0.5% right? Concordance 0.1% at max.

Bullshit, concordance was not the only thing that raise up with AP. It was also your HP which was far more valuable than fraction of power. You also grinded that stupid trinket. And lets not forget about RNG trinket from argus.

While in BfA I have not gotten my bis corruption yet and not gotten the bis Azerite Armor yet because the system is so full of flaws. Get it easy in raids? Give me a break.

3 weeks from zero to Nzoth capable alt to main transition. And that includes gear, corruptions, azerite, trinkets, weapon. And with minimal engagement playing 3-5h a week.

Legion in 3 weeks i wouldn't even have decent legiondaries, tier sets, arcanocrystal, relics etc. It would take me at least 2 months.

[leggomydairy]

If feels like an apology after this mess of an expansion and maybe even a bit of Legion before it too. It feels like a lot of classes are reverting back to older designs, like monks returning to their original MOP design.

But the lore.....

I don’t think exploring the afterlife is a cool concept, that’s one of those things that’s better left alone. If we explore every nook and cranny, every inch of this universe, there’s nothing left to cause wonder or curiosity, and it cheapens the feel of a lot of events.
If anything, I’ve been just along for the ride as it were. I don’t enjoy the ride, but I’ve been on it for over 10 years so I guess I’m not getting off anytime soon.

I hope they can fix a lot of their mistakes....but I doubt it will happen.

It isn’t redeeming it for me, not yet. I’ll wait to see, but I’m not optimistic.

[Doffen]

3 weeks from zero to Nzoth capable alt to main transition. And that includes gear, corruptions, azerite, trinkets, weapon. And with minimal engagement playing 3-5h a week.

So we are talking about BfA after the vendors got in place right. Same time in Legion it took 1-2 weeks to be ready for an alt to main because you already had all leggos on main, you could buy the legendaries you needed on your alt within 1-2 reset with titan essence that you could target legendary of your liking, while also having other chars that could send you class spesific legendaries. But legendaries only did 10-15% of your power. The weapon did the rest and you got that just by dinging 110 almost. And corruption have far more RNG(until vendor, 2.5 months in Antorus, 4 months in BfA) than legendaries had and have a much larger impact on throughput(except for healers, poor people left out in 8.3) than Legendaries had. Why can't you see that? Go to warcraftlogs and check for yourself. That's why rental power in Legion was both better and faster to catch up, much much faster.

Legion in 3 weeks i wouldn't even have decent legiondaries, tier sets, arcanocrystal, relics etc. It would take me at least 2 months.

Yeah, it took even less than 3 weeks seeing you got most power up 1 hour after you leveled to 110 because of the awesome catch up mechanic on the weapon. Getting tier was faster than bis azerite armor, fact seeing tier came from raid only. No other source where you got better gear like the Azerite Armor vendor.

You have already said you almost didn't play half of Legion so how you could possibly know how it was. What you just wrote is flat out wrong.

Bullshit, concordance was not the only thing that raise up with AP. It was also your HP which was far more valuable than fraction of power. You also grinded that stupid trinket. And lets not forget about RNG trinket from argus.

That you try to get trinkets into this LOL. So like since vanilla? Like in BfA? I still use Razor from EP in 430 because its so good and I don't get it in 445. But again, dragging trinkets into this. And HP? Just like Heart of Azeroth does? So it's the same as the weapon, just that HoA increase dps even more because of twilight devastation and pure upgrades on your traits? Do you see that your logic is full of flaws? Do you understand that everything with borrowed power in BfA is enhanced further than the borrowed power in Legion did? Being blinded by playing a favorable spec of your liking is one thing, being in complete denial over simple, obvious things is even worse.

[Tetley]

Shadowlands isn't even out yet!

Yes, it looks promising with the let 'loot be loot' philosophy they are going with. In BfA I waited about three months before I subscribed again and will probably do the same again. The smaller X.5 patches often seem to contain a lot of stuff that was missing when the expansion launched.

[kaminaris]

So we are talking about BfA after the vendors got in place right. Same time in Legion it took 1-2 weeks to be ready for an alt to main because you already had all leggos on main, you could buy the legendaries you needed on your alt within 1-2 reset with titan essence that you could target legendary of your liking, while also having other chars that could send you class spesific legendaries. But legendaries only did 10-15% of your power. The weapon did the rest and you got that just by dinging 110 almost. And corruption have far more RNG(until vendor, 2.5 months in Antorus, 4 months in BfA) than legendaries had and have a much larger impact on throughput(except for healers, poor people left out in 8.3) than Legendaries had. Why can't you see that? Go to warcraftlogs and check for yourself. That's why rental power in Legion was both better and faster to catch up, much much faster.


