More toxic than ever.

[MoanaLisa]

I don't play with strangers. Trying to do even minimally difficult things with total strangers is a perversion of what being 'social' means. It's not how we relate to people in real life and it's been a mistake from the start to prioritize it in the game.

[poggers]

Sounds like your joining the wrong groups. I’ve full cleared both weeks in pugs only and we have one shot the majority of bosses with very little communication.

I think the issue you’re running into is all the slow levelers are finally hitting an item level they want to try mythics in and it’s getting mixed with people who already know them

[Lazy Gecko]

I prefer pugging, that way more fuckups can happen and I learn more, cause I do need to learn these dungeons. If everyone does 5-8k dps on boss it just melts before anything happens, and I have to learn it on an m+ timer next week, which is not fun.
So as a tank, I actively take in lesser geared players and learn the mechanics now, rather than later. Usually a dps dies in a boss fight, and it's nice and slow, cause what is the rush this week anyway? Most people aren't going for halls, most people don't even go for CE.

Just make sure OP, that you create your own group, stating what this group is for. If you just type in "m0", you get players who are in a hurry to gear their 4th alt for their CE guild mixed in the bag with "horrible" players that didn't play the beta.

This is basically what I do, and it works wonders. It's up to you to set the appropriate discourse on your own terms as early as possible. Had a run in Tirna Scithe earlier where we died quite a lot on most of the bosses but there was no pressure and we all just had a good time figuring out the strats together.

[dacoolist]

So im playing on and off since day one.
Used to play in a very good guild pushing content hard with a few realm first boss kills etc [ive grown up since and dont care for trivial stuff like that anymore] more power to those that do but its just not for me anymore, life is too busy for that.
These days im a lot more casual, no interest in raiding but do like to do mythics.
My guild have died off so im pugging content but my god is this game more toxic than ever.
Every single mythic run there are arguments, toxic abuse, really bad stuff not just blame game etc.
Its actually got to the stage where im questioning playing anymore as im holding my breath every time i join a mythic group, its just too stressful.
Maybe its a society thing but im not so sure as i play other games and few are this toxic.
Grow a thick skin you might say but ive grown a very thick one over the last 16 years but right now im finding it hard to log in anymore.

Youre going to sit here and tell ME, probably the worst wow player in history - that people are having issues in M0s?

Look, I’ve wiped a few times, 100% Ive seen people pull crazy mobs and wipe the group.. but people arguing or having issues on some of the easiest content in the ENTIRE history of WOW..

Wtf you going to do running an M+2 lololo, like what happens when you’re running dungeons multiple times harder AND you get ONE SINGLE fucken piece of loot for the ENTIRE group at the end of the run... come on: something is wrong here and no offense, I doubt it’s the groups you’re in: it’s You

[Doffen]

Done a few dungeons myself and have yet to see any toxicity in SL. In the open world its all friendly too.

The most toxic people I have met so far is my guildies when we point out when a guildie get loot and get pissed on how lucky he/she is all the time!

[T-34]

Sounds like your joining the wrong groups. I’ve full cleared both weeks in pugs only and we have one shot the majority of bosses with very little communication.

I think the issue you’re running into is all the slow levelers are finally hitting an item level they want to try mythics in and it’s getting mixed with people who already know them

Yes, the OPs problem is that he doesn't do his due diligence when he either joins or creates a group.
When people with different skill and/or attitude are put together it can only have negative consequences for both parties.
And it should be added that if the OP constantly has "toxic" experiences then it is 100% his own problem as he is the common factor.

We can't say if the OP is better than the groups he joins or worse, but he certainly plays with the wrong people and that is solely his own fault.

- - - Updated - - -

Oh yeah its bad, welcome to the online world, where people act shitty because its anonymous. Experienced it already in SL (we were in a NORMAL dungeon), friend says, sorry sec just answering door, in the middle of a trash pack, hes gone for less than 20s before they vote kicked him. Its disgusting attitude imo, they then kick me for protesting. In my opinion, and I dont give a fuck what anyone here says, they all deserve to be punished for being such fucking dicks.

I would kick your friend as well and I always initiate a kick when someone goes AFK because it is extremely rude to waste other people's time. And more often than not the AFK'er gets kicked.
And if you reacted with the same language as you do here you should be happy that you got away with just getting kicked. Had they reported you as well then you would most likely gotten an infraction.

And lastly they were perfectly within their right to kick your friend. Let me remind you of Blizzard's kick policy:

"Groups are empowered to manage their own members through the vote-kick system. If the majority of the group feels a player should be removed, they can initiate a vote-kick to remove them. The system is entirely under the control of our players. Players may choose to remove any other player from the group for any reason, provided the vote to kick passes." (my bolding)
https://eu.battle.net/support/en/article/52363

Tell your friend not to be rude to other people by wasting their time.

