Could North Korea's cult of personality ever work or sustain itself done right?

[YUPPIE]

The way I see it: North Korea is an isolated country with a regime that enforces cult of personality based on its dictator, promotes ultranationalism, and teaches its citizens to view all outsiders as enemies. The problem is North Korea has limited resources and lives in abject poverty, its leader(s) is a tyrannical fearmonger, and everyone is unhappy but forced to worship an openly evil man.

But the concept of North Korea fascinates certain ideals so much I wonder if it could ever be done right and whether it could importantly sustain itself.

A country that mostly cut itself off from the world and enforces a cult of personality but was rich as hell and sustainable, founded by brilliant minds and industrialists led by a singular leader. It brainwashes its populace into a borderline religious worship of said leader but the person leads through genuine charisma and manipulation expertly woven into a way that can't be discerned as anything like what North Korea does with murder. To pretty much ensure absolute genuine loyalty than falsehood led by fear. People are similarly taught to reject outsiders for fear of dissent should they openly accept them.

That sounds good to me and all but the problem I have with a cult of personality state is even if it works out, what happens when the person that its led around dies? Even if you mind wash a successor, human beings are wholly unpredictable and you don't know if they'll continue to make it work. You also can't predict if the populace will take this new person well over their previous godlike being.

It just seems doomed to inevitably fail and degenerate into a tyrannical regime but I'm wondering if there really any way to make it work.

[s_bushido]

That sounds good to me

No. Just stop.

There's nothing good about brainwashing. And a country that's isolated from the rest of the world won't be "rich as hell and sustainable" for very long.

Leave this shit for your Warhammer 40k fanfic or something. Christ.

[PC2]

It just seems doomed to inevitably fail and degenerate into a tyrannical regime but I'm wondering if there really any way to make it work.

No it can't work over the long run. Closed-systems lead to static societies which are doomed to failure because they are based on sustaining the same thing forever where innovation does not occur. An open-society is a liberal democracy based on valuing freedom and consent of all people. Innovation will only occur in this latter society and so it's the only sustainable model.

[Calfredd]

-SNIP-

Yes we get it, you have some weird hard-on for North Korea. What's odd is you are actually trying to advocate for a serious, unironic, unthinking sheep population.

[Wilfire]

Most countries are already based on cults of personality but instead of a singular leader you have capitalism, mass media and an amorphous blob of "scientists", "politicians" and "public opinion leaders" and instead of roaming death squads you have the court of public opinion and cancel culture.

[PC2]

lol... what a bunch of bullshit...

Why? What is the best kind of society in your opinion? You live in a liberal democracy and benefit from it so you should be grateful.

[PC2]

there is no democracy in the world that is based around freedom and consent of all people...

Getting 100% of those things is impossible but a society that is closer to them will prosper more than a society that is further away from them. Perfection is something that we should shoot for but it is not necessary or realistic.

[draynay]

instead of roaming death squads you have the court of public opinion and cancel culture.

Being held accountable for being an asshole is only scary for assholes.

[Mihalik]

The way I see

Stop fantasizing about fascism.

Fascism is always bad. Nationalism is bad. Isolationism is bad. Xenophobia is bad. Cults of personality are bad.

[Gaidax]

Sounds like China, then.

/shrug

[Machismo]

Most countries are already based on cults of personality but instead of a singular leader you have capitalism, mass media and an amorphous blob of "scientists", "politicians" and "public opinion leaders" and instead of roaming death squads you have the court of public opinion and cancel culture.

Umm, have you seen your signature?

I'm hoping you recognize the utter irony in what you just stated.

[draynay]

Umm, have you seen your signature?

I'm hoping you recognize the utter irony in what you just stated.

He complained that this forum has too much American politics while using a MAGA avatar, I'm pretty sure he is incapable of recognizing irony.

[bladeXcrasher]

This how you guys are spinning it now? Cucker Carlson had that guy on saying that you guys are going to vote for a dictator because "democrats made you do it", so now you are all rationalizing N Korea?

[Shadowferal]

Conflating the "cult" with the country never goes well...for the country since the narcissist so blatantly displayed tends to implode and insist on taking the country with him.

[Slant]

there is no democracy in the world that is based around freedom and consent of all people...

What are you talking about? All of the Western democracies have their base in personal freedoms and the democratic consent of all people to a reasonable degree. That compromises happen doesn't mean it's not based in the idea of getting as much consent as possible.

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Most countries are already based on cults of personality but instead of a singular leader you have capitalism, mass media and an amorphous blob of "scientists", "politicians" and "public opinion leaders" and instead of roaming death squads you have the court of public opinion and cancel culture.

cult of personality
n. A situation where a leader (often a dictator) has been falsely idolized and made into a national or group icon and is revered as a result.
n. intense devotion to a particular person

What you're describing is by definition the opposite of a cult of personality. And that's just the beginning of where you go wrong...

Capitalism is not a cult in Europe, we have just eliminated most countries in Western civilisation. The only country where capitalism is rampaging wild is the US. That's ONE country. And it's a bit of a stretch to call it a cult as much as it is the idea of maximum freedom flowing into economics.

