A time skip in 10.0 would make Tinkers possible.

[Triceron]

That alongside the death of his son explains Genn's rage. However, he isn't indicative of the entire Worgen race, who despises their curse and seeks a way to cure themselves of it.

We're talking about giving a visual transmog to them. They can already use claws in unarmed combat. Any time they go into combat they already embrace their curse, and none have sought any cure or even gotten to a point where they could become Monks. A class skin that allows transmogs for unarmed attacks would make sense, given that Genn is their racial leader and the Worgen follow his lead fairly closely. It's not like every other Worgen isn't filled with personal trauma and need for vengeance either; like I said Sylvanas just took away their refuge and place of meditation this expansion. That changes things for ALL Worgen.

Again, they wouldn't do that because it would cause a power creep within professions and force players to learn them. Blizzard wants professions to be optional.

Healing Spray could be optional.

Which is a straw man. The argument was about the Alchemist hero's abilities.

And there is no Alchemist hero to represent such abilities. You're arbitrarily attaching them to the Tinker, who uses a completely different theme. For things that are related to technology like Healing Spray (adapted to a gun) or Acid Bomb (literally make a bomb out of it) then yeah. But Chemical Rage and Transmute have nothing to do with technology or the Tinker's theme.

So you're saying that a Tinker creating a beam that transmutes targets wouldn't be an example of technology?

Yeah, because Tinkers are not known for using Alchemy. Transmutation of Flesh to Gold is well established in pop culture as an alchemical process, the entire theme is sourced back to Alchemy.

I mean really, you could stretch to say Tinkers could create a technological totem that summons Fire Elementals too, but it's not within the Tinker theme to do so.

[Teriz]

And I'll repeat what I said before:

And your question is a complete red-herring that does not prove your original claim in any way, shape or form even if answered in the positive.

My original claim is that following basic logic, a Tinker class would follow the same formula as the previous three expansion classes. So far, your only counter is "nu uh".

Thank you. You did exactly what I expected you to do: you completely argued yourself into a corner, because now you're holding two diametrically opposing views. So, Teriz, which is it? Does the way things used to be in the past matter and are still 'canon' today... or do they not? Because Death Pact is not a blood ability today, just like today we don't need trainers to learn new abilities.

I'm sure you believe that, but that isn't the case. Pointing out that when Blizzard first brought the class into the game from WC3 is valid because it shows the origins of the design. Over time, Blizzard shuffled Death Pact around and in a few expansions removed it entirely. However, that doesn't change the origins of the ability, and how it worked to develop the Blood Spec.

I think it's beyond obvious, to anyone with more than two brain cells, that the camera is above the character.

If it was above the character, you wouldn't be able to see the entire back of the character.

Gameplay is not lore. That is a fact. And every single occurrence of characters learning abilities without going to a trainer are simply gameplay concessions to smooth out gameplay. Not to mention there isn't a single lore mention about characters "learning things" out of nowhere.

Gameplay reflects lore. That is a fact.

No. No, it's not. Again: game mechanics are not lore. For example: assuming a blood elf priest character, and a very low-ball estimate that 1 in-game iron bar = 1 kg, it means a full stack of 200 means 200 kg. That means, having the biggest bags in the game, all completely full of full stacks of iron bars, our character would be carrying 30.800 kilos, or little over 30 tons. Carrying 30 tons of weight... effortlessly. Because our character can still run non-stop from Silvermoon to Booty Bay without getting tired. Because our character can swim without being stuck to the bottom of the lake/river/ocean. And yet our blood elf priest is somehow physically unable wear plate armor? Or wield a shield?

You're using completely irrelevant examples to try to make an absurd point. Again, YOUR argument is that we need trainers to learn abilities DESPITE THE FACT that we learn abilities without trainers. The onus is on you to provide lore that states that the occurrence in the game is not lore. The fact that you can't invalidates your entire argument.

No. No, it doesn't. Because the internal logic of the game, even revolving around magic, has not shown that things can "magically appear out of nowhere" without someone making it so. And characters don't spontaneously "know" stuff.

Your character spontaneously knows talents once they hit a certain level. Your character spontaneously learns their first ability at level 1.

Those are facts.

