Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Edward Wu]

I have yet to see a single comment on any internet page praising the aesthetics and lore of 9.2. I'm sure some people like it, but its so overwhelmingly and vocally disliked that I doubt we will ever see another fractal in Warcraft.

It was probably like Mechagon/Mechagnomes where it was a passion project by devs that ended up being out of touch with what players wanted.

Considering the epilogue looks like the events of Sepulcher are calm enough for everyone to have an trial for Sylvanas afterwards, we are probably just going back to Azeroth and they are going to pretend like this patch didn't happen.

Aeluron is convinced the majority of people share his opinion and that people who do not like it are an annoying minority.

[Foolicious]

it's funny that the whole lore of the patch is hidden in a 2 minute cinematics. When other games make 5 hour lore cutscenes, Warcraft makes 3 minute burps.

Thats because you will have to buy a book with the important information instead.

[Syegfryed]

Sci-fi in warcraft is fine, when it makes sense and align with the races/factions

shadowlands is a clown fest, mixing scifi with something that was supposed to be "spooky" or in a spiritual level, was a fucking miss. Shadowlands definetly do not feel like warcraft, at all, it just borrow the name and the characters.

It was probably like Mechagon/Mechagnomes where it was a passion project by devs that ended up being out of touch with what players wanted.

what are you talking about, people liked mechagon

[Wadrak]

I have yet to see a single comment on any internet page praising the aesthetics and lore of 9.2. I'm sure some people like it, but its so overwhelmingly and vocally disliked that I doubt we will ever see another fractal in Warcraft.

It was probably like Mechagon/Mechagnomes where it was a passion project by devs that ended up being out of touch with what players wanted.

Considering the epilogue looks like the events of Sepulcher are calm enough for everyone to have an trial for Sylvanas afterwards, we are probably just going back to Azeroth and they are going to pretend like this patch didn't happen.

You mean 9.2 or 2.0 Nagrand ??

[Aeluron Lightsong]

No, there's no lore about the First Ones in there either.

They kept the lore information vague on purpose (except for the hint that they made a Zereth for every piece of magic) in case they want to retcon it out of existence. Which they will because very few people like it.

They left it vague because they don't want to close that thread just yet.

[Makorus]

It literally hasn't. Are you really gonna sit there and tell me Warcraft: Orcs & Humans had actual sci-fi elements to it? Feel free to prove me wrong.

Warcraft 1 didn't, but Warcraft 2 literally had helicopters and zeppelins, as well as submarines.

Orcs are literally invading from a different planet through a space portal.

[Raetary]

it's funny that the whole lore of the patch is hidden in a 2 minute cinematics. When other games make 5 hour lore cutscenes, Warcraft makes 3 minute burps.

While i agree that Blizzards approach to wows storytelling is trash, unsustainable and is in desperate need of a reevalutation, FF14 can keep its 16 and a half hours of movie watching per expansion to itself.

I'm absolutely in favor of more story focus and story content, but i'd rather they do it through the game, preferably with in-game dialogue and scenarios than take the FF approach where you sit around for an hour after every 10 minutes of questing.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

Go back to Warcraft.

Can we stop saying things we don't like "isn't Warcraft"? It's cringy as fuck.

[Varx]

It literally hasn't. Are you really gonna sit there and tell me Warcraft: Orcs & Humans had actual sci-fi elements to it? Feel free to prove me wrong.

Well, maybe not orcs and humans, or even W2, not too sure. But W3 had it for sure and Vanilla as well. Back then it was okay but now its somehow over stepped a line?

I mean the tram that connects SW and IF has been in wow since vanilla and that has a very techy vibe that you'd never seen in medieval stuff.

Warcraft has done a good job with mixing the two if you ask me. But then again art is subjective. It's just silly when people act like sci fi hasnt been a part of warcraft for years now.

After what Mechagon and Legion showed us, the sky's the limit at this point.

[huth]

I never fully understood the dislike of "scifi" stuff in the games.

Its like Arthur C. Clarke's Third Law, "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic".

Yeah its got a bit of a techno coating but can easily pass as magic, too.

Golems and Robots, flying castles and spaceships, etc.

And the corollary, any sufficiently analysed magic is indistinguishable from technology. Fantasy and SciFi are not truly seperate genres.

I think there's a fine line and Warcraft did cross that way too much in the last years. TBC was great and totally fit the Warcraft universe, Legion was already borderline. But Shadowlands is just another level, but that's no new complaint.

And you'd be wrong. There's no line, only an indistinct smudge that people insist is a line, even though they can't even agree where it is.