[Piando]

My boyfriend (healer) and I (dps) are forming our own groups for the mythic dungeons. We call them "chill group, no rush" in the tool and so far I've only had chill people and even some very nice people that we had a conversation with. This works well to avoid toxic people who generally avoid groups that are not in a rush.

[Eurhetemec]

Found the bad.
I'm not ever the person raging at groups like this. I just leave. However, I do always have competitive IOs, plethora of orange parses, etc. I'm in favor of the toxic attitudes all you people are talking about because what it results in is less scrubs queueing and leaving me with an easier time of randomly getting people who are actually good at the game.

Please keep your "hurr durr toxic epeen people are usually actually BAD at the game!" mentality to yourself. It's a lie you and other bads tell themselves. If you were actually playing "perfectly" you wouldn't be doing bad numbers that make it "not good enough" for the other person. Are they assholes? Sure. But I'll take a capable asshole over an incapable nice guy 10/10 times.

TL;DR: If you can't stand the heat, stay the fuck out the kitchen. Git Gud before subjecting other people to yourself, because ain't nobody got time for dat. I've literally chainpulled and solo'd tons of mythic dungeons because the rest of the squad was taking too long and they literally weren't needed, but I wanted that loot satchel.

Like I said, you're bullshitting, and you're directly admitting to causing and encouraging toxicity.

You may not be bad - not all toxic players are - just the vast majority of them. The mindless checkboxer attitude combined with thinking it's totally okay to act like a vile piece of shit (this isn't an insult, you're saying you are "in favour of toxic attitudes" above) even if it wastes tons of time and achieves nothing is why there are still toxic people in the game.

Most of them are extremely bad.

You're having the exact kind of tantrum I'm describing and trying really desperately to claim I'm bad, but you know perfectly well that most people who act and think toxically are terrible and cause the problem. And you say you "just leave". I don't believe you - because you contradict yourself by claiming you "solo" Mythics (sure mate, sure you do, that's definitely an honest and truthful statement and you not exaggerating a situation that happened once when you happened to have massively OP gear and the dungeon was nearly finished already or something) when people aren't good enough. As for "bad numbers", that's my point. I don't see much toxicity over "bad numbers". Toxic people ignore "bad numbers" 9 times in 10. Or they blame the wrong person, like screaming at the healer for not doing enough DPS when it's actually the DPS who are shit (often the DPS are their mates, though), which is especially funny if the group isn't even having a problem. Toxic people throw fits for other reasons most of the time, often related to people's specs or choices, or routes through dungeons or the like. Or they do something suicidally stupid and decide to pull for the tank when the tank is barely surviving the current pull, then have a mental breakdown when the tank dies. Toxic people almost never are the tank or the healer, I note.

The thing is, toxicity is actually kind of rare, because people are horrific as you're describing are rare - and again, usually bad. The whole checkboxer attitude is the sign of bad who desperately wants a path to be seen as good which doesn't involve him actually having to learn to use his brain.

As for "if you can't stand the heat", the fuck is that supposed to mean lol? You're advocating for pouring petrol all over the kitchen floor and then lighting a match lol! That's not "the heat" that accompanies cooking. That's a ton of totally unnecessary, time-wasting flaming.

Re-reading your post I finally understood the issue - you're in denial. You think that you don't get much toxicity directed at you because you're "playing perfectly". Nah mate. You don't get toxicity because there isn't much. And you're assuming, in the amazing way, that your magical unicorn presence of awesome playing is preventing it. It ain't. Yeah, there's like a correlation between successful groups and low toxicity - because genuinely good and confident players mostly aren't toxic. You even claim you're good, but also claim you don't ever engage in toxicity. So you'd think you'd make that connection. The people who are toxic are bads playing above their level 9 times in 10, and following the checkboxing Karen approach you've described.

[cface]

My boyfriend (healer) and I (dps) are forming our own groups for the mythic dungeons. We call them "chill group, no rush" in the tool and so far I've only had chill people and even some very nice people that we had a conversation with. This works well to avoid toxic people who generally avoid groups that are not in a rush.

Worked every single time since the start of BFA for me, and I played all 4 seasons. I even stated "weekly completion" on my 15 runs just cause it attracted some chill guys that don't tilt like a teenage girl cause the route isn't exactly as they thought it would be, or we had a wipe or two. Still plenty of time to complete.
Use rio to get the skills, the description to get the adults.

[Matsumotto]

I rarely do anything as "difficult" as mythic dungeons these days, and when i do, i just go in expecting a terrible experience. I realize that the "good players" use things like raider.io or whatever to pick other experienced players to play with, so odds are that the players you run these dungeons with are the leftovers, the baddies or toxic players. If you go in expecting to have a bad experience, you're either gonna be right and happy you were so, or wrong and just as happy, lol.

