1. #3141
    You gotta wonder why they even bothered to make Torghast gameplay spec-specific when the entire point of the mode is that you experiment way beyond your character's usual strengths? They had to have noticed that the specializations being tightly designed for normal gameplay outside of Torghast would result in the obvious repetitiveness of the game mode and make people bored.

    What they should have done is had your character go in completely spec-less, and build up your abilities and anima powers both from a pool consistently of the entirety of your class. So you go in, start with 0 abilities on your hotbar, pick 3-5 abilities to start with and a couple anima powers to amp them up, and go from there. Just imagine the combinations you could come up with and build around from stuff that was conventionally useless together.

  2. #3142
    The Patient
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    206
    I still believe that Chains of Domination will probably be the final Shadowlands update. Previous patches have come out within a 3 - 6 month cycle with the X.1 patch generally being around 60 - 90 days from launch. This is the longest gap we've had between X.0 and X.1 which is fast approaching the 8 month mark as of writing. This massive delay tells me that something is seriously up within the Warcraft dev team.

    The cynic inside me worries that Activision are micromanaging Blizzard far more than previously thought. They probably see content patches as an unnecessary expense because they don't drive more sales, and if they had their way, WoW expansions would be shat out annually and for a full $60 price tag, with each new content update being bundled as $20 DLC.

    Wouldn't be surprised one bit if Shadowlands were wrapped up and outright shelved after Chains of Domination, either to focus on the next expansion or to focus on adding new content to Classic.

    And before you tell me that Blizz won't be stupid enough to do that, do you remember Warlords of Draenor at all? That abomination of an expansion that concluded 6 months into launch with just 3 raids? That $50 scam that Blizzard left to rot for fifteen months before pushing out Legion? WoD had serious potential and Blizzard had pathlogically lied about their intentions to support the expansion until they turned around and said "Nah, we have no plans to support the game with any further updates."

  3. #3143
    I'll be so mad if 9.1 is the last patch, not because I like Shadowlands, but because I hate Shadowlands and its entire story. If Shadowlands ended at 9.1, then the Janitor and the "Generic 4 deities with 0 backstory who won't be relevant ever again", oops Eternal Ones, would be featured in the next expansion too, so 10.0 would be ruined as well.

    The ideal world would be 9.2 as the last patch.
    Some will tell you that the Light is the only path. The only weapon that can stop the enemies of Azeroth. But we see alternatives. Many roads, many possibilities, that are open to us. There will be those who doubt you. Who question your resolve, your ability to harness powers that have caused the downfall of weaker wills. Together, we will prove them wrong.

  4. #3144
    Quote Originally Posted by Edward Wu View Post
    You gotta wonder why they even bothered to make Torghast gameplay spec-specific when the entire point of the mode is that you experiment way beyond your character's usual strengths? They had to have noticed that the specializations being tightly designed for normal gameplay outside of Torghast would result in the obvious repetitiveness of the game mode and make people bored.

    What they should have done is had your character go in completely spec-less, and build up your abilities and anima powers both from a pool consistently of the entirety of your class. So you go in, start with 0 abilities on your hotbar, pick 3-5 abilities to start with and a couple anima powers to amp them up, and go from there. Just imagine the combinations you could come up with and build around from stuff that was conventionally useless together.
    Overall I think Torghast (by this name I mean all this type of content) need 4 major things:

    1) More crazy powers, more playing around with them. Something like your idea, but of course it should be tested, it could be good idea only on paper.

    2) Completely excluded from power systems. Torghast should you give nothing but cosmetics, achievements, titles, mounts etc. Or some completely new type of award. Of course it doesn't mean is scalable - your gear and power matters.

    3) More diverse environment. Also it's mistake making it same theme as current patch/raid.

    4) No easy mode, but of course it can't be as hardcore as Mage Tower before Tomb opened, since there is heavy RNG factor.

    Imo they really should at least try to do version like that during 9.2 (9.3?). Torghast has potential, but if we won't see changes, it will be thrown to failure box with garrison, warfronts and islands.

    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    I'll be so mad if 9.1 is the last patch, not because I like Shadowlands, but because I hate Shadowlands and its entire story. If Shadowlands ended at 9.1, then the Janitor and the "Generic 4 deities with 0 backstory who won't be relevant ever again", oops Eternal Ones, would be featured in the next expansion too, so 10.0 would be ruined as well.

