Did high end raiding guilds change or is it me?

[Krakan]

I got back into the high end (well world 900 but still full clearing)) and the attitudes I'm encountering seem so forgien to me. Previously I was in a guild from tbc to legion and everything was laid back. We hit world 50ish constantly and each raid night was laid back like a cozy pub with friends.

I returned during the last patch of bfa and the guilds I've joined have been almost Mercantile in how they operate. Massive benches are brought in full of people they never plan to use. Sale runs are pushed heavily for all level of content and their is a odd air of distrust between the members.

At first I thought this was a one off but I've seen it in more then a couple of guilds now and I'm wondering if this is the new norm or if I've had rotten luck?

[Wuusah]

maybe it's your guild. There have always been sweaty raid groups and there are still chill raid groups. I guess the chill raid groups usually don't get quite as far anymore because the difficulty of raiding went up. That's the thing with multiple difficulties. They made a playground for the ultra casuals with LFR and normal but they also made super tight encounters for the hardcores with mythic.

[themortalgod]

You just had a bad luck now and good luck in the past. I've experienced both sides of the spectrum over the years. Though I have not done any high end raiding for a while now. I remember back in the Ulduar patch, for example, I was on a pretty high end guild that was only a few steps behind Blood Legion at the time pushing content. That raid environment was utter cancer. Raid days consistent of 2-4 hours of getting screamed at. Every time you made a mistake expect to be berated and shamed. It was an awful experience and I only stuck around for a single patch. I've also experienced the flip side, though, where the entire guild community is wonderful and acts as a team. We have fun and enjoy ourselves. It is a supportive and fun environment.

I don't think things have really changed so much as some guild leaders promote a culture of positivity while others promote a culture of negativity. This is no different than sports teams, which I have also been on many of. Sometimes the experience is amazing, other times it is horrible. Just gotta keep hunting until you find one that is a good experience for you. Some people actually enjoy being in an environment where everyone is always mad at everyone else, I don't know why. (Anyone who thinks this actually increases performance though, is insane. There certainly need to be expectations of performance but inspired, motivated humans almost always outperform abused ones)

[holywhiskers]

Every guild is different. I've been in at least 7 different M guilds in BfA and it just varies a lot. I will also say though the game has changed a lot and is without a doubt end game PvE content is much more challenging now than it was back then. Like much much more. There's a reason on guild apps no one really cares about raiding experience before MoP/WoD, and thats even pushing it.

[Kaver]

I got back into the high end (well world 900 but still full clearing)) and the attitudes I'm encountering seem so forgien to me. Previously I was in a guild from tbc to legion and everything was laid back. We hit world 50ish constantly and each raid night was laid back like a cozy pub with friends.

I returned during the last patch of bfa and the guilds I've joined have been almost Mercantile in how they operate. Massive benches are brought in full of people they never plan to use. Sale runs are pushed heavily for all level of content and their is a odd air of distrust between the members.

At first I thought this was a one off but I've seen it in more then a couple of guilds now and I'm wondering if this is the new norm or if I've had rotten luck?

Well if you’re asking if people are acting different in 2020 compared to 2007, then yes.

[ONCHEhap]

it's bad luck with your current guild,but even more laid back guilds are moving faster and faster towards that kind of attitude these days.
It's a mix of the extreme minmax mindset,obsession over DPS parses,the GOGOGOGO mentality and RIO pushing that behaviour,from what I've observed in my long years in the top 500.

It's kinda sad honestly,cause I can tell those pushing that don't enjoy it either(trust me,after enough time raiding at the highest level together,you start to know these people and how they feel),ends up being a net loss for everyone involved

[spalernTJ]

I can only speak from my own experience. I've taken breaks in every tier of BFA cause... Fuck BFA. but returned for N'zoth. I found myself a random guild that was going to push into Shadowlands on a 2 day raid schedule with mythic raiding in mind. Guild started up with the beginning of the corona virus, which is roughly when I joined. We've pushed CE N'zoth and continue clearing every week, with a tiny bench, giving people achievements & CE's while having a super chill, laid back atmosphere. Every guild is different, it's up to you to find a guild that feels like a home to you.

[Krakan]

I can only speak from my own experience. I've taken breaks in every tier of BFA cause... Fuck BFA. but returned for N'zoth. I found myself a random guild that was going to push into Shadowlands on a 2 day raid schedule with mythic raiding in mind. Guild started up with the beginning of the corona virus, which is roughly when I joined. We've pushed CE N'zoth and continue clearing every week, with a tiny bench, giving people achievements & CE's while having a super chill, laid back atmosphere. Every guild is different, it's up to you to find a guild that feels like a home to you.

Suppose I just have to search around I suppose now is the time for it pre shadow lands. I might of just been spoiled but I'm sure I can find something that will fit like a glove.

[Hellobolis]

varies from guild to guild. the practices you describe would be a bit too much for me to stay.

some of it might be end of xpac syndrome though.

[Relapses]

>provides a singular experience based on one guild

"Are ALL guilds like this???"

Do you write for BuzzFeed in your spare time?

