Sentenced to life imprisonment for trying to steal hedge clippers.

[Edge-]

Hedge clippers today. A school girls back pack tomorrow. Back packs are cheap though right? Just buy a new one

Again, you're just sinking to rank hyperbole and hypotheticals, trying to play on emotions by making the victim of your absurd fantasy a schoolgirl.

You're just desperate for a way to rationalize locking a guy up for live for trying to steal some hedge trimmers.

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Less than half of American? You could fill thier population into the smallest state rofl

...you understand how per-capita statistics work...right? Because that list was per-capita statistics my dude, not raw totals.

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Some of those countries that have the lowest rates of theft also have punishments like cutting of the hand of someone who steals.

This is true, and also questionable reporting systems. But that's not what this was about, this was to show that countries with stronger social safety nets generally do have lower instances of theft than in the US, which was what RobertoCarlos asserted without evidence.

[RobertoCarlos]

right. so how do you draw the line?

Pretty easily. Minor traffic offences are a fine. Stealing is a crime that repeat offenders should be punished for. As well as paying back what they took

[wunksta]

It would be better for him to be somewhere that he can be watched(forced mental care facilities are prisons, just a different kind) then be out in society where he could be shot for breaking into a house or property. Yes, the punishment is harsh for him and prison may not be the right answer but he does need to be separated from society which will ultimately cost money.

For violent crimes, sure but not for petty theft. If he is able to function better with medication then there's no reason to have a prior petty thief under constant supervision. I don't even know why misdemeanors are counted because the three strikes law requires a felony. It's intent is to keep violent criminals off the street, not lock up poor, mentally ill people.

[RobertoCarlos]

Again, you're just sinking to rank hyperbole and hypotheticals, trying to play on emotions by making the victim of your absurd fantasy a schoolgirl.

You're just desperate for a way to rationalize locking a guy up for live for trying to steal some hedge trimmers.

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...you understand how per-capita statistics work...right? Because that list was per-capita statistics my dude, not raw totals.

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This is true, and also questionable reporting systems. But that's not what this was about, this was to show that countries with stronger social safety nets generally do have lower instances of theft than in the US, which was what RobertoCarlos asserted without evidence.

I did not say lower than USA. I said in countries with welfare support you still get thieves. Because someone was suggesting free bread and netflix would stop crminals

[Edge-]

I did not say lower than USA. I said in countries with welfare support you still get thieves.

Fair point on the former, but you didn't say the latter either -

In countries with good welfare support you still get high levels of theft.

So again, even by this measure of "high levels of theft", they don't. They're overwhelming below the top quartile, with most being in the bottom half of countries in that study.

Because someone was suggesting free bread and netflix would stop crminals

Actually, it does appear to reduce theft, at least. So yeah, give them bread and netflix, yo.

[wunksta]

I did not say lower than USA. I said in countries with welfare support you still get thieves. Because someone was suggesting free bread and netflix would stop crminals

Like you said, some people like the rush and are bored etc. The vast majority of criminals are mentally ill and/or addicts though and need help to become functioning members of society. We shouldn't be locking up people indefinitely in a prison for minor non-violent crimes. America's prison population has exploded and is drastically higher than most other countries. What we are doing isn't working and is only funneling money into the prison industrial complex.

[Hellobolis]

Pretty easily. Minor traffic offences are a fine. Stealing is a crime that repeat offenders should be punished for. As well as paying back what they took

how about running a red light or speeding? those things kill lots of people every year.

[RobertoCarlos]

Fair point on the former, but you didn't say the latter either -



So again, even by this measure of "high levels of theft", they don't. They're overwhelming below the top quartile, with most being in the bottom half of countries in that study.



Actually, it does appear to reduce theft, at least. So yeah, give them bread and netflix, yo.

So now gang members get free bread and Netflix AND my wallet and car? Why should I bother with my shitty job I'm gonna join a gang tomorrow then

[draynay]

Hedge clippers today. A school girls back pack tomorrow. Back packs are cheap though right? Just buy a new one

Maybe he stole those hedge clippers from the next Hitler because of a psychic premonition.