    The ideal world would be 9.2 as the last patch.
    9.2 is already confirmed.

  5. #3145
    Quote Originally Posted by Edward Wu View Post
    You gotta wonder why they even bothered to make Torghast gameplay spec-specific when the entire point of the mode is that you experiment way beyond your character's usual strengths? They had to have noticed that the specializations being tightly designed for normal gameplay outside of Torghast would result in the obvious repetitiveness of the game mode and make people bored.

    What they should have done is had your character go in completely spec-less, and build up your abilities and anima powers both from a pool consistently of the entirety of your class. So you go in, start with 0 abilities on your hotbar, pick 3-5 abilities to start with and a couple anima powers to amp them up, and go from there. Just imagine the combinations you could come up with and build around from stuff that was conventionally useless together.
    That would be fun, but I don't think it would be necessarily work in WoW.

    Part of the point in Torghast is that you go in with the gear you have. Not to mention that your idea would require players to learn a new set of mechanics for each riun potentially.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  6. #3146
    The Lightbringer Wangming's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Not Azeroth
    Posts
    3,205
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    If you want the expansion to end, making it end a patch shorter won't speed anything up, if anything the same people that want it to end will moan about no content. Watching this thread progress. I don't think people know what they want.
    Well there is the usual schedule. 6 months between patches and 10 months after final patch. As a lot of raiders will tell you a 6 month wait is optimal because raid tiers need that much before they get boring. Less than that and it is rushed. It is why MoP had more frequent patches but not all of them had raids. To keep this schedule up.

    Now then. With no delays it looks like:

    9.1 -six month wait-9.2-six month wait-9.3 -ten month wait-10.0

    or

    9.1 - six month wait- 9.2 - ten month wait - 10.0

    So yes I think it really is preferrable to not have a 9.3

  7. #3147
    Quote Originally Posted by Clbull View Post
    I still believe that Chains of Domination will probably be the final Shadowlands update. Previous patches have come out within a 3 - 6 month cycle with the X.1 patch generally being around 60 - 90 days from launch. This is the longest gap we've had between X.0 and X.1 which is fast approaching the 8 month mark as of writing. This massive delay tells me that something is seriously up within the Warcraft dev team.

    The cynic inside me worries that Activision are micromanaging Blizzard far more than previously thought. They probably see content patches as an unnecessary expense because they don't drive more sales, and if they had their way, WoW expansions would be shat out annually and for a full $60 price tag, with each new content update being bundled as $20 DLC.

    Wouldn't be surprised one bit if Shadowlands were wrapped up and outright shelved after Chains of Domination, either to focus on the next expansion or to focus on adding new content to Classic.

    And before you tell me that Blizz won't be stupid enough to do that, do you remember Warlords of Draenor at all? That abomination of an expansion that concluded 6 months into launch with just 3 raids? That $50 scam that Blizzard left to rot for fifteen months before pushing out Legion? WoD had serious potential and Blizzard had pathlogically lied about their intentions to support the expansion until they turned around and said "Nah, we have no plans to support the game with any further updates."
    I get where you come from, but with Blizzcon delayed and honestly it seems Blizzard is very very behind on their schedule for this expansion doesn't make me believe they will do a Legion.
    Quote Originally Posted by Firedemon View Post
    No. On these forums any updates mean an expansion hint.
    Wrathin comes back? Dragon expansion clearly!
    LK part of a quest? Wotlk 2 clearly!
    Sylvanas working with a death master? Shadowlands clearly!

    At the point we're headed for Wrath of the Shdowlands Dragon Isles Lich and tinkers.

  8. #3148
    The Lightbringer Wangming's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Not Azeroth
    Posts
    3,205
    Quote Originally Posted by Clbull View Post
    I still believe that Chains of Domination will probably be the final Shadowlands update. Previous patches have come out within a 3 - 6 month cycle with the X.1 patch generally being around 60 - 90 days from launch. This is the longest gap we've had between X.0 and X.1 which is fast approaching the 8 month mark as of writing. This massive delay tells me that something is seriously up within the Warcraft dev team.

    The cynic inside me worries that Activision are micromanaging Blizzard far more than previously thought. They probably see content patches as an unnecessary expense because they don't drive more sales, and if they had their way, WoW expansions would be shat out annually and for a full $60 price tag, with each new content update being bundled as $20 DLC.

