what the fuck did I just ran into?

[This One Time At Bandcamp]

Well.. I had to do 45 boss kills to get my legendary.

I dont blame people wanting to speed up those 45 kills.. Takes forever if you want to complete the full dungeon.

[gaymer77]

Yeah, Shadowlands has been full of assholes leaving when they do/don't get their legendary.

It would have been so much better if legendary memories had dropped only off the last bosses. That way the folks would have to sit through the whole dungeon.

Same dungeon but the banner boss with every fucking warrior too....

In fact when I see a warrior in the group when the party forms I say "so & so will be leaving after banner boss I guarantee it" and if I see a rogue in the group I say "rogue will be leaving after the first boss I guarantee it". Wanna know how many times I've been wrong? (only 3 times since launch when TOP wasn't a dungeon you can do for completing a calling or weekly dungeon quest the chooseable rep item)

[TheRevenantHero]

Nobody is a jerk when all they do is designed and supported by Blizzard.

It was Blizzard who put a legendary memory on first boss, not the player. It was Blizzard who provided an automatic tool for the player to kill the boss they want. It was Blizzard who made a deserter debuff for leaving before the first boss but no debuff when leaving afterwards. It was Blizzard who automatically refills a group when the player left.

Take it up with Blizzard for creating incentive to leave after first boss, not the player wanting to get it.

So once again, instead of condemning people's actions in game, we should instead blame Blizzard. You're just justifying toxic behavior at this point. Blizzard has never once said "Oh yeah we fully support people leaving dungeons after the first boss." They designed it, sure, but I doubt that they support leaving a dungeon after the first boss.

- - - Updated - - -

No, there's nothing wrong with people wanting to focus on something specific in a dungeon and then leaving after what they want to do is complete. If you want that kind of commitment, you need to form your own groups. The purpose of LFG is to have access to quick, non-committal groups, but that comes with different people with different goals, which will sometimes clash. In your circumstance it is a little rude that they then asked for you to help them afterwards (i.e.: leaving and then trying to impose on you), but that's not a huge problem. You are still fully capable of re-queuing and finishing the dungeon; however, I think this is why people should be in favour of legendary recipes and important items only being dropped by final bosses.

If they want to focus on it, they should just make a premade group instead of wasting the time of people in matchmaking. There are so many groups I've been in where people leave before finishing the dungeon and causing the group to just disband because it's taking forever to find a new tank or healer.

- - - Updated - - -

Those people did absolutely nothing wrong. It's 100% Blizzards fault and in this instance the phrase 'dont hate the player, hate the game' is 100% valid.

No it's not 100% Blizzards fault. People are willfully being jerks by leaving a dungeon without completing it in matchmaking.

[chiddie]

well.... I queued up for heroic instead of normal for my calling this time. (it was the strong enemies one again, but for Rivendeath this time) umm. UMM. I guess at least the tank could actualy take the damage that half the dungeon he would pull at a time dished out :/ I was about to type that it went so fast I didn't have time to get a headache... and then... there it is. the headache. yeah, I think I'm going to avoid WoW dungeons entirely from now on.

I understand your problem but if what you’re searching is TBC or WotLK dungeons pace, the only way is finding a fixed group willing to do so even if it’s not necessary or rewarding. Things like recovering mana/health or carefully pull packs using ccs and cooldowns with priority mobs to be taken down are long gone and not necessary anymore in normal/HC. I don’t see a sheep/hex/sap/hybernate and something like that in dungeons since literally ages.

Noone cares about normal/hc and in part even M0, they are done only for callings or quests but the idea is doing them as fast as possible (and as I said they are easy enough to allow that) because rewards are meaningless.

I repeat, if you want an old fashioned dungeoning style, the only way is M0 with an old fashioned group that shares you vision.

If you just think opting out from dungeons his better for your mental wellness, just do it of course, it makes no sense if you’re not having fun and only stress.

[Twdft]

You're just justifying toxic behavior at this point. Blizzard has never once said "Oh yeah we fully support people leaving dungeons after the first boss." They designed it, sure, but I doubt that they support leaving a dungeon after the first boss.

You keep ignoring how Blizzard refills your group automatically. Does it matter to you which player you continue the dungeon with? Why does it have to be the one present at start of dungeon? Did the original players sign a contract with you to complete the dungeon?

[TheRevenantHero]

You keep ignoring how Blizzard refills your group automatically. Does it matter to you which player you continue the dungeon with? Why does it have to be the one present at start of dungeon? Did the original players sign a contract with you to complete the dungeon?

No it really fucking doesn't. You have to enter the queue again after someone leaves and when it's a tank or healer, that can take quite a while. There is absolutely no excuse for dropping from a matchmade dungeon just because you didn't get a legendary recipe off the first boss. It's a dick move and if someone wants to farm a boss, they shouldn't enter matchmaking and just form a farming group.

[RedBrood]

Ah yes it's such a poor "design". Are we so full of it nowadays that we can't see anything that isn't instant as a bad design? If it drops off the first boss and you are to lazy to clear the whole dungeon you should get a premade group to do it. If you don't have 4 people willing to help you at this point in the game, then why are you even farming it? Probably aren't raiding with the lack of help you obviously have.

