First Day of Raiding Statistics: DPS

[AntenoraDK]

No uh dk that knows what they are doing has a lego right now either.

This.

Bad UHDK's will have a legendary right now.

Super bad UHDK's will have crafted Reanimated Shambler.

[ymirsson]

I don't get what you're saying with your first sentence. Both of us likely aren't in guilds where playing a suboptimal spec would get us benched anyway. I'm stating in order for a DH, monk, or pally to DPS they are locked into one spec, regardless of how shitty it's doing in the logs. They cannot DPS as any other spec (unless you want to do some shitty healer dps build and gimp your raid). No one has to play another spec if their main dps spec is doing poorly, but at least pures have the option. That's also much better than rerolling a completely new class, which is what the aforementioned classes HAVE to do if they want better DPS.

Either you have the right to tell your raid members to change specs regardless of role, because your raid has the intent of clearing more difficult content, or you do not.
I don't see a specific middle ground where you would tell pure DPS to respec, but not hybrids. Sounds like baseless favoritism to me.
That's what i am trying to say. But for about 95% of raids, it is not a deciding factor either way, before you antagonize a raid member you could simply play tighter instead of respeccing.

[Fallen Angel]

Either you have the right to tell your raid members to change specs regardless of role, because your raid has the intent of clearing more difficult content, or you do not.
I don't see a specific middle ground where you would tell pure DPS to respec, but not hybrids. Sounds like baseless favoritism to me.
That's what i am trying to say. But for about 95% of raids, it is not a deciding factor either way, before you antagonize a raid member you could simply play tighter instead of respeccing.

I'm not telling anyone to do anything, so I don't get why you're insinuating I am. I'm saying in the hypothetical world of warcraft if someone has a bad dps spec, and two good dps specs, they have the option of rolling onto those better specs if they don't like how their spec is doing. 3 classes out of 12 only have 1 dps spec so either they reroll, or they deal with their underperforming spec. Healing or tanking is not an option if they want to dps which is what this entire thread is about. Nowhere did I tell anyone to go respec or reroll. That is just what the options are.

[ymirsson]

I'm not telling anyone to do anything, so I don't get why you're insinuating I am. I'm saying in the hypothetical world of warcraft if someone has a bad dps spec, and two good dps specs, they have the option of rolling onto those better specs if they don't like how their spec is doing. 3 classes out of 12 only have 1 dps spec so either they reroll, or they deal with their underperforming spec. Healing or tanking is not an option if they want to dps which is what this entire thread is about. Nowhere did I tell anyone to go respec or reroll. That is just what the options are.

You don't understand which distinction i am trying to make.
I am playing sub rogue.
I might not want to play outlaw, even though it might perform better.
At which point do i need to respec to a spec unwanted by me just to satisfy some DPS check or similar?


Or differently: unless i am partaking in the world first race or runner ups, why would the need for 3% more performance compel me to respec? And why the same not be true for a ret paladin?


or even differently; are you playing a hybrid trying to justify your subpar DPS?

[Fallen Angel]

You don't understand which distinction i am trying to make.
I am playing sub rogue.
I might not want to play outlaw, even though it might perform better.
At which point do i need to respec to a spec unwanted by me just to satisfy some DPS check or similar?


Or differently: unless i am partaking in the world first race or runner ups, why would the need for 3% more performance compel me to respec? And why the same not be true for a ret paladin?


or even differently; are you playing a hybrid trying to justify your subpar DPS?

I'm not telling you or anyone how, or what to play. That's up to your raid leader. I've simply stated if 3 of the hybrids want to dps, they MUST play their ONE dps spec. Pures have 3 different specs if they want to go uber optimal. Not sure how you're not getting that.

I don't appreciate the shade being thrown at me for playing enhance because I like it and they actually do decent this expac, but hey, go you I guess

[ymirsson]

I'm not telling you or anyone how, or what to play. That's up to your raid leader. I've simply stated if 3 of the hybrids want to dps, they MUST play their ONE dps spec. Pures have 3 different specs if they want to go uber optimal. Not sure how you're not getting that.