- - - Updated - - -

We're talking about giving a visual transmog to them. They can already use claws in unarmed combat. Any time they go into combat they already embrace their curse, and none have sought any cure or even gotten to a point where they could become Monks. A class skin that allows transmogs for unarmed attacks would make sense, given that Genn is their racial leader and the Worgen follow his lead fairly closely. It's not like every other Worgen isn't filled with personal trauma and need for vengeance either; like I said Sylvanas just took away their refuge and place of meditation this expansion. That changes things for ALL Worgen.

And again, Blizzard would never do that because it goes against Worgen lore.

Healing Spray could be optional.

Then what's the point? Just to be argumentative?

And there is no Alchemist hero to represent such abilities. You're arbitrarily attaching them to the Tinker, who uses a completely different theme. For things that are related to technology like Healing Spray (adapted to a gun) or Acid Bomb (literally make a bomb out of it) then yeah. But Chemical Rage and Transmute have nothing to do with technology or the Tinker's theme.

Goblin-based alchemy is extremely science based. They even have an alchemy based racial, so it actually fits quite well with the Tinker, since the Alchemist hero in WC3 used technology to assist its abilities.

Yeah, because Tinkers are not known for using Alchemy. Transmutation of Flesh to Gold is well established in pop culture as an alchemical process, the entire theme is sourced back to Alchemy.

I mean really, you could stretch to say Tinkers could create a technological totem that summons Fire Elementals too, but it's not within the Tinker theme to do so.

Except once again, there were Blackfuse engineers who had Healing Spray, and Adrenaline Bomb, which was a mirror ability for Chemical Rage. Blizzard altering the Transmute ability to better fit into the Tinker class makes sense. After all, they did it for the other expansion classes.

[Triceron]

And again, Blizzard would never do that because it goes against Worgen lore.

Lore can change due to circumstances. Look how Blood Elves joined the Horde or how we travelled to an alternate reality Draenor for very little reason other than 'stopping Garrosh'.

Then what's the point? Just to be argumentative?

You suggest how an Alchemy ability can be added to the game. I said in Alchemy. That should explain everything. I'm not the one arguing that it can't be represented in Alchemy Profession, where practically everything else Alchemy related resides.

Goblin-based alchemy is extremely science based.

Transmuting an enemy into gold isn't science based. I don't see him using a technological device that emits a beam, do you?

[Teriz]

Lore can change due to circumstances. Look how Blood Elves joined the Horde or how we travelled to an alternate reality Draenor for very little reason other than 'stopping Garrosh'.

Okay, but Blizzard would have to change the lore. I'm not saying that this change isn't possible, it just runs against the established lore that shaped the race when they were released. Blizzard's goal was to differentiate them from the "evil" Worgen we encountered in Darkshire and other places.

You suggest how an Alchemy ability can be added to the game. I said in Alchemy. That should explain everything. I'm not the one arguing that it can't be represented in Alchemy Profession, where practically everything else Alchemy related resides.

But it can't be represented in Alchemy because it defeats the purpose of professions. Professions are in place to allow you to craft interesting and cool items, not to give you new abilities.

Transmuting an enemy into gold isn't science based. I don't see him using a technological device that emits a beam, do you?

Again, an alteration to the original concept so that it can fit in a unified class. This is no different than when Blizzard gave Death Knights Vampiric Aura from the Dreadlord in order to round out the Blood spec despite the latter being a demon.

[Triceron]

Okay, but Blizzard would have to change the lore. I'm not saying that this change isn't possible, it just runs against the established lore that shaped the race when they were released. Blizzard's goal was to differentiate them from the "evil" Worgen we encountered in Darkshire and other places.

I dunno what part of Sylvanas fucked up their place of peace you're not understanding when it comes to established Worgen lore. They never got Gilneas back, they're still refugees.. dudes got a lot of reason to hold on to hatred. BFA hasn't helped their situation one bit.

It's not a change in their lore, if anything it's a natural progression based on current events. If we really were to abide by Worgen being more peaceful, then the story should have progressed towards a cure or at the very least a more standardized way of control. None of that has been reflected or even touched upon in game, and all Worgen still mandatorily shapeshift into Worgen form in combat. You can't play a 'Gilnean', so to speak.

But it can't be represented in Alchemy because it defeats the purpose of professions. Professions are in place to allow you to craft interesting and cool items, not to give you new abilities.

Herbalism gives you new abilities. Even Death Knights can have a nature-based healing ability through Herbalism. Professions support classes with added themes, that's the whole point. Alchemy is, for the most part, regarded as a support theme.

