Should TBC have LFR?

[tikcol]

With TBC on the horizon many players are now asking themselves if Classic TBC will follow the same philosophy as Classic.

Among those are players like me that realize that LFR is the most sought out piece of content in WoW ever. Since it was introduced and to this day.

The question remains. Why is that?

The answer is simple. Players for the most part do not want to partake in forced grouping which leads to undesirable socializing. We shouldn't be forced to do it.

TBC raids are very complex and time inducing in their preparations. Dozens of pre-quests, material farming, profession optimization, etc.

Nowadays their intended audience has grown up. We do not have time to do everything and remain competitive. Which brings me to this easy solution.

Introduce LFR in Classic TBC. Create group automization where players aren't forced to spam trade chat 24/7 looking for other players.

This pillar of forced socialization baked into WoW development philosophy doesn't work anymore in 2020 just like Shadowlands has proven. One of the biggest critics of Classic WoW was the lack of group creation tools which led to much misery among players and led many to unsubscribe, like me.

LFR and all solo or semi solo systems are the most beloved pieces of content. We should want the best for this expansion.

What do you think?

[Lord Pebbleton]

I don't think TBC should have LFR.

My reasoning is that LFR is way too hard for the average player. I'd wager that a lot of them would not even have consumables like flasks in order to push through the first few encounters.

All in all, the skill required to clear a wing would be so massive, that players would just abandon it in droves, and deprive the whole community of a source of gear.

[Twelveplay]

Man if u're grown up and don't have time to do stuff just don't do it?
Just move on play solitaire or something. Leave people that have time to do this stuff do it and stop trying to change stuff to your needs.
U can just level a shadowlands char and go do old content when u feel like it and see how bosses look if that's what u want.

[tikcol]

Man if u're grown up and don't have time to do stuff just don't do it?
Just move on play solitaire or something. Leave people that have time to do this stuff do it and stop trying to change stuff to your needs.
U can just level a shadowlands char and go do old content when u feel like it and see how bosses look if that's what u want.

Why should Blizzard catter to the minority?

[Segus1992]

Guys, this is a troll thread, come on. OP is fully aware that LFR is one of the things the Classic community hates the most. Don't take such obvious bait.

[tikcol]

I don't think TBC should have LFR.

My reasoning is that LFR is way too hard for the average player. I'd wager that a lot of them would not even have consumables like flasks in order to push through the first few encounters.

All in all, the skill required to clear a wing would be so massive, that players would just abandon it in droves, and deprive the whole community of a source of gear.

Yes the difficulty is indeed a very real concern so are the raid lockouts.

My suggestion is, remove raid lockouts and introduce 2 pieces of epics per week maxium and make it so people that join through LFR have an easier time.

Either remove mechanics, tinker with the numbers, etc.

[Twelveplay]

Are u some sort of troll?
why is this discussed every single time on this forum.
why should blizzard cater to you? Who are you?
The game was fine when it was released some time ago and people loved it and it has evolved into being user friendly for everybody.
Just play the better and evolved version and let nerds just paly hours and hours to see old content and everybody is happy.

what's your issue?

[Coldfrostzero]

With TBC on the horizon many players are now asking themselves if Classic TBC will follow the same philosophy as Classic.

Among those are players like me that realize that LFR is the most sought out piece of content in WoW ever. Since it was introduced and to this day.

The question remains. Why is that?

The answer is simple. Players for the most part do not want to partake in forced grouping which leads to undesirable socializing. We shouldn't be forced to do it.

TBC raids are very complex and time inducing in their preparations. Dozens of pre-quests, material farming, profession optimization, etc.

Nowadays their intended audience has grown up. We do not have time to do everything and remain competitive. Which brings me to this easy solution.

Introduce LFR in Classic TBC. Create group automization where players aren't forced to spam trade chat 24/7 looking for other players.

This pillar of forced socialization baked into WoW development philosophy doesn't work anymore in 2020 just like Shadowlands has proven. One of the biggest critics of Classic WoW was the lack of group creation tools which led to much misery among players and led many to unsubscribe, like me.

LFR and all solo or semi solo systems are the most beloved pieces of content. We should want the best for this expansion.

What do you think?

Burning Crusade had an LFG mechanic. It just wasn't that great. If they didn't do automated grouping and always had it like pugging for raids and M+ then the game would have never become a dumpster fire of anonymity without any social aspects.

The cross-realm, random group, click a button thing was in Wrath and that was the start of making everything too easy. They tried to bring back harder dungeons in Cata to start and people complained up a storm because random groups couldn't complete it. If you built your own group with people from your guild/server it was fine and not a smashing your head against wall experience. That's why M+ is a success as a mechanic. You get to pick and chose your team and if you they don't have the credentials, they don't get into the group. It creates the one thing Blizzard hates: barriers to content (well they hate now), but if you're going to create content that requires more skill than Joe "Keyboard-turner" Smith, people are going to create their own test to keep these people out.