[Wadrak]

Fighting over "is Warcraft scifi or not" is stupid when the problem is that it's judged on a case by case basis.

Some people were put off by TBC, some people were put off by the space stuff in Legion, a LOT of people are put off by Shadowlands and Zereth Mortis in particular. This expansion was a filler vacation from Azeroth while the devs work on.... something else, and they paid the price by alienating a lot of people temporarily(?).

If the next expac is a giant revamp with every race getting a new story and revamped starter zone with questlines etc, people won't really care about SL annoying them, same as how people came back after other expansions they didn't like.

I think scifi is necessary for any large scale fantasy like warcraft

First there is time travel in fantasy, atleast in warcraft, so intelligent beings will try to survive by developing sci-fi technologies. And with time travel you will encounter that.

Also for example there is Burning Legion, which controls large intergalactic empire so is very likely that on such scale one of their planets is technologically developed.

It doesnt take too long for a civilization to move into a technologies we would consider scifi.

Scifi in Warcraft comes mostly because of Burning Legion.

But in any case I consider fantasy genre like warcraft to be primary medieval type era.

[huth]

I think scifi is necessary for any large scale fantasy like warcraft

First there is time travel in fantasy, atleast in warcraft, so intelligent beings will try to survive by developing sci-fi technologies. And with time travel you will encounter that.

Also for example there is Burning Legion, which controls large intergalactic empire so is very likely that on such scale one of their planets is technologically developed.

It doesnt take too long for a civilization to move into a technologies we would consider scifi.

Scifi in Warcraft comes mostly because of Burning Legion.

But in any case I consider fantasy genre like warcraft to be primary medieval type era.

Just look at the timescales involved. Some of the cultures in WoW have many thousand years of history. If anything, what's conspicuous is the lack of advanced technology.

WarCraft is far closer to Renessaince than medieval, though.

[Edward Wu]

After what Mechagon and Legion showed us, the sky's the limit at this point.

That's not a good thing. Art direction and theme is important, and Warcraft should not be a catch-all fantasy game, that will just continue to alienate people and create a product that is less and less recognizable. Warcraft needs to set boundaries and have a set art direction it does not deviate from. This is standard. You either get that or you don't. Not explaining this further.

[Wadrak]

Just look at the timescales involved. Some of the cultures in WoW have many thousand years of history. If anything, what's conspicuous is the lack of advanced technology.

WarCraft is far closer to Renessaince than medieval, though.

Well in renessaince there were no Knights or Footman with Armor. Also Stormwind looks rather medieval. Not to mention bows, catapults.

Also in medieval there was gunpowder, it was developed in 1250 with cannons and handguns.
And medieval age ended in 1450 or so.

But I see what you mean it looks bit like renesaince. Or I dont know.

But I really dislike that alliance steam ship model. Looks awkward.

[bagina]

If the sterile aesthetics of Zereth Mortis are Warcraft then everything is Warcraft. Warcraft has always been about overdesigning, exaggerrated proportions and intense colour palettes, among other things. ZM things are too sterile, too regular, too ascetic, too neutral.

[Zexaniro]

I have yet to see a single comment on any internet page praising the aesthetics and lore of 9.2.

i mean, 9.2 is ugly for wow (before shadowlands) standards, but 9.1 torghast aesthetics that encompassed the entire new zone and raid were far more unpleasant.

[bagina]

.. and all of the assets are actually reused.

Yeah, it's very blatant.

[Varx]

That's not a good thing. Art direction and theme is important, and Warcraft should not be a catch-all fantasy game, that will just continue to alienate people and create a product that is less and less recognizable. Warcraft needs to set boundaries and have a set art direction it does not deviate from. This is standard. You either get that or you don't. Not explaining this further.

I personally think its awesome.

But whats you're line then?

[Aeluron Lightsong]

I personally think its awesome.

But whats you're line then?

His closed vision of Warcraft. Somehow adding some space elements(Its been there since TBC) and I don't think the themes are pushing people away.

[Khaza-R]

His closed vision of Warcraft or else. Somehow adding some space elements(Its been there since TBC) and I don't think the themes are pushing people away.

I would imagine the themes are pretty alienating to a lot fans. Simulated realities, 3D printed gods, experimental lifeforms, etc themes otherwise so divorced from classical fantasy I can get why some people say it "doesn't feel like WarCraft".

But I don't think that's really the main issue with Zereth Mortis. Its just really, really boring looking. Netherstorm in TBC was pretty out in comparison to the standard WarCrafts setting at that point, but at least it was still intriguing looking.