Thread: Undead Paladin?

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  1. #41
    Over 9000! Soon-TM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nathreim View Post
    Bad writing aside nothing is physically restraining Tauren from worshiping the Sun or using the light any Tauren could become one with the right training/faith.

    Undead who use the light fell as if they are being fully engulfed in fire. Undead Paladins who are infused with the Light 24-7 would be constantly feeling the effects. They face an extraordinarily high barrier to overcome unlike any other race except perhaps Void Elves.
    If void elves can "harness the void" without being driven to madness like anyone who has tried that trick before, I can't fathom a reason that an especially masochist/duty-oriented Forsaken can't be infused with light. After all, it wouldn't be any different to a DK being healed by a paladin/priest when it comes to lore.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dundebuns View Post
    I know lore wise it's probably never going to happen, but I would jump onto the chance to have a male undead paladin. Who knows, if they run with Calia being a light forged undead we might see them soon.
    My pally is a belf, and has been since BC. But I'd be really torn between Zandalari or Forsaken pally if the latter were ever introduced.
    If the Janitor managed to pwn Azeroth:

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  2. #42
    I am Murloc! Selastan's Avatar
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    They should totally exist.

    Lightforged Death Knights are a thing, that's the same concept in reverse. They are INFUSED with Light, they are permanently GLOWING with it, yet can become undead.

  3. #43
    The Lightbringer ProphetFlume's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amnaught View Post
    The Light burns them.
    Sorry Irish people, no paladins for you either.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gumboy View Post
    I'm not sure if you guys have noticed but sometimes I say things that are kind of dumb
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    I just like reading about the "vigorous rubbing" that might affect ball inflation.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Nathreim View Post
    Bad writing aside nothing is physically restraining Tauren from worshiping the Sun or using the light any Tauren could become one with the right training/faith.

    Undead who use the light fell as if they are being fully engulfed in fire. Undead Paladins who are infused with the Light 24-7 would be constantly feeling the effects. They face an extraordinarily high barrier to overcome unlike any other race except perhaps Void Elves.
    Would you be okay with Forsaken Paladins if they used cosmetic variants like Unholy Light? I feel like this is a way that makes sense for people who don't like the pure Light direction for Undead Paladins, and I don't hear people in favor of pure Light Undead Paladin not liking this either, it just seems completely off the table because of the art it would require to make it happen. What I'm saying is, is that I don't think the class itself is what is driving some away from the concept, it's that some may feel Blizzard aren't willing to do the work necessary to make it as cool as it may need to be to bring everyone on board with it. There may also be a worry other classes would look for these options too, but this has been done before circa Warlock Green Fire, so I don't think it's unfeasible.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Tekra View Post
    Yo guys,

    I got a question and I'm quite curious how you think about this. Why aren't Undead Paladins a thing? They're dead humans revived basically right?
    So what if it was a Paladin before it died. I've heard arguments that Undead are not able to wield Holy magic, however, Undead Priests are a thing as well.

    So I basically don't see why it shouldn't be, but you guys probably could tell me.
    This has been discussed to death. It is possible lorewise. Dunno why blizzard doesnt add them to the game.

  6. #46
    Dragonrider Talritha, from the Descent of Dragons Hearthstone expansion:


  7. #47
    I've actually, for some reason, put a little thought into some potential lore behind an undead paladin. So the way a paladin works is they channel some kind of 'divine' energy. For the Silver Hand and draenei it's 'the light', for the belf's it's the sunwell, for the tauren it is their sun god, and for the zandalari it's some loa or something (never really figured that one out).

    Now in D&D you can have evil aligned paladins, andinstead of drawing divine power they draw infernal power. So how about an undead paladin does something similar? We know that Naaru go through a cycle of going all void like before being reborn as a being of light, so how about a Naaru, or section of Naaru embracing that part of their cycle and instead of becoming some mindless void god type thing, they retain their reason and become a font of more shadowy power that acts in a similar way to their light bound siblings? This would provide a font of power that the undead could draw from without the problem of it burning them inside and out.
    RETH

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Dundebuns View Post
    I've actually, for some reason, put a little thought into some potential lore behind an undead paladin. So the way a paladin works is they channel some kind of 'divine' energy. For the Silver Hand and draenei it's 'the light', for the belf's it's the sunwell, for the tauren it is their sun god, and for the zandalari it's some loa or something (never really figured that one out).