[Twdft]

No it really fucking doesn't. You have to enter the queue again after someone leaves and when it's a tank or healer, that can take quite a while.

I think it's rather toxic of you to value your own time above other players time, to the point you want them to hold them inside the dungeon.

How is it ok for you to demand other people helping you longer than they want, but not ok for them to leave after they accomplished what they signed up for?

[Magical Mudcrab]

If they want to focus on it, they should just make a premade group instead of wasting the time of people in matchmaking. There are so many groups I've been in where people leave before finishing the dungeon and causing the group to just disband because it's taking forever to find a new tank or healer.

If you want commitment to finishing the dungeon you need to create a group. LFG is a tool for non-committal groups, and therefore people will join and leave when they have completed their objective. If you want to claim that people are being selfish or wasting others time for leaving, go for it, but know that the argument is no more valid than those leaving claiming people who want them to stay want to waste their time. Your goals in the dungeon are at odds and neither of you has a commitment to the other, and it does not help that the game incentivizes the leaver's behaviour. If you want to deal with this behaviour, Blizzard needs to incentivize staying in these groups, like making legendary items/recipes drop from the final boss.

[DechCJC]

If they want to focus on it, they should just make a premade group instead of wasting the time of people in matchmaking. There are so many groups I've been in where people leave before finishing the dungeon and causing the group to just disband because it's taking forever to find a new tank or healer.

How on earth are you supposed to create a group that's going to reset the instance after the first boss repeatedly? You're being ridiculous. You think rogues enjoy having to spam the first boss of ToP for a BIS legendary? Imagine how much worse it would be if they felt obliged to do the entire dungeon every time, just so the rest of the group could save 10 seconds waiting on a replacement DPS. It has literally took some specs upwards of 50 attempts to get their legendary, is it so bad wasting 10 seconds of your time so that they can save dozens of hours of theirs?

This is not a player issue, it's a design issue. You're a liar if you say that you would clear ToP in full 50 times when you could just leave immediately after the first boss for the same result. To say that leaving the instance is even an inconvenience to the rest of the group is absurd as if that DPS hadn't signed up in the first place the queue would have been longer. You would still have been in the queue in the first place had they not signed up.

For the record, I'm a priest and have not had the misfortune of having to spam for a legendary as mine came from the raid. You know, from bosses where they had 100% drop rates, design that makes sense.

[Useful]

40 runs on my hunter. I left only 1 time. after I finally freaking got the drop.

[Squigglyo]

Actually the most efficient way would be forming up a group yourself and spamming the boss rather than taking over the lfg groups. At least the way I see the OP describing it seemed like a group jumped into LFG and wasn't actually trying to complete the dungeon that they (other randoms) were queuing up to complete. So if the other people are thus coerced to bail and eat the deserter debuff it's kind of retarded.

Creating a group of 5 that want to run it takes time.
Running back out every time takes time.
Refilling once someone gets it takes time.


Its definitly more efficient to spam LFG unless youve got 4 friends who will play with you until every single person has it.

[MatPandaZ]

No it's not 100% Blizzards fault. People are willfully being jerks by leaving a dungeon without completing it in matchmaking.

Show me where on the LFG tool it says that you must be prepared to do a whole dungeon. It doesn't. You are not required or saying you are going to do a full dungeon. If you leave too soon Blizzard stop you re-joining for 30 mins, if you are outside their rules for that then they clearly have no problem with it. You are making up arbitary rules that suit what you want and you want to gatekeep how people find groups for their legendary.

[T-34]

Honestly? the people defending it are likely the same people that will leave after the first boss because their legendary didn't drop so they come to these threads to defend it so they don't have admit their behavior is toxic.

People trying to guilt-shame other people that follow the rules made by Blizzard are a good example of the rampant toxic bullying going on the internet and in-game.

[Aristai1723]

For quests like these, I tank heroics, I tank nothing else, I have no interest in tanking, I just mash my buttons because it gets the job done.

Heroics are full of people that just want to kill the last boss as fast as humanly possible for callings and oribos weeklies. And all of them are face rolled by now.

[Witchblade77]

I think it's rather toxic of you to value your own time above other players time, to the point you want them to hold them inside the dungeon.

How is it ok for you to demand other people helping you longer than they want, but not ok for them to leave after they accomplished what they signed up for?

reminder.

it seems like this most often happens with the rogue or whatnot teaming up with a tank friend. that leaves 3, people not just one that they are wasting time of. moreover - that's 3 often different people each. and every. run. for however many resets they do. so why is it that all those people somehow do not matter in a face of this rogues "need" to farm a legendary? and if they are able to find a tank buddy to help them, what is stopping them from finding 2 other rogues and a healer to go along and queue up over and over in a full premade? I'm sure plenty of other rogues would LOVE an opportunity to farm their leggo faster and helpful tanks are rare then helpful healers, so if they were able to find a tank, healer should be no problem. last but not least. this is apparently very old fashioned of me, but if I join a group where multiple people are farming something. I stay until everyone gets their drop, I don't just leave once I got mine. becasue I'm NOT that much of a dick. they helped me. its only fair that i helped them back. in case of this rogue and tank? they didn't even offer to help me finish the dungeon, or explain what they were doing. because only their needs matter apparently. not anyone else's.

and this attitude of "I got mine, fuck you" is IMO a problem and Blizzard enabling this attitude to persist does NOT excuse people insisting on sticking to said attitude.