If we're talking about a class, then it's a theme that better fits with actual Alchemists, or to an extent other classes that are known to brew, like Witchdoctors, Shadow Hunters or Necromancers. Tinkers don't do brews.

Again, an alteration to the original concept

Status quo.

#notmytinker

Tinkers are based on technology, not alchemical transmutation. X to Gold is an Alchemy theme, much like Fire Elementals would be Shaman theme. You can't just tack it on another class because their abilities haven't been used yet. If the examples are Blackfuse, Gazlowe and Mekkatorque, then no I can't imagine either of them using this kind of ability. That's the framework of discussion we should stick to.

[Teriz]

I dunno what part of Sylvanas fucked up their place of peace you're not understanding when it comes to established Worgen lore. They never got Gilneas back, they're still refugees.. dudes got a lot of reason to hold on to hatred. BFA hasn't helped their situation one bit.

It's not a change in their lore, if anything it's a natural progression based on current events. If we really were to abide by Worgen being more peaceful, then the story should have progressed towards a cure or at the very least a more standardized way of control. None of that has been reflected or even touched upon in game, and all Worgen still mandatorily shapeshift into Worgen form in combat. You can't play a 'Gilnean', so to speak.

Which is typical Blizzard lore neglect, which is another reason it's highly unlikely you'll see a dramatic shift in Worgen lore.

Herbalism gives you new abilities. Even Death Knights can have a nature-based healing ability through Herbalism. Professions support classes with added themes, that's the whole point. Alchemy is, for the most part, regarded as a support theme.

What abilities?

Status quo.

Precedent.

[Syegfryed]

We have no reason to believe a "tinkologist" is different than a tinker, based on what we have seen them do.

that is not a canon proof, that is your projection and headcanon "we have no reason to believe they are not the same thing is a nonsense argument

While you are claiming that they are not despite not having a single shred of evidence that they are other than a slightly different name.

im claiming that they could be or could not be the same thing, we have no enough proof or evidence to proof with certain fact that they are the same thing, unlike you who are taking those bits of evidence and treating as enough canon proof, projection

It's not a strawman. It's an actual point. It's your subjective opinion that something "good" is not "excellent" or that something "excellent" is not "good". If two words a synonyms, that means they can generally be used interchangeably.

thats literally a strawman and you are trying to distort things to fit your point, you can't get the meaning of the synonym and don't realize they not always mean the same thing, even with the literally defition of synonym saying that

generally means exactly what generally means, its not always like that, synonyms also means nearly, again, read the meaning of the word nearly

They have been shown to be doing things that tinkers do: working with high-end technology.

thats not what tinker only do, you don't see those tinkologists with mechasuits blasting people off, so again, your point is invallid, they have been show to be doing things that engineers do, and since tinkologists are a snynonmy to engineers, they are more engineers than tinkers

Again: every piece of evidence that exists in the game points to the idea that 'tinker' and 'tinkologist' are just different names to the same thing.

no it don't, again, your projection, every piece of evidence suggest that they may or may not be, in fact, the piece of evidences that exist show they are way more different than they are alike.

unless you want to live in the fantasy of those tinkologists are doing the same thing and are being the same as Gelbin and Blackfuse one of the OG tinkers

And human and night elf tinkers...

if they were, they would be called as tinkers, not another thing, if they were, they would be on the wiki, and are not

Except you're the one using that list to say "see? no human/night elf on that list!"

im not using just the list, nice try, im using the wiki as a whole, and the only mention on elves and humans are in the RPG

[Triceron]

Which is typical Blizzard lore neglect, which is another reason it's highly unlikely you'll see a dramatic shift in Worgen lore.

I don't think letting them transmog unarmed attacks is a dramatic shift in lore. It's a visual perk that's already supported by existing lore. Like I said, every Worgen shapeshifts into Worgen form in combat, and that has been unchanged since they were introduced. Allowing a transmog for unarmed attacks is not a change in any lore. Wanting to be less cursed does not stop them from engaging in combat and turning into Worgens.

What abilities?

https://wowwiki.fandom.com/wiki/Lifeblood

Precedent.

Unlikely status quo.

[Teriz]

I don't think letting them transmog unarmed attacks is a dramatic shift in lore. It's a visual perk that's already supported by existing lore. Like I said, every Worgen shapeshifts into Worgen form in combat, and that has been unchanged since they were introduced. Allowing a transmog for unarmed attacks is not a change in any lore. Wanting to be less cursed does not stop them from engaging in combat and turning into Worgens.