There is no "amorphous blob" of scientists, politicians and public opinion leaders. You're talking about a democratic society. The scientists are real, they have physical bodies and they put their work out every day and if you're brave enough, you can ask them stupid questions. Be prepared for a brutally honest answer, though. Given that you seem to disengage yourself from any substantiality, I doubt you'd do that. Same with politicians, although their answer is probably not going to be the most honest and more likely to be a PR statement. As for "public opinion leaders", no idea who you're thinking off, but even if we assume there's a cult around them, it's very questionable how big their influence actually is. See, you have to call them "opinion leaders", because these freaks typically wield zero power and their influence is not strong enough to get them any power. That's why they're "opinion leaders" and not "actual political leaders". I have a hard time associating "personality cult" with that, given the small scope. Although technically it may be. In kind of the same vein that my gf could be accused of having a personality cult around me and vice versa. What can I say, that's how a relationship is sometimes. It's a bit of an insane statement to make, though...

And comparing the "court of public opinion" and "cancel culture" with death squads is rich. See, what I'm doing right now is telling you in detail why your post is... uh, let's be nice and say "flawed" so I don't get another of these bullshit infractions. Make no mistake, whatever is in my head falls into the "brutally honest" category and is more descriptive. This isn't "the court of public opinion". This is you fucking up and me telling you how and why you fucked up. Your generation needs to grow up and take the criticism in, or you'll wreck the planet with the superficiality you think is "public discourse". It's not. It's a very public inability to go beyond the surface and think about actual issues due to laziness.

Feel free to support your argument. Rest assured I'm going to ignore any hand waving and empty debate buzzphrasing.

[Wilfire]

What you're describing is by definition the opposite of a cult of personality. And that's just the beginning of where you go wrong...

Capitalism is not a cult in Europe, we have just eliminated most countries in Western civilisation. The only country where capitalism is rampaging wild is the US. That's ONE country. And it's a bit of a stretch to call it a cult as much as it is the idea of maximum freedom flowing into economics.

There is no "amorphous blob" of scientists, politicians and public opinion leaders. You're talking about a democratic society. The scientists are real, they have physical bodies and they put their work out every day and if you're brave enough, you can ask them stupid questions. Be prepared for a brutally honest answer, though. Given that you seem to disengage yourself from any substantiality, I doubt you'd do that. Same with politicians, although their answer is probably not going to be the most honest and more likely to be a PR statement. As for "public opinion leaders", no idea who you're thinking off, but even if we assume there's a cult around them, it's very questionable how big their influence actually is. See, you have to call them "opinion leaders", because these freaks typically wield zero power and their influence is not strong enough to get them any power. That's why they're "opinion leaders" and not "actual political leaders". I have a hard time associating "personality cult" with that, given the small scope. Although technically it may be. In kind of the same vein that my gf could be accused of having a personality cult around me and vice versa. What can I say, that's how a relationship is sometimes. It's a bit of an insane statement to make, though...

And comparing the "court of public opinion" and "cancel culture" with death squads is rich. See, what I'm doing right now is telling you in detail why your post is... uh, let's be nice and say "flawed" so I don't get another of these bullshit infractions. Make no mistake, whatever is in my head falls into the "brutally honest" category and is more descriptive. This isn't "the court of public opinion". This is you fucking up and me telling you how and why you fucked up. Your generation needs to grow up and take the criticism in, or you'll wreck the planet with the superficiality you think is "public discourse". It's not. It's a very public inability to go beyond the surface and think about actual issues due to laziness.

Feel free to support your argument. Rest assured I'm going to ignore any hand waving and empty debate buzzphrasing.

Take a load of this guy, he thinks that politicians and scientists in Europe aren't lying straight out of their asses 24/7 while taking suitcase after suitcase of donor $$$ from predatory capitalists.

[Slant]

Take a load of this guy, he thinks that politicians and scientists in Europe aren't lying straight out of their asses 24/7 while taking suitcase after suitcase of donor $$$ from predatory capitalists.

Ok, so you got nothing... thought so.

[Ivanstone]

North Korea is an isolated country

North Korea is not an isolated country. It only exists because China wanted a cheep way to line a stretch of land with artillery and mine fields.

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Take a load of this guy, he thinks that politicians and scientists in Europe aren't lying straight out of their asses 24/7 while taking suitcase after suitcase of donor $$$ from predatory capitalists.

You just described the GOP. Although their definition of "scientist" should be taken with a grain of salt.

[Edge-]

Most countries are already based on cults of personality but instead of a singular leader you have capitalism, mass media and an amorphous blob of "scientists", "politicians" and "public opinion leaders" and instead of roaming death squads you have the court of public opinion and cancel culture.

What kind of personality does capitalism have?
How about the mass media?

Can I party with the amorphous blob of "scientists", "politicians", and "public opinion leaders"?

If someone gets "canceled" on Twitter are they literally killed like in a roaming death squad?

I mean, what does your reality look like? Tell us about it.

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Take a load of this guy, he thinks that politicians and scientists in Europe aren't lying straight out of their asses 24/7 while taking suitcase after suitcase of donor $$$ from predatory capitalists.

So join the glorious worldwide workers revolution, comrade. You gotta ditch the MAGA tho.

[RadasNoir]

He complained that this forum has too much American politics while using a MAGA avatar, I'm pretty sure he is incapable of recognizing irony.

I know we're not supposed to say the "T-word" around here, but I'm fairly certain that he's a particular under-the-bridge dwelling fairy tale creature, and not a particularly subtle one at that.