    Now in D&D you can have evil aligned paladins, andinstead of drawing divine power they draw infernal power. So how about an undead paladin does something similar? We know that Naaru go through a cycle of going all void like before being reborn as a being of light, so how about a Naaru, or section of Naaru embracing that part of their cycle and instead of becoming some mindless void god type thing, they retain their reason and become a font of more shadowy power that acts in a similar way to their light bound siblings? This would provide a font of power that the undead could draw from without the problem of it burning them inside and out.
    If I had to guess at how this would best work, we know that Naaru twisted turn Void aligned. And while this derives from faith, it seems one has to intentionally revere a source they deem good or lawful to get Light and a source they deem evil or chaotic to get Void. The one Void-aligned Paladin variants I can find are those of the Twilight Cult.

    To find something a bit more common for Undead some assortment of Undead so far have wielded Unholy Light. From two sources I know can we see how things like Unholy Light actually operate in lore -- it's referenced in The Raising of a Frost Wyrm, and in the Shadow Ascendant (an rpg class and card in Hearthstone). In the book, it describes the light in the chest of a Frost Wyrm, and for Ascendants it's described as the eyes of the Ascended Forsaken. The same eye description follows similarly to the given appearance of all Undead player eyes pre-SL.

    Combined with he more prominent use of Unholy Light in various raised Undead, and I suppose by extension the kind we could theorize makes up all Forsaken, that this is a force they could all reasonably tap into regardless of how they were raised, as even post-Cata Forsaken have shown to have the yellow eyes.

    And, to be clear, the Shadow Ascendant follows the Forgotten Shadow - a religion that already permeates Forsaken culture. Meanwhile, Void worshipping in the Twilight variant we have seen not only has less Forsaken examples it's also all but gone now with the fall of Deathwing. Though, there were aberrations that share model with Undead for recent N'zoth content, but Drowned aren't really Forsaken for all intents and purposes, and unlike the control of the Lich King can't be broken or found in friendly variants in lore like the Shadow Ascendant can - all N'zoth Drowned variants seem to be entirely hostile long-term. But if that hurdle or another rising of the Twilight Cult were to happen, those seem more wide-spread in the world enough to make more sense, whereas the Forgotten Shadow is more specific to Forsaken Society.

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Kithelle View Post
    As long as Nelves get Paladin too I don't care if Undead get it

    - - - Updated - - -



    There are great reasons some aren't open to certain classes, it's people like you who say there is no rpg left in the game while cheering for the rpg elements to be destroyed
    Psst.

    Hey you. Yeah, you.

    You should really look into Dungeons & Dragons somtimes. You know, the game that inspired Warcraft in the first place, and RPGs in general. Yeah, that game.

    Even they fucking realized how stupid race/class restrictions were. Decades ago.

  10. #50
    Lore reasons. The reason I heard is the difference between priests and paladins is something like priests only use the light around them but paladins infuse their bodys with the light itself.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Selastan View Post
    They should totally exist.

    Lightforged Death Knights are a thing, that's the same concept in reverse. They are INFUSED with Light, they are permanently GLOWING with it, yet can become undead.
    you can get cut off from the light.
    the report systems sucks and the mods are bias.

  12. #52
    Elemental Lord Kathranis's Avatar
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    I still dig the idea of a Forsaken Paladin Order done up like flagellants and lepers, with bandage wrappings covering them up, who treat the pain caused by the Light as a purifying penance for their sins.

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by The Council View Post
    you can get cut off from the light.
    And like with Tirion, Paladins can also reconnect with it. But The Light isn't the only faith that can work with Paladins, anyway.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Moose184 View Post
    Lore reasons. The reason I heard is the difference between priests and paladins is something like priests only use the light around them but paladins infuse their bodys with the light itself.
    There are many examples of Undead Paladins that exist. Whether it's possible or not isn't the issue.

  14. #54
    Elemental Lord Kithelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Something Wicked View Post
    Psst.