And I’m not disagreeing with you. I’m just saying that the reason it probably won’t get implemented is because it goes against the (current) lore of the race.

https://wowwiki.fandom.com/wiki/Lifeblood

Yeah, I’m pretty sure that ability got removed in WoD for exactly the reasons I mentioned.

Unlikely status quo.

How is it unlikely when it has happened multiple times?

- - - Updated - - -

Okay and sure it would probably be pretty fun and cool, but you've literally just given evidence to my concern. My concern was not that goblins and gnomes are technologically advanced, or tech based, its undeniable they are and they possess things like mechanostriders, trikes, motorbikes, helicopters and aircraft, but as you just said.

"So much so that their racial leaders both pilot mech suits"

And thats the key for me. Gnomes/Goblins stomping around in mechanical suits with miniguns, flamethrowers, rocket boots and rocket pods on them is not common place at all except for a few tiny parts of the story plus the racial leaders.

In the same way anduin can mess res an entire army, that a player paladin cannot, or Arthas/Lich King can possess powers other DK's cannot, or Guldan is immensely powerful compared to a normal Warlock, what makes these racial leaders stand out as powerful is that they are in possession of their races/civilisations best and brightest creations, I dont see how all the other gnomes should be able to be in possession of giant mechanosuits.

I dont want to walk into stormwind and see an army of mechanical monsters, it isnt right for the theme of the game in my opinion.

I dont see how they can make it fit without doing this, and thats why I dont agree with it.

Well here’s the thing, while you can’t mass res, you can still wear heavy armor and use holy magic like Anduin. While you can’t possess people like the Lich King, you can take over the minds of the undead, and you’ll get some of his abilities like Defile and Soul Reaper. And yes, Guldan is an immensely powerful warlock, yet the Warlock class can still utilize abilities that mirror what he does.

Gnomes and Goblins can’t do that with Mekkatorque or Gazlowe. Also it isn’t just those two who use mechs or crazy tech, it’s almost every major Goblin or Gnome figure.

Noggenfogger has a mech. Gallywix has two mechs. Razdunk had a mech. Blackfuse had a mech. Cruschcog had a mech. Her Tallness has a mech. The Gob Squad had a mech. Thermaplugg had a mech. Razak had a mech, Goblin Mech Jockies use mechs, etc.

In the Goblin starter zone, you pilot a mech to play football.

It gets to the point where you’re wondering why you can’t partake in something that is obviously common among these races. Also for them being “giant”, they honestly shouldn’t be any bigger than a fully armored Draenei or Tauren.

[Triceron]

And I’m not disagreeing with you. I’m just saying that the reason it probably won’t get implemented is because it goes against the (current) lore of the race.

It doesn't go against any current lore of the race. They have all reason to be furious right now, more than ever lol

Yeah, I’m pretty sure that ability got removed in WoD for exactly the reasons I mentioned.

That they're removing it and keeping it out simply means that neither Lifeblood or Healing Spray are being added to the game.

How is it unlikely when it has happened multiple times?

Very unlikely when we're talking about themes that are already represented by Professions in the game. It's very unlikely that we'll get an Alchemist class in the game, despite having Paladins, Shamans, Priests all as classes from WC3. No other class really fits taking on an ability that insta-kills a mob into gold.

[Teriz]

It doesn't go against any current lore of the race. They have all reason to be furious right now, more than ever lol

In your opinion.

That they're removing it and keeping it out simply means that neither Lifeblood or Healing Spray are being added to the game.

Healing spray will never be added as a profession ability, yes.

No other class really fits taking on an ability that insta-kills a mob into gold.

Agreed, which is why it makes sense to attach to a Tinker class.

[Triceron]

In your opinion.

My opinion which is based on the current lore, yes lol

Agreed, which is why it makes sense to attach to a Tinker class.

It doesn't fit the Tinker either though. Mekkatorque and Gazlowe would not be using inventions to turn enemies into gold, it just doesn't mesh with the other tech abilities they'd have in the game.

But hey, if you really think it fits, then that's your opinion and I'm fine to disagree. I mean, it'll just be another point I'll bring up the next time you ask why Tinkers are seemingly whimsical.

[Teriz]

My opinion which is based on the current lore, yes lol

An opinion on current lore which isn't shared by Blizzard.