[vitor210]

So im playing on and off since day one.
Used to play in a very good guild pushing content hard with a few realm first boss kills etc [ive grown up since and dont care for trivial stuff like that anymore] more power to those that do but its just not for me anymore, life is too busy for that.
These days im a lot more casual, no interest in raiding but do like to do mythics.
My guild have died off so im pugging content but my god is this game more toxic than ever.
Every single mythic run there are arguments, toxic abuse, really bad stuff not just blame game etc.
Its actually got to the stage where im questioning playing anymore as im holding my breath every time i join a mythic group, its just too stressful.
Maybe its a society thing but im not so sure as i play other games and few are this toxic.
Grow a thick skin you might say but ive grown a very thick one over the last 16 years but right now im finding it hard to log in anymore.

1) Join a guild

2) STOP Pugging for the love of Jesus

3) Focus on having fun, this is a game after all

4) Everytime you find a group that downs a boss pretty easily take some notes on what you guys did to make it go smoothly. Explain these tactics to your new group when you're redoing the boss, not only will this help the boss go down faster, but it's less drama due to wipes AND you come out as a cool dude for helping others, which means people will eventually praise you, which means they'll probably add you as friends and they'll want to play with you later. This is the bases for WoW

[NineSpine]

Gaming* 2020

I experience nothing like this in any other cooperative game I play.

[Dastreus]

WoW? Toxic? Nooooo

[shise]

To be honest, I don´t remember a time when pugging wasn´t toxic.

Only in BC when I was also in the competitive scene, and you would "pug" on the weekend some older raid tier with your competitor guild for some still needed rings and what not. But I barely call it pug unless it is full of randoms.

Random. That is the word. It adds risk and chances.. hence the toxicity. Do not expect less

[erifwodahs]

I experience nothing like this in any other cooperative game I play.

League, Apex, CS:GO, FN not so much, CoD, PuBG absolutely. Wanna talk about The Rust? OW is better now, but was really bad at some point and now OW is not same demographic as WoW. Dota2, FF on higher end content. Thank God Hearthstone does not have any real chat Oh, Amon Us is the one of the new additions, playing with randoms there is absolute crap, people raging, snitching or straight up trolling if you call em out or if someone was not doing what someone thinks they should have done.

[Sinte]

Sounds like you're miserable, aren't getting any enjoyment out of the game anymore, and aren't having much if any fun. Holding your breath in anything but anticipation of a Mythic run sounds like a bad thing. And it sounds more like a human nature problem, or a fundamental nature of MMOs and anonymous internet problem, and not something Blizzard can fix. So quit - sounds like a good decision to me. What do you lose?

I wouldn't say blizzard can't fix it - look at FFXIV. You'll almost never get abused by other players, unless you're in discord with them or something. They have strict etiquette that stops you from harassing or insulting other people. Now I'm sure plenty of people in WoW are going to be "but muh rights" and all that, but it IS possible to enforce and obtain.

[Ryzeth]

Done 16 mythics so far.

8 each week. All of them completed successfully. Every single one with different PuG group, found from the tool. Literally not a single one had toxic attitude from anyone, despite few wipes.

I've done every mythic, both weeks now, on four different characters. Have had a total of 1 toxic person in all of them, and he calmed down after a few minutes.

[NineSpine]

League, Apex, CS:GO, FN not so much, CoD, PuBG absolutely. Wanna talk about The Rust? OW is better now, but was really bad at some point and now OW is not same demographic as WoW. Dota2, FF on higher end content. Thank God Hearthstone does not have any real chat Oh, Amon Us is the one of the new additions, playing with randoms there is absolute crap, people raging, snitching or straight up trolling if you call em out or if someone was not doing what someone thinks they should have done.

All competitive games, not cooperative games. Everyone knows competitive games are toxic as hell. If this behavior was isolated to PvP in wow, we wouldn't be having this conversation. WoW has a uniquely toxic cooperative game.

- - - Updated - - -

seems like most of these "good" players are usually pretty bad ones in a hurry who get mad at you for not being useful enough for them to achieve their goal

I'm recovering from the devastating effects of this truth bomb.

[Magneto]

the degree of toxicity is also dependant on your role: if you sign up as tank and cant tank or if you sign up as healer and cant heal is very different from being a not so good dps.

[chiddie]

This should be stickied.

Again, a guild does not mean “yey no more pugs”, no guilds can make you enter an m+ whatever the level of m+ and whenever you login in a time slot of 10-15 minutes.

There will be MANY times you’ll have to pug anyways.