I don't appreciate the shade being thrown at me for playing enhance because I like it and they actually do decent this expac, but hey, go you I guess

I do get that. But i can't see a compelling reason to make that necessary, unless you are playing in a guild with an above average goal. Where that point is, that makes personal satisfaction less important then raid performance, that's a completely different discussion. But saying "you have 3 DPS specs" is not very convincing by itself.

[Crutos]

can someone tell me what the "score" at the bottom means?

[msdos]

Frost DK scales really well, can only get better.

Unholy got straight up spoiled, but they were completely useless in the first raid tier of BFA and most of Legion without the legendary changes. Unholy was basically an M+ and pvp spec, using it in raids felt horrible and did bad damage.
I got so frustrated with Unholy I dropped it right before Nya'lotha, then it suddenly became god mode. Good for them.

[Specialka]

I do get that. But i can't see a compelling reason to make that necessary, unless you are playing in a guild with an above average goal. Where that point is, that makes personal satisfaction less important then raid performance, that's a completely different discussion. But saying "you have 3 DPS specs" is not very convincing by itself.

In theory, you are wrong, he is right. In practice, unless you aim for top performance, your little debate does not matter. Period.

Most of the time, it is up to personal preference. I play an Arcane mage, I do not want to play frost or fire, I won't switch to those spec as I am top dps of my raid, though it seems, according to current log that fire performs better.

[blankfaced]

Offhealing is just one form of utility.. Why are you ignoring the utility that pure dps specs bring? I'd trade that for Turtle/Cloak/Ice Block, rogues and hunters have often been taken just for their ability to cheese boss mechanics.

Yeah and off healing isn't the only utility hybrids bring. I've seen feral druids save raids swapping to bear to tank. Yet somehow that level of utility is still capable of pulling off the same dps as classes who're incapable of such things?

And you would never trade all your offhealing for a five minute cooldown immobile immunity for ten seconds....I know, because i would never give up all my druids healing for that trash.

[InfernalDark]

Nerf UH, buff assa and we're done.

[intenz]

Weird how Blizzard were so much better at tuning DPS in TBC all those years ago. Get these hybrids away from the top of the meters...

[Gorsameth]

Weird how Blizzard were so much better at tuning DPS in TBC all those years ago. Get these hybrids away from the top of the meters...

if your going to troll atleast put the tiniest bit of effort into it.

[Metrox]

Anytime that I see Blizzard putting an "X% buff to all powers" on a class, that says to me they have no clue what to do and need to throw out a quick fix. Usually it is 5% and that is what we see tossed on Assa Rogues, Fury Warriors, and Havoc DH. Thanks to the people who posted the charts of dps earlier. I like to think that Blizzard carefully studies each and every post and saw these poor specs at the bottom. I simmed my Assa Rogue and converted him over to Subtlety (which I have never played before in all 16 years). He simmed about 26% higher in Sub spec. 5% boost? LOLOLOL........Keep guessing Blizzard.....even a blind squirrel finds a nut sometime!

[intenz]

if your going to troll atleast put the tiniest bit of effort into it.

*You're.

And no I'm not trolling, this DPS tuning is comically bad. You have a pure dps spec barely above tanks and hybrids crushing meters. Tuning was better in TBC. That isn't an opinion it is fact.

Anytime that I see Blizzard putting an "X% buff to all powers" on a class, that says to me they have no clue what to do and need to throw out a quick fix. Usually it is 5% and that is what we see tossed on Assa Rogues, Fury Warriors, and Havoc DH. Thanks to the people who posted the charts of dps earlier. I like to think that Blizzard carefully studies each and every post and saw these poor specs at the bottom. I simmed my Assa Rogue and converted him over to Subtlety (which I have never played before in all 16 years). He simmed about 26% higher in Sub spec. 5% boost? LOLOLOL........Keep guessing Blizzard.....even a blind squirrel finds a nut sometime!

Assassination's mechanics never got updated, especially with the addition of SnD further making the spec slow and clunky. Throwing 5% modifiers on specs is a band-aid but truly assassination will be worthless until its' mechanics are looked at.