    Wouldn't be surprised one bit if Shadowlands were wrapped up and outright shelved after Chains of Domination, either to focus on the next expansion or to focus on adding new content to Classic.

    And before you tell me that Blizz won't be stupid enough to do that, do you remember Warlords of Draenor at all? That abomination of an expansion that concluded 6 months into launch with just 3 raids? That $50 scam that Blizzard left to rot for fifteen months before pushing out Legion? WoD had serious potential and Blizzard had pathlogically lied about their intentions to support the expansion until they turned around and said "Nah, we have no plans to support the game with any further updates."
    I wouldn't go that far. The Janitor story has to end. Or will it be like Garrosh who died midway into WoD? Not seeing it. I think we will get a 9.2 to wrap things up. Unless we get a Gamescom reveal they wil not scrap 9.2. The next online BlizzCon will be next year. Way too late if there is no patch between it and 9.1

  9. #3149
    The Lightbringer Makabreska's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Orbis Terrarum
    Posts
    3,845
    Are we going from "there is no 9.3" to "there is no 9.2" now?
    Deep into that darkness peering, long I stood there, wondering, fearing...

  10. #3150
    Quote Originally Posted by Makabreska View Post
    Are we going from "there is no 9.3" to "there is no 9.2" now?
    Never underestimate amount of stupidity in this community.

  11. #3151
    Quote Originally Posted by Makabreska View Post
    Are we going from "there is no 9.3" to "there is no 9.2" now?
    The expansion ending at 9.3 has too many realistic points in its favour, specifically Covid. The expansion ending at 9.2 is a realistic option if Blizzard is really struggling, so clearly it isn't pessimistic enough for the doomsayers.

    Doomsayers always seem to have to one up the general consensus. And since most people I have talked to have mentioned that something has to give in Shadowlands because of slow WFH development and general bad luck (California forest fires for instance) merely saying the expansion ends early isn't enough. It has to end catastrophically to ensure the view that Blizzard is failing and that WoW is dying.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

  12. #3152
    Quote Originally Posted by Edward Wu View Post
    You gotta wonder why they even bothered to make Torghast gameplay spec-specific when the entire point of the mode is that you experiment way beyond your character's usual strengths? They had to have noticed that the specializations being tightly designed for normal gameplay outside of Torghast would result in the obvious repetitiveness of the game mode and make people bored.

    What they should have done is had your character go in completely spec-less, and build up your abilities and anima powers both from a pool consistently of the entirety of your class. So you go in, start with 0 abilities on your hotbar, pick 3-5 abilities to start with and a couple anima powers to amp them up, and go from there. Just imagine the combinations you could come up with and build around from stuff that was conventionally useless together.
    I'd say a huge problem was that it wasn't spec-specific enough. The anima powers focused too much on the general powers all specs shared which resulted in a lot of very lame and non-game changing powers. With how different specs are from one another now, their overlap is piss poor.

  13. #3153
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    How can 9.3 be irrelevant to that? You think all the developers that work / would work on 9.3 just do nothing for 10.0? It's silly to think that the manpower they can spare by not having 9.3 isn't positively affecting the development of 10.0.

    Do you think Legion would have launched back in August 2016 when WoD had gotten a 6.3 patch half a year after 6.2? They had no 6.3 to accelerate and focus work on Legion. The same can easily apply to 9.3 and the next expansion right now. And they could have made this decision even before Shadowlands' launch because they knew they'd be late with everything. A delay for 10.0 means we assume there ever were plans to have 9.3, a thing we simply have no insight on. Maybe 9.3 was never planned and Shadowlands was always going to end with the 9.2(.5) patch and everything besides the wait for 9.1 is pretty much as usual.
    No, it's silly to think that manpower could possibly affect the 10.0 release. At this point, it's already going to be delayed, regardless of whether they do a 9.3. Not having a 9.3 just means a longer drought, and throwing more people at a late project doesn't make it not late.

    The rest is just meaningless supposition that could be turned around against you just as easily. What reason do we have to assume they didn't plan a 9.3? Why would they suddenly change their content cycle plans for no practical reason? And no, Covid/Work from home is not a reason, since those delays wouldn't have happened until after the planning.

  14. #3154
    9.2 being the last patch doesn't mean Blizzard is struggling. Just means that's where the Expansion's plot stops. Simple.