Yeah, it took even less than 3 weeks seeing you got most power up 1 hour after you leveled to 110 because of the awesome catch up mechanic on the weapon. Getting tier was faster than bis azerite armor, fact seeing tier came from raid only. No other source where you got better gear like the Azerite Armor vendor.

You have already said you almost didn't play half of Legion so how you could possibly know how it was. What you just wrote is flat out wrong.


That you try to get trinkets into this LOL. So like since vanilla? Like in BfA? I still use Razor from EP in 430 because its so good and I don't get it in 445. But again, dragging trinkets into this. And HP? Just like Heart of Azeroth does? So it's the same as the weapon, just that HoA increase dps even more because of twilight devastation and pure upgrades on your traits? Do you see that your logic is full of flaws? Do you understand that everything with borrowed power in BfA is enhanced further than the borrowed power in Legion did? Being blinded by playing a favorable spec of your liking is one thing, being in complete denial over simple, obvious things is even worse.

In legion we waited entire expansion to get vendors. It was too late.

And no In Legion you had to farm for 1-2 months with tons of more effort to be able to "be in the middle of pack".

[Boricha]

I won't say until I've play tested it. My feelings right now are that it looks like improvements to BFA, but also introducing new concerns.

[Rotted]

It is indeed, I'd come back just for the story in SL compared to BFA.

That being said, if we a carbon copy of cataclysm down to the last grey item, that would be enough to entice me back after BFA

[valax]

doesn't seem so , haven't seen any good changes to gameplay honestly . If classes suck the game sucks , rental powers won't cut it.

[CaptainV]

Dun really see shadowlands redeeming wow at this point, after cata, wod and bfa, the damage is done, irreprably so.

Theres really no point in trying to believe shadowlands will be some amazing legion 2.0 because I sincerely doubt it, at best, it'll be more like MoP 2.0, decent, but nothing special.

At worst, it'll be BFA 2.0 and make the game even worse...

Despite this pessimistic tone im not saying wow is going to die or anything but rather, the golden days? Yeah they went long ago, and I cant see Shadowlands redeeming it.

[DemonDays]

Personally I absolutely hated BFA.

I don't think any game or movie has ever pissed me off so much. Now with Shadowlands there are new features that I do admit look nice but after BFA it feels... wrong to me.

Especially since everything in BFA felt as though was pushed through so we can get this expansion.
How do you guys think about Shadowlands?

Was it all worth it with all these spoilers?

It's hilarious that Shadowlands main selling points is that it's "NOT BFA".

All this whole expansion looks like to me is them trying to walk back on all the horrible design choices they've forced down our throats for 4 years straight. But you just know they'll never move away from their Vision(tm) for the game. So things like Covenants and Class Design will probably ruin this expansion anyway.

[Amarys]

Even yours is wrong. Cata was actually decent. MoP is one of if not thee most missed expansion ever for a vast amount of the community and players strictly because of the patch staging (which was great as a timeline) and the class design that many consider the peak of it. Cata would be categorized as mixed at the worst and for Mop it would be mixed on both sides but missed by many players for how amazing the gameplay systems and class designs were.

Nah, like I said, players have forgotten and forgiven Cata. I guess partly because it was so long ago and because of nostalgia too. When it was live though, it was almost as hated as BfA is now. Players complained about heroics being too hard. Disconnected zones, the world revamp and a number of other things.

As for MoP, it caused a massive amount of players to quit. From 10 million or so at the start to less than 7 at the end.

[Dug]

Long as alts and catch ups aren't as much of a slog as BfA it will be way better in my eyes.

[Sorrowseer]

I'm taking a nice long break before Shadowlands to get BFA out of my mouth.

[dagonar]

I don't know what the hell is wrong with blizzard, it just changes the game so that there are blacks and Chinese, surely the next thing will be gypsies, transvestites and gays ... blizzard is starting to disgust me but seriously ... this is a game there is no reason to reflect the races of reality or sexual orientations, especially those anomalous and indecent, the product of a dark vice ...and a mental imbalance

This needs calling out. It is horrendously offensive to people of colour and non-binary genders. This is nothing to do with the game, and honestly, it is a positive if Blizzard develop WoW to add diversity to the character customisations.

[ClassicPeon]

SNIP

You are in the nimority if you like bfa more then Legion. Several polls have already been made on that subject.

The passive damage from azerite, essences and corruption makes player skill less important among many other factors. This expansion is on par, if not even more hated then WoD.