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  1. #381
    Quote Originally Posted by CostinR View Post
    Which has been going on for almost two decades and has been widely known in political and national security circles in numerous countries, because might I remind you that America isn't the only one that has troops on the ground in Afghanistan?



    Acting as if you give a damn instead of just being the latest hot story to attack Trump. If people like you actually cared you wouldn't have allowed your troops, and the troops of many of your allies, to die in a pointless stupid war financed by hostile foreign powers for two decades.
    Russia has been pushing bounties on American soldiers for two decades? Surely you can back up such a narrative.

    Oh, I do give a damn, because I served in the Marines, and I tend to care about such things. We all know Trump's sycophants won't care. It's been well established that Trump could rape a kid on live television, and his supporters would try and justify it.

    Remember the shit storm that was Benghazi, and American personnel getting screwed over? This is worse, by a lot... again.

  2. #382
    Herald of the Titans CostinR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zaydin View Post
    The obvious rebuttal is: What authority does Adam Schiff have over the military? He's a Congressman while Trump is supposed to be the Commander in Chief of the US military and the one charged with taking care of our soldiers. Trump is supposed to be the one our generals and intelligence agencies report to and get orders from.
    Congress has gotten very good at pretending they aren't accountable for foreign policy decisions haven't they? All the disasters over the last two decades: it wasn't their fault surely.

    That's the myth, the reality is: Yes The President is the Commander in Chief, but Congress is the one that holds the purse strings and has an enormous amount of power in terms of crafting foreign policy, and they use that.
    "Life is one long series of problems to solve. The more you solve, the better a man you become.... Tribulations spawn in life and over and over again we must stand our ground and face them."

  3. #383
    Quote Originally Posted by CostinR View Post
    Adam Schiff is part of the gang of eight: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gang_o...(intelligence)

    The gist of it: He, Nunes, Pelosi, McCarthy, Rubio, Warner, Schumer and McConnell are a privileged group that should know this stuff.

    Because in theory the members of the gang of eight should be just as informed as Trump and Pence are about highly sensitive intelligence matters, like this. In practice....well if there's any highly sensitive matter like this and Congress wants to pretend they didn't know they are either lying or the executive branch didn't bother to tell them.
    If he ignored it, then it's very likely they were never informed.

    Once again, Trump is the weak link in that chain.

  4. #384
    Quote Originally Posted by CostinR View Post
    Which has been going on for almost two decades and has been widely known in political and national security circles in numerous countries, because might I remind you that America isn't the only one that has troops on the ground in Afghanistan?
    You got any citation that for the last 20 years Russia has been paying Terrorists bounties for the scalps of American troops or is this Trumpkin truth where your feelings are more important then truth and facts.

    Acting as if you give a damn instead of just being the latest hot story to attack Trump. If people like you actually cared you wouldn't have allowed your troops, and the troops of many of your allies, to die in a pointless stupid war financed by hostile foreign powers for two decades.
    Democrats aren't the ones who use the American flag and troops like fucking props to show how they are so uber patriotic yet handwave it away and call it fake news when a hostile foreign power puts out bounties for the scalps of American troops.

  5. #385
    Quote Originally Posted by Bryntrollian View Post
    Damn, and how many US troops have lost their lives as a result of this?
    21 are dead, some are believe to have been linked, being that money moved from a GRU account to the Taliban, and price was up to 100k.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Jettisawn View Post
    Hurray More US Soldiers can die in Afghanistan and we can waste Trillions more dollars.

    https://theintercept.com/2020/07/02/...n-and-germany/





    Oh wait I need to list other sources that basically say the EXACT SAME THING.

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...al/ar-BB16eq96

    https://www.stamfordadvocate.com/new...o-15381104.php

    What are we at 9 Trillion dollars spending now on these wars, 100,000s civilian lives, many soldiers have lost their lives, 10,000s troops were wounded, countless more troops who will have to deal with PTSD for the rest of their lives. Yupe, we better just stay there, maybe we can make Afghanistan a US State. I mean we are spending more to rebuild their infrastructure then we are places like Flint, Michigan.
    I am of two minds.

    WE can't simply leave after fucking up the country and destabilising the reason. We also can't just stay there for fuckign ever, at some point we have to cut our losses.