[Edge-]

So now gang members get free bread and Netflix AND my wallet and car? Why should I bother with my shitty job I'm gonna join a gang tomorrow then

Jesus christ on a stick, are you just going to respond to everything with hyperbolic nonsense?

Join a fuckin gang then, bro. Rep those colors and flash that sign.

[RobertoCarlos]

how about running a red light or speeding? those things kill lots of people every year.

Speeding isn't a minor offence nor is running a red light. They should get points and with enough points you lose your license and they'll have to bike or use public transport

[RobertoCarlos]

Jesus christ on a stick, are you just going to respond to everything with hyperbolic nonsense?

Join a fuckin gang then, bro. Rep those colors and flash that sign.

Well I literally had my car and wallet stolen two weeks ago by a crack head gang member who brought themselves a feed from Mcdonalds and smokes from a gas station.

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They keep your wallet and the car in the prison? What kind of prison allows that?

Cops don't give a shit and only took prints on the car when it was dumped down a random street

[Edge-]

Well I literally had my car and wallet stolen two weeks ago by a crack head gang member who brought themselves a feed from Mcdonalds and smokes from a gas station.

That sucks man, and nobody here is arguing that there should be no consequences for theft, especially theft of items with objectively higher value like a car and a wallet. Hope they catch the guy and he serves some time for his crimes.

I'm not sure what the fuck this has to do with a guy who is in prison for life for trying to steal a pair of hedge trimmers.

[wunksta]

Well I literally had my car and wallet stolen two weeks ago by a crack head gang member who brought themselves a feed from Mcdonalds and smokes from a gas station.

Yeah, we have been ignoring the drug epidemic in America and been treating it as a criminal problem. Like I said, these people need help.

[Hellobolis]

So now gang members get free bread and Netflix AND my wallet and car? Why should I bother with my shitty job I'm gonna join a gang tomorrow then

risk vs reward? crime does pay, very well too. but you're rolling the dice against more than just the justice system.

[wunksta]

risk vs reward? crime does pay, very well too. but you're rolling the dice against more than just the justice system.

Crime usually pays because of ridiculous draconian drug laws that create a lucrative black market.

[Doctor Amadeus]

Jay walking shouldn't be a crime. Just like not wearing your seat belt isn't a crime. It's a fine

Theft is 100% a crime

No Jaywalking is a crime, not wearing your seat belt is a crime, no it isn't ok, you are simply rationalizing being more strict than the law allows for one rather than the other. Speeding is also a crime, all of the above have lead to deaths and a lot of them due to people doing those things.

Stealing, has effectively lead to almost no deaths or grave harm by themselves

[RobertoCarlos]

That sucks man, and nobody here is arguing that there should be no consequences for theft, especially theft of items with objectively higher value like a car and a wallet. Hope they catch the guy and he serves some time for his crimes.

I'm not sure what the fuck this has to do with a guy who is in prison for life for trying to steal a pair of hedge trimmers.

Well when you get 0 help from police. Government. And are expected to just have insurance to cover it. Its really fucking annoying no one gives a shit. So when people talk about theft as some petty crime that shouldn't be another bonus for the prisons quarterly profits I like to point out the other side of the argument. That there are victims and you don't know how it effects that victim. I struggle with anxiety and Im getting emails from banks telling me they need info for account creation when whoever stole the car/wallet they have my drivers licence. It's stressful and you get no help unless you have a good insurance company. So prisons win. Insurance companies win
And the victim always loses

[Hellobolis]

Crime usually pays because of ridiculous draconian drug laws that create a lucrative black market.

small crime happens because of immediate need.
big crime happens because something creates a imbalance between supply an demand (most often caused by government regulations, drugs being the obvious example.)

[RobertoCarlos]

Stealing, has effectively lead to almost no deaths or grave harm by themselves

If you say so