    Hey you. Yeah, you.

    You should really look into Dungeons & Dragons somtimes. You know, the game that inspired Warcraft in the first place, and RPGs in general. Yeah, that game.

    Even they fucking realized how stupid race/class restrictions were. Decades ago.
    Yes...lets make everything better by just being identical to one another! So people like you...yeah I'm looking at you can complain and say WoW is so boring because it's just ripping off D&D...because people like you love to complain no matter what.

    But yes...lets pretend like Goblin Druids and Gnome Demon Hunters would make sense, because it's totally the same when you make up a character on paper vs a character in a video game
    #WithoutRespectWeReject

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Kithelle View Post
    Yes...lets make everything better by just being identical to one another! So people like you...yeah I'm looking at you can complain and say WoW is so boring because it's just ripping off D&D...because people like you love to complain no matter what.

    But yes...lets pretend like Goblin Druids and Gnome Demon Hunters would make sense, because it's totally the same when you make up a character on paper vs a character in a video game
    As a skeptic to certain race-class combos like Undead Paladin, despite all the tangible NPC examples using abilities in combat that are available in the game, what could be done to have it make sense to you?

    Sunwalkers still receive flak despite established NPCs, lore gossip and quests, as well as hubs and prominent recurring friendly named NPCs. What needs to be done to make these concepts more grounded in WoW that hasn't been done already, that maybe other accepted new race-class combos have gotten?

    Or is it more an issue that anything that, even if it was in Classic, if it wasn't playable at a race's inception, is this somehow unacceptable altogether to some people and do you thnk it's reasonable to maintain restrictions like these indefinitely when lore develops to allow them?

  16. #56
    Elemental Lord Kithelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Razion View Post
    As a skeptic to certain race-class combos like Undead Paladin, despite all the tangible NPC examples using abilities in combat that are available in the game, what could be done to have it make sense to you?

    Sunwalkers still receive flak despite established NPCs, lore gossip and quests, as well as hubs and prominent recurring friendly named NPCs. What needs to be done to make these concepts more grounded in WoW that hasn't been done already, that maybe other accepted new race-class combos have gotten?

    Or is it more an issue that anything that, even if it was in Classic, if it wasn't playable at a race's inception, is this somehow unacceptable altogether to some people and do you thnk it's reasonable to maintain restrictions like these indefinitely when lore develops to allow them?
    I don't have a big problem with Undead Pallies...maybe a little far fetched but there has been at least one example since vanilla...my problem is with what the person I replied to said...that every class should be open to every race.

    Like the examples I used are too farfetched to be believable

    I don't have a problem with Undead Pally...I just want Nelf Pallies if Undead get it
    #WithoutRespectWeReject

  17. #57
    Because reasons.

    Everything is possible if those stubburn devs allow it cause shockingly enough, our characters aren't canon. They are just a random champion. They don't need to conform to lore and all class combos should be unlocked... but reasons. Dev reasons.

    I mean, at this point we have lightforged undead, cursed druids, shaman goblins, etc. It really doesn't matter. It's just stubburness at this point.
    Last edited by Swnem; 2021-03-29 at 08:00 AM.

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Amnaught View Post
    The Light burns them.

    They had this whole thing in a lore Q&A where holy priests exist because of their personal devotion, using light magic causes them immense pain. Plus they balance it with shadow magic, just like living priests balance a shadow spec with light magic to keep them sane. Paladins simply can't be reborn as forsaken, their bodies are too ...irradiated.

    There is one undead paladin and the necromancy controlling him is a higher level than the scourge's plague and valkyr.

    Now Calia exists though so fuck it.
    That's convoluted for no reason. Why does "holy light" heal them then?

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Nite92 View Post
    That's convoluted for no reason. Why does "holy light" heal them then?
    Because instead of chalking it up to game mechanics, Blizzard decided to fuel the undead paladin speculations with that garbage explanation.

  20. #60
    Eh at this point why not. fuck it. Class exclusivity has gone down the drain and the only thing holding anything back is lack of resources for every class getting unique stuff, specifically racial paladin mounts, druid forms, shaman totems aaaand.... thats it isnt it... yeah.

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