    Right now... what are we doing? We're negotiating with terrorists... at this point we have lost. What is the point of negotiating with literal terrorist, the fact that was even an option means we should simply have left if you're going to be okay with letting the fucking terrorist be in charge.

  6. #386
    Quote Originally Posted by Themius View Post
    Right now... what are we doing? We're negotiating with terrorists... at this point we have lost. What is the point of negotiating with literal terrorist, the fact that was even an option means we should simply have left if you're going to be okay with letting the fucking terrorist be in charge.
    Maybe you can try staying in countries that actually want you to be there... you know, like the ones afraid of Scary Russians, rather then the ones where people see hunting you for money as perfectly acceptable.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Themius View Post
    21 are dead, some are believe to have been linked, being that money moved from a GRU account to the Taliban, and price was up to 100k.
    Given how much US spends on their military, it is probably even cost-effective as far as damage to US is concerned.

    That would be just 800 millions to kill entire Congress-mandated minimum US presence there.

  7. #387
    Banned Yadryonych's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jettisawn View Post
    Hurray More US Soldiers can die in Afghanistan and we can waste Trillions more dollars.
    And thus corrupt media's piece of fake news has already paid off and keeps on giving. They can both keep their military contractors on payroll and badmouth trump until november and all this just for a price of few articles

  8. #388
    You people defending this are disgusting.
    World needs more Goblin Warriors https://i.imgur.com/WKs8aJA.jpg

  9. #389
    Quote Originally Posted by Yadryonych View Post
    And thus corrupt media's piece of fake news has already paid off and keeps on giving. They can both keep their military contractors on payroll and badmouth trump until november and all this just for a price of few articles
    Again not fake news because our Intelligence agencies and other countries have verified this. Sorry I know you Trumpsters love to plug your years and scream "I CAN'T HEAR YOU!" when you hear things you don't like but reality doesn't care about your feelings buttercup.

  10. #390
    The Undying
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yadryonych View Post
    And thus corrupt media's piece of fake news has already paid off and keeps on giving. They can both keep their military contractors on payroll and badmouth trump until november and all this just for a price of few articles
    NATO is fake news? Wow - you all are just chuggin' that kool-aid, eyes closed, eh?

    The bounty story is fact - it happened. You two either get a room or get back to reality, because your shrilling doesn't do any good.

  11. #391
    https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2020/...-add-up-a70772

    Quote Originally Posted by Moscow Times
    The ‘Talibangate’ Claims About Russian Bounties Still Don’t Add Up

    A story that raises serious probability questions is being accepted by many as proven.
    By Mark Galeotti

    What to make of the current claims that Russia paid the Taliban bounties to kill U.S. and allied soldiers in Afghanistan? Both Moscow and the Taliban deny it, while claims of new evidence surface. It is still hard to understand any reason for the Kremlin to take such a dangerous step, though — and a possible alternative explanation for what evidence has been presented.

    The original claim was that early in 2019, the Kremlin began offering the Taliban and possibly other insurgent groups bounties to target allied forces. It came, though, from unnamed “U.S. intelligence sources” speaking to The New York Times. Since then there have been further claims about money found in Taliban headquarters and the role of a shadowy Afghan hawala-broker — an informal money-mover — in the alleged transfers, as well as the involvement of Unit 29155 of the GRU (military intelligence). However, as of this writing, there has been no formal confirmation of the story.

    The story was quickly mobilized to attack Donald Trump for his alleged indifference to the deaths of American soldiers. After all, in current U.S. political circles it often seems that talking about “Russia” is really shorthand for talking about the current White House. This has just been the latest in a string of leaked stories eagerly — and often uncritically — run by U.S. media outlets which make no secret of their distaste for the current president.

    An extraordinary tale

    It is very hard to know what to make of this allegation. The Kremlin is not averse to playing geopolitics hard. New evidence has emerged recently linking the FSB to murders in Germany and Turkey, and the GRU has been connected to “wet work” in the U.K., Ukraine and beyond.

    Yet their targets tend to be “traitors,” from Chechen rebels to defectors, rather that outsiders. Indeed, they appear well aware of the risks in killing others, especially Americans. In Syria, for example, they sat back and meekly allowed U.S. forces to kill hundreds of Russians from the Wagner Group mercenary force.