[Twdft]

reminder.

it seems like this most often happens with the rogue or whatnot teaming up with a tank friend. that leaves 3, people not just one that they are wasting time of. moreover - that's 3 often different people each. and every. run. for however many resets they do. so why is it that all those people somehow do not matter in a face of this rogues "need" to farm a legendary? and if they are able to find a tank buddy to help them, what is stopping them from finding 2 other rogues and a healer to go along and queue up over and over in a full premade? I'm sure plenty of other rogues would LOVE an opportunity to farm their leggo faster and helpful tanks are rare then helpful healers, so if they were able to find a tank, healer should be no problem. last but not least. this is apparently very old fashioned of me, but if I join a group where multiple people are farming something. I stay until everyone gets their drop, I don't just leave once I got mine. becasue I'm NOT that much of a dick. they helped me. its only fair that i helped them back. in case of this rogue and tank? they didn't even offer to help me finish the dungeon, or explain what they were doing. because only their needs matter apparently. not anyone else's.

and this attitude of "I got mine, fuck you" is IMO a problem and Blizzard enabling this attitude to persist does NOT excuse people insisting on sticking to said attitude.

Reminder, this argument goes both ways: if you want to be sure everyone stays to the endboss you can make your own group of 5 too and go in together. LFD is a jamboree bag, you never know what players you get and what their goals are. Treat it as such.

Leaving means the other 3 are waiting a couple seconds for a dd or maybe a minute for a tank (again and again and again: you'll be put first in the queue to refill).

Memories from normal dungeons drop very bad, even heroic you'll probably have to go in 10 times. You expect players whose memory drops from the first boss, who only want that and nothing else, to waste 10x15 minutes sticking to the endboss. You expect them to play the game with you even if they don't want to. You are just as selfish as they are, even more so because you want them to waste much more time.

Blizzard enables this behaviour, they even removed the daily id from specific heroic dungeons so you can farm one all day long if you like. Blizzard refills your group shortly. And most importantly Blizzard created the problem by putting memories on the first boss. It's really improper to blame players for wanting to leave if all they want is that memory.

[Witchblade77]

Reminder, this argument goes both ways: if you want to be sure everyone stays to the endboss you can make your own group of 5 too and go in together. LFD is a jamboree bag, you never know what players you get and what their goals are. Treat it as such.

Leaving means the other 3 are waiting a couple seconds for a dd or maybe a minute for a tank (again and again and again: you'll be put first in the queue to refill).

Memories from normal dungeons drop very bad, even heroic you'll probably have to go in 10 times. You expect players whose memory drops from the first boss, who only want that and nothing else, to waste 10x15 minutes sticking to the endboss. You expect them to play the game with you even if they don't want to. You are just as selfish as they are, even more so because you want them to waste much more time.

Blizzard enables this behaviour, they even removed the daily id from specific heroic dungeons so you can farm one all day long if you like. Blizzard refills your group shortly. And most importantly Blizzard created the problem by putting memories on the first boss. It's really improper to blame players for wanting to leave if all they want is that memory.

from experience. its not couple of seconds for these dungeons.

and no, this argument does NOT go both ways. did you know that when you queue up for a random dungeon through groupfinder.. you get a reward of gold and anima for finishing it? if that's not showing the intent of Blizzard expecting people to FINISH dungeons, I'm not sure what does. I mean, they even give you extra rewards in case your role is particularly lacking on that day.

Blizzard made a shitty design decision by putting that legendary on a boss other then last. that however does NOT excuse the choice people make to continuously fuck over others in a queue. that is their choice. Not blizzards.

I don't expect people who are farming a memory to keep sticking around. I expect them to form their own groups becasue they are the ones with goals that go contrary to finishing the dungeon they queued up for, not the other way around. and from what i'm told the drop rates increase with difficulty. why not form a group for mythic zero and improve your drop chances?

so not, don't flip this around on me claiming that I'm selfish for considering not just my own needs but those of people other then the farmers whose queue they also mess up. you know, those non rogue dps who were waiting all this time for the queue, only to have to requeue again and start over? yeah... those people. they exist! and they matter.

so no its not improper to blame the players. players are the ones who chose to use the queue and abuse random people they get in it for their goals. blizzard creating an opportunity to do so, does NOT remove the blame from them for making that choice.

[Thunderball]

I dont see anything wrong here. It's morally wrong here but why would anyone care about morals when it comes to people they will never see again? I have no clue.

[TheRevenantHero]

The responses in this thread are exactly why the community is a toxic cess pool in WoW now. People defending shitty actions like leaving after the first boss, forcing players to sit and wait for a replacement. And if the person that left was a tank or healer? That group is more than likely disbanding because the wait is horrendous. Anyone who sees nothing wrong with leaving after the first boss are only saying that because THEY do that same thing and don't want to own up to their toxic behavior.