[Aviditas]

Absolutely not, for the sole reason that TBC actually included some raids and mechanics that require coordination. LFR has always been known as the relaxed, fly by the seat of your pants way of doing raids. How would you handle tossing orbs on lady vashj or not having dps taking the tank legendaries on Kael'thas? What about the good ol warlock tank used for most leo kills?

LFR works now because the raids were built ahead of time with LFR in mind. If you try and throw it into past content for the sake of "moar content for meee", it's gonna be bad day.

[tikcol]

Are u some sort of troll?
why is this discussed every single time on this forum.
why should blizzard cater to you? Who are you?
The game was fine when it was released some time ago and people loved it and it has evolved into being user friendly for everybody.
Just play the better and evolved version and let nerds just paly hours and hours to see old content and everybody is happy.

what's your issue?

The game was fine, until everyone left.

Now it's empty.

Why?

We need to ask the right questions.

- - - Updated - - -

Absolutely not, for the sole reason that TBC actually included some raids and mechanics that require coordination. LFR has always been known as the relaxed, fly by the seat of your pants way of doing raids. How would you handle tossing orbs on lady vashj or not having dps taking the tank legendaries on Kael'thas? What about the good ol warlock tank used for most leo kills?

LFR works now because the raids were built ahead of time with LFR in mind. If you try and throw it into past content for the sake of "moar content for meee", it's gonna be bad day.

They can easily make LFR versions of the raids by removing mechanics or tuning numbers up or down.. It's not rocket science.

[Twelveplay]

The game was fine, until everyone left.

Now it's empty.

Why?

We need to ask the right questions.

What are you even talking about?
Game is at it's highest point with both classic and SL having players.
I don't wanna be "that guy" But Mods can u pls close this stupid thread ?
this guy is obviously looking for attention or to annoy people.

[tikcol]

What are you even talking about?
Game is at it's highest point with both classic and SL having players.
I don't wanna be "that guy" But Mods can u pls close this stupid thread ?
this guy is obviously looking for attention or to annoy people.

I play in Gehennas one of the biggest servers. It's very empty right now. Most places with reasonable amounts of people are actually bots. We need to ask why this is happening and what happened to everyone.

What would make them stay subscribed?

I believe LFR

[Twelveplay]

Go play shadowlands

[tikcol]

Go play shadowlands

Shadowlands's problems aren't as easily fixable as is the incoming TBC.

[Kralljin]

No.

First off, TBC shouldn't have multiple layers of (raid)difficulties, having only a single mode of difficulty is a pillar of that expansion, something that doesn't exist past TBC anymore.

Second, the socializing aspect is something that is part of the older iterations of the game, if you cannot stand "forced socialization" then those older expansion just aren't for you, it's same as when you don't have the time anymore to play WoW like you used back in 05 / 06, then you just need to pass on it or make room for it in your schedule, the game attempting to cater to every player is one of the major criticims that a lot of people have towards the modern game.

Thirdly, this may be more on the general topic of LFR but even (former) devs have admitted that LFR as a system has also tons of downsides, such as
1. Despite being the "entry level" to raiding, it hardly teaches you "how to" raid
2. Because you always play with random people, every week presents "new" progress, rather than a steady improvement you'd have in an organized group
3. It incentives AFK leeching

I am by no means a "#nochanges" guy in regards to TBC, as said above, any change made to the game should still respect the original vision of the game, LFR is such a blatant departure from that vision.
If you think TBC needs LFR to succeed, then i think this is an actual case of "You think you want to play TBC, but you don't", as it so diametrically opposed to what the older iterations of the game represent.

[Twelveplay]

Shadowlands's problems aren't as easily fixable as is the incoming TBC.

All this seems like a you problem.
I dont mind it and i bet a lot of people don't either so u can just gather your LFR heroes and make a discord and just play Hello Kitty Island Adventure together xD.

[tikcol]

"You think you want to play TBC, but you don't".

Yep, that's the realization people came to in Classic WoW that's why they all left for Shadowlands and nobody is raiding Naxxramas.

We can fix some of that in TBC. There's time.

Bring LFR and fix half the problems with one swing.

- - - Updated - - -

All this seems like a you problem.
I dont mind it and i bet a lot of people don't either so u can just gather your LFR heroes and make a discord and just play Hello Kitty Island Adventure together xD.

LFR isn't easy. I do have a LFR raiders discord and we all agree there that TBC needs LFR in order to succeed with the vast majority of potential players.

Let's make sure people stay subscribed more than one month and you don't end up filling Outlands with Bots.

[Aviditas]

LFR isn't easy. I do have a LFR raiders discord.

Welp, it all makes sense now.

[Shadowdude]

Report as troll and move along.

[chrisnumbers]

I think LFR tool should be deleted from WOW forever, including in retail.