    To target Americans would seem to be a major escalation, inviting retaliation — and despite the claims that Trump is “Putin’s puppet,” U.S. policy towards Russia is already tougher than at any point since 1991, largely because it is in the hands of Congress. Were Moscow to take this step — and it is worth noting that the recent allegations about a Russian plot to assassinate Czech politicians, another seeming escalation of Kremlin “active measures,” turned out to be a hoax – this would presumably only be for the best of reasons.

    --
    news
    ‘100% Bullsh*t’: Russia Blasts Reports of Taliban Bounties for Killed U.S. Troops
    --

    And those reasons would be? That’s rather trickier to say, except for the ultra-hawks who believe, evidence notwithstanding, that hurting Americans is an end in itself for Putin and his circle, or that everything is a provocation intended to make Washington look weak because it cannot stop them.

    Admittedly, the USA did much the same to the Soviets during their ten-year occupation of Afghanistan 1979-88, but there is no reason to believe that war has any particular relevance to Putin — he has scarcely mentioned it, and in 2004 called it a “hopeless war” — let alone that it could trigger such a murderous adventure.

    Today, Afghanistan matters to Moscow especially as a source of potential instability. The irony is that some have suggested that killing more American soldiers was intended to accelerate their withdrawal from the country — and some that it would make it harder for them to strike a deal with the Taliban, and thus keep them there longer. Either way, it is hard to see how a few more deaths, however tragic, would alter policy.

    A similarly implausible suggestion is that it is revenge for the deaths of those Wagner mercenaries in 2018. Yet the Russian military command cell in Damascus had done nothing to prevent the U.S. forces from destroying them, nor even warned them. Nor was there any real sign of serious dismay back in Moscow.

    An alternative explanation

    The Kremlin or the GRU can hardly have put their faith in the discretion of a random collection of Afghan militants, drug barons and warlords for the operational security of such a mission: it would have taken epic over-confidence to think that news of bounties on Americans’ heads would not have leaked, and leaked soon.

    Moscow had greeted the U.S.-Taliban agreement paving the way for a withdrawal of American forces with satisfaction. They were happy to see Washington draw down its commitments across the Middle East, not least as it gives the Russians a chance to play a more substantial role on the cheap.

    The Russians need to limit and monitor the Afghan heroin trade (Russia has the highest per-capita consumption in the world). They are also desperate to prevent Afghanistan from becoming a source of transnational jihadism spreading into Central Asia and thence Russia.

    To this end, they have identified Islamic State, and specifically its resurgent local branch, Islamic State-Khorasan (IS-K), as the main threat. They maintain relationships with the Taliban especially because they see them as a useful counter to IS-K, and seek to develop networks of other allies across the country for both military and intelligence-gathering reasons.

    ---
    news
    Bank Transfers Bolstered U.S. Suspicions of Russia-Taliban Bounty – NYT
    ---

    These hard-nosed Afghan warlords do not cooperate with Moscow out of altruism or good-neighborliness. In today’s Afghanistan — just as the British and the Russians found during the “Great Game” of the nineteenth century — alliances are bought with blood, arms, and cash. Certainly, the U.S. has not shied away from such pragmatic behavior.

    The Russians are already supplying the Taliban weapons. Let’s suppose they have a wider program to establish networks of contacts and proxies in-country, one that involves direct payments as well as the involvement of a hawala-broker. If sending a suitcase of dollars to a warlord in the hills around Kandahar, for example, they will want to make sure it gets to its destination. This sounds like a job for the tough throat-slitters of Unit 29155.

    (Besides, the Taliban’s involvement in the opium trade means it is, to quote The New York Times, “awash with cash” — finding large sums in one of their headquarters is hardly a surprise.)

    Is this actually what was happening? I have no idea. The point is, rather, that a narrative that seems to stretch probability to breaking point, and which may have emerged from very tainted sources, is being accepted as proven, when there are all kinds of alternative possibilities.

    This story appears to have originated from Kabul, likely from interrogations carried out by the Afghan security forces. They have been implicated in systematic abuses — and under torture anyone will say anything. With the U.S. National Security Agency having said that it had no evidence supporting the bounty story, we still have no corroboration yet that this is a story based on more than conjecture and coercion.