It doesn't fit the Tinker either though. Mekkatorque and Gazlowe would not be using inventions to turn enemies into gold, it just doesn't mesh with the other tech abilities they'd have in the game.

So we have Tinkers in WoW who invent beams that do all sorts of things. Some turn people into robotic chickens. Others shrink them. Others turn them into goop. You're saying that an inventor/mad scientist wouldn't come up with a beam that turns living things into a valuable substance? Especially Goblins?

[Triceron]

An opinion on current lore which isn't shared by Blizzard.

No, an opinion that isn't shared by you. You aren't Blizzard nor do you speak on their behalf :P Let's not get too cocky here.

So we have Tinkers in WoW who invent beams that do all sorts of things. Some turn people into robotic chickens. Others shrink them. Others turn them into goop. You're saying that an inventor/mad scientist wouldn't come up with a beam that turns living things into a valuable substance? Especially Goblins?

I'm saying it has no place in the Tinker class. Sure, they can invent all sorts of things, but I'm sure you'd agree that if they started inventing a Corpse-raisermatic that lets them summon an army of ghouls or a Portal-nometer 3000 that allows them to bind and summon demons at their command, it's no longer in the theme of an inventor/mad scientist and encroaching on themes that aren't privvy to what a Tinker should be doing.

For that matter, I don't think Tinkers would turn living things into robotic chickens or shrinking them either. We have those kind of things in Engineering.

https://classic.wowhead.com/item=107...battle-chicken

https://www.wowhead.com/item=153487/...lation-grenade

https://classic.wowhead.com/item=18660/world-enlarger

Sometimes I wonder if you even know anything about Engineering when you talk about how Tinkers do things Engineers can't, then list a bunch of stuff that's already in the Engineering profession.

[Teriz]

No, an opinion that isn't shared by you. You aren't Blizzard nor do you speak on their behalf :P Let's not get too cocky here.

Except it has nothing to do with me. That's the lore Blizzard put forth when they introduced the race, and it perfectly explains why Worgen use standard weapons instead of their teeth and claws. You being unable to accept that is a completely different issue altogether.

I'm saying it has no place in the Tinker class. Sure, they can invent all sorts of things, but I'm sure you'd agree that if they started inventing a Corpse-raisermatic that lets them summon an army of ghouls or a Portal-nometer 3000 that allows them to bind and summon demons at their command, it's no longer in the theme of an inventor/mad scientist and encroaching on themes that aren't privvy to what a Tinker should be doing.

An utter and complete straw man. Transmute is a WC3 ability associated with a concept that has already been connected to tech users in WoW. No one is talking about raising corpses and using demons. We're talking about yet another quirky ability that fits with the rest of the Tinker concept just fine.

[Triceron]

Except it has nothing to do with me. That's the lore Blizzard put forth when they introduced the race, and it perfectly explains why Worgen use standard weapons instead of their teeth and claws. You being unable to accept that is a completely different issue altogether.

lol what?

An utter and complete straw man. Transmute is a WC3 ability associated with a concept that has already been connected to tech users in WoW.

Yeah, but not to Tinkers.

Like I said, Engineering does this robot chicken polymorph shrinking already.

As for Transmuting mobs to gold, that just doesn't fit to any concept other than an actual Alchemist hero. And even then it's a stretch cuz it was specific to Goblins, not any other race.

Why would a Gnome Tinker turn enemies into gold? They wouldn't.

[Teriz]

lol what?

Yeah, but not to Tinkers.

Like I said, Engineering does this robot chicken polymorph shrinking already.

Which engineering items do the Robot Chicken polymorph?

As for Transmuting mobs to gold, that just doesn't fit to any concept other than an actual Alchemist hero. And even then it's a stretch cuz it was specific to Goblins, not any other race.

Why would a Gnome Tinker turn enemies into gold? They wouldn't.

To protect an ally by turning them into living metal. Again, when targeting an ally, it reduces their damage. When targeting an enemy, it turns them into a gold statue. One is based on Gnomes, the other is based on Goblins. It's perfect.

[Ielenia]

My original claim is that following basic logic,

Teriz, your claim "follows basic logic" as much as someone with 50 points in a breathalyzer can walk in a straight line. It's "flat earth" levels of illogical. Basic logic states characters cannot "learn things spontaneously".

I'm sure you believe that, but that isn't the case. Pointing out that when Blizzard first brought the class into the game from WC3 is valid because it shows the origins of the design. Over time, Blizzard shuffled Death Pact around and in a few expansions removed it entirely. However, that doesn't change the origins of the ability, and how it worked to develop the Blood Spec.