[gd8]

most high end guilds operate like a company and treat you as if you're working for them

[Biomega]

I don't believe that you were top 50 during Legion but in a guild where "everything was laid back". You're either misrepresenting the level you were operating at, or your memory is biased and you're remembering the good times more than the bad. You can't get to top 50 without ambition and drive, and even the guilds that are among the most "casual" at that level WILL push hard and be demanding, either in effort or skill (or both). Because if you don't, you don't get to be at that level and are overtaken by the guilds that do.

At the "world 900" level, that's a very different story. There, anything can happen - there's more relaxed guilds, and there's more demanding guilds, but of course mythic raiding isn't just a walk in the park where you show up and get loot. That being said, of course there'll be some guilds that show more ambition and some guilds that show less, and it's just a matter of finding the guild that's right for you.

[Gaidax]

/shrug

You just got into edgy guild, that all. I mean, just use common sense - guilds be guilds always - among guilds that are performing reasonably decently, you always had those edgy drama guilds and you always had good guys guilds.

For example over my 15 years in game I was in about 5 guilds off top of my head, always guilds that take on top tier raiding content - I am super stable and usually stay in guilds for a long time. 2 of them were edgy, one in Vanilla and one in WoD and the rest were pretty chill. Vanilla one basically imploded, due to shady crap some officer did and WoD one I was basically forced to quit due to accumulated bad blood with an officer.

Rest I basically stayed until I quit for a long period.

My current one I am in since last tier of WoD and I'm pretty happy with it - good progress, always cutting edge, chill 2 raiding nights a week, 3 hours each and people are mostly in 35-25 years old range, some with kids and such, so overall no edgy crap. Of course, we still are pretty competitive among ourselves and sometimes it might spike a bit too hard with feels and such, people aren't robots, after all, but mostly it's really a great guild with good raiders.

[arkanon]

I got back into the high end (well world 900 but still full clearing)) and the attitudes I'm encountering seem so forgien to me. Previously I was in a guild from tbc to legion and everything was laid back. We hit world 50ish constantly and each raid night was laid back like a cozy pub with friends.

I returned during the last patch of bfa and the guilds I've joined have been almost Mercantile in how they operate. Massive benches are brought in full of people they never plan to use. Sale runs are pushed heavily for all level of content and their is a odd air of distrust between the members.

At first I thought this was a one off but I've seen it in more then a couple of guilds now and I'm wondering if this is the new norm or if I've had rotten luck?

What was the world top 50 guild you were in back then called? Can probably clear quite a bit up by looking into it.

- - - Updated - - -

Raiding in BFA demands much more than raiding in BC so it's fair to assume attitudes have changed with that, however, it could just be you have an overly serious guild. Plenty of guilds clear mythic and are nice guilds to be in, in fact I'm sure most are

I mean, there are DEAD SERIOUS guilds raiding in classic - they are funny as hell. It makes me cringe to even watch some of the videos to be honest.

[Krakan]

What was the world top 50 guild you were in back then called? Can probably clear quite a bit up by looking into it.

- - - Updated - - -



I mean, there are DEAD SERIOUS guilds raiding in classic - they are funny as hell. It makes me cringe to even watch some of the videos to be honest.

It went under a few renaming and different rankings over the years. Was chosen then invictus, then fast forward and now its focus up.

It still exists but I'm not really back to that level of play yet ( well I might be but lacking perfect corruptions who can tell?). I could hitch a ride there and be welcomed back with open arms but I want to progress and I have a feeling I'm not at that level anymore.

I want to earn my ce if that makes any sense I would just like to enjoy the company I earn it with as well.

[goldlock]

Honestly from the sounds of it your used to an extremely high ranking guild and are now only experiencing the lower end of CE guilds. The really savage guilds are those that are poised to stop being feeder guilds and move into the big leagues. Your to used to being in the comfort era I would suggest pushing back up to it.

[Amazingdom]

People think shit is hard. It’s all about commitment, education and patience, most of these qualities are hard to find, as people think their brilliant at everything they do, but rarely execute what they should. People are just cocky these days because they can press 1,2,3,1 in sequence

[goldlock]

OP has one bad experience in a mythic guild, and now he assumes ALL guilds are like his guild, great thread.

Sounds like they struck gold early and bypassed the annoying levels and are now being introduced to them for the first time.

I find end game guilds that full clear almost have a rating system. Sounds like he was in plat or diamond and now finds himself in silver and gold. They are vastly different atmospheres.

[Boricha]

8.3 made sales runs more important than ever because of extremely powerful and expensive BoEs. Having a large pool of players is also good for class stacking cheese, split runs, and more sales runs. Keep in mind that the difference in dps potential between an optimized char and someone wearing whatever is enormous nowadays, and Blizz has to design mythic around optimized chars in order for it to not get steamrolled, at least during the pre-nerf phase. That said, we are long into the nerfs and I'm kind of surprised to see a mythic prog guild still doing those sorts of things for a raid that has been out this long. Maybe your guild is done with prog and just preparing for potentially the same scenario in SL?

[Captain Proton]

>provides a singular experience based on one guild

"Are ALL guilds like this???"

Do you write for BuzzFeed in your spare time?

Notice he said "guilds I joined" and "I've seen it in more then a couple of guilds". Reading is hard, I know, just stick with BuzzFeed.