    Of course, it could be absolutely true, and the hard evidence and on-the-record confirmation may be just around the corner. At present, though, it is worth being cautious about assuming the absolute worse and that Moscow has dramatically changed its rules of engagement.

    The views expressed in opinion pieces do not necessarily reflect the position of The Moscow Times.

    Prof. Mark Galeotti is a senior associate fellow at the Royal United Services Institute and a Honorary Professor at the UCL School of Slavonic & East European Studies. He is the author of “We Need To Talk About Putin.”

  12. #392
    Pandaren Monk wunksta's Avatar
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    So his alternative explanation is that Putin is trying to money and weapons to the Taliban to stop heroin from going into Russia?

  13. #393
    Quote Originally Posted by wunksta View Post
    So his alternative explanation is that Putin is trying to money and weapons to the Taliban to stop heroin from going into Russia?
    Well, you cannot deny that Afghan's drug trade is a concern for Russia.

    And Taliban is enemy of IS, so there is that too.

  14. #394
    Quote Originally Posted by Shalcker View Post
    Well, you cannot deny that Afghan's drug trade is a concern for Russia.

    And Taliban is enemy of IS, so there is that too.
    It would be really naive to think that Taliban would not send drugs into Russia on the first chance they get. Are they more reasonable than IS? Sure. Are they someone you should make deals with? Well...
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    Take that haters.
    IF IM STUPID, so is Donald Trump.

  15. #395
    Legendary! Ihavewaffles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Yet you'd think that even if it wasn't fully corroborated, that they'd want to take precautions out of an abundance of caution to protect US troops in the region while they continue to work on verifying or discrediting the information, no?



    Russian mercenaries*

    Which was the result of ongoing Syrian aggression supported by said Russian mercenaries.

    https://www.politico.com/news/2020/0...r-trump-345584

    All while Russia continues to inch closer to US troops, further stoking tensions.

    Still doesn't change the fact that Trump and his administration have repeatedly lied about this from day 1.
    Syrian "aggression" against the invading occupying force, the US? Did you just write that? You are shameless American..

    And those "mercenaries" is just as fake news as this thread's subject, last time anyone paid islamists in Afghanistan, was in the 80s by USA.

    Taliban shoot at US troops for free, why should Russia throw away money for something already being done?

  16. #396
    Wooooooow. He just keeps tripping over the bar so he keeps lowering it.

    Also, thing #2,143,626 that he's done that would've been a BIG PROBLEM with his fan club if Obama had done it.
    "We must make our choice. We may have democracy, or we may have wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both."
    -Louis Brandeis

  17. #397
    Legendary! Ihavewaffles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Easo View Post
    Order Intel/AMD to cut them off, order Microsoft to do it, Oracle, etc. That is just the start, there are more things that can be done. Oh, do this - give shit to Taiwan to pressure TSMC to cut off waffers for Elbrus CPU's. There goes literally the only option Russia has for making their CPU's. New fab, locally? Decade minimum, likely much more.
    It may be surprise to you but there are spheres Russia has no local replacements. No, not even China will be able to help them.
    Ah, the famous US response, help others replace US influence in the long term

  18. #398
    Void Lord Felya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ihavewaffles View Post
    Taliban shoot at US troops for free, why should Russia throw away money for something already being done?
    To make America look incompetent and sow turmoil within the US, because Trump was trying to have a peace treaty with Taliban, instead of the Afghan government.
    Folly and fakery have always been with us... but it has never before been as dangerous as it is now, never in history have we been able to afford it less. - Isaac Asimov
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  19. #399
    Legendary! Ihavewaffles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Felya View Post
    To make America look incompetent and sow turmoil within the US, because Trump was trying to have a peace treaty with Taliban, instead of the Afghan government.
    You have managed to do that for 19 years in afghanistan all on your own lol

  20. #400
    Quote Originally Posted by Ihavewaffles View Post
    Ah, the famous US response, help others replace US influence in the long term
    Russia cannot replace things it cannot make. And it cannot make a lot. Your fantasy land where it can is not real.
    There are no others which can replace USA in certain spheres without long term investment of shitload of money and manpower.

    P.S.
    Wagner suffered losses in Syria when they were bombed to shit in that infamous failed attack. You are denying that? Really? xD
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    Take that haters.
    IF IM STUPID, so is Donald Trump.

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