Gameplay being changed did not change the origins of the spell, and the origins are still valid today so it's a "blood" ability despite not being available to blood... but when gameplay is changed to not require you to stop leveling in Feralas to go Darnassus to learn new spells from your class trainer, then that shit is gone forever, never to be lore again?

Again... double-standards.

If it was above the character, you wouldn't be able to see the entire back of the character.

Yes. Yes, you could see the character's back. As demonstrated several times already.

Gameplay reflects lore. That is a fact.

You're using completely irrelevant examples to try to make an absurd point.

I'm sorry, Teriz. You can't say "gameplay reflects lore" and then say it doesn't when you're presented with an example that showcases how dumb your assertion is. The only "absurd point" here is your claim that our characters learn everything on their own. If our characters "learning abilities on their own" is canon lore, then our characters being able to effortlessly carry over 30 tons of weight is also canon lore.

Again, YOUR argument is that we need trainers to learn abilities DESPITE THE FACT that we learn abilities without trainers.

But it's not a fact. A gameplay mechanic is not a lore fact, Teriz. Are you going to say our characters stop existing in the lore when we log out of the game? Are you going to say that all heroes are telepathically linked because we can communicate with others across an entire zone through the general chat, or across literal worlds with the "whisper" command?

The onus is on you to provide lore that states that the occurrence in the game is not lore. The fact that you can't invalidates your entire argument.

No, Teriz. It's actually your burden to prove it. Because, and I'll explain once again. Gameplay mechanics is not lore. Our characters no longer needing to visit trainers is a gameplay concession, not lore. Our characters already knowing one or two abilities at level 1 when we start the game is also not evidence, because it's another gameplay concession.

Again: your claim contradicts basic logic.

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that is not a canon proof, that is your projection and headcanon "we have no reason to believe they are not the same thing is a nonsense argument

So you're going to dishonestly misrepresent my argument? Because you ignored a very important part of my argument: "based on what we have seen them do."

im claiming that they could be or could not be the same thing, we have no enough proof or evidence to proof with certain fact that they are the same thing, unlike you who are taking those bits of evidence and treating as enough canon proof, projection

We have evidence that they may be, and we have zero evidence that they may not.

thats literally a strawman and you are trying to distort things to fit your point,

You were the one who claimed synonyms "are not always the same thing", so it's very valid to ask for an example when they're not the same thing, i.e. one but not the other.

thats not what tinker only do, you don't see those tinkologists with mechasuits blasting people off, so again, your point is invallid,

Funny how you love to accuse me of "headcanon" and "projection" and whatnot... but here you are doing the exact same thing. Worse, because your "headcanon" goes against factual evidence, because there are many tinkers who do not use mechs to fight. Here are some examples.

no it don't,

Yes, it does, and I've already explained the reasoning and the evidence. You, so far, have only said that they're not the same thing because we're not explicitly told they're the same thing.

if they were, they would be called as tinkers, not another thing,

Siegecrafter Blackfuse was never called a "tinker" in game. Does that mean he is not a tinker, then? Gazlowe is also never called a "tinker".

if they were, they would be on the wiki, and are not

The wiki also says that "tinkers" and "tinkologists" are the same thing. So if you're going to say "they don't exist in the wiki, therefore they are not canon", then you also must accept that "tinkers" and "tinkologists" are the same thing since the wiki says they are.

[Triceron]

Which engineering items do the Robot Chicken polymorph?

What Tinker ability polymorphs enemies into Robot Chickens?

To protect an ally by turning them into living metal. Again, when targeting an ally, it reduces their damage. When targeting an enemy, it turns them into a gold statue. One is based on Gnomes, the other is based on Goblins. It's perfect.

Very whimsical Not very practical.

Whatever you explained right here though, isn't the Warcraft 3 Alchemist Transmute ability. So despite whatever you're proposing, the Tinker still wouldn't have the Alchemist's ability, instead they get some awkward whimisical metal-transmutation ability that is usable on allies.

[Varodoc]

How? Warriors and Hunters have abilities that rely on equipped weapons. If they lose their weapons, they're very easy to kill. A Tinker in a mech is no different.

Not true. Warriors can be very deadly with mere punches (see Garrosh vs. Thrall), while hunters can always rely on their mighty pet.