  15. #3155
    The Lightbringer Makabreska's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Orbis Terrarum
    Posts
    3,845
    Quote Originally Posted by TheFirstOnes View Post
    9.2 being the last patch doesn't mean Blizzard is struggling. Just means that's where the Expansion's plot stops. Simple.
    I mean sure, that's where it would stop AFTER they do the cuts if they decided to cancel 9.3. Because I don't think Blizz would plan SL to be two patches from the start if it comes to that. And Blizz is struggling in general, as we know from last reports and interveiws, with pandemic not helping at all.
    Last edited by Makabreska; 2021-06-06 at 06:35 PM.
    Deep into that darkness peering, long I stood there, wondering, fearing...

  16. #3156
    Void Lord Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    In some Sanctuaryesque place or a Haven
    Posts
    42,383
    Quote Originally Posted by Makabreska View Post
    I mean sure, that's where it would stop AFTER they do the cuts if they decided to cancel 9.3. Because I don't think Blizz would plan SL to be two patches from the start if it comes to that. And Blizz is struggling in general, as we know from last reports, with pandemic not helping at all.
    Pre Pandemic, nothing was really struggling aside from the usual controversy stuff the internet lives for. The Pandemic just made them struggle because...well no company on earth is handling it well.
    #TeamLegion #UnderEarthofAzerothexpansion plz #Arathor4Alliance

    Warrior-Magi

  17. #3157
    The Lightbringer Makabreska's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Orbis Terrarum
    Posts
    3,845
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    They aren't really struggling, the Pandemic is most of the strain.
    Debatable. Revenue went up, but player-base dropped 29% in last 3 years I think? And Blizz, as many, is heavily relaying on game releases with D4 and Overwatch 2 being barely on the horizon (and suddenly loosing Kaplan is also a bad sign). As we learned from some recent interviews, Blizz workers pay is tied to bonuses from game releases, but these were obviously not present due to games not being released, making people not happy. Company may not be on the ropes, but all the signs are worrying. I don't think it's a coincident they turned to remasters for some quick $. They need a big hit quickly.
    Last edited by Makabreska; 2021-06-06 at 06:46 PM.
    Deep into that darkness peering, long I stood there, wondering, fearing...

  18. #3158
    Quote Originally Posted by Makabreska View Post
    I mean sure, that's where it would stop AFTER they do the cuts if they decided to cancel 9.3. Because I don't think Blizz would plan SL to be two patches from the start if it comes to that. And Blizz is struggling in general, as we know from last reports and interveiws, with pandemic not helping at all.
    What did they cut?

    The story is going the usual pace, and 9.1 handles the shit in 9.0 perfectly. I already said what I thought 9.2 would be about. Seems fitting that it would end there.

    - - - Updated - - -

    9.2 could’ve always been the final patch, you know that yeah? Maybe they wanted SL to be dealt with quicker lol.

    And if not, nothing stops them from 9.3 anyway outside of time. Either way, they said 9.2 would be big, and 9.1 literally finishes off the 9.0 story perfectly. So, I don’t get the argument here.

    Blizzard is lucky they’re only focusing on Life and Death, mainly Death, this expac. Makes shit much easier.

  19. #3159
    The Lightbringer Makabreska's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Orbis Terrarum
    Posts
    3,845
    Quote Originally Posted by TheFirstOnes View Post
    What did they cut?

    The story is going the usual pace, and 9.1 handles the shit in 9.0 perfectly. I already said what I thought 9.2 would be about. Seems fitting that it would end there.
    We don't know what, if anything. But I don't think Blizz planned SL story from the start to be 2 patches only, so if it is, then they would have to make changes during xpac.
    Deep into that darkness peering, long I stood there, wondering, fearing...

  20. #3160
    Quote Originally Posted by Makabreska View Post
    We don't know what, if anything. But I don't think Blizz planned SL story from the start to be 2 patches only, so if it is, then they would have to make changes during xpac.
    Why would they have planned to only make it 2 patches though? After WoD they would have needed a damn good reason, and better yet be upfront about the reason behind doing so. The bad press from another WoD would hardly be silenced by announcing an above average expansion after.

    At best Blizzard could have designed the expansion so a patch could be excised in case of an emergency, which would be good practice, but also something that would require being upfront about.
    The world revamp dream will never die!

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •