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  1. #1121
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    Personally, I found WoD to be far better than this. This was not an expansion to be dismissed lightly; this was an expansion to be thrown with great force.
    Any previous expansion was better than SL, by far.

  2. #1122
    Shadowlands is the hollow husk of far better expansions past. It's as if every gameplay decision is designed by a team of accountants who have never actually played WoW, just faceless suits counting MAU's and token sales and scrutinizing engagement metrics. This game is rotten to the core, and it's sad people are still paying Blizzard for the privilege.
    Last edited by Antero; 2021-04-16 at 11:24 PM.

  3. #1123
    I still can't decide for myself if Shadowlands is worse than BfA or not. After BfA, Blizzard needed to come back with a BANG! like they did with Legion. Shadowlands definitely was the opposite - but I haven't made up my mind yet. Shadowlands still is young and the first weeks were miles ahead of BfA, but in the end?
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again

  4. #1124
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    I still can't decide for myself if Shadowlands is worse than BfA or not. After BfA, Blizzard needed to come back with a BANG! like they did with Legion. Shadowlands definitely was the opposite - but I haven't made up my mind yet. Shadowlands still is young and the first weeks were miles ahead of BfA, but in the end?
    BfA was also somewhat praised at the very start too. WoD was praised at the start.

    Legion was hated at the start due to how many half assed and not thought out gameplay systems that they introduced and fixed over months.
    Last edited by Toppy; 2021-04-17 at 11:19 AM.
    World needs more Goblin Warriors https://i.imgur.com/WKs8aJA.jpg

  5. #1125
    Quote Originally Posted by Toppy View Post
    BfA was also somewhat praised at the very start too. WoD was praised at the start.

    Legion was hated at the start due to how many half assed and not thought out gameplay systems that they introduced and fixed over months.
    I don’t remember anyone praising BfA. From my experience it was universally hated, due to the horrible faction war theme and Azerite gear, which was abysmal until major revamps and essences in 8.2.

    I remember people praising the setting and art, which was understandable, but seems to be the only praise WoW gets nowadays.
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again

  6. #1126
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    I don’t remember anyone praising BfA. From my experience it was universally hated, due to the horrible faction war theme and Azerite gear, which was abysmal until major revamps and essences in 8.2.

    I remember people praising the setting and art, which was understandable, but seems to be the only praise WoW gets nowadays.
    Funny enough Shadowlands praise in that respect has been somewhat of a mixed bag. People admit it looks great, but a common complaint i see leveled at it, is that while fantastic looking and neat, it's not really Warcraft. That its like someone just shoved another setting into Warcraft and we're told to not question it.
    World needs more Goblin Warriors https://i.imgur.com/WKs8aJA.jpg

  7. #1127
    Quote Originally Posted by Toppy View Post
    Funny enough Shadowlands praise in that respect has been somewhat of a mixed bag. People admit it looks great, but a common complaint i see leveled at it, is that while fantastic looking and neat, it's not really Warcraft. That its like someone just shoved another setting into Warcraft and we're told to not question it.
    I totally agree with that. Shadowlands looks good, yes. But for me in most parts it’s just not Warcraft. It feels completely detached from the Warcraft franchise and I dislike the lore and retcons in Shadowlands as well. It’s just a mess.
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again

  8. #1128
    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    I totally agree with that. Shadowlands looks good, yes. But for me in most parts it’s just not Warcraft. It feels completely detached from the Warcraft franchise and I dislike the lore and retcons in Shadowlands as well. It’s just a mess.
    What makes it worse is that the new starting experience: Exiles Reach, has such a nostalgic, warcraft feel to it. So its like, here is blizzard showing us that they can give us exactly that goodness. And then Shadowlands is the exact opposite. Shadowlands is someone on the art teams personal project they got the go ahead to slam into Warcraft.
    World needs more Goblin Warriors https://i.imgur.com/WKs8aJA.jpg

  9. #1129
    To me, the best this expansion could get is Legion tier (mid pack for my opinion) if it expanded upon and added more to its systems to help even it out -- hopefully on a timeline faster than Legion.

    The issue with SL over Legion is going to be the disconnect in story to Azeroth. Usually people find more interest in stories that have consequences for the world their character is in -- and nothing so far shows this. People may like the aspect of the afterlife explorations and the general concepts with the four zones (I find myself in this camp) -- but outside of that, if you dont have that connection: you're going to hate the story and not care. Legion at least had the imminent BL "threat" and only slipped off the tracks when we somehow ended up on Argus to fight a Titan.

  10. #1130
    Quote Originally Posted by Toppy View Post
    What makes it worse is that the new starting experience: Exiles Reach, has such a nostalgic, warcraft feel to it. So its like, here is blizzard showing us that they can give us exactly that goodness. And then Shadowlands is the exact opposite. Shadowlands is someone on the art teams personal project they got the go ahead to slam into Warcraft.
    Yeah it’s a pity. I hate how they try to connect all the lose ends to Shadowlands, I hate that Denathrius is the head of the Nathrezim and the Jailer sent the Nathrezim to the Legion or whatever... this is all so silly and idiotic, I can’t even tell. They try to make the Jailer someone who clearly isn’t. You can’t develop a Sargeras level villain within a sole expansion or even less like that, yet Blizzard‘s writer try to achieve exactly that and they fail massively. For me the Jailer is no threat, he’s a clown. But he is the mastermind behind the creation of the Lich King and the Legion stuff etc? I shake my head and lol.
    MAGA - Make Alliance Great Again

  11. #1131
    Quote Originally Posted by Necrosaro123 View Post
    Remove WoW or whatever game you have in that SSD. ESO is going to be your new main game. Is worth it.
    This happened to me. I'm watching ESO continually get better and WoW continually get worse. Once I got fully invested in ESO crafting, thievery, customization, story and lore... I looked back at WoW and just cleared it off my drive. Truth is for WoW to catch up to what ESO is now it's going to take a massive update that won't happen until 10.0 and that's potentially 2 years away.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Toppy View Post
    What makes it worse is that the new starting experience: Exiles Reach, has such a nostalgic, warcraft feel to it. So its like, here is blizzard showing us that they can give us exactly that goodness. And then Shadowlands is the exact opposite. Shadowlands is someone on the art teams personal project they got the go ahead to slam into Warcraft.
    Agreed. Exile's reach was my favorite Shadowlands content lol. And I'm a 800+ days played veteran, but it really hit a modern vanilla feels for me.

  12. #1132
    Quote Originally Posted by ro9ue View Post
    This happened to me. I'm watching ESO continually get better and WoW continually get worse. Once I got fully invested in ESO crafting, thievery, customization, story and lore... I looked back at WoW and just cleared it off my drive. Truth is for WoW to catch up to what ESO is now it's going to take a massive update that won't happen until 10.0 and that's potentially 2 years away.

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    Agreed. Exile's reach was my favorite Shadowlands content lol. And I'm a 800+ days played veteran, but it really hit a modern vanilla feels for me.
    I'm not going to lie to you but...The first time i did Thieves Guild i was impressed how fun it was. But not only that, its also useful in order to make gold + getting important skills. Being a Nightblade is so freaking fun in ESO.

    The only thing i didnt like about ESO, is that for a new player, it make take a Month or 2, to get professions research done. It took me a lot of time getting Jewelcrafting to max level + unlock all the traits on it, mostly because it was expensive and time consuming. Those researches takes a lot of time to be done. But at least ESO professions are really useful....something I'm afraid i cant say for WoW.

    Btw....Why we dont have House system in WoW?....or being able to collect old set items and use them? (Blizzard literally invented the set items with Diablo 2, and they are not doing it right in WoW....weird....) or what about making the old world relevant again?, instead of 1 shooting everything. I mean, no wonder why people leave WoW fast, once they do the endgame content they are more than done with the game.

  13. #1133
    Quote Originally Posted by Necrosaro123 View Post
    I'm not going to lie to you but...The first time i did Thieves Guild i was impressed how fun it was. But not only that, its also useful in order to make gold + getting important skills. Being a Nightblade is so freaking fun in ESO.

    The only thing i didnt like about ESO, is that for a new player, it make take a Month or 2, to get professions research done. It took me a lot of time getting Jewelcrafting to max level + unlock all the traits on it, mostly because it was expensive and time consuming. Those researches takes a lot of time to be done. But at least ESO professions are really useful....something I'm afraid i cant say for WoW.

    Btw....Why we dont have House system in WoW?....or being able to collect old set items and use them? (Blizzard literally invented the set items with Diablo 2, and they are not doing it right in WoW....weird....) or what about making the old world relevant again?, instead of 1 shooting everything. I mean, no wonder why people leave WoW fast, once they do the endgame content they are more than done with the game.
    For some reason the modern dev team has a massive hate boner for player housing. Remember when they claimed to have given us player housing via that garrison system which lacked the most important aspect of player housing? The customization? Hard to forget that bullshit.
    World needs more Goblin Warriors https://i.imgur.com/WKs8aJA.jpg

  14. #1134
    The Good:
    -Chromie Time
    -Shadowlands leveling
    -PvP vendors
    -No endless power grind
    -Craftable legendaries that augment gameplay
    -Titanforging removed
    -Alt friendliness

    The bad:
    -Covenant restrictions
    -Renown
    -Choreghast
    -PvP gear in PvE
    -PvP gear being rating-locked
    -World Quests 2.0

    The ugly:
    -The story
    -Soulbinds
    -Conduits
    -The great vault
    -The anima system & covenant sanctum upgrades

  15. #1135
    The Insane Glorious Leader's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bloodykiller86 View Post
    man people complain about "systems" in shadowlands when pretty much all of them are trivial or optional to do
    Which is the problem because what people called forced content in the past was other people's character progression. Now the game just ends.
    The hammer comes down:
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    Normal should be reduced in difficulty. Heroic should be reduced in difficulty.
    And the tiny fraction for whom heroic raids are currently well tuned? Too bad,so sad! With the arterial bleed of subs the fastest it's ever been, the vanity development that gives you guys your own content is no longer supportable.

  16. #1136
    Quote Originally Posted by Toppy View Post
    For some reason the modern dev team has a massive hate boner for player housing. Remember when they claimed to have given us player housing via that garrison system which lacked the most important aspect of player housing? The customization? Hard to forget that bullshit.
    I don't see the modern devs hating it anymore than the wannabe bro-gamers of yesteryear that dictated the direction of the game until the end of WoD. Frankly I think the current devs just have not found a good way to implement it in a way that allows them to show absolutely no commitment like almost all new systems they've added since WoD. At best they have issues with their engine and database, like dynamic loading of many objects (with collisions) and storing all this in a characters dataset.

    As much as I dislike Ion and his empty lawyer talk, at least he (or his team) stated that they want to implement it, but just haven't found a way to do it justice. Even as the empty platitude that this is, it's an upgrade over "we need to add our Blizzard spin to it" that got us garrisons. You can at least argue that they might realize that WoD had nothing to do with housing.
    /tar Tinker-zealot /point /lol
    WoW:Shadowlands - Danuser's Divina Commedia?

    koko := coocoo

  17. #1137
    Quote Originally Posted by Wangming View Post
    I did. Two times in fact. I quite like it, but not as much as FFXIV. Somehow it just didn't click. If I ever get a better PC and a good enough income to support multiple MMOs I might get my hands on all th expansions and start a fresh character with Greymoor. I'm a sucker of dark gothic vampire stories.
    Usually, when a game doesn't click like that it's because you just don't like the core gameplay loop despite all the features being attractive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Necrosaro123 View Post
    the bad endgame content that start to feel more like collection Garrision resources in order to upgrade your Garrison
    I really wish people would realize anima is garrison resources. It's always been garrison resources. It was always intended to be garrison resources.

  18. #1138
    The Lightbringer Wangming's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shaetha View Post
    Usually, when a game doesn't click like that it's because you just don't like the core gameplay loop despite all the features being attractive.

    - - - Updated - - -


    I guess. Can't really put my finger on it. I know what put me off BDO was the interface, primarily. For SWTOR it was how they acted every single time during login as if I used a different computer. And how there wasn't much to do once you've reached the end of the main story.
    For WoW, it was the story, the animations, the class mechanics, all the subsystems designed to waste your time, and the unengaging profession system. This seems to an excessive ammount of negativity regarding WoW, but you know, out of these I've spent the most time playing WoW. I'm not even sure my FFXIV playtime is above WoW's yet. So I have more impressions and therefore more chance to find something that rubs me the wrong way.

  19. #1139
    Quote Originally Posted by Glorious Leader View Post
    Which is the problem because what people called forced content in the past was other people's character progression. Now the game just ends.
    what are you talking about? the game doesnt end until you've completed all relevant content such as Mythic raids, all 15 keys, PvP etc etc lol like theres really no end at all unless you got 100% of achievements

  20. #1140
    Bloodsail Admiral Pheraz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nyel View Post
    I still can't decide for myself if Shadowlands is worse than BfA or not. After BfA, Blizzard needed to come back with a BANG! like they did with Legion. Shadowlands definitely was the opposite - but I haven't made up my mind yet. Shadowlands still is young and the first weeks were miles ahead of BfA, but in the end?
    Subjectively, Bfa had a better atmosphere and felt like two coherent new land masses, plus the awesome naga zone.

    Objectively, for a casual like me there was much much more to do in Bfa than in shadowlands.

    I already miss Bfa and come back to Boralus from time to time for the vibes
    Vynd | Zorn | Pheraz | Silwyna | Mondlicht | Eis | Blut | Emerelle - My personal Kaldorei army <3